Ep 150: How Teachers Can Deal With Tricky Parents

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Hello everyone and welcome back
to another episode of Teach Seat

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Repeat.
My name is Dylan.

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And my name is.
Hayden, this week we're going to

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be giving you our top tips on
how to deal with parents.

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I've got a little game for Dylan
and before all of that.

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Hayden wants to have a little
catch up.

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Let's do that, OK?
You can't be asked to lead this

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one, so I'll.
I'll do it.

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Don't worry about it.
Fine.

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You've planned everything
through.

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You've done your own episode for
once, but you don't want the

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listeners.
To know for once.

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Yeah, you don't want the
listeners to know, you know.

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You want to just keep it all
normal.

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So I'll lead.
It's fine.

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I'll take all the Flack for
chatting all the time even

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though you refuse to do it
yourself.

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And you edit it as well.
Edit it afterwards as well.

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Do all the work.
Honestly, social media doesn't.

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Count, Honestly, yeah, you you
cut a few gaps and I make 50,000

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followers on Instagram.
It's very cool.

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Let's have a quick catch.
Up.

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Go on.
Yeah.

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Shall we?
What do you want to catch up

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about?
Well, it's look, it's been just

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over 2 months now since we did
not go back to teaching.

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I'm not counting some holidays,
right?

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So from September, I just want
to catch up and see how you're

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feeling because I felt we used
to do this all the time on the

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podcast and a few people have
said I miss your catch UPS

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because we used to, we used to.
I, I, let's be honest, our catch

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UPS normally spiralled into some
complete nonsensical chat for

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like 15 minutes.
But I do kind of miss the chat,

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the catch UPS as well.
Now, since we've introduced the

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Q&A episode each week, I feel
like we've kind of changed our

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structure up a little bit and I
miss it.

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I just miss it, you know?
So I thought it'd be nice to

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retention off.
The curve right now off you.

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Guys, get back in.
Not even that.

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Don't talk about yourselves
please.

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I click this for parental
advice.

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Look, don't worry, it's not
going to be completely off the

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rails here.
I'm going to keep it within

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education because I want to know
how you're feeling because it's

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been a couple of months since
we've quit teaching, not gone

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back to teaching.
And I just want to know now that

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the initial, that few first few
weeks, we were super excited.

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We reflect on the podcast like,
wow, this is so different.

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How are you feeling now?
It's been a few months.

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Has anything changed?
No.

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I think it's been more and more
as I've gone on, cemented that

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it was definitely the right
choice for me in this moment,

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that is for sure.
Luckily we've been able to stay

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quite busy.
Well, you know, we talked quite

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a lot in the episodes recently
about the maths platform we're

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building.
So exciting.

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Can't wait to get that up and
running.

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And if it's something you're
interested in, by the way, get

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in touch with us.
We're going to try and solve

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fluency and just get something
out there for arithmetic and

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children doing maths.
So get in touch and you can be

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on the list to try out first.
Good pleasure.

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Definitely go.
No, definitely, because I think

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we're going to help a lot of
people.

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I'm really excited about that.
I agree.

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So a lot of the time goes into
that.

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We're keeping busy.
But here's what I love about it.

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I love the flexibility.
I value flexibility so much, so

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much now in in where I am my
life.

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And I feel quite privileged to
be able to have that because

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it's very, very, very easy,
isn't it, to say to someone,

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yeah, just take it.
Just quit your teacher.

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Be flexible.
But it's not an option for

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everyone.
So I feel very, very lucky,

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which I need to keep reminding
myself because it can be be

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quite a drag sometimes.
I'm working from home a lot of

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the time.
There's lots to get done.

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Everything is kind of off our
own backs.

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We're self-employed essentially
right now.

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Everything we do being self.
Everyone out there who is

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self-employed or maybe has a
partner who is self-employed

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will know how much hard work
goes into that as well.

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It's not just teaching is awful,
there's a utopia and everything

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else you come from and where
teachers work so hard they do

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doesn't mean other people don't
work hard.

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So it's not like we've just had
an easy road now.

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But the flexibility is amazing.
I think whilst I've got young

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children, I've said this, I'll
say it again, whilst I've got

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Rory, who's to, the flexibility
is the number one thing.

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Even though we've taken a pay
cut to do this, quite a sizable

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pay card, I'd say it's the time,
the flexibility right now.

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I will never regret this, You
know, I mean, like when I'm 45,

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you know, if I need to step into
a role and then lots more money

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again and work 10 times as much,
I will.

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And you know, you need to be
answering someone to be in the

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exact place at exact time.
Cool.

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But right now this suits me.
I could do work when I want.

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So to answer the question, there
are pros and cons.

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It's not just the utopia now
we've left, but it certainly

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suits me way more and the pros
are more beneficial for me.

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Yeah.
Sure.

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Is there anything?
I'll come to me in a minute.

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I'm going to quiz you for a
while.

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I'm the interview.
I'm leading this podcast, if you

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didn't realise.
Actually, I'm.

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Yeah, I'm sorry, sorry.
We're going to go back to the

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episode where you talked 95%.
Of the time, yeah.

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You was there anything that
every episode.

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Yeah, this is it.
Now I'm just the.

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Come on, Jonathan Ross.
Is there anything you didn't

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expect to miss that you do miss?
You think, actually, I really do

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miss this from school, from the
classroom that you maybe didn't

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anticipate straight away,
unbelievably.

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I miss interacting with people,
but he's very unbelievable for

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you, like genuinely, because
even though you know anyone

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who's worked for me will know
that I am very, I keep myself to

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myself.
It's the kind of thing that I

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remember the head teacher even
said to me once he was like, oh,

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thank you, do a great job.
You just keep yourself to keep

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yourself to yourself and crack
on.

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And he meant it only in a
positive way.

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But I was like, oh, OK, clearly
does come across like I'm not

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the most chatty person.
I don't really do small talk,

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but what I really enjoyed was
still having a team, some people

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I could talk to every now and
then, knowing that that was part

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of something, you know what I
mean?

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And have you still got that kind
of community aspect with the

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team of working with maths?
They're amazing people.

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I absolutely love working with
them.

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But a lot of time is now spent
me sat in that chair over there

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doing work on the computer, not
necessarily the most inspiring

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work in the world.
I knew that I'd miss actually

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teaching the children and
nothing comes close to that in

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terms of how to spend my time,
but I knew that was going to

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happen.
But yeah, in terms of your

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question, what do I not expect
to miss?

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I think I find myself sometimes
at like half two thinking I've

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not actually interacted with
another human being at all.

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And even though I wasn't
necessarily doing my colleagues

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all the time, I did it every now
and then.

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I was interacting with people
all the time and my kids in

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front of me all the time.
I was constantly interacting,

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constantly talking, constantly
chatting, had my teaching

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assistants in the room whenever
they're with me.

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I was part of a team, Yeah.
I missed that more than I.

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Thought I would.
Sometimes you don't realise the

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passive benefits of just being
around people.

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Even if you don't feel like
you're actively going, I'm going

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to go and interact with this
person.

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You're obviously interacting
with people, including children

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all the time.
You just take for granted.

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I feel exactly the same.
Like I again, I knew that I had

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missed the kids, but I don't
think I realised how much it

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would impact me mentally.
Like I'm definitely struggling

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more than I thought I would in
terms of just being at home all

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the time.
People always said I was.

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I guess I was kind of
anticipating it based on the

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fact that everyone ever says to
me who works from home, they're

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always like, oh, give it some
time.

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You'll start getting bored.
You'll be your home.

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Body.
I know, which is why I thought

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maybe I wouldn't really mind
that much, but I, but I think I

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do like, I think, I think
sometimes the days go by and I'm

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not, I don't feel like I'm
naturally as motivated sometimes

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and I'm like, oh, maybe I, maybe
I do just need to get out of the

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house and do something.
Even even the teaching days

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where you think you come home,
you think, Oh my God, that was

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such a slog.
There was something to be said

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about the reward of coming home,
and that sounds really.

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Silly.
Yeah, I know what you mean.

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Like even when you've had a
tough day, at the end of that

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day being like, do you know
what, I'm going to mark this in

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the morning, I'm going to head
home.

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That felt nice.
That felt good because it was so

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tough.
I could appreciate how nice it

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was.
Whereas when I'm at home, I'm

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like, I'll roll out of bed and
walk for four steps to my Home

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Office and then work there all
day.

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And then when the day kind of
finishes, I'm like, what do I

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just move out of this room
again?

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And then I'm back in my kitchen
and that's kind of it.

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There's no, it's all closer.
Yeah.

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It's just odd.
I never really anticipated this

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and how like mentally I make
some days I just feel a bit

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like, yeah, there's not much.
There's not enough change

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happening.
So that's the only bit I'd say

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I'm struggling with that I
didn't really think of.

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You know, we've been working
with you.

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We're we're building our mass
platform.

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Yeah.
And we're working with some

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people from a brand called Story
Zoo.

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We spoke to Sophie on this
podcast when we were leaving.

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She left teaching, went into
that world.

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And there was a few
opportunities in the past where

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we've had to like, go and
physically do something with

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them.
I went up to Birmingham recently

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to a, it was like a SEND show,
helping children with additional

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needs.
And Sophie was running a stand

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with her husband, Sam.
And I went as well.

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And it was US 3 and we were
talking to send codes and it was

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all about stories.
You know, if you go and check

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out stories, it's this kind of
platform that they're building

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to help home readers, to
encourage reading.

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It's had some really, really
good beneficial outcomes for

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children just to get them being
able to just access things

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that's suitable for them.
And there's a lot of SEND kind

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of adjustments they're making in
terms of, you know, that think

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of traditional overlays,
etcetera.

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And there's a lot of discussion
around that.

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But it's there as an option, the
type of text you have,

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accessibility options, go and
have a look because it's really

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good what they're doing.
But the point I had is there was

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just just going there and being
able to spend the day talking to

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people, talking to people who
are working at Sencos in school.

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That's kind of think where my
push recently has come from.

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Being like this is such a hard
job for you guys.

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And every single person we spoke
to was so passionate about

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helping children.
And I miss that.

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I don't get that as much when
I'm sat there.

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You know, we've been making
arithmetic tests.

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You know, we've been sat there
building arithmetic tests for

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every year group.
Can't wait to release those as

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well.
We're just plugging everything

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here.
But it's really exciting.

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It's really fun, but nothing can
replace being in a room with

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passionate people being in a
room and talking to people who

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00:08:51,200 --> 00:08:52,680
are passionate about helping
children.

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00:08:53,160 --> 00:08:55,400
And I just, I'm going to take
every opportunity I can.

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00:08:55,400 --> 00:08:56,680
Do you know what I mean?
I want to go to shows.

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00:08:56,840 --> 00:08:59,440
We're going to go to the BET
show in January, talk to some

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00:08:59,440 --> 00:09:00,880
educators.
We're going to go to as many as

232
00:09:00,880 --> 00:09:02,320
we can.
And I think we need to keep

233
00:09:02,320 --> 00:09:03,640
doing that.
That's that's what I'd reflect

234
00:09:03,640 --> 00:09:07,600
and I'd say to you now, like we
have to keep making sure we have

235
00:09:07,600 --> 00:09:11,360
things in our calendar that are
physical face to face, talking

236
00:09:11,360 --> 00:09:14,280
to people who work in schools
all the time.

237
00:09:14,280 --> 00:09:14,840
Definitely.
And.

238
00:09:15,120 --> 00:09:17,800
Getting in schools, I know we've
been invited to a school to come

239
00:09:17,800 --> 00:09:19,840
and see how they do play,
continuous play, and I'm like,

240
00:09:19,840 --> 00:09:21,280
I'm buzzer.
I want to do that so badly.

241
00:09:21,280 --> 00:09:23,880
I just want to get in school and
honestly I just want to be in

242
00:09:23,880 --> 00:09:25,600
that that that buzz again and
just interact with.

243
00:09:25,960 --> 00:09:27,960
What you're listening fighters
along?

244
00:09:28,120 --> 00:09:29,680
Absolutely.
Especially if you're in Kent.

245
00:09:29,680 --> 00:09:31,360
If you're in school in Kent,
we'll come.

246
00:09:31,360 --> 00:09:33,160
We'll happily come to your
school and have a look around,

247
00:09:33,160 --> 00:09:34,680
have chat, be really good.
Bumble around.

248
00:09:34,680 --> 00:09:36,280
Just walk around pretending
we're retired.

249
00:09:36,360 --> 00:09:38,240
Yeah, we're just retired.
We just walk around schools.

250
00:09:38,240 --> 00:09:40,000
Now there's one thing I wanted
to talk about.

251
00:09:40,760 --> 00:09:42,920
What we're doing is catch up.
You talked about things that

252
00:09:43,160 --> 00:09:45,160
maybe you didn't realise would
be a negative.

253
00:09:45,640 --> 00:09:48,400
Has there been any point then in
the last couple of months where

254
00:09:48,400 --> 00:09:52,040
you've thought, Oh my God, yeah,
this is what I thought, This is

255
00:09:52,040 --> 00:09:53,800
why I expect it's better than I
thought.

256
00:09:54,080 --> 00:09:56,120
Definitely.
And it is very much linked to

257
00:09:56,120 --> 00:09:59,160
your whole flexibility thing is
the fact that we're in complete

258
00:09:59,160 --> 00:10:01,080
control now of when we do
things.

259
00:10:01,160 --> 00:10:03,520
So having multiple occasions now
where I've literally said to

260
00:10:03,520 --> 00:10:06,920
you, I am doing this thing with
my daughter and Lauren all day

261
00:10:06,920 --> 00:10:08,280
today.
I'll do the bits of work we're

262
00:10:08,280 --> 00:10:09,960
doing tonight.
You do all the time, all the.

263
00:10:09,960 --> 00:10:12,520
Time every day in fact, and I
don't do it an evening, but like

264
00:10:12,800 --> 00:10:15,440
that is such a privilege and
it's so easy to come very

265
00:10:15,440 --> 00:10:17,920
quickly, forget how much of A
privilege that is because it

266
00:10:17,920 --> 00:10:20,520
just becomes your normal life.
And I'll look at the, you know,

267
00:10:20,600 --> 00:10:21,920
I'll realise it's the school
run.

268
00:10:21,920 --> 00:10:23,320
I didn't realise, you know,
there'll be loads of people

269
00:10:23,320 --> 00:10:25,080
frantic going around.
What are these people doing on

270
00:10:25,080 --> 00:10:28,160
the streets?
God, get out of here, you know,

271
00:10:28,160 --> 00:10:29,600
get out of my way.
I'm trying to have a nice day.

272
00:10:29,920 --> 00:10:32,160
And then it's those moments
where I'm like, Oh yeah, the

273
00:10:32,160 --> 00:10:34,320
majority of people are just,
whether they like it or not,

274
00:10:34,320 --> 00:10:36,000
just at work doing their job
right now.

275
00:10:36,000 --> 00:10:38,520
And, and in this moment, the
flexibility that I've managed to

276
00:10:38,760 --> 00:10:40,040
have.
And yes, it did come up, like

277
00:10:40,040 --> 00:10:41,960
you said, a massive pay cut.
I'm not going to pretend that

278
00:10:41,960 --> 00:10:44,880
everything is like everything
has just exponentially got

279
00:10:44,880 --> 00:10:48,320
better, but that is a huge perk.
And that to me, I'm like, oh

280
00:10:48,320 --> 00:10:50,480
God, I, I don't think I could
trade this back in because I get

281
00:10:50,480 --> 00:10:53,120
to, I can spend some time with
my child now at times when I

282
00:10:53,120 --> 00:10:55,000
normally wouldn't be able to.
So that's really lovely.

283
00:10:55,240 --> 00:10:56,920
Do you think I'm listening to
this now?

284
00:10:57,080 --> 00:10:59,680
I'd love to know what people are
thinking because my thought

285
00:10:59,680 --> 00:11:03,360
genuinely is just like, oh shut
up, you 2 going on and on about

286
00:11:03,360 --> 00:11:05,520
how great it is and you know,
people can't do it, etcetera.

287
00:11:05,520 --> 00:11:07,080
And there's loads of people
listening who are on their way

288
00:11:07,080 --> 00:11:09,760
to school who are wishing maybe
they had something similar.

289
00:11:10,280 --> 00:11:12,360
And it's not necessarily maybe
helpful to hear us have this

290
00:11:12,360 --> 00:11:13,640
conversation.
Obviously we're going to catch

291
00:11:13,640 --> 00:11:14,760
up about it.
It's been real.

292
00:11:15,320 --> 00:11:18,920
So I guess maybe the last thing
we can round up on then is just

293
00:11:18,920 --> 00:11:21,760
do you think we've already lost
a bit of touch with teaching?

294
00:11:22,200 --> 00:11:24,000
Do you think we've already lost
a little bit of something?

295
00:11:24,360 --> 00:11:27,000
Or is it just a case of just
with describing how it is?

296
00:11:27,000 --> 00:11:28,160
Guys, I don't think we've lost
touch yet.

297
00:11:28,360 --> 00:11:30,760
I think everyone thinks they
don't lose touch, and I don't

298
00:11:30,760 --> 00:11:32,040
think I've lost touch at all
with teaching.

299
00:11:32,040 --> 00:11:34,520
And maybe that's due to the fact
that it has only been a couple

300
00:11:34,520 --> 00:11:37,000
of months, right, For a start,
yeah, I don't personally think

301
00:11:37,000 --> 00:11:38,600
I've lost touch with teaching.
I think because we do this and

302
00:11:38,600 --> 00:11:41,360
we're still so involved in
education, I think maybe if I'd

303
00:11:41,360 --> 00:11:43,680
quit teaching to go and work on
the trains, right?

