198. Should Teachers Model Healthy Eating? Plus Quickest ECT Quits, Ethical Issues & Zombie Outbreaks

0:00 Hello everyone, welcome back to another episode of Teach the Repeat. My name is Dylan, my name's Hayden, and we're here with your questions. Join the WhatsApp community down below and you can submit them yourselves and join the gang. Just the Q&A this week, quite a packed one for us. So enjoy this one guys because it's all you're getting so. We can deal with it, deal with it, deal with it. Kid, let's do AQ and a Hayden. Why don't you start with the first? One I will for some reason like this. Oh my God, in a world. Where there were questions to read from a community in WhatsApp? Two ex teachers step up to the throne at the throne throne anyway, right? Ignore that.

0:41 Ignore that here we. Go is it A2 seat of throw? No. Are we standing on it? The problem is you're not on the throne. Are you on my lap? No, no, you're just again, you're not involved. Sure, but here we go. Is it acceptable for teachers to eat biscuits and drink sugary drinks? Yep. Oh, sorry. There's sorry. There's more, there's more. Oh wait, I got lost at. That sorry hold on, let me just drink my full fat coke it's a glass of water doesn't even. Work as a joke. You forgot people can see. It's a podcast. It's a video podcast. I forgot. That's so funny. Try to make a joke and forgot people can see that you're not making the joke.

1:21 Let me drink, not the elixir of life. Oh, it's the oldest drink possible anyway. Christ, what are we doing? Is it acceptable teachers to drink water? Yeah, I'm going to start this question again. Here we go is it acceptable for teachers to eat biscuits and drinks sugar and. Drinks water, water my. Sake. Water. Water. Sorry, I've got a full pack Coke all over my head. Oh man. In front of children. Cool. OK. Is it acceptable? Is it accessible to treat them in front of children? Are we supposed to be role models when it comes to eating? Or can you be a Have I forgot to read this? No, let's just, let's just say a a a greedy piggy, a piggy, a piggy. That's what I say to, you know, myself.

2:02 Or can you be a piggy when it comes to eating your packed lunch? OK, so is it OK, there's, I think there's two questions there to be fair. Well, there is because there's two question marks. But when it comes to your packed lunch, it's like, well, I don't know about you, but I don't eat my packed lunch in front of the kids. Or at least I have the option to. Like I know what's forcing me. Yeah, exactly. Yeah, we're just like we we got it. Strange to be like, do you know what? I'm going to go and actually I'm going to go and eat this share bar of Dairy Milk in the canteen with the kids who've got the worst score that is I've ever seen in my life. Yeah, not sure the share bar of them. I reckon we could go down a step and have maybe a time out or something. No share bar. Share. I mean, yeah. There's no such thing as a share bar anyway. So it's just, yeah, obviously you know what, have whatever you want in your lunch.

2:44 You're a grown adult. And I don't know what like there has to be role models like just. Imagining open your lunch box at school and it's just an Easter egg. Like a whisper gold Easter egg, there's. No lunch box, they're just the carrier bag from the shop with a six pack packed multi bag of crisps and and probably 3 cream eggs. Now my point is you are a grown adult. Like people will see stuff from from other people in the world ever eating a biscuit every now and like it. To eat a biscuit every now and then is absolutely fine. It's absolutely fine. Of course it is. If every single day you're eating half pack of crusted creams and down in a too late a bottle of coke in front of the kids, Yeah, you kind of enjoy your thing. Obviously I think that's bad.

3:25 So there's a line somewhere, that's for sure. So is there? Is there a line don't know where you can in front of the kids though because ultimately you said they obviously they'