304
00:11:44,000 --> 00:11:45,840
And that was what I did and I
didn't, I just had no

305
00:11:45,840 --> 00:11:47,760
involvement in education any
more than maybe after a couple

306
00:11:47,760 --> 00:11:48,880
of months, I'd start to lose
touch.

307
00:11:48,880 --> 00:11:52,080
But I think because we keep our
ear to the ground and we talk to

308
00:11:52,080 --> 00:11:54,000
a lot of educators and we keep
up with the news and we do this

309
00:11:54,000 --> 00:11:55,640
podcast and obviously
researching things.

310
00:11:56,080 --> 00:11:58,320
I run their socials.
You run all the socials and

311
00:11:58,320 --> 00:12:01,840
build our Instagram up to 50K
followers, that sort of thing, I

312
00:12:01,840 --> 00:12:03,040
think.
Therefore, I don't think I've

313
00:12:03,040 --> 00:12:04,640
lost touch.
No, I don't think I've lost

314
00:12:04,640 --> 00:12:05,880
touch at all.
No, I don't think at all.

315
00:12:05,880 --> 00:12:08,760
Do you think we won't?
There'll be a point where we do,

316
00:12:08,760 --> 00:12:10,920
maybe.
There'll certainly be a point

317
00:12:10,920 --> 00:12:15,640
where we do in terms of from the
outlook of a classroom teacher.

318
00:12:15,640 --> 00:12:19,960
Yeah, that will happen with the
best of intentions, you know,

319
00:12:19,960 --> 00:12:22,200
people who still stay in
education and still maybe go and

320
00:12:22,200 --> 00:12:25,040
do some training or something
or, you know, just do, oh, I'm

321
00:12:25,080 --> 00:12:27,280
just going to do a lesson every
now and then, but I've got a

322
00:12:27,280 --> 00:12:30,240
million other things going on.
Yeah, you just will naturally.

323
00:12:30,240 --> 00:12:32,760
But I think by, you know,
submersing ourself in this

324
00:12:32,760 --> 00:12:35,160
culture, talking to teachers all
the time, we've got our WhatsApp

325
00:12:35,160 --> 00:12:38,840
community where we literally
have over like 200 people in a

326
00:12:38,840 --> 00:12:40,720
WhatsApp community talking to
each other, helping each other

327
00:12:40,720 --> 00:12:41,880
out.
I love keeping my ear to the

328
00:12:41,880 --> 00:12:43,720
ground here, helping people.
It's so good.

329
00:12:43,720 --> 00:12:46,440
Honestly, I would say to you, if
you're looking for a community,

330
00:12:46,720 --> 00:12:48,640
click the link down below
because it is really, really,

331
00:12:48,640 --> 00:12:50,760
really nice and people are so
lovely.

332
00:12:51,000 --> 00:12:52,560
I just, I think that's what it
is.

333
00:12:53,080 --> 00:12:56,000
I miss being around lovely
people and teaching and

334
00:12:56,000 --> 00:12:59,320
education and schools in general
seem to attract the most lovely

335
00:12:59,320 --> 00:13:01,600
people I've ever met.
You know, down to teaching

336
00:13:01,600 --> 00:13:04,280
assistants, you know, people who
help us serve the school

337
00:13:04,280 --> 00:13:07,760
dinners, site managers.
I'm talking about all those

338
00:13:07,760 --> 00:13:09,880
people as well as the obvious
classroom teachers, etcetera.

339
00:13:10,640 --> 00:13:12,800
The people on the ground doing
jobs or working in schools,

340
00:13:13,200 --> 00:13:15,120
they're not doing it for the
pay, are they?

341
00:13:15,480 --> 00:13:17,120
They're not doing it for the
pay, let's be real.

342
00:13:17,400 --> 00:13:19,440
And they tend to be the most
lovely people that want to help

343
00:13:19,440 --> 00:13:21,960
kids.
And and that's where I certainly

344
00:13:21,960 --> 00:13:24,560
feel like I'm missing it because
I'm talking to you hates.

345
00:13:25,360 --> 00:13:26,200
Children I did 10.
Years.

346
00:13:26,760 --> 00:13:31,160
But no, jokes aside, that's
where I feel like I'm like, am I

347
00:13:31,160 --> 00:13:33,920
losing touch because I'm not in
the classroom every single day?

348
00:13:34,520 --> 00:13:37,000
Eventually, I definitely will.
I don't think I am.

349
00:13:37,160 --> 00:13:39,880
You know, we've got a huge
listener race to this podcast

350
00:13:39,880 --> 00:13:42,760
now, and I'd like to think that
they also don't think, please,

351
00:13:43,280 --> 00:13:45,560
hopefully, hopefully.
If you do think it, don't tell.

352
00:13:46,720 --> 00:13:48,600
Us well, if anything, if you
look at the numbers on our

353
00:13:48,600 --> 00:13:50,560
podcast since we quit and
started doing a couple episodes

354
00:13:50,560 --> 00:13:53,040
a week, listen to questions.
But in the community it's grown.

355
00:13:53,040 --> 00:13:56,480
If anything, I think we're now I
think IA is A1 and truly to the

356
00:13:56,480 --> 00:13:58,600
ground.
But yeah, personal nice little

357
00:13:58,600 --> 00:14:02,120
catch up there.
I would say it was the right

358
00:14:02,160 --> 00:14:04,640
choice.
I don't have regrets, that's for

359
00:14:04,640 --> 00:14:05,200
sure.
What about you?

360
00:14:05,200 --> 00:14:07,760
Do you have regrets?
Overall, no, I don't regret it,

361
00:14:07,840 --> 00:14:10,600
but like I said, like I don't I
don't what I don't want to make

362
00:14:10,600 --> 00:14:13,160
people think is the grass is
just always greener, like in in

363
00:14:13,160 --> 00:14:14,520
every situation, because it's
genuine.

364
00:14:14,520 --> 00:14:16,240
Isn't I've I think I've been
quite honest about a few of the

365
00:14:16,240 --> 00:14:18,240
things I struggle with at the
moment, and I need to make some

366
00:14:18,240 --> 00:14:19,400
changes.
Like I'm definitely have to

367
00:14:19,400 --> 00:14:21,720
change my life a bit in terms of
exercise.

368
00:14:22,320 --> 00:14:24,360
Genuinely honest.
You know, it sounds silly, but

369
00:14:24,360 --> 00:14:26,720
like doesn't sound silly in
terms of like you normally make

370
00:14:26,720 --> 00:14:27,680
out of.
Exercise.

371
00:14:28,120 --> 00:14:31,240
But it's real, it's in exercise,
diet, genuinely just getting

372
00:14:31,240 --> 00:14:33,120
outside of to the house, looking
after my mental health.

373
00:14:33,440 --> 00:14:35,520
Ironically, I feel like I have
to do more than ever.

374
00:14:35,720 --> 00:14:37,760
And I come from a career in
teaching where I felt like

375
00:14:37,760 --> 00:14:40,600
mental health was such a huge
like it's it's something that

376
00:14:40,600 --> 00:14:41,600
was so high up in the
priorities.

377
00:14:41,600 --> 00:14:43,640
You have to look after yourself
because it can be such a burnout

378
00:14:43,640 --> 00:14:45,320
job.
And ironically, my mental health

379
00:14:45,320 --> 00:14:49,960
feels like it's arguably in the
most like it could potentially

380
00:14:49,960 --> 00:14:51,960
in the world.
Yeah, fragile place it's ever

381
00:14:51,960 --> 00:14:53,760
been.
So yeah, it's just I think it's

382
00:14:53,760 --> 00:14:55,120
good to talk about.
I think we should be honest and

383
00:14:55,120 --> 00:14:56,560
not just say, Oh yeah, it's all
great.

384
00:14:56,560 --> 00:14:57,680
And.
You know what you need to do?

385
00:14:57,680 --> 00:14:59,000
Genuinely be real with you right
now.

386
00:14:59,000 --> 00:15:01,520
You need to just bloody do it
because you've been saying this

387
00:15:01,520 --> 00:15:04,080
to me for over a month.
I know, like I know I'm doing

388
00:15:04,080 --> 00:15:06,440
this from a nice place now just
do it then I'm.

389
00:15:06,440 --> 00:15:09,080
Doing it now like I'm out of it.
I'm off to exercise, guys.

390
00:15:09,640 --> 00:15:11,080
That's great.
It's been a great one.

391
00:15:11,080 --> 00:15:14,760
Thanks for chilling.
In no, but honestly, because I

392
00:15:14,760 --> 00:15:16,520
need to do it as well.
Yeah, I'm talking to myself

393
00:15:16,520 --> 00:15:17,360
here.
Just do it.

394
00:15:17,440 --> 00:15:18,680
We all know what the right
answer is.

395
00:15:18,680 --> 00:15:20,760
You need to bloody do it.
Sometimes go for 1/2 an hour

396
00:15:20,760 --> 00:15:23,280
walk in the day.
I get too obsessed with work.

397
00:15:23,440 --> 00:15:26,280
Yeah, I'm so bad at drawing.
You've.

398
00:15:26,280 --> 00:15:28,760
Always been bad at that I'm.
Sorry, when I get up and I think

399
00:15:29,520 --> 00:15:32,080
I could, I could go and do a run
or something or I could just get

400
00:15:32,080 --> 00:15:33,720
on with the thing I've been
thinking about the last 12 hours

401
00:15:33,720 --> 00:15:35,760
because I want to continue doing
this job and building the thing

402
00:15:35,760 --> 00:15:37,840
we're building.
And I find it so hard to just be

403
00:15:37,840 --> 00:15:40,080
like, no, set a boundary.
You're not doing that.

404
00:15:40,080 --> 00:15:41,720
You're doing this thing first
and then you can carry on your

405
00:15:41,720 --> 00:15:42,840
work.
You might get a bit less done

406
00:15:42,840 --> 00:15:44,280
today, but.
If you're done.

407
00:15:44,440 --> 00:15:47,480
But if that's not, that's not
right this time you might get a

408
00:15:47,480 --> 00:15:48,680
bit less done, but but that's
OK.

409
00:15:48,680 --> 00:15:50,760
And I really struggle with that.
I'm like, Oh no, I can't.

410
00:15:50,760 --> 00:15:52,920
How can I possibly get less done
than I've already planned out in

411
00:15:52,920 --> 00:15:54,240
my head?
Yeah.

412
00:15:54,240 --> 00:15:55,520
So that you've you've.
Made.

413
00:15:55,520 --> 00:15:57,000
I've made-up.
Yeah, completely invented.

414
00:15:57,120 --> 00:15:58,840
Yeah, because I've like we're
literally accountable to

415
00:15:58,840 --> 00:16:00,600
ourselves.
I cannot use that excuse

416
00:16:00,600 --> 00:16:01,640
anymore.
At least before I could say

417
00:16:01,640 --> 00:16:03,680
yeah, well, the head teacher
needs it done or my team are

418
00:16:03,680 --> 00:16:05,680
waiting for this thing.
It's like, no, I literally, I'm

419
00:16:05,680 --> 00:16:07,600
making it up.
So yeah, I need.

420
00:16:07,800 --> 00:16:10,200
To I'll tell you what, your
personality very quickly you,

421
00:16:10,200 --> 00:16:12,600
you made-up, you had this
workaholic thing, right?

422
00:16:12,880 --> 00:16:15,560
If you didn't have the top dog
tutoring that we did and the

423
00:16:15,560 --> 00:16:17,680
side businesses, etcetera, and
everything we're focusing on

424
00:16:17,680 --> 00:16:19,920
whilst we're teaching, you would
have turned into the teacher

425
00:16:19,920 --> 00:16:21,640
that you say needs to calm down
and not do stuff.

426
00:16:22,040 --> 00:16:23,960
And you would have said that,
but still done all the stuff you

427
00:16:23,960 --> 00:16:26,160
would have done for school.
You kind of built that for you

428
00:16:26,160 --> 00:16:28,240
on the side where you could go
away and spend 3 hours a day

429
00:16:28,240 --> 00:16:30,680
doing something different and
easily be like, no, you need to

430
00:16:30,680 --> 00:16:32,400
say no to work.
So it's very interesting.

431
00:16:32,480 --> 00:16:34,080
So true.
You would have really struggled

432
00:16:34,080 --> 00:16:36,200
to be the person listening to us
I think, but unless you had the

433
00:16:36,200 --> 00:16:37,880
side stuff.
Think that would have happened

434
00:16:37,880 --> 00:16:38,720
ever?
I don't, I don't think that

435
00:16:38,720 --> 00:16:40,480
reality could have happened
because I think the only reason

436
00:16:40,480 --> 00:16:43,160
I did all of that stuff is
because I also immediately also

437
00:16:43,160 --> 00:16:46,400
appreciated that that is not OK
in terms of doing all that extra

438
00:16:46,400 --> 00:16:47,640
free workload.
And I was like, if I'm going to

439
00:16:47,640 --> 00:16:49,800
do that, I'm going to channel it
somewhere for my business, for

440
00:16:49,800 --> 00:16:53,680
my own, for my, for my business
where I'm not just giving up my

441
00:16:53,680 --> 00:16:55,080
all my time for free for
nothing.

442
00:16:55,080 --> 00:16:56,720
Like, yeah, great point.
So like, I don't think I was

443
00:16:56,720 --> 00:16:58,360
ever going to do that.
Yeah, brilliant.

444
00:16:58,400 --> 00:17:00,000
I was always going to do.
That's a good point.

445
00:17:00,120 --> 00:17:02,320
Anyway, Anyways, right, I've got
a little game for you.

446
00:17:02,320 --> 00:17:05,000
So last week you had a little
game for me.

447
00:17:05,000 --> 00:17:06,359
Embarrassed you.
You embarrassed me.

448
00:17:06,359 --> 00:17:08,520
I don't know what PFA was, which
haunts me.

449
00:17:08,800 --> 00:17:12,079
I couldn't believe parent
teachers friends frog friends

450
00:17:12,079 --> 00:17:14,440
association Dylan I learned I.
Love, by the way, if you go back

451
00:17:14,440 --> 00:17:17,359
and listen to it, you said a
word that doesn't begin with a

452
00:17:17,359 --> 00:17:18,480
after.
I know it was.

453
00:17:18,480 --> 00:17:22,480
I said trust or something.
Yeah, trust PTC.

454
00:17:24,119 --> 00:17:25,480
I literally thought that.
I'm glad you brought it out.

455
00:17:25,480 --> 00:17:26,440
Thanks for embarrassing me
again.

456
00:17:26,440 --> 00:17:27,880
No problem.
So I'm going to try to embarrass

457
00:17:27,880 --> 00:17:28,440
you now.
I've.

458
00:17:28,440 --> 00:17:30,680
I've got literally just five
questions and they're true or

459
00:17:30,680 --> 00:17:32,160
false.
OK, OK, that is it.

460
00:17:32,520 --> 00:17:34,880
All right, so let's see if you
have lost touch for education.

461
00:17:34,960 --> 00:17:36,840
Oh, OK.
All right.

462
00:17:36,840 --> 00:17:42,720
Let's just see right 24.7% of
pupils in state funded schools

463
00:17:42,920 --> 00:17:45,880
in England were eligible for
free school meals in January

464
00:17:45,880 --> 00:17:48,320
2025.
Is that true or false?

465
00:17:48,960 --> 00:17:50,560
False.
I think it's higher.

466
00:17:50,880 --> 00:17:51,640
You think it's higher?
Yeah.

467
00:17:52,360 --> 00:17:54,680
It's not 24.7%.
You're correct, it's false.

468
00:17:54,680 --> 00:17:58,720
It's 25.7%.
Free school meal eligibility is

469
00:17:58,720 --> 00:18:02,000
up from the previous year
despite there being 60,000 fewer

470
00:18:02,000 --> 00:18:03,200
children in school.
Oh my.

471
00:18:04,000 --> 00:18:06,760
Gosh. 60,000 fewer children in.
School and the previous year.

472
00:18:07,520 --> 00:18:09,520
But free school meal eligibility
is higher.

473
00:18:09,880 --> 00:18:12,520
Yeah, it's true.
Like I'm glad I got that right

474
00:18:12,520 --> 00:18:16,880
because I, I remember a cohort
that I had one year quite

475
00:18:16,880 --> 00:18:21,320
recently went to, I think it was
34% free school males because we

476
00:18:21,320 --> 00:18:22,600
work in a slightly more deprived
area.

477
00:18:22,600 --> 00:18:24,080
But how many?
Kids and it was more deprived

478
00:18:24,080 --> 00:18:26,320
area we worked in.
But then like again, if you

479
00:18:26,320 --> 00:18:28,360
think about the average is 25%,
right?

480
00:18:28,360 --> 00:18:29,400
There'll be people listening
though.

481
00:18:29,920 --> 00:18:32,400
My school's 42%, my school's
45%.

482
00:18:33,000 --> 00:18:36,360
Just shows you the range we have
and the post code lottery that

483
00:18:36,360 --> 00:18:39,520
we have.
And funnily enough, you know,

484
00:18:39,760 --> 00:18:43,360
I've had schools, I've seen
schools before who can do lots

485
00:18:43,360 --> 00:18:45,280
of amazing stuff for their
children because they have the

486
00:18:45,280 --> 00:18:47,280
high percentage.
That's how it should work, isn't

487
00:18:47,280 --> 00:18:48,240
it?
You know, of course if these

488
00:18:48,240 --> 00:18:50,840
children lower deprived areas,
schools should get a bit more

489
00:18:50,840 --> 00:18:52,240
money to be able to then
provide.

490
00:18:52,480 --> 00:18:55,720
I know a local school near near
me who has a very high level of

491
00:18:55,720 --> 00:18:59,640
pupil premium free school meal
eligibility who have made the

492
00:18:59,640 --> 00:19:01,360
decision to have free school
meals for everyone.

493
00:19:01,360 --> 00:19:03,680
Yeah, I know for the.
Whole for everyone who goes to

494
00:19:03,680 --> 00:19:06,080
that school, they have free
school meals and I'm just like

495
00:19:06,960 --> 00:19:09,480
fantastic.
You know, whether you fall into

496
00:19:09,480 --> 00:19:12,600
eligibility criteria or not, you
should still get more if you

497
00:19:12,600 --> 00:19:13,680
need that.
But that all they did was they

498
00:19:13,680 --> 00:19:15,200
looked at their community and
they went do you know what?

499
00:19:15,200 --> 00:19:18,680
OK, this line we've made let's
just serve our community and

500
00:19:18,680 --> 00:19:21,800
feed children and I was so good
and they have a really high you

501
00:19:21,800 --> 00:19:24,800
know, level of need and it just
took that out for parents.

502
00:19:24,840 --> 00:19:26,840
Just take that out completely
because they had the funding to

503
00:19:26,840 --> 00:19:28,480
do it as it should be.
Yeah, definitely.

504
00:19:28,480 --> 00:19:30,920
As we should be doing.
It's mad to think that people

505
00:19:30,920 --> 00:19:33,360
would be like, have such like, I
know there'll be people out

506
00:19:33,360 --> 00:19:34,840
there that would be like, that's
terrorised.

507
00:19:34,840 --> 00:19:36,680
You should.
Feed your own.

508
00:19:38,360 --> 00:19:41,000
Exactly like that.
OK, you should.

509
00:19:41,600 --> 00:19:42,600
Cool.
You should.

510
00:19:44,160 --> 00:19:46,840
I don't care though.
I'm going to feed kids.

511
00:19:46,960 --> 00:19:50,480
Yeah, I'm going to feed kids.
And like, OK, you can honestly

512
00:19:50,480 --> 00:19:52,760
sit there and tell me why that's
wrong.

513
00:19:52,760 --> 00:19:56,800
So until you're red in the face
and I'll just be like, all

514
00:19:56,800 --> 00:19:58,160
right, well, I think we should
feed kids.

515
00:19:58,160 --> 00:20:00,040
That's the end of the
discussion.

516
00:20:00,040 --> 00:20:01,440
Yeah, don't care.
Children, them.

517
00:20:01,440 --> 00:20:03,680
I don't care.
I just you are.

518
00:20:03,680 --> 00:20:04,840
The parents should feed them.
OK?

519
00:20:04,840 --> 00:20:06,120
They can spend their money on
something else.

520
00:20:06,240 --> 00:20:08,720
Yeah, they can take it to
something and go to the museum

521
00:20:08,720 --> 00:20:09,960
now, Yeah.
Whatever, whatever.

522
00:20:11,320 --> 00:20:11,800
Don't care.
They.

523
00:20:11,800 --> 00:20:13,040
Can go and take Roy for the.
Country.

524
00:20:13,040 --> 00:20:15,400
They'll just be going to buy
some facts from Carter Shop.

525
00:20:15,400 --> 00:20:16,560
They were going to do that
anyway.

526
00:20:16,800 --> 00:20:18,480
Yeah, they were going to do that
anyway.

527
00:20:19,080 --> 00:20:20,640
It just means they had less
money for their children at the

528
00:20:20,640 --> 00:20:22,160
end.
So if we cover the food, there's

529
00:20:22,160 --> 00:20:23,560
more money for the kids.
Yeah, Yeah.

530
00:20:23,560 --> 00:20:25,680
We can guarantee something,
yeah, that they're going to get

531
00:20:25,680 --> 00:20:27,800
fed 5%.
Oh well, they just fed that, but

532
00:20:27,800 --> 00:20:29,160
no, no, no no, no.
Kid got fed.

533
00:20:30,280 --> 00:20:33,120
I ended it and kid got fed.
There you go.

534
00:20:33,120 --> 00:20:34,640
Sorry to say as well, you're
being passionate and you ignore

535
00:20:34,640 --> 00:20:36,040
my joke about taking Roy to see
trains.

536
00:20:36,320 --> 00:20:38,080
So can you please acknowledge
the fact that I'm.

537
00:20:38,120 --> 00:20:40,200
Joking.
We went to see Rory, we went to

538
00:20:40,200 --> 00:20:41,520
see Rory, we took Roy to see
some trains.

539
00:20:41,680 --> 00:20:44,080
Funny enough, his ticket was
free so there's no money and.

540
00:20:44,080 --> 00:20:45,600
How long did he spend looking at
that?

541
00:20:46,720 --> 00:20:50,480
It's me, a long time, like
father, like son, who wants to

542
00:20:50,480 --> 00:20:52,640
press that button to make the
train guys so funny.

543
00:20:52,680 --> 00:20:54,840
Yeah, it was really good.
Wonder works in Margate if

544
00:20:54,840 --> 00:20:57,680
anyone is like remotely local to
where we are, it's like a hidden

545
00:20:57,680 --> 00:20:59,280
gem.
Something interesting about

546
00:20:59,280 --> 00:21:02,400
anyway one nil to me.
One nil bit annoyingly so.

547
00:21:02,400 --> 00:21:04,960
Next question.
By the way, sorry very quickly,

548
00:21:05,080 --> 00:21:08,280
you didn't give me much leeway
on that exactly.

549
00:21:08,280 --> 00:21:09,880
It's higher.
It's nought point nought 1%

550
00:21:09,880 --> 00:21:10,640
higher.
Well done.

551
00:21:10,720 --> 00:21:13,760
Annoyingly, that was the joke,
but you were so in the zone I'll

552
00:21:13,760 --> 00:21:16,000
brush over it.
I literally made change by 1%

553
00:21:16,000 --> 00:21:17,960
hoping you get it wrong and then
get annoyed at the fact that I'd

554
00:21:17,960 --> 00:21:19,720
made it 1% different.
You got it right you.

555
00:21:19,880 --> 00:21:20,920
Got it right and I still got
annoyed.

556
00:21:20,920 --> 00:21:22,480
It's like, no, it's waiting this
next.

557
00:21:22,480 --> 00:21:26,120
Ruin my joke.
There were 6,424,321.

558
00:21:26,120 --> 00:21:29,800
Children in the UK but OK ready
The Northeast has seen the

559
00:21:29,800 --> 00:21:34,600
biggest fall in trainee teachers
in England, down by 56% since

560
00:21:34,600 --> 00:21:36,920
2019-2020.
Right, OK, listen, is the true

561
00:21:36,920 --> 00:21:40,720
or false thing here the exact #4
or is it that the Northeast is

562
00:21:40,720 --> 00:21:42,360
is dropping?
It's a true or false game mate.

563
00:21:42,960 --> 00:21:44,880
You've really set me up.
It's a true or false game.

564
00:21:45,040 --> 00:21:48,240
True.
Damn it, you're ruining my game.

565
00:21:49,440 --> 00:21:50,640
True.
I was supposed to throw you off

566
00:21:50,640 --> 00:21:52,360
and you're like, oh, you've
messed me up.

567
00:21:52,440 --> 00:21:54,840
That is true.
Your narrative is not worth.

568
00:21:54,840 --> 00:21:57,240
It's really, really rude.
Every single rest of them is

569
00:21:57,240 --> 00:21:58,600
true, isn't?
It if you I'll tell you what if

570
00:21:58,600 --> 00:22:01,320
you get, I'll actually be
considering I've purposely made

571
00:22:01,320 --> 00:22:03,240
this to try and make you get it
wrong so I can make a fool of

572
00:22:03,240 --> 00:22:04,440
you.
If you get 5 out of five on

573
00:22:04,440 --> 00:22:06,320
this, I'm walking out and doing
some exercise.

574
00:22:07,360 --> 00:22:08,440
And get me a pack of Whisper
Gold.

575
00:22:09,120 --> 00:22:10,280
I promise you.
All right, go on.

576
00:22:10,440 --> 00:22:12,080
Can I get a whisper gold per
answer?

577
00:22:12,080 --> 00:22:13,560
I'm already on 2.
This is now, this is the deal.

578
00:22:13,560 --> 00:22:14,520
OK, I'm going to go middle
ground.

579
00:22:14,880 --> 00:22:17,520
If you get 4 or five out of
five, I'll give you a bit of

580
00:22:17,520 --> 00:22:19,560
leeway there.
One I will go and and to Tesco's

581
00:22:19,560 --> 00:22:20,880
after this and buy you a pack of
Whisper Golds.

582
00:22:21,040 --> 00:22:23,640
I can't wait to post that with
no context on Instagram and then

583
00:22:23,640 --> 00:22:26,120
when people eventually that is
the deal, they'll know why.

584
00:22:26,560 --> 00:22:29,000
Bearing in mind by this point I
was adamant you'd be on zero out

585
00:22:29,000 --> 00:22:31,400
of two 2, so you're on 2.
So just to repeat that one

586
00:22:31,400 --> 00:22:32,600
because if case you want to talk
about it.

587
00:22:32,760 --> 00:22:34,720
The Northeast has seen the
biggest fall in trainee teachers

588
00:22:34,720 --> 00:22:37,960
in England, down by 56% since
2019-2020.

589
00:22:37,960 --> 00:22:39,240
Why do you?
Think that if it's very quick,

590
00:22:39,240 --> 00:22:42,040
if it was down by 54% would you
have said I was wrong in saying

591
00:22:42,040 --> 00:22:48,320
it was true?
Yeah, I was really open that you

592
00:22:48,320 --> 00:22:50,400
were going to try and double
bluff me and think you've

593
00:22:50,400 --> 00:22:52,920
made-up you've you've changed it
by 1 and I but no, it's true.

594
00:22:53,640 --> 00:22:55,760
Do you know what, I'm not even
going to pretend to be an expert

595
00:22:55,760 --> 00:22:57,400
on this kind of thing in terms
of different parts of the

596
00:22:57,400 --> 00:22:59,440
country, but it doesn't surprise
me.

597
00:22:59,720 --> 00:23:01,680
And again, we've got listed up
in the Northeast.

598
00:23:02,520 --> 00:23:04,680
I'd love to hear more because
I'm always hearing in the news

599
00:23:04,680 --> 00:23:06,720
about the North-south divide,
the amount of money in different

600
00:23:06,720 --> 00:23:10,480
areas, deprivation, etcetera.
It, it doesn't shock me that

601
00:23:10,480 --> 00:23:13,520
that's been lowering up there.
It's a real shame.

602
00:23:13,520 --> 00:23:15,600
We need as many teachers from as
many different backgrounds as

603
00:23:15,600 --> 00:23:17,520
possible.
And it's such a shame when it it

604
00:23:17,520 --> 00:23:21,520
feels sometimes like affluence
links to, you know, how many

605
00:23:21,520 --> 00:23:24,200
teachers we get.
And it's like a huge amount of

606
00:23:24,200 --> 00:23:26,560
teachers are, you know, white
middle class people.

607
00:23:26,960 --> 00:23:29,640
And I think it's best for our
children to have the most

608
00:23:29,640 --> 00:23:33,040
diverse range of, of teachers,
not only racially, obviously,

609
00:23:33,040 --> 00:23:35,760
but just in terms of, you know,
affluence class, etcetera.

610
00:23:36,040 --> 00:23:38,680
Kids need to see everyone.
So the the more the better.

611
00:23:38,680 --> 00:23:40,640
And it's worrying that, you
know, that part of the country

612
00:23:40,640 --> 00:23:42,200
seems to be falling.
Yeah, it's down a lot.

613
00:23:42,200 --> 00:23:43,680
I was genuinely shocked at the
number.

614
00:23:43,680 --> 00:23:47,160
It's such a huge amount.
Right, next one honestly ruining

615
00:23:47,160 --> 00:23:50,240
my game. 20.
Percent of pupils in the 2024 to

616
00:23:50,240 --> 00:23:53,440
2025 academic year were
classified as persistently

617
00:23:53,440 --> 00:23:55,360
absent.
And just to make sure you know

618
00:23:55,360 --> 00:23:58,240
exactly what that means, that
is, they missed 10% or more of

619
00:23:58,240 --> 00:23:59,560
possible sessions.
That's how you define

620
00:23:59,560 --> 00:24:00,400
persistently.
Absent.

621
00:24:00,480 --> 00:24:01,480
It's false.
It's fewer.

622
00:24:01,480 --> 00:24:05,480
It's less than that, I think.
He's got three out of three.

623
00:24:05,800 --> 00:24:07,040
It is false.
Not for that reason.

624
00:24:07,040 --> 00:24:12,480
It was the 2023 to 2024 year,
all right.

625
00:24:12,520 --> 00:24:14,360
I can't believe I was in this
game so.

626
00:24:14,600 --> 00:24:16,240
I thought it was in the teens,
that percentage.

627
00:24:16,240 --> 00:24:17,520
That's interesting.
Maybe when I saw.

628
00:24:17,600 --> 00:24:20,360
It, well it has come down a bit.
So for context, the previous

629
00:24:20,360 --> 00:24:25,480
2022-2023 it was 21.2% and it
went down to 20%.

630
00:24:25,480 --> 00:24:26,720
So it's ever so slight change.
Do you?

631
00:24:26,720 --> 00:24:30,200
Think fines are working I.
Don't know it's still 20% of

632
00:24:30,200 --> 00:24:31,240
children.
Yeah, it's a lot and.

633
00:24:31,560 --> 00:24:33,400
There's so much persistently
absent.

634
00:24:33,440 --> 00:24:35,240
Just maybe there's 1% become
homeschooled.

635
00:24:36,080 --> 00:24:38,520
Yeah, potentially, potentially,
I don't know, but yeah, I

636
00:24:38,520 --> 00:24:39,120
thought it was a.
Shocking.

637
00:24:39,440 --> 00:24:40,840
That's a.
That's a high bar though, isn't

638
00:24:40,840 --> 00:24:42,840
it as well to have that many
reaching that high of a bar?

639
00:24:42,840 --> 00:24:45,800
What was the definition again?
So it's so they missed 10% or

640
00:24:45,800 --> 00:24:48,880
more of possible sessions.
So that's so in sessions,

641
00:24:48,880 --> 00:24:51,440
because absence is done in
sessions, which is 2 a day.

642
00:24:51,880 --> 00:24:53,800
So that's why you do 2 registers
more than an afternoon.

643
00:24:53,800 --> 00:24:57,120
So 10%.
So that's one session.

644
00:24:57,120 --> 00:24:58,680
That's half a day every week.
Yeah.

645
00:24:58,760 --> 00:25:03,440
So one day every two weeks.
So one in five children are

646
00:25:03,440 --> 00:25:06,640
missing more than a day every
two weeks.

647
00:25:06,640 --> 00:25:08,640
Yeah.
That's a lot, Yeah, it's a lot,

648
00:25:08,640 --> 00:25:09,360
isn't it?
That's a lot.

649
00:25:09,440 --> 00:25:13,800
It's a lot, I guess if you have
a week long holiday that that

650
00:25:13,800 --> 00:25:16,840
ratio means what's that?
A week long holiday is 10

651
00:25:16,840 --> 00:25:18,800
sessions, Yeah.
So that's 10 weeks, right.

652
00:25:19,120 --> 00:25:21,160
So you can go on one week long.
Holiday, that's such a good

653
00:25:21,160 --> 00:25:22,640
point.
If you go on one week long

654
00:25:22,640 --> 00:25:26,840
holiday in a big time, you are
technically could be classed as

655
00:25:26,840 --> 00:25:27,800
persistently absent.
Yeah.

656
00:25:29,080 --> 00:25:31,000
But then I guess, yeah, that's
interesting.

657
00:25:31,000 --> 00:25:33,240
And even if, like, let's say if
you took the holiday out right

658
00:25:33,240 --> 00:25:35,360
across the whole year, let's
say, you wouldn't have tipped

659
00:25:35,360 --> 00:25:37,520
into that persistently absent
bit, but the holiday topped it

660
00:25:37,560 --> 00:25:40,640
up.
So 10% on 190 days, that's 19

661
00:25:40,640 --> 00:25:42,800
days, Yeah.
So 19 days off a year is

662
00:25:42,800 --> 00:25:45,200
persistent. 19 days off a year
sounds like quite a lot.

663
00:25:45,200 --> 00:25:47,840
It does, didn't it?
Like, you know, we talk about

664
00:25:47,840 --> 00:25:49,640
how it's fine to take children
out every now and then if you're

665
00:25:49,640 --> 00:25:50,800
I'll, you shouldn't come into
school.

666
00:25:51,000 --> 00:25:53,640
And I'm sure there's some, you
know, there's some absences out

667
00:25:53,640 --> 00:25:56,160
there that go above that and
it's all completely above board.

668
00:25:56,160 --> 00:25:57,640
It's like, yeah, you're
oppositely, absolutely, but you

669
00:25:57,640 --> 00:25:58,440
should be.
It's fine.

670
00:25:58,560 --> 00:25:59,960
Yeah, yeah.
And yeah.

671
00:25:59,960 --> 00:26:01,120
They sound like a lot though,
like.

672
00:26:01,120 --> 00:26:04,160
Would it be 19 days if it's 10%
of missed sessions?

673
00:26:04,160 --> 00:26:06,400
Yeah, 10% though, isn't it?
It's 10% of missed sessions

674
00:26:06,400 --> 00:26:06,840
though.
Yeah, there.

675
00:26:06,840 --> 00:26:09,120
Yeah.
But there's OK, 190 days is 380

676
00:26:09,120 --> 00:26:11,760
sessions, Yeah, yeah, yeah.
So so 38 sessions, which is. 19

677
00:26:11,760 --> 00:26:13,720
Oh, I see.
Yeah, OK. 10% works.

678
00:26:13,720 --> 00:26:14,160
You know what?
I.

679
00:26:14,160 --> 00:26:15,160
Need.
I need.

680
00:26:15,160 --> 00:26:20,280
I need, I need.
Yeah, but crazy.

681
00:26:20,280 --> 00:26:21,720
That's not always.
I think we talked about a couple

682
00:26:21,720 --> 00:26:23,760
of years ago and it hasn't
changed much from a tiny bit,

683
00:26:23,760 --> 00:26:25,560
but like.
There's one star I read about

684
00:26:25,560 --> 00:26:27,200
this recently.
It was that Dylan's on Three

685
00:26:27,200 --> 00:26:28,720
Nil.
It is, yeah, crazy.

686
00:26:28,720 --> 00:26:30,200
In a game designed to meet you
get 0.

687
00:26:30,400 --> 00:26:32,520
Three hours as well, which is I
just can't do quizzes badly.

688
00:26:32,600 --> 00:26:34,160
Really quite annoying, right?
Here we go.

689
00:26:34,400 --> 00:26:34,920
Ready.
Yeah.

690
00:26:35,600 --> 00:26:39,360
In January 2025, average class
sizes infants, which is

691
00:26:39,360 --> 00:26:43,840
Reception Tier 2 dropped to
26.2, which is the lowest since

692
00:26:43,840 --> 00:26:46,080
2009.
True.

693
00:26:47,640 --> 00:26:50,640
Oh, I thought we have to re
record this whole podcast where

694
00:26:50,640 --> 00:26:52,920
you lose because you're on which
you've guaranteed them with

695
00:26:52,920 --> 00:26:54,960
packet wish for gold.
You guaranteed a packet Wish for

696
00:26:54,960 --> 00:26:57,240
gold.
I saw, I saw us that about 26

697
00:26:57,240 --> 00:26:58,240
points something.
I just hedged.

698
00:26:58,240 --> 00:27:00,800
I thought I, you know, I was so
adamant that you'd go for

699
00:27:00,800 --> 00:27:02,800
something because I was like,
we've talked about how class

700
00:27:02,800 --> 00:27:05,080
size is getting ridiculous.
Now, here's the thing, Hayden, I

701
00:27:05,080 --> 00:27:07,440
just have knowledge of stuff.
You can't trick knowledge.

702
00:27:07,840 --> 00:27:10,400
You can't trick that.
You just got to get around it.

703
00:27:10,400 --> 00:27:12,720
Honestly, I saw, I saw something
about 26 points.

704
00:27:12,720 --> 00:27:15,400
I remember thinking to myself,
really, what's called these?

705
00:27:15,600 --> 00:27:18,280
Where's how's the average 26.2
like?

706
00:27:18,280 --> 00:27:20,760
It's dropped to that.
Which is the lowest since 2009.

707
00:27:20,760 --> 00:27:22,400
And the reason behind that is
very very simple.

708
00:27:22,400 --> 00:27:24,320
I'm sure we can get it.
Has dropped, It is true.

709
00:27:24,320 --> 00:27:25,960
Just just reiterate.
It's true.

710
00:27:26,200 --> 00:27:27,280
What?
Why do you think that is?

711
00:27:27,960 --> 00:27:30,800
Oh, just because I'm right.
It's the birth rate.

712
00:27:30,800 --> 00:27:32,320
We've talked about the birth
rate before, but the birth rate

713
00:27:32,320 --> 00:27:35,080
is so low right now.
So in those early years, there's

714
00:27:35,080 --> 00:27:36,880
just not as many times.
Interesting how the averages

715
00:27:36,880 --> 00:27:39,600
will will like kind of fluctuate
and change in terms of school

716
00:27:39,600 --> 00:27:43,080
closures because like as schools
begin to close, because like

717
00:27:43,080 --> 00:27:45,560
they're just, you know, known
for free form to two form, maybe

718
00:27:45,560 --> 00:27:48,440
one form entry, schools closing,
the average will be bumped back

719
00:27:48,440 --> 00:27:50,280
up again because it's fewer
classes.

720
00:27:50,280 --> 00:27:53,320
So watching that over time would
be interesting to see because I

721
00:27:53,320 --> 00:27:54,960
can't imagine the government
letting it too low.

722
00:27:55,520 --> 00:27:57,240
Yeah, quite expensive.
Such an interesting point

723
00:27:57,240 --> 00:27:59,120
because yeah, if they close
enough schools you can make the

724
00:27:59,240 --> 00:28:01,520
average as high as you want if
you just cram enough kids into a

725
00:28:01,760 --> 00:28:03,400
queer of schools.
Yeah, so it'd be interesting to

726
00:28:03,400 --> 00:28:06,160
watch that maybe I will continue
to watch that and keep my ear to

727
00:28:06,160 --> 00:28:08,760
the ground, not not losing touch
of education clearly because

728
00:28:08,760 --> 00:28:11,160
I've got 4 out of four I've
skilled my whisper gold.

729
00:28:11,440 --> 00:28:12,960
This is about we almost don't
need to do this I.

730
00:28:13,160 --> 00:28:13,840
Don't.
We don't.

731
00:28:13,880 --> 00:28:14,800
I don't.
This is for glory.

732
00:28:14,800 --> 00:28:17,760
OK, I can abstain if I want to.
You can't say yeah, this is.

733
00:28:17,800 --> 00:28:18,720
Glory, I'm going to read out
this.

734
00:28:18,720 --> 00:28:20,120
This is hilarious.
Now read out this little bit.

735
00:28:20,120 --> 00:28:21,240
I wrote to myself.
It's false.

736
00:28:21,240 --> 00:28:22,440
I wrote this little note for
myself.

737
00:28:22,480 --> 00:28:24,320
It's false.
I was meant to say to you at

738
00:28:24,320 --> 00:28:26,400
this point.
Yeah, a little hint for you as

739
00:28:26,400 --> 00:28:29,080
you're doing so bad.
That's what I wrote down here.

740
00:28:29,080 --> 00:28:31,240
Yeah, false.
Just think about the last one we

741
00:28:31,240 --> 00:28:32,520
just talked about to help you
answer this last.

742
00:28:32,520 --> 00:28:33,440
Question False False.
Right.

743
00:28:33,960 --> 00:28:36,960
You're gonna false, right?
The pupil to teacher ratio for

744
00:28:36,960 --> 00:28:39,720
primary schools in England rose
for the first time in recent

745
00:28:39,720 --> 00:28:42,640
years, meaning there were more
pupils per teacher on average

746
00:28:42,640 --> 00:28:44,240
than previous.
That's true.

747
00:28:44,920 --> 00:28:46,880
What makes you think that?
I think I've read that somewhere

748
00:28:46,880 --> 00:28:50,440
again, like when people like
you, you have like stats out

749
00:28:50,440 --> 00:28:52,760
there that make it sound like
it's improving and like I'm

750
00:28:52,800 --> 00:28:55,800
like, oh, we've improved this.
I think that could be true, but

751
00:28:55,800 --> 00:28:58,200
then I'm thinking about the
whole premise of this game and

752
00:28:58,200 --> 00:29:00,800
you give me a hint to basically
walk me towards it being true.

753
00:29:01,160 --> 00:29:03,560
I thought you might have written
that knowing it's false.

754
00:29:03,560 --> 00:29:06,320
OK, what are you saying for I
think retention.

755
00:29:06,320 --> 00:29:09,000
I think recruitment's got quite
good as well actually, and

756
00:29:09,000 --> 00:29:10,200
there's fewer children than
ever.

757
00:29:12,840 --> 00:29:15,320
Sorry, final answer.
Read the question one more time.

758
00:29:15,320 --> 00:29:17,080
One more time, OK.
And I said think about the last

759
00:29:17,080 --> 00:29:19,000
one, which is about the fact.
That I know, you said.

760
00:29:19,000 --> 00:29:21,600
I think you're you're going
against, you're trying to make

761
00:29:21,600 --> 00:29:24,640
me.
Maybe maybe The pupil to teacher

762
00:29:24,640 --> 00:29:27,440
ratio for primary schools in
England rose for the first time

763
00:29:27,440 --> 00:29:30,160
in recent years, meaning there
were more pupils per teacher on

764
00:29:30,160 --> 00:29:33,720
average than previous years.
I've that, that means I think

765
00:29:33,720 --> 00:29:35,600
it's false.
There were more pupils.

766
00:29:35,600 --> 00:29:36,720
No, that's false.
Sorry.

767
00:29:37,040 --> 00:29:39,080
That's true.
Yes, yes.

768
00:29:39,560 --> 00:29:41,400
I said true, to be fair.
Though Oh, you're such an idiot.

769
00:29:41,800 --> 00:29:43,560
You're such an idiot.
I can't believe you got 4 out of

770
00:29:43,560 --> 00:29:46,840
five in this game.
When you said true at first, did

771
00:29:46,840 --> 00:29:49,080
you not see me go?
Why do you think that thinking?

772
00:29:49,280 --> 00:29:51,320
Oh, come on.
No, you Really.

773
00:29:51,360 --> 00:29:52,280
I do.
You know what?

774
00:29:52,280 --> 00:29:53,600
Do you know what's really
interesting?

775
00:29:53,760 --> 00:29:56,800
The only time I let gameplay get
into my head I got it wrong.

776
00:29:56,960 --> 00:29:58,480
I know right?
You went true.

777
00:29:58,480 --> 00:29:59,480
That's so funny.
Gosh.

778
00:29:59,720 --> 00:30:01,440
I thought that was genuinely
interesting though considering

779
00:30:01,440 --> 00:30:03,120
because I was a bit like that
doesn't make any sense to me.

780
00:30:03,120 --> 00:30:04,840
Because, well, teachers leaving.
Not replacing them.

781
00:30:04,840 --> 00:30:06,480
Yeah.
So it's simple as this, right?

782
00:30:06,480 --> 00:30:08,680
Even though, even though class
sizes are getting smaller

783
00:30:08,680 --> 00:30:11,080
because the perf rate's smaller,
teachers are leaving even faster

784
00:30:11,080 --> 00:30:13,040
than kids aren't being born.
How mental is that?

785
00:30:13,040 --> 00:30:15,200
Yeah, that's crazy.
Like it's going even faster the

786
00:30:15,200 --> 00:30:16,040
down.
That's nuts.

787
00:30:16,240 --> 00:30:17,360
Yeah.
I just can't believe that.

788
00:30:17,520 --> 00:30:20,560
Yeah, I can see that though
because we left teaching and our

789
00:30:20,560 --> 00:30:22,760
roles were not advertised.
It was just like, OK, we'll make

790
00:30:22,760 --> 00:30:23,800
deal, we're going to downsize a
bit.

791
00:30:24,160 --> 00:30:26,880
So yeah, I can again, I can see
that be interesting in to watch

792
00:30:26,880 --> 00:30:30,560
over time like how that changes
when schools close maybe and

793
00:30:30,560 --> 00:30:32,720
classes close now.
Last year do you How many

794
00:30:32,720 --> 00:30:37,080
teachers left overall?
This includes, wasn't it 40,041

795
00:30:37,080 --> 00:30:38,600
thousand?
Because it was a bit lower than

796
00:30:38,600 --> 00:30:40,640
the year before.
So obviously label like see it's

797
00:30:40,640 --> 00:30:41,600
lower.
That's right.

798
00:30:41,600 --> 00:30:42,680
Yeah, right.
But we're not replaced them

799
00:30:42,760 --> 00:30:44,440
though.
So what's for replacement?

800
00:30:44,440 --> 00:30:46,640
Not much.
The year before was 43,500 and

801
00:30:46,640 --> 00:30:48,840
it went down to 41,002. 100
yeah, it was something like

802
00:30:48,840 --> 00:30:51,240
nought .5% or something,
Something like there we are.

803
00:30:51,720 --> 00:30:53,200
Interesting.
One last start, I'll just give

804
00:30:53,200 --> 00:30:57,240
you a couple was related. 11% of
NQT or ECTS, sorry, newly

805
00:30:57,240 --> 00:30:59,880
qualified teachers, 11% of them
quit within the first year.

806
00:31:01,520 --> 00:31:02,560
That's mental.
That's mad, isn't it?

807
00:31:02,560 --> 00:31:04,080
Because I mean, we're quite
often talk about how many quick

808
00:31:04,080 --> 00:31:05,880
within the first three years And
I saw this start and I was like,

809
00:31:05,880 --> 00:31:07,400
that's interesting.
Within the first year of

810
00:31:07,400 --> 00:31:11,360
teaching, 10 like 11%, a tenth
of our training, a tenth of our

811
00:31:11,360 --> 00:31:14,400
newly most of these people would
have paid as well money to go

812
00:31:14,400 --> 00:31:16,840
and train some of them three
years in university, some of

813
00:31:16,840 --> 00:31:18,640
them one, some of them would
have done paid routes here.

814
00:31:18,640 --> 00:31:20,760
And maybe that you know,
contributes to a bit, but a

815
00:31:20,760 --> 00:31:23,720
tenth are like, Nah, I'm not
doing this job.

816
00:31:24,760 --> 00:31:26,320
Crazy, crazy.
I can't go over the fact that my

817
00:31:26,320 --> 00:31:27,680
percentage I said a minute ago
was wrong.

818
00:31:27,720 --> 00:31:30,080
So I've been thinking about it's
not .5%, it's 5%.

819
00:31:30,320 --> 00:31:35,680
I see going to 43,000 to 4241
thousand is 2000 which is about

820
00:31:35,680 --> 00:31:36,960
5%.
You know, when someone has like

821
00:31:36,960 --> 00:31:39,520
a glazed look, I could see you
were absolutely in your head

822
00:31:39,520 --> 00:31:40,720
thinking I was.
I don't know what he's thinking

823
00:31:40,720 --> 00:31:41,840
about, but I'll buy in some
time.

824
00:31:41,960 --> 00:31:43,080
Sorry.
Thank you.

825
00:31:43,080 --> 00:31:44,000
I'm sorry guys.
So.

826
00:31:44,000 --> 00:31:45,480
There we go.
Thanks for I tell you what.

827
00:31:45,720 --> 00:31:48,160
I spent a lot of time thinking
about that game and how I can

828
00:31:48,160 --> 00:31:49,760
structure it to make you look
like a fool.

829
00:31:50,240 --> 00:31:52,840
And I am kind of annoyed that
you completely ruined it.

830
00:31:52,840 --> 00:31:54,640
Backfired in it.
Yeah, big time You're talking.

831
00:31:54,760 --> 00:31:56,000
Someone who was on Who wants to
be in there?

832
00:31:56,000 --> 00:31:57,000
Yeah.
Been on Tenable.

833
00:31:57,000 --> 00:31:59,680
Oh, this got an impossible.
But on 1000 Heartbeats.

834
00:31:59,680 --> 00:32:02,520
I've done TV quizzes, Hayden.
Yeah, you can't penetrate this.

835
00:32:02,520 --> 00:32:03,680
Who wants to be in in our
YouTube bit?

836
00:32:03,680 --> 00:32:04,880
Dylan Price.
Who wants to be a millionaire?

837
00:32:04,880 --> 00:32:06,320
It's on there, baby.
You want some money?

838
00:32:06,640 --> 00:32:08,360
Big thanks to my friend who
helped me out.

839
00:32:08,680 --> 00:32:12,840
I'm a friend, right?
She's me, not you.

840
00:32:12,960 --> 00:32:16,320
Not the list of the list of my
friends who want to help me.

841
00:32:16,440 --> 00:32:19,040
Honestly, you'd be below my
inanimate desk.

842
00:32:19,480 --> 00:32:21,760
But I would.
I would rather phone my

843
00:32:21,760 --> 00:32:23,600
inanimate desk and say hi.
Yeah.

844
00:32:23,600 --> 00:32:26,960
What do you think it's better?
Yeah.

845
00:32:26,960 --> 00:32:29,120
It's a desk that moves.
It's not an animate.

846
00:32:29,120 --> 00:32:32,200
Then it's very much animate.
Full you shouldn't be on any

847
00:32:32,200 --> 00:32:33,400
questions.
Oh, gosh, right.

848
00:32:33,400 --> 00:32:35,640
So we we've gone very old school
here half of through the

849
00:32:35,640 --> 00:32:37,680
episode, not remotely touched
what we're going to talk about.

850
00:32:38,040 --> 00:32:42,800
Let's do that.
All right, jokes aside, you came

851
00:32:42,800 --> 00:32:45,240
with an idea for this episode.
You wanted to talk about dealing

852
00:32:45,240 --> 00:32:46,520
with parents.
And I think that's huge.

853
00:32:46,520 --> 00:32:49,560
I think that's a really huge
part of teaching and you want to

854
00:32:49,560 --> 00:32:51,240
get it right, you want to be
able to deal with parents

855
00:32:51,240 --> 00:32:54,440
professionally, but there are
also times when something's just

856
00:32:54,440 --> 00:32:56,560
unacceptable.
So we're going to try and go

857
00:32:56,560 --> 00:32:59,960
through a guide here you've put
together of how best to deal

858
00:32:59,960 --> 00:33:02,120
with parents in general.
Very much so.

859
00:33:02,120 --> 00:33:04,440
So some of these are just tips,
things you can do and just quick

860
00:33:04,440 --> 00:33:07,400
actions, and some of them are
more like just ways to be or

861
00:33:07,400 --> 00:33:09,240
just policies to follow and
things you should be looking out

862
00:33:09,240 --> 00:33:10,280
for when you're actually in the
school.

863
00:33:10,280 --> 00:33:12,360
I'm going to start with #1 is my
favourite tip.

864
00:33:12,360 --> 00:33:15,160
And, and I say this because our
head teacher often reference

865
00:33:15,160 --> 00:33:17,240
this as Hayden's thing.
I definitely stole it from

866
00:33:17,240 --> 00:33:19,160
someone else in the past, but
it's called the positive

867
00:33:19,160 --> 00:33:22,200
sandwich.
Oh, I love the idea of anyone in

868
00:33:22,200 --> 00:33:23,680
the world thinking that you
invented.

869
00:33:23,680 --> 00:33:25,680
I know.
Oh, I didn't invent this, guys.

870
00:33:25,800 --> 00:33:26,840
No, I didn't invent this.
What?

871
00:33:26,840 --> 00:33:29,160
Most traditional way of giving a
concern ever.

872
00:33:29,680 --> 00:33:31,720
But our head teacher did the
need often before.

873
00:33:32,200 --> 00:33:34,160
It's like parents evening.
He'd be like, remember guys?

874
00:33:34,160 --> 00:33:36,760
Hayden's good old Hayden's good
old positive sandwiches.

875
00:33:36,760 --> 00:33:38,520
It's mine, is it?
I don't think he was saying you

876
00:33:38,520 --> 00:33:39,320
invented it.
I think he did.

877
00:33:39,320 --> 00:33:41,200
I think he was saying that you
do it and it's good.

878
00:33:41,240 --> 00:33:42,440
But you've ruined enough of this
podcast.

879
00:33:42,960 --> 00:33:44,240
Don't ruin me as.
Well, I love doing it.

880
00:33:44,280 --> 00:33:46,240
You've got photography.
People think, I mean, yeah,

881
00:33:46,320 --> 00:33:48,680
people think I came up with the
idea of not just giving bad

882
00:33:48,680 --> 00:33:51,240
news, but rather giving good
news even aside of it.

883
00:33:51,320 --> 00:33:53,120
It works though.
So just to clarify for those

884
00:33:53,120 --> 00:33:54,480
that are thinking I don't really
know what this is.

885
00:33:54,480 --> 00:33:55,720
A positive sandwich is simply
this.

886
00:33:55,720 --> 00:33:58,240
When you want to deliver some
feedback that is simply awkward

887
00:33:58,240 --> 00:34:00,440
for any reason because perhaps
it's negative about the child or

888
00:34:00,480 --> 00:34:03,040
whatever, Don't just go straight
in with that.

889
00:34:03,080 --> 00:34:04,960
It's so easy just to get
yourself worked up and then you

890
00:34:04,960 --> 00:34:07,200
just start this conversation and
you say and you say the bad

891
00:34:07,200 --> 00:34:08,840
thing and you get the parents
back up because they're thinking

892
00:34:08,840 --> 00:34:10,719
no one wants to hear bad things
about their child.

893
00:34:11,239 --> 00:34:14,560
Start with something positive.
Have a positive conversation

894
00:34:14,560 --> 00:34:17,360
with this parent first.
Then you can weave in the bad

895
00:34:17,360 --> 00:34:20,520
thing, and you can the filling,
the lovely, lovely sweet juicy

896
00:34:20,520 --> 00:34:22,840
feeling of negativeness in the
middle, and then you come back

897
00:34:22,840 --> 00:34:24,880
around after it.
Don't leave it on that either.

898
00:34:24,880 --> 00:34:26,360
It's just as bad starting with
it as leaving it.

899
00:34:26,600 --> 00:34:27,760
Come back around to something
positive.

900
00:34:27,760 --> 00:34:29,840
I've got an issue.
OK, that's not a positive

901
00:34:29,840 --> 00:34:30,520
sandwich.
Why not?

902
00:34:30,520 --> 00:34:31,560
That's a negative.
Yeah, OK.

903
00:34:31,639 --> 00:34:32,760
All right.
It's a negative sandwich.

904
00:34:32,880 --> 00:34:34,320
It is.
I have a jam sandwich where I

905
00:34:34,320 --> 00:34:36,440
have jam break jam, right?
That's not that's a bread

906
00:34:36,440 --> 00:34:38,440
sandwich.
OK, this is what you've just

907
00:34:38,440 --> 00:34:39,719
described is not a positive
sandwich.

908
00:34:39,719 --> 00:34:41,120
So true.
So first thing I'm going to

909
00:34:41,120 --> 00:34:42,639
carry on my ruining.
I did invent it wrong.

910
00:34:43,159 --> 00:34:44,920
You did you.
Did because what you did?

911
00:34:45,280 --> 00:34:48,840
What's you?
You was a positive sandwich.

912
00:34:50,080 --> 00:34:51,600
You gave awful things.
He was.

913
00:34:51,880 --> 00:34:53,920
Like but negative sandwich
sounds so bad, doesn't it?

914
00:34:54,120 --> 00:34:55,560
Don't want to do the old
negative sandwich.

915
00:34:55,639 --> 00:34:56,840
Oh, that doesn't sound good.
Does.

916
00:34:56,840 --> 00:34:58,400
It it's not, it's my background,
that's not on me.

917
00:34:58,400 --> 00:35:00,960
If you misunderstand what I'm
saying, it's not my fault.

918
00:35:01,040 --> 00:35:02,360
Mate look, it's I'm calling it
a.

919
00:35:02,360 --> 00:35:03,880
Battery.
Let's role play a negative

920
00:35:03,880 --> 00:35:06,160
sandwich.
OK, I'm going to be the teacher.

921
00:35:06,440 --> 00:35:07,640
OK, You're you're the adult.
All right?

922
00:35:07,640 --> 00:35:08,600
So I'm going to role play with
people.

923
00:35:08,600 --> 00:35:08,920
All right.
OK.

924
00:35:09,240 --> 00:35:09,680
Hi.
Yeah.

925
00:35:09,680 --> 00:35:11,240
Can I have a quick word, please?
Yeah, of course, of course.

926
00:35:11,320 --> 00:35:12,480
Everything all right?
Yeah, that's all.

927
00:35:12,520 --> 00:35:13,200
Good.
Johnny's OK.

928
00:35:13,720 --> 00:35:15,040
He's absolutely fine.
Jordan here.

929
00:35:15,200 --> 00:35:16,200
Just a few things.
No.

930
00:35:16,360 --> 00:35:17,880
Yeah.
Go over there, go and play.

931
00:35:18,160 --> 00:35:19,400
With just a quick one.
Yeah.

932
00:35:20,080 --> 00:35:24,080
So First things first.
His hair looks great today.

933
00:35:24,080 --> 00:35:26,160
I love what you did of his hair.
It's fantastic.

934
00:35:26,440 --> 00:35:30,200
Throw a chair at my face.
Oh, throw a chair about it

935
00:35:30,400 --> 00:35:32,240
because he had his shirt tucked
in all day.

936
00:35:32,600 --> 00:35:34,360
Frank, that's thank you.
Bye.

937
00:35:34,360 --> 00:35:35,840
I.
Think there's one thing you said

938
00:35:35,840 --> 00:35:37,720
I want to go back to actually in
this conversation, which is his

939
00:35:37,720 --> 00:35:39,880
hair look good.
I really did spend some time on

940
00:35:39,880 --> 00:35:41,360
this one.
So thank you so much for

941
00:35:41,640 --> 00:35:42,840
mentioning that.
The thing in the middle coming,

942
00:35:42,840 --> 00:35:44,680
we said.
But yeah, he's a lovely kid.

943
00:35:44,680 --> 00:35:46,160
Yeah, fruit in my head.
Lovely.

944
00:35:46,160 --> 00:35:47,920
He's.
A lovely kid, Lovely kid.

945
00:35:48,000 --> 00:35:49,920
But let's not, let's not let
that get lost.

946
00:35:50,560 --> 00:35:52,280
Oh, A.
Positive bread, right?

947
00:35:52,360 --> 00:35:53,520
Think about the roll out of the
roll.

948
00:35:53,520 --> 00:35:55,840
That was not a good example of a
positive.

949
00:35:56,000 --> 00:35:58,120
Yeah, or negative.
So be really, really, really,

950
00:35:58,120 --> 00:36:00,320
really, really clear here.
Then what is it actually looked

951
00:36:00,320 --> 00:36:03,040
like?
Because, you know, it sounds

952
00:36:03,040 --> 00:36:04,480
good.
It sounds a bit gimmicky to me,

953
00:36:04,480 --> 00:36:06,400
I'm not going to lie.
But I think I do think it's a

954
00:36:06,400 --> 00:36:07,920
really powerful way of doing
this.

955
00:36:07,920 --> 00:36:09,280
So what does it actually?
Look, I think you gave an

956
00:36:09,280 --> 00:36:11,040
example of how it can be
gimmicky exactly that.

957
00:36:11,040 --> 00:36:13,040
You have to do it meaningfully.
Everything has to be real.

958
00:36:13,040 --> 00:36:14,200
You got to do things in a real
way.

959
00:36:14,200 --> 00:36:16,200
If a positive sandwich doesn't
mean just to think of some

960
00:36:16,200 --> 00:36:18,280
surface of a made-up thing
that's nice just so you can

961
00:36:18,280 --> 00:36:20,760
quickly get to the bad thing, it
means genuinely have a

962
00:36:20,760 --> 00:36:23,520
conversation with a parent and
actually say something real to

963
00:36:23,520 --> 00:36:24,880
them about how you like that
kid.

964
00:36:25,240 --> 00:36:28,120
There's there shouldn't be a
child where you cannot think of

965
00:36:28,120 --> 00:36:30,360
one single positive thing in
that entire a year about

966
00:36:30,560 --> 00:36:34,360
anything they've ever done that
you can't be real about, even if

967
00:36:34,360 --> 00:36:36,560
it comes down to progress in
something that you think that

968
00:36:36,560 --> 00:36:40,480
they've struggled with before.
Yeah, one or two.

969
00:36:41,000 --> 00:36:44,680
Do you think this could do you
think a sandwich in this way can

970
00:36:44,680 --> 00:36:47,880
be done over time?
Because I think, I think that

971
00:36:47,880 --> 00:36:50,440
the problem where I think it's
quite gimmicky is where you try

972
00:36:50,440 --> 00:36:53,000
and do this in 10 seconds.
Because sure, because you're

973
00:36:53,000 --> 00:36:55,360
thinking I've got a negative
thing to say about this child.

974
00:36:55,720 --> 00:36:58,000
But I, you know, I heard Hayden
on the podcast say I've got the

975
00:36:58,000 --> 00:37:00,080
same positive.
So I'm going to try and just nip

976
00:37:00,080 --> 00:37:02,640
it in, but it is after school
grabbing you quick because to

977
00:37:02,640 --> 00:37:05,760
me, the best way to do this is
over time where it's like, you

978
00:37:05,760 --> 00:37:07,880
know, I've already done the
positive part, like I've already

979
00:37:07,880 --> 00:37:09,400
built it up.
That took me like 3-4, five

980
00:37:09,400 --> 00:37:11,840
weeks where I was happy talking
to the parent.

981
00:37:11,840 --> 00:37:14,480
I was building up that rapport.
I was going to them saying

982
00:37:14,480 --> 00:37:16,760
positive things just on its own.
Doesn't have to be a sandwich

983
00:37:16,760 --> 00:37:18,600
all time.
It's just wow, he did really

984
00:37:18,600 --> 00:37:21,280
well today with his phonics.
Like he tried so hard.

985
00:37:21,280 --> 00:37:24,040
He's learning so much.
Well done, finish next time.

986
00:37:24,560 --> 00:37:26,640
He behaved so well today in
assembly.

987
00:37:26,640 --> 00:37:28,520
I couldn't believe how well he
listened to their teacher.

988
00:37:28,520 --> 00:37:31,000
Was so respectful.
Well done, finished like build,

989
00:37:31,000 --> 00:37:33,280
build, build, build.
Because then when you give the

990
00:37:33,280 --> 00:37:35,640
bad news, you can still argue
it's with it's within the

991
00:37:35,640 --> 00:37:38,560
context of what you're saying
essentially is don't just give

992
00:37:38,560 --> 00:37:40,360
bad news.
Sure, but it's not in the

993
00:37:40,360 --> 00:37:42,160
moment.
It's like, well, I've spent time

994
00:37:42,160 --> 00:37:43,920
building this up.
Like I I feel like what you're

995
00:37:43,920 --> 00:37:47,160
saying here is done best over
time, not in a slot.

996
00:37:47,160 --> 00:37:49,320
I think that works really well
and I think that works really

997
00:37:49,320 --> 00:37:53,160
well with a lot of parents.
But I do still think that there

998
00:37:53,160 --> 00:37:55,800
are some children, some
situations, even some parents,

999
00:37:55,800 --> 00:37:58,040
you think about their
personality where they just will

1000
00:37:58,040 --> 00:38:01,040
not be able to take bad feedback
or their child regularly

1001
00:38:01,040 --> 00:38:03,360
receives negative feedback.
And there are just some

1002
00:38:03,360 --> 00:38:06,800
situations where I feel like
you, you just can't get away

1003
00:38:06,800 --> 00:38:08,880
with just saying a negative
thing because you feel like

1004
00:38:08,880 --> 00:38:10,040
you've built because maybe you
haven't.

1005
00:38:10,160 --> 00:38:12,320
Maybe there genuinely hasn't
really been many opportunities

1006
00:38:12,320 --> 00:38:15,040
before and you've had a lot of
negative, negative conversations

1007
00:38:15,040 --> 00:38:17,000
about the child because they are
genuinely really misbehaved.

1008
00:38:17,360 --> 00:38:19,720
But you should still, when
you're talking to those parents,

1009
00:38:19,720 --> 00:38:22,200
still look for it's still their
baby at the end of the day.

1010
00:38:22,280 --> 00:38:25,360
You should still try to look for
something positive and and not

1011
00:38:25,360 --> 00:38:28,200
give off the feeling to them
that you just don't like that

1012
00:38:28,200 --> 00:38:29,280
kid.
Because sometimes people get

1013
00:38:29,280 --> 00:38:30,520
that feeling.
Whether you think it or not,

1014
00:38:30,600 --> 00:38:31,440
it's not about you at this
point.

1015
00:38:31,440 --> 00:38:32,800
It's actually just about that
perception.

1016
00:38:33,200 --> 00:38:35,680
No parent should be walking away
from school feeling upset,

1017
00:38:35,680 --> 00:38:37,000
thinking that you just don't
like that kid.

1018
00:38:37,280 --> 00:38:39,880
That just shouldn't be a thing.
And the positive sandwich, I

1019
00:38:39,880 --> 00:38:41,360
think comes in clutch in those
situations.

1020
00:38:41,360 --> 00:38:43,120
I'm not saying it's every
situation, the negative

1021
00:38:43,120 --> 00:38:45,400
sandwich, whatever you want to
call it sharp, it does.

1022
00:38:45,400 --> 00:38:47,160
It just works because you can
say, and it has to be

1023
00:38:47,160 --> 00:38:48,560
meaningful.
Like I said, you can say, look,

1024
00:38:49,240 --> 00:38:51,080
they were working so well to
better than they have done the

1025
00:38:51,080 --> 00:38:52,680
last few weeks.
I know we had a few trouble a

1026
00:38:52,680 --> 00:38:54,240
few weeks ago.
They've really been trying to

1027
00:38:54,240 --> 00:38:56,240
improve, but today it just got
the best of them.

1028
00:38:56,440 --> 00:38:58,760
And then you can go into it.
But even that one sentence

1029
00:38:58,760 --> 00:39:01,040
before of just saying they've
been really trying hard and I've

1030
00:39:01,040 --> 00:39:02,880
really appreciated the fact that
they've come in every day and

1031
00:39:02,880 --> 00:39:04,000
done this thing it.
Can be.

1032
00:39:04,000 --> 00:39:06,280
It can be linked to the negative
thing, but it still can be

1033
00:39:06,280 --> 00:39:06,880
positive.
Exactly.

1034
00:39:06,880 --> 00:39:09,000
You're still starting in a way
that shows you care about this

1035
00:39:09,000 --> 00:39:11,320
child holistically, and you
don't just want to quickly get

1036
00:39:11,320 --> 00:39:13,240
to that parent and tell them how
horrible like it is and then go

1037
00:39:13,520 --> 00:39:15,200
crack on your day.
And then finish with the

1038
00:39:15,200 --> 00:39:15,920
positive.
Exactly.

1039
00:39:15,920 --> 00:39:18,320
And then go back to positive.
So what I want to do is see it,

1040
00:39:18,320 --> 00:39:19,560
see a bit more of this.
He's done.

1041
00:39:19,560 --> 00:39:21,720
Do you know what somebody's done
fantastically recently?

1042
00:39:21,880 --> 00:39:24,400
He's been coming into school and
he he's held the door for me 3

1043
00:39:24,400 --> 00:39:26,520
times this week and I've said
thank you and he smiled at me

1044
00:39:26,760 --> 00:39:27,840
and I really want to pick him up
for.

1045
00:39:27,840 --> 00:39:28,920
That and then he threw a chat in
my head.

1046
00:39:29,200 --> 00:39:30,520
Yeah.
No, I've already done that bit.

1047
00:39:30,520 --> 00:39:32,040
We've done a little bit.
I'm going back to the end.

1048
00:39:32,080 --> 00:39:34,440
It's.
A double salvage bread.

1049
00:39:34,440 --> 00:39:35,400
Philly bread.
Philly Bread.

1050
00:39:35,560 --> 00:39:36,840
We've all been there.
We've all been there.

1051
00:39:36,840 --> 00:39:38,280
You've got scooby-doo.
Filling Philling Philly.

1052
00:39:38,280 --> 00:39:41,160
Filling Philling Philly.
It's 17.

1053
00:39:41,160 --> 00:39:42,560
Sorry, no.
Sorry, one second.

1054
00:39:42,560 --> 00:39:45,440
I'm on the tomato at the minute.
So wait a minute, he threw a

1055
00:39:45,440 --> 00:39:47,920
glue stick at a child.
Now I'm on the beef burger.

1056
00:39:49,840 --> 00:39:51,800
He decided to break some pencils
in the classroom.

1057
00:39:52,120 --> 00:39:53,560
It's a big sandwich.
Yeah.

1058
00:39:53,600 --> 00:39:55,840
What is the limit of how many
negative things you can put

1059
00:39:55,840 --> 00:39:59,360
within the two positives?
But by the way, I hope, I hope.

1060
00:39:59,800 --> 00:40:02,120
I'm sure there's some nuances to
this, but I hope the idea.

1061
00:40:02,200 --> 00:40:04,480
Of jokes aside, I think you're
absolutely right.

1062
00:40:04,480 --> 00:40:06,960
You know, it's basically comes
down to this, doesn't it?

1063
00:40:07,720 --> 00:40:10,360
You don't want the parent to
think they're out to get your

1064
00:40:10,360 --> 00:40:12,800
kid OK.
And, and wherever you are or

1065
00:40:12,800 --> 00:40:14,400
not, you're absolutely right.
It's perception.

1066
00:40:14,760 --> 00:40:16,480
It is perception at the end of
the day.

1067
00:40:16,880 --> 00:40:19,080
And yeah, I don't think you have
to bend over backwards all the

1068
00:40:19,080 --> 00:40:20,840
time.
I think sometimes you have to

1069
00:40:20,840 --> 00:40:22,000
just say it as it is.
Definitely.

1070
00:40:22,000 --> 00:40:25,680
I don't, I don't personally
think every single time you do

1071
00:40:25,680 --> 00:40:27,280
something, you have to shoehorn
this in.

1072
00:40:27,360 --> 00:40:30,120
That's my personal belief.
I think it's a nice good

1073
00:40:30,120 --> 00:40:32,480
technique.
It gets to the point where I

1074
00:40:32,480 --> 00:40:35,160
think it's more than fine just
to say to someone, look, this

1075
00:40:35,160 --> 00:40:37,760
happened today is unacceptable.
I agree, and I agree and should

1076
00:40:37,760 --> 00:40:38,920
be, really.
Clear how for some time.

1077
00:40:38,920 --> 00:40:40,720
This is just a technique.
This is just something to have

1078
00:40:40,720 --> 00:40:42,880
up your sleeve.
I've used it before where I felt

1079
00:40:42,880 --> 00:40:44,560
like I have had four
conversations in a row that were

1080
00:40:44,560 --> 00:40:45,480
negative.
And I think you know what?

1081
00:40:45,840 --> 00:40:47,800
This is just isn't good.
This isn't a good perception of

1082
00:40:47,800 --> 00:40:49,320
this child.
So and I'll and I'll use it.

1083
00:40:49,440 --> 00:40:52,200
Can I talk about one thing and
maybe you can give me some

1084
00:40:52,200 --> 00:40:54,480
advice?
One thing, just one thing I,

1085
00:40:54,480 --> 00:40:59,240
I've found before multiple times
that I've put off speaking to a

1086
00:40:59,240 --> 00:41:02,920
parent when something is kind of
brewing or I, I see a kind of

1087
00:41:02,920 --> 00:41:06,000
issue and I'm like, you know
what?

1088
00:41:06,000 --> 00:41:07,040
It's fine, I'll just deal with
it.

1089
00:41:07,040 --> 00:41:08,640
It's fine.
I'll try and stay on top of it.

1090
00:41:08,920 --> 00:41:11,240
It's got progressively worse,
but it's just like it's creeping

1091
00:41:11,240 --> 00:41:13,120
up.
Not enough where it's a full

1092
00:41:13,120 --> 00:41:15,280
blown thing and I'm like, OK,
obviously let's go to the head,

1093
00:41:15,480 --> 00:41:18,160
but enough where actually it
gets to the end.

1094
00:41:18,160 --> 00:41:19,920
It's almost like a lobster in
boiling water.

1095
00:41:20,400 --> 00:41:22,240
You don't realise what's
happening until oh, wait a

1096
00:41:22,240 --> 00:41:25,800
minute, this, this was like a 2
month thing and it's ended here

1097
00:41:25,800 --> 00:41:27,680
and now I've got to go and speak
to the parent about this.

1098
00:41:27,680 --> 00:41:31,760
And it's really awkward because
I've got to go with seven other

1099
00:41:31,760 --> 00:41:33,240
things that have happened that
link to it.

1100
00:41:33,280 --> 00:41:36,120
And there's no way I can say
this without them thinking, why

1101
00:41:36,120 --> 00:41:39,000
didn't you raise this earlier?
So how, how on earth can we go

1102
00:41:39,000 --> 00:41:41,200
about that?
Like when do we know how to

1103
00:41:41,200 --> 00:41:43,000
break the ice with a parent?
What is the line?

1104
00:41:43,000 --> 00:41:45,360
Do you go to your, you know,
your leadership first?

1105
00:41:45,360 --> 00:41:47,200
You're the line manager, your
group leader.

1106
00:41:47,200 --> 00:41:48,880
What what do you think is the
best way to?

1107
00:41:48,960 --> 00:41:50,840
Do I'd say over time you do
start to build up an

1108
00:41:50,840 --> 00:41:52,720
understanding of that line, but
definitely at the start of your

1109
00:41:52,720 --> 00:41:55,200
career, I would absolutely
recommend talking to other

1110
00:41:55,200 --> 00:41:57,680
teachers, other staff, go to
your senior leadership team and

1111
00:41:57,680 --> 00:41:59,960
just be honest and say this is a
situation.

1112
00:42:00,160 --> 00:42:01,160
What do you think I should do
about it?

1113
00:42:01,240 --> 00:42:02,680
About it?
Sometimes they will say, well,

1114
00:42:02,680 --> 00:42:03,920
do you know what?
I think I need to get involved

1115
00:42:03,920 --> 00:42:04,840
and they'll take it off your
hands.

1116
00:42:05,040 --> 00:42:06,960
Other times they will give you
just really good advice.

1117
00:42:06,960 --> 00:42:10,000
And it's normally which, which
is literally tip #2 from here,

1118
00:42:10,400 --> 00:42:13,400
being preemptive, not allowing
it to get to that point where

1119
00:42:13,400 --> 00:42:15,960
you just said they're getting in
there straight away and having

1120
00:42:15,960 --> 00:42:17,800
that slightly awkward
conversation to save an

1121
00:42:17,800 --> 00:42:20,640
extremely awkward conversation a
month later when it all blows

1122
00:42:20,640 --> 00:42:22,440
up.
So being preemptive, getting in

1123
00:42:22,440 --> 00:42:24,640
there with communications,
really, really, really important

1124
00:42:24,640 --> 00:42:26,000
when it comes to talking to
parents in the day.

1125
00:42:26,000 --> 00:42:27,320
It's their child.
They're going to want to know

1126
00:42:27,320 --> 00:42:28,640
what's going on.
Even if you think it's a bit

1127
00:42:28,640 --> 00:42:31,600
awkward, even if they get a bit
offensive in that moment, it is

1128
00:42:31,600 --> 00:42:34,320
still objectively ultimately
better for them to know what

1129
00:42:34,320 --> 00:42:36,120
their child has been doing.
If you feel like that should,

1130
00:42:36,200 --> 00:42:37,840
they should know that they
probably should.

1131
00:42:38,240 --> 00:42:40,920
How important is keeping records
of what's been said and and

1132
00:42:40,920 --> 00:42:42,480
what's going on?
Like, because obviously we're

1133
00:42:42,480 --> 00:42:46,160
talking about parents in general
here and I've dealt with a lot

1134
00:42:46,160 --> 00:42:48,680
of parents. 98% of parents been
absolutely lovely.

1135
00:42:48,720 --> 00:42:51,960
Yeah, absolutely lovely. 1% may
be neutral, 1% may be

1136
00:42:51,960 --> 00:42:54,600
problematic.
What what's your, what's your

1137
00:42:54,600 --> 00:42:57,200
deal on keeping records or, you
know, writing things down of

1138
00:42:57,200 --> 00:42:59,480
what's happened?
How stringent should we be?

1139
00:42:59,480 --> 00:43:01,440
Like, should we do it with some
parents but not with others?

1140
00:43:01,440 --> 00:43:02,920
Yeah, sure.
Now what's that look like?

1141
00:43:03,040 --> 00:43:05,600
I think with the majority of
parents genuinely like you're

1142
00:43:05,600 --> 00:43:08,720
not going to have these really
horrible interactions all the

1143
00:43:08,720 --> 00:43:10,840
time and these like these dire
relationships between you and

1144
00:43:10,840 --> 00:43:13,080
parent, but only in those
situations where you do.

1145
00:43:13,160 --> 00:43:16,520
And I have had a few before
where I, I can honestly say like

1146
00:43:16,520 --> 00:43:18,400
I would get anxious about the
idea of talking to a particular

1147
00:43:18,400 --> 00:43:20,960
parent because our relationship
just was quite negative.

1148
00:43:20,960 --> 00:43:23,400
And they didn't, you know, they
weren't very fond of the school

1149
00:43:23,400 --> 00:43:26,160
for whatever reason.
The best advice I ever got that

1150
00:43:26,160 --> 00:43:29,760
year was write down everything
they say to you because this

1151
00:43:29,760 --> 00:43:31,960
parent was particularly
initiative and would two months

1152
00:43:31,960 --> 00:43:33,600
later say, well, the teacher
didn't tell me that last time

1153
00:43:33,760 --> 00:43:35,720
they told me to do this.
And there's no evidence of it.

1154
00:43:36,000 --> 00:43:37,800
Write down things they say to
you, keep any letters, if they

1155
00:43:37,800 --> 00:43:39,920
write in things, keep emails,
put them in an inbox, you know,

1156
00:43:39,920 --> 00:43:41,960
folder, whatever, just to
protect yourself.

1157
00:43:41,960 --> 00:43:44,040
And you know what, nothing
happened to me in that, in that

1158
00:43:44,040 --> 00:43:45,840
situation.
I'd heard that it had happened

1159
00:43:45,840 --> 00:43:47,480
before, that someone had been
called out on something that

1160
00:43:47,480 --> 00:43:49,040
just did not happen and there
was no proof.

1161
00:43:49,680 --> 00:43:51,320
I kept it all.
End of the year, it got traded

1162
00:43:51,320 --> 00:43:54,240
to the dump of it.
But if it did, if something came

1163
00:43:54,240 --> 00:43:56,200
up later and I didn't have
evidence of actually, no, I

1164
00:43:56,200 --> 00:43:57,840
didn't say that.
I said this and I wrote down the

1165
00:43:57,840 --> 00:44:00,080
conversation we had there and
then on that day, this is the

1166
00:44:00,080 --> 00:44:01,720
log of it.
This isn't true.

1167
00:44:02,080 --> 00:44:03,720
Then I could have been in a
tricky situation.

1168
00:44:03,720 --> 00:44:06,920
And it's not about not trusting
anyone.

1169
00:44:07,320 --> 00:44:08,880
It's not about that.
It's just about protecting

1170
00:44:08,880 --> 00:44:10,520
yourself.
So how wide that is the net for

1171
00:44:10,520 --> 00:44:11,720
this?
Like, you know, you're saying

1172
00:44:11,720 --> 00:44:13,120
write things down.
That's a huge job.

1173
00:44:13,120 --> 00:44:15,640
If I write absolutely everything
down that I have with a parent,

1174
00:44:15,680 --> 00:44:18,000
yeah, interaction.
But I can see why it might be

1175
00:44:18,000 --> 00:44:20,040
useful to have for everyone
because you simply don't know.

1176
00:44:20,080 --> 00:44:22,560
You're like, you might have what
you think is a really fine

1177
00:44:22,560 --> 00:44:24,480
relationship with a parent, and
then it turns sour.

1178
00:44:24,480 --> 00:44:27,760
And actually, I wish I had that.
I think we, we just have to

1179
00:44:27,760 --> 00:44:30,680
appreciate the fact that the
majority of parents aren't going

1180
00:44:30,680 --> 00:44:32,280
to be like this.
We have to accept that.

1181
00:44:32,280 --> 00:44:34,480
Like I think if you start
thinking 100% of parents can be

1182
00:44:34,480 --> 00:44:36,440
like this and it's you're,
you're going to create some mad

1183
00:44:36,440 --> 00:44:38,000
workload for yourself.
You need to go with your gut.

1184
00:44:38,000 --> 00:44:40,240
In my opinion.
There are just some, the odd

1185
00:44:40,240 --> 00:44:42,400
time where you think and, and
your gut might even be the fact

1186
00:44:42,400 --> 00:44:44,600
that the previous teacher said
this parent was quite tricky and

1187
00:44:44,600 --> 00:44:47,920
caused me a lot of AG last year.
Just be a bear that in mind and

1188
00:44:47,920 --> 00:44:49,720
then you think yourself right,
OK, I'm going to keep some

1189
00:44:49,720 --> 00:44:51,760
communication for this parent
and it might just develop over

1190
00:44:51,760 --> 00:44:52,880
time.
You don't need to do it the

1191
00:44:52,880 --> 00:44:54,720
whole year for everybody.
In case it starts changing.

1192
00:44:54,720 --> 00:44:56,600
If it does start changing, then
you can start writing things

1193
00:44:56,600 --> 00:44:58,680
down if you need to.
But in all honesty, my whole

1194
00:44:58,680 --> 00:45:03,360
career, I probably did this like
3 times, like literally 3 * / 10

1195
00:45:03,360 --> 00:45:04,960
years.
All those parents like it.

1196
00:45:04,960 --> 00:45:07,400
It's not something that happens
loads, but you should just just

1197
00:45:07,400 --> 00:45:09,640
have it in mind to protect
yourself if you feel like things

1198
00:45:09,640 --> 00:45:11,840
are going that way.
We had like an unwritten role in

1199
00:45:11,840 --> 00:45:13,320
our career and all the schools I
worked with.

1200
00:45:13,320 --> 00:45:15,960
It'd be interesting to hear
listeners have this too, where

1201
00:45:15,960 --> 00:45:17,960
if you were talking to a parent,
like they caught you after

1202
00:45:17,960 --> 00:45:21,800
school or whatever it might be,
always, you know, if someone

1203
00:45:21,800 --> 00:45:23,280
else was doing it, I'd be
keeping an eye out.

1204
00:45:23,680 --> 00:45:25,560
And if I was talking to a
parent, I'd be looking around,

1205
00:45:25,560 --> 00:45:26,600
just see if there's someone
nearby.

1206
00:45:26,840 --> 00:45:29,040
And the only point is just
almost like you're saying, it's

1207
00:45:29,040 --> 00:45:31,040
kind of like keeping a record,
but it's just another pair of

1208
00:45:31,040 --> 00:45:32,960
eyes.
It's just someone like a witness

1209
00:45:32,960 --> 00:45:35,320
almost, you know, especially if
it's starting to get a bit of an

1210
00:45:35,320 --> 00:45:38,280
awk conversation.
I always would just hang around.

1211
00:45:38,280 --> 00:45:40,280
If I saw a colleague of mine
talking to a parent and it was

1212
00:45:40,280 --> 00:45:43,520
getting a bit heated, I'd just
be there listening and both

1213
00:45:43,520 --> 00:45:45,600
people would know I was there.
I wouldn't be interrupted.

1214
00:45:45,600 --> 00:45:47,360
I wouldn't be, you know, it's
hard for me not to interrupt

1215
00:45:47,360 --> 00:45:49,560
Hayden, as you know, but I
wouldn't be getting involved at

1216
00:45:49,560 --> 00:45:51,520
all.
But I'd want both people to know

1217
00:45:51,520 --> 00:45:53,600
that there's another adult just.
Hit I always love that awkward

1218
00:45:53,600 --> 00:45:55,520
thing where it's like you're
blatantly just standing around

1219
00:45:55,680 --> 00:45:58,560
because there's the last parent
left on pickup and the teachers

1220
00:45:58,560 --> 00:46:00,040
talking to them and you think,
oh, I don't know if this is a

1221
00:46:00,040 --> 00:46:02,120
positive conversation or not.
And you're lingering around

1222
00:46:02,120 --> 00:46:04,680
just, like pretending that
you're doing something like,

1223
00:46:04,760 --> 00:46:07,240
what's that looking over there
like, oh, is that gate closed?

1224
00:46:08,000 --> 00:46:09,920
Yeah, I think so.
I have to check my watch.

1225
00:46:10,120 --> 00:46:12,080
As if like they don't, as if the
parents aren't going to work

1226
00:46:12,080 --> 00:46:12,920
out.
They obviously just stand.

1227
00:46:12,920 --> 00:46:14,320
Just do it because you know
what?

1228
00:46:14,600 --> 00:46:16,200
Who cares about the awkwardness?
Just stand around there.

1229
00:46:16,200 --> 00:46:17,120
See you on an extra pair of
eyes.

1230
00:46:17,120 --> 00:46:18,640
I agree.
And brings me on to my next

1231
00:46:18,640 --> 00:46:21,640
point, really about if, if it if
that conversation does go South

1232
00:46:22,040 --> 00:46:24,440
and that parent starts getting
angry and a raised voice.

1233
00:46:24,760 --> 00:46:27,480
What would be your advice to
someone in that situation?

1234
00:46:27,480 --> 00:46:29,040
You're getting yelled at by a
parent.

1235
00:46:29,800 --> 00:46:32,200
What do you?
Do double down, shout back, make

1236
00:46:32,200 --> 00:46:36,080
a scene, be the alpha dominant
and just go for me, honestly,

1237
00:46:37,120 --> 00:46:41,600
no, look, try and stay calm.
Try and separate it, try and

1238
00:46:41,600 --> 00:46:42,840
separate it out.
I feel like I can do.

1239
00:46:42,840 --> 00:46:45,480
I feel like I'm quite good at
doing that where I can just

1240
00:46:45,480 --> 00:46:48,760
separate out and and just think
to myself, OK, I'm in the role

1241
00:46:48,760 --> 00:46:51,000
of the teacher right now.
If this was on the street and it

1242
00:46:51,000 --> 00:46:53,760
was about something different, I
Gen I know that I'd read

1243
00:46:53,760 --> 00:46:55,560
differently.
I'd be more likely to lose my

1244
00:46:55,560 --> 00:46:57,200
temper as well.
I'd be more likely to be like,

1245
00:46:57,200 --> 00:46:58,480
this is just unacceptable, blah
blah, blah.

1246
00:46:59,040 --> 00:47:01,520
But I can very much think to
myself, I'm in the role of the

1247
00:47:01,520 --> 00:47:04,200
teacher right now, OK?
I need to stay calm and not

1248
00:47:04,200 --> 00:47:07,040
match this energy.
I need to not get personal and

1249
00:47:07,040 --> 00:47:11,560
don't be afraid to walk away.
Don't be afraid to say I cannot

1250
00:47:11,560 --> 00:47:14,040
have this conversation right now
whilst you're behaving the way

1251
00:47:14,040 --> 00:47:15,680
you are.
I'm more than willing to talk

1252
00:47:15,680 --> 00:47:17,840
about it.
That's a range of time to do so.

1253
00:47:18,400 --> 00:47:20,120
And I'll have some leadership
with me as well.

1254
00:47:20,200 --> 00:47:21,560
We'll, we'll have a few people
in the room.

1255
00:47:21,560 --> 00:47:23,800
But what we're not going to do
on the playground is have you

1256
00:47:23,800 --> 00:47:25,280
shout at me and treat me like
this.

1257
00:47:25,520 --> 00:47:27,800
It's unacceptable.
It's embarrassing.

1258
00:47:28,000 --> 00:47:30,040
And there's lots of children and
other adults here.

1259
00:47:30,320 --> 00:47:33,000
So I can't allow you to do that.
I'm afraid it's not acceptable.

1260
00:47:33,080 --> 00:47:35,040
Yeah.
And I'd I'd be very much to the

1261
00:47:35,040 --> 00:47:37,680
line very exact and say that.
I thought you've done that.

1262
00:47:37,760 --> 00:47:38,960
You've said to a parent before,
haven't you?

1263
00:47:38,960 --> 00:47:41,280
Literally something along the
lines of you need to calm down

1264
00:47:41,280 --> 00:47:42,840
and when you calm we can have a
conversation.

1265
00:47:43,000 --> 00:47:44,840
Yeah.
And it's still professionally,

1266
00:47:44,920 --> 00:47:46,880
Yeah, still still in the way,
which is still acceptable

1267
00:47:47,320 --> 00:47:48,400
because parent was shouting at
me.

1268
00:47:49,320 --> 00:47:51,520
No, don't shout at me, please.
I don't shouting at you.

1269
00:47:52,000 --> 00:47:53,160
You're allowed to have
disagreements.

1270
00:47:53,160 --> 00:47:54,840
I literally said this to them.
Like you're allowed to not like

1271
00:47:54,840 --> 00:47:57,040
how something's going on.
And we can talk about that and

1272
00:47:57,040 --> 00:48:00,320
we can get to the bottom of it.
And we can either understand,

1273
00:48:00,320 --> 00:48:02,520
hopefully you can see why we've
done it this way and come around

1274
00:48:02,520 --> 00:48:04,720
to it, or it might be that we've
done something wrong.

1275
00:48:04,960 --> 00:48:07,760
Either of those options are
available, but we need to sit

1276
00:48:07,760 --> 00:48:09,680
and talk about it.
You can't shout at me.

1277
00:48:09,720 --> 00:48:11,880
Do you find that that normally
actually hilariously, your

1278
00:48:11,880 --> 00:48:13,800
confidence in that situation
kind of diffuses a bit?

1279
00:48:14,120 --> 00:48:16,960
Every time I've done it, it has,
and I'm not going to pretend

1280
00:48:16,960 --> 00:48:19,040
that it means every time it'll
work indefinitely because there

1281
00:48:19,040 --> 00:48:21,240
will be some people that are so
angry where that doesn't help

1282
00:48:21,240 --> 00:48:23,280
and I'll just shout effing and
blinding at you.

1283
00:48:23,600 --> 00:48:26,880
But every time I've done that, I
think more often you're more

1284
00:48:26,880 --> 00:48:29,280
likely to get a good outcome
where you can just be to the

1285
00:48:29,280 --> 00:48:30,600
point.
Calm.

1286
00:48:31,000 --> 00:48:33,960
Being calm helps.
And I found that I didn't know

1287
00:48:33,960 --> 00:48:37,200
if you do this as a teacher as
well, but sometimes I will talk

1288
00:48:37,200 --> 00:48:40,160
for much longer than is like
socially acceptable and, and

1289
00:48:40,160 --> 00:48:42,040
just keep going on and making
another point.

1290
00:48:42,040 --> 00:48:43,680
Do you know when you keep
telling your kids how, how

1291
00:48:43,680 --> 00:48:46,680
really let down you are by your
children and you've really gone

1292
00:48:46,680 --> 00:48:49,600
too far this time And you could
just stop there, but you keep

1293
00:48:49,600 --> 00:48:51,120
talking because you want to make
the point to the kids.

1294
00:48:51,120 --> 00:48:52,280
And I just can't believe it,
guys.

1295
00:48:52,280 --> 00:48:54,440
So whilst you're sitting there
quietly thinking about what

1296
00:48:54,440 --> 00:48:57,480
you've done, I just want you to
remember that actually what

1297
00:48:57,480 --> 00:48:58,600
you've done, you've gone too
far.

1298
00:48:58,680 --> 00:49:01,080
And as a teacher, I feel like
we're a team.

1299
00:49:02,000 --> 00:49:03,360
You've just, you've just let me
down.

1300
00:49:03,360 --> 00:49:05,560
You've just let me down.
And I know you're all thinking,

1301
00:49:05,560 --> 00:49:07,400
I wish you'd stop talking now,
but you really need to

1302
00:49:07,400 --> 00:49:09,280
understand this guys.
No shush.

1303
00:49:09,880 --> 00:49:11,520
You need to know and just keep
going, keep going.

1304
00:49:11,800 --> 00:49:14,760
I found with parents sometimes
doing that, it makes them shush

1305
00:49:15,160 --> 00:49:17,320
and it almost lets them calm
down a bit because they're not

1306
00:49:17,320 --> 00:49:18,760
able just to go motormouth and
go.

1307
00:49:19,200 --> 00:49:21,880
So you just, you know, you go
two or three sentences too long

1308
00:49:22,080 --> 00:49:24,280
being calm, being very matter of
fact.

1309
00:49:24,640 --> 00:49:28,320
And then by the end that they
are often just like, all right,

1310
00:49:28,320 --> 00:49:31,200
fine, but let's talk then.
So that's what I always try and

1311
00:49:31,200 --> 00:49:32,440
do, and I think that's a good
way to do.

1312
00:49:32,600 --> 00:49:34,320
Definitely.
I think another one's kind of on

1313
00:49:34,320 --> 00:49:36,520
this topic of just interacting
with parents in general is about

1314
00:49:36,520 --> 00:49:39,640
gatekeeping your time.
I feel like in educate, in

1315
00:49:39,640 --> 00:49:42,800
teaching, it is just weirdly
accepted that like teachers,

1316
00:49:42,800 --> 00:49:44,440
time is just nothing.
You just talk to them whenever

1317
00:49:44,440 --> 00:49:46,160
you want.
I'll I'll grab you in the

1318
00:49:46,160 --> 00:49:48,040
morning, I'll grab you after
school, I'll ring you after

1319
00:49:48,040 --> 00:49:50,520
school and and it's just very
much like a of course you do

1320
00:49:50,520 --> 00:49:51,520
that.
Of course you drop everything

1321
00:49:51,520 --> 00:49:52,840
you're doing.
Wouldn't it be great if doctors

1322
00:49:52,840 --> 00:49:53,760
want?
Genuine.

1323
00:49:53,760 --> 00:49:55,720
I always compare it to doctors.
I'm like, that's just not how

1324
00:49:55,720 --> 00:49:58,440
professional sectors work.
It doesn't work like that.

1325
00:49:58,440 --> 00:50:00,040
We're obviously like our time is
already filled.

1326
00:50:00,320 --> 00:50:02,240
We don't reserve time for parent
phone calls.

1327
00:50:02,560 --> 00:50:04,160
That's always going to be
replacing something else.

1328
00:50:04,160 --> 00:50:07,760
So I think as a newer teacher,
it's very easy to be like, I

1329
00:50:07,760 --> 00:50:09,000
don't want to get anyone's
backup.

1330
00:50:09,000 --> 00:50:11,680
I couldn't possibly make anyone
be offended or think badly.

1331
00:50:11,680 --> 00:50:12,600
Of course I'll talk to you right
now.

1332
00:50:12,600 --> 00:50:14,080
I'll.
Talk to you right now and and I

1333
00:50:14,080 --> 00:50:16,000
was in a situation, you know,
I'll get your opinion on this

1334
00:50:16,000 --> 00:50:18,320
about like emails, parents
having direct e-mail to you.

1335
00:50:18,560 --> 00:50:21,560
I was in a situation where I'd
e-mail at 9:00 PM, I'd e-mail at

1336
00:50:21,560 --> 00:50:23,280
the weekend, I'd reply all the
time.

1337
00:50:23,280 --> 00:50:26,240
And there were even situations
where if I hadn't replied over

1338
00:50:26,240 --> 00:50:28,520
the weekend, the parent might be
like, oh, I didn't get, I didn't

1339
00:50:28,520 --> 00:50:30,440
get a reply from you.
And he's like, mate, you emailed

1340
00:50:30,440 --> 00:50:33,400
me up 7:00 PM on Saturday and
now it's Monday morning.

1341
00:50:33,400 --> 00:50:34,560
What do you mean you haven't had
a reply?

1342
00:50:34,560 --> 00:50:35,480
Of course you haven't had a
reply.

1343
00:50:35,560 --> 00:50:37,080
But I was not confident enough
to say that back then.

1344
00:50:37,080 --> 00:50:39,920
So I think a big tip here is be
really confident of knowing your

1345
00:50:39,920 --> 00:50:42,440
boundaries in terms of
gatekeeping your professional

1346
00:50:42,440 --> 00:50:44,960
time and personal time.
And that it is completely

1347
00:50:44,960 --> 00:50:48,040
acceptable to say these are the
hours that I'll reply within

1348
00:50:48,040 --> 00:50:51,320
and, and it won't necessarily be
within two hours because there's

1349
00:50:51,320 --> 00:50:53,000
lots of other things to do.
And that's just how it is.

1350
00:50:53,520 --> 00:50:55,560
Yeah, a big thing for me on this
is 2 things.

1351
00:50:55,560 --> 00:50:59,360
Firstly, I don't like the idea
of all parents having a Direct

1352
00:50:59,360 --> 00:51:01,320
Line to your e-mail from school.
I don't like that.

1353
00:51:01,440 --> 00:51:02,680
OK.
I think there should be some

1354
00:51:02,680 --> 00:51:03,920
kind of gatekeeping involved
there.

1355
00:51:04,280 --> 00:51:08,400
However, a lot of schools do do
this and you know, OK, whatever,

1356
00:51:08,400 --> 00:51:09,400
there's a lot of teachers who
work there.

1357
00:51:09,400 --> 00:51:11,120
I don't have to agree with
everything, but some teachers

1358
00:51:11,120 --> 00:51:12,400
do.
So if you work in a school where

1359
00:51:12,400 --> 00:51:16,000
actually parents do have that, I
still think a lot of what you

1360
00:51:16,000 --> 00:51:18,720
just said is absolutely right,
but it falls on deaf ears when

1361
00:51:18,720 --> 00:51:21,160
only two teachers are doing it.
OK, If you just to say, you

1362
00:51:21,160 --> 00:51:25,080
know, if what you used to be
like and what you are now worked

1363
00:51:25,080 --> 00:51:27,440
in classrooms next to each
other, both in year 4, let's say

1364
00:51:28,000 --> 00:51:30,040
there'd be a bunch of parents
who are getting replies quickly

1365
00:51:30,440 --> 00:51:32,720
and a bunch of parents here who
aren't and they'll obviously

1366
00:51:32,720 --> 00:51:34,320
talk to each other and they're
like, you're getting in touch

1367
00:51:34,320 --> 00:51:36,280
with a teacher much quicker.
That's not intractable and it

1368
00:51:36,280 --> 00:51:39,960
would look bad.
So my point here is you have to

1369
00:51:39,960 --> 00:51:41,960
when we're dealing with parents
and we're talking about this

1370
00:51:41,960 --> 00:51:43,720
now, if your leadership
listening to this, a lot of

1371
00:51:43,720 --> 00:51:46,480
leaders do and I appreciate them
so much because it can come

1372
00:51:46,480 --> 00:51:48,400
across sometimes that we're very
much like this doesn't work,

1373
00:51:48,400 --> 00:51:50,120
this doesn't work.
But there's a lot of leaders who

1374
00:51:50,120 --> 00:51:51,760
listen to this and understand
what we're saying, which is

1375
00:51:51,760 --> 00:51:55,320
trying to help everyone.
You have to take grab hold of

1376
00:51:55,320 --> 00:51:59,120
this yourself, take control and
say, look, these are the rules.

1377
00:51:59,280 --> 00:52:01,880
These are the rules for getting
in touch with our teachers.

1378
00:52:01,880 --> 00:52:04,560
If you're going to be the person
who gives them all, all the

1379
00:52:04,560 --> 00:52:06,960
parents, the emails of the
teacher that needs to come along

1380
00:52:06,960 --> 00:52:10,920
with at least two working days,
allow for a reply.

1381
00:52:11,240 --> 00:52:13,720
Yeah.
My staff have got this time that

1382
00:52:13,720 --> 00:52:15,760
I've allocated for them.
Maybe I've even put it in their

1383
00:52:15,760 --> 00:52:18,240
directed time calendar to look
and reply to emails.

1384
00:52:18,240 --> 00:52:18,880
Yeah, right.
Yeah.

1385
00:52:19,120 --> 00:52:20,040
Just imagine.
Just imagine.

1386
00:52:20,040 --> 00:52:21,440
But I think you say take this.
Yeah.

1387
00:52:21,440 --> 00:52:23,360
What you can't do is just say
here, here it is.

1388
00:52:23,360 --> 00:52:25,200
And by the way, guys, can you
just reply to that, please?

1389
00:52:25,200 --> 00:52:26,400
Yeah.
And if you happen to get that

1390
00:52:26,400 --> 00:52:28,040
one parent emails every day,
it's like, right, you've got to

1391
00:52:28,080 --> 00:52:28,880
deal with that now.
Exactly.

1392
00:52:28,880 --> 00:52:32,240
So then again, as teacher, I'd
be saying for any consistent

1393
00:52:32,240 --> 00:52:36,840
problems or for these types of
issues, I don't expect my staff

1394
00:52:36,840 --> 00:52:38,880
to reply to you, so please don't
e-mail them.

1395
00:52:39,000 --> 00:52:41,160
Yeah, therefore when they do and
they're emailing staff saying

1396
00:52:41,160 --> 00:52:44,720
what day is PE day, it's OK for
the teacher to not to reply to

1397
00:52:44,720 --> 00:52:45,800
that.
Yeah, because that's just

1398
00:52:45,800 --> 00:52:47,560
something you can go to the
office and ask in the morning

1399
00:52:47,560 --> 00:52:50,480
when you drop off your kids.
OK, So what I'd say is if you're

1400
00:52:50,480 --> 00:52:54,640
gonna do this and allow teachers
emails to be accessed by

1401
00:52:54,640 --> 00:52:58,360
parents, it has to come as
strict rules where it's not then

1402
00:52:58,360 --> 00:53:00,880
on the teacher to decide what
their boundaries are because

1403
00:53:00,880 --> 00:53:02,600
then it can lead to some awkward
situations.

1404
00:53:02,640 --> 00:53:04,160
Yeah, I agree.
I, I, I.

1405
00:53:04,160 --> 00:53:07,160
And the more we talk about
parent e-mail, like having your

1406
00:53:07,160 --> 00:53:09,040
e-mail address, the more I
genuinely just fundamentally

1407
00:53:09,040 --> 00:53:10,960
think is awful.
Well, our old school, we didn't

1408
00:53:10,960 --> 00:53:13,000
do it at all and we were fine.
Yeah, and you know what they

1409
00:53:13,000 --> 00:53:15,240
did?
They've all the emails came

1410
00:53:15,240 --> 00:53:17,120
through the office system and it
literally allowed them to

1411
00:53:17,120 --> 00:53:19,080
philtre out stuff like when
there's PE on this day.

1412
00:53:19,080 --> 00:53:22,280
So I, I sometimes got emails
from parents, but it was the

1413
00:53:22,280 --> 00:53:24,040
office saying, see this e-mail
from this.

1414
00:53:24,040 --> 00:53:25,960
Yeah, most of the time was
information.

1415
00:53:26,320 --> 00:53:29,400
Like it was like little Johnny
has a dentist appointment, he'll

1416
00:53:29,400 --> 00:53:31,480
be late for maths tomorrow.
Just information.

1417
00:53:31,480 --> 00:53:35,000
Yeah, sometimes it was something
actionable like, oh, this, this

1418
00:53:35,000 --> 00:53:37,240
person's going on holiday there,
but hoping for a bit of work,

1419
00:53:38,000 --> 00:53:39,640
OK.
You know, like it might be that

1420
00:53:39,680 --> 00:53:42,440
either I say to look while we're
doing this and this, yeah, or I

1421
00:53:42,440 --> 00:53:44,600
go by the school policy of what
we do for that kind of thing.

1422
00:53:44,920 --> 00:53:47,440
Most of the time, even with
that, it would be intercepted by

1423
00:53:47,440 --> 00:53:49,800
leadership and now and the
leadership would sort it and say

1424
00:53:50,160 --> 00:53:51,800
we don't do this or we do do
that, blah.

1425
00:53:51,800 --> 00:53:53,120
Blah blah.
I think that system worked

1426
00:53:53,120 --> 00:53:55,160
really well.
It took a lot of the additional

1427
00:53:55,160 --> 00:53:56,400
stress off the teachers in our
school.

1428
00:53:56,480 --> 00:53:57,560
And it was a big job for the
leaders.

1429
00:53:57,560 --> 00:53:58,960
Let's not forget that.
Yeah, of course we need to be

1430
00:53:58,960 --> 00:54:02,920
very grateful because we didn't
suddenly have, you know, a lower

1431
00:54:02,920 --> 00:54:05,600
demand from parents.
We just as teachers saw it less.

1432
00:54:05,880 --> 00:54:09,520
But I do think having that means
parents get the hint almost

1433
00:54:09,840 --> 00:54:10,760
eventually.
They're like time.

1434
00:54:11,080 --> 00:54:12,480
Oh, this is a waste of time.
The.

1435
00:54:12,480 --> 00:54:14,120
Culture was really clear in our
school.

1436
00:54:14,120 --> 00:54:16,760
I think of what is acceptable to
e-mail into school and, and the

1437
00:54:16,760 --> 00:54:19,160
acceptable like layers of
communication exactly.

1438
00:54:19,160 --> 00:54:21,200
Some a lot of parents would have
would have realised that's how

1439
00:54:21,200 --> 00:54:22,240
it works.
And I think you know what, I

1440
00:54:22,240 --> 00:54:23,760
just need to have a conversation
with the teacher.

1441
00:54:23,760 --> 00:54:25,520
I'll just talk to them after
school for 10 seconds sure,

1442
00:54:25,520 --> 00:54:27,640
rather than emailing them at
7:00 PM and making them worry

1443
00:54:27,640 --> 00:54:29,920
about replying.
So I think that the ultimate tip

1444
00:54:29,920 --> 00:54:31,560
here is knowing your boundaries
as well.

1445
00:54:31,560 --> 00:54:33,040
So the school, you all need to
have those boundaries.

1446
00:54:33,040 --> 00:54:35,880
You also need to know them and
follow those boundaries.

1447
00:54:35,880 --> 00:54:38,240
Like you said with the example
of me versus my old self, you

1448
00:54:38,240 --> 00:54:40,560
need to know and follow those
boundaries and your school

1449
00:54:40,560 --> 00:54:42,480
should back you up.
You know, when you're in those

1450
00:54:42,480 --> 00:54:45,680
situations of a parent may be
challenging that you've not done

1451
00:54:45,680 --> 00:54:47,520
something and you know it's a
school policy not to do this.

1452
00:54:47,840 --> 00:54:50,880
Your head teacher, your senior
leadership team should be

1453
00:54:50,960 --> 00:54:52,960
actively going and talking to
the parent saying no, no, no,

1454
00:54:53,080 --> 00:54:55,120
no, you're wrong.
This is the policy I've set for

1455
00:54:55,120 --> 00:54:56,440
my teacher and they're just
following it.

1456
00:54:56,680 --> 00:54:58,400
So actually, please don't get
annoyed at them for that, you

1457
00:54:58,440 --> 00:54:59,720
know?
Definitely.

1458
00:54:59,840 --> 00:55:02,240
OK, last thing from me, we
talked about this a bit recently

1459
00:55:02,240 --> 00:55:04,520
and it's when you bump into
parents outside of school, you

1460
00:55:04,520 --> 00:55:06,840
know, how do you approach that?
What's professional, etcetera.

1461
00:55:06,840 --> 00:55:09,760
And I would say to people, don't
be afraid to talk to them.

1462
00:55:10,120 --> 00:55:11,800
Don't don't forget you're a
human being.

1463
00:55:11,840 --> 00:55:13,920
You're doing a job.
Sure.

1464
00:55:13,920 --> 00:55:17,000
If you're in the middle of Tesco
buying carrots, just say hello.

1465
00:55:17,800 --> 00:55:19,440
Oh, it's chucking it down out
there, isn't it?

1466
00:55:19,440 --> 00:55:20,960
Drenched.
Yeah, it was making a roast

1467
00:55:20,960 --> 00:55:21,960
dinner.
Have a nice one.

1468
00:55:23,080 --> 00:55:26,080
That's it.
You don't need to seize up and

1469
00:55:26,080 --> 00:55:29,040
say, Oh yes, I checked your,
your, your, your timetable

1470
00:55:29,040 --> 00:55:30,520
practise at the weekend.
It was fantastic.

1471
00:55:30,520 --> 00:55:33,320
Well done, little Jimmy here.
Don't worry about it.

1472
00:55:33,320 --> 00:55:34,680
You don't have to go into that
role.

1473
00:55:34,920 --> 00:55:36,440
You're a human.
They're a human.

1474
00:55:36,520 --> 00:55:39,880
I think there's something to be
said for parents seeing teachers

1475
00:55:40,080 --> 00:55:42,520
in a different role and for
teachers seeing parents and

1476
00:55:42,520 --> 00:55:47,040
children outside of school and
just knowing that this exists.

1477
00:55:47,040 --> 00:55:49,440
We're just people.
Have a great day.

1478
00:55:49,440 --> 00:55:51,800
Hope you're enjoying yourself.
Nothing to do with the job.

1479
00:55:52,120 --> 00:55:54,760
Monday morning times on that
child's not been reading at

1480
00:55:54,760 --> 00:55:56,720
home.
I'm not going to say in Tesco I

1481
00:55:56,760 --> 00:55:59,000
no exactly, but I might catch
them after school and just say

1482
00:55:59,000 --> 00:56:00,840
oh quick one didn't see a
reading record sign.

1483
00:56:01,840 --> 00:56:03,480
Funny to see at the weekend.
I hope you had a great time.

1484
00:56:04,280 --> 00:56:05,360
Are you doing much reading at
home?

1485
00:56:05,960 --> 00:56:07,400
I'm in the context of school
there.

1486
00:56:07,680 --> 00:56:09,440
You don't have to have those
blurred.

1487
00:56:09,440 --> 00:56:11,560
That really was a positive
sandwich that one start with

1488
00:56:11,560 --> 00:56:12,840
some negative.
Well, great to see the weekend

1489
00:56:12,840 --> 00:56:13,800
though.
Back to the negative though.

1490
00:56:14,000 --> 00:56:15,080
Very.
Good, Johnny showed a chair.

1491
00:56:15,320 --> 00:56:17,680
A chair on my face.
It's true though, and equally

1492
00:56:17,840 --> 00:56:19,720
the opposite way around.
Sometimes you can keep your

1493
00:56:19,720 --> 00:56:22,120
boundaries outside if a parent
actually is the one overstepping

1494
00:56:22,120 --> 00:56:23,360
and trying to make it about
school.

1495
00:56:23,520 --> 00:56:25,400
But oh, did you check my e-mail,
you know, in the middle of the

1496
00:56:25,400 --> 00:56:26,840
Tesco?
Did you get my e-mail on Friday

1497
00:56:26,840 --> 00:56:28,840
about this thing?
You can genuinely you you are

1498
00:56:28,840 --> 00:56:30,760
allowed to say I will check it
on Monday.

1499
00:56:30,760 --> 00:56:32,080
Obviously I'm I'm I'm off juicy
right now.

1500
00:56:32,080 --> 00:56:34,320
I'm just doing doing a shopping.
Make it make light heart of it.

1501
00:56:34,480 --> 00:56:35,800
But yeah, of course I'll check
that on Monday.

1502
00:56:35,800 --> 00:56:37,560
I haven't had, I haven't had
time yet because obviously, you

1503
00:56:37,560 --> 00:56:39,320
know, you sent it on Friday.
Did have time, Didn't want to,

1504
00:56:39,320 --> 00:56:40,480
yeah.
Didn't have time, didn't want to

1505
00:56:40,480 --> 00:56:41,200
or whatever.
Go away.

1506
00:56:41,200 --> 00:56:42,560
Please leave me alone.
I'm trying to buy some carrots

1507
00:56:42,560 --> 00:56:45,280
actually for Rudolph.
So it's nearly Christmas, mate.

1508
00:56:45,960 --> 00:56:46,720
Yeah.
But yeah, you can.

1509
00:56:46,720 --> 00:56:48,120
You just keep your boundaries.
It's acceptable.

1510
00:56:48,120 --> 00:56:49,720
Like you're allowed to be a
human being outside.

1511
00:56:49,720 --> 00:56:51,720
You don't have to be a teacher
24/7 all the time.

1512
00:56:51,840 --> 00:56:54,120
Like you can just be normal.
I feel like there's one big

1513
00:56:54,120 --> 00:56:58,440
strand going through all of this
and it's like as a teacher, you

1514
00:56:58,440 --> 00:57:01,720
can only control yourself.
You can only control how you

1515
00:57:01,720 --> 00:57:04,720
react to people, etcetera, OK?
You can't control a parent

1516
00:57:04,720 --> 00:57:06,480
frothing at the mouth getting
annoyed at you over something.

1517
00:57:06,520 --> 00:57:09,240
You also can't control the
parent coming up to your Tesco

1518
00:57:09,240 --> 00:57:10,760
and saying, Oh my kid, how are
they getting on?

1519
00:57:11,040 --> 00:57:13,120
You can't control these things.
What you can control is how you

1520
00:57:13,120 --> 00:57:15,280
react to it.
And I think if for me, it's

1521
00:57:15,280 --> 00:57:17,800
about being rooted in empathy,
OK, That's always the thing.

1522
00:57:17,800 --> 00:57:20,440
It's always the thing you, you,
you care about the kids, you

1523
00:57:20,440 --> 00:57:23,720
care about yourself, you care
about your work life balance and

1524
00:57:23,720 --> 00:57:25,960
it's about getting all of those
things right.

1525
00:57:26,040 --> 00:57:29,200
And I think, yeah, it just comes
down to that, doesn't it?

1526
00:57:29,200 --> 00:57:31,240
That's how I look at this.
And I think you've made some

1527
00:57:31,240 --> 00:57:33,360
really good points here that I
think are really helpful.

1528
00:57:33,800 --> 00:57:36,240
How do you summarise?
This is linked.

1529
00:57:36,320 --> 00:57:40,240
A while ago we asked each other
on the podcast whether becoming

1530
00:57:40,240 --> 00:57:43,040
a parent has affected how we
think about being a teacher.

1531
00:57:43,040 --> 00:57:46,040
I mean, we did that maybe last
year and at the first I was, I'm

1532
00:57:46,040 --> 00:57:48,440
not really sure.
I feel feel mostly the same.

1533
00:57:48,440 --> 00:57:49,800
But I think this has changed
now.

1534
00:57:50,040 --> 00:57:53,320
Being a parent now has made me
realise how unbelievably

1535
00:57:53,320 --> 00:57:56,640
defensive I am of my own child.
And obviously most people are

1536
00:57:56,640 --> 00:57:57,800
going to be feeling like this as
well.

1537
00:57:57,840 --> 00:58:00,960
It has made, it has allowed me
to empathise with parents a bit

1538
00:58:00,960 --> 00:58:03,040
more in situations where as a
teacher, I might be thinking,

1539
00:58:03,040 --> 00:58:04,640
oh, this is nothing, I've got 32
kids.

1540
00:58:04,640 --> 00:58:05,880
This is just one of my
conversations.

1541
00:58:05,880 --> 00:58:07,800
This is they've just been a bit
silly or whatever, or they were

1542
00:58:07,800 --> 00:58:09,480
just struggling in this thing.
I'm just going to tell you, go

1543
00:58:09,480 --> 00:58:11,360
over it.
And I used to think a bit more

1544
00:58:11,360 --> 00:58:12,800
like that.
Whereas now I'm like, Oh my God,

1545
00:58:12,800 --> 00:58:15,840
I can really, really appreciate
how intense that feeling might

1546
00:58:15,840 --> 00:58:17,960
be for a parent to hear
literally any feedback, whether

1547
00:58:17,960 --> 00:58:20,160
it's positive or negative or
more so negative.

1548
00:58:20,920 --> 00:58:22,200
And I can just understand that a
bit more.

1549
00:58:22,200 --> 00:58:24,280
Do you know what?
When they get angry, I'm going

1550
00:58:24,320 --> 00:58:26,640
to forgive them even though that
it was inappropriate.

1551
00:58:27,200 --> 00:58:28,560
I can walk away and be like, do
you know what?

1552
00:58:28,560 --> 00:58:30,520
If that was my kid, would I have
been feeling that way?

1553
00:58:30,520 --> 00:58:33,360
Maybe I wouldn't have manifested
it out, you know, so outwardly

1554
00:58:33,360 --> 00:58:35,440
and got angry.
But I can absolutely tell you

1555
00:58:35,440 --> 00:58:37,560
right now where there's only two
and there's already been a

1556
00:58:37,560 --> 00:58:40,480
couple of situations where I've
felt really defensive.

1557
00:58:40,520 --> 00:58:43,360
And I almost like my natural
instinct is like, oh, I need to,

1558
00:58:43,680 --> 00:58:46,760
I need to get a bit angry and
angry about this.

1559
00:58:46,760 --> 00:58:49,200
And realistically, it's nothing.
I was like, they didn't need

1560
00:58:49,200 --> 00:58:51,560
that at all, but I felt that
feeling and that was the first

1561
00:58:51,560 --> 00:58:53,360
one I felt that I was like, oh,
I get it now.

1562
00:58:53,920 --> 00:58:55,920
I, I get it now.
This is this, this is the

1563
00:58:55,920 --> 00:58:57,640
empathy I'm supposed to have for
parents when they're hearing

1564
00:58:57,640 --> 00:58:59,120
this.
I remember speaking to my job

1565
00:58:59,120 --> 00:59:02,480
share Julie when, when we worked
together and she was really good

1566
00:59:02,480 --> 00:59:03,960
at this.
She was so good at being

1567
00:59:03,960 --> 00:59:05,720
empathetic for parents and
parents evening and things like

1568
00:59:05,720 --> 00:59:06,920
that.
And I was always like, Nah, just

1569
00:59:06,920 --> 00:59:08,280
give the feedback we've got,
we've got 5 minutes.

1570
00:59:08,280 --> 00:59:10,080
Just get on with it.
And she'd always do the positive

1571
00:59:10,080 --> 00:59:12,800
sandwich approach and it was
because the next sandwich.

1572
00:59:12,880 --> 00:59:14,800
And it's because she had her own
children and she totally

1573
00:59:14,800 --> 00:59:17,640
understood how much they were
her world and how hearing

1574
00:59:17,640 --> 00:59:19,440
certain feedback would affect
her massively

1575
00:59:19,440 --> 00:59:21,160
disproportionately.
And we should, we should

1576
00:59:21,280 --> 00:59:23,440
empathise with that.
So yeah, running thing for all

1577
00:59:23,440 --> 00:59:24,400
this.
I hope you enjoyed this episode,

1578
00:59:24,400 --> 00:59:25,800
guys.
We're talking about how to deal

1579
00:59:25,800 --> 00:59:29,200
with parents, but having empathy
is definitely a core theme for

1580
00:59:29,200 --> 00:59:31,200
every single tip we've given.
Well, that was 1/2 of it.

1581
00:59:31,200 --> 00:59:32,960
The other half was me absolutely
smashing a quiz that you

1582
00:59:32,960 --> 00:59:34,400
designed from the ground up for
me to fail.

1583
00:59:34,400 --> 00:59:36,760
No, no, listen, I've edited that
but out so no one.

1584
00:59:38,280 --> 00:59:42,560
I am buzzing because I love
recording this podcast, but the

1585
00:59:42,560 --> 00:59:44,760
end of this podcast means you're
going to go to Tesco and get me

1586
00:59:44,760 --> 00:59:46,560
some whisper gold because I did
well in the quiz.

1587
00:59:46,560 --> 00:59:48,440
Guys, if you enjoyed this
episode, share it with someone

1588
00:59:48,440 --> 00:59:50,640
you think might find it useful.
Please leave us a review.

1589
00:59:50,640 --> 00:59:54,080
It helps us out so, so much.
And hey them before we go

1590
00:59:54,480 --> 00:59:56,120
anything you want to.
Say every now and then Whisper

1591
00:59:56,120 --> 00:59:57,760
golds 4 pack are on club card
price.

1592
00:59:57,840 --> 00:59:59,120
I'll be going there right now.
See you there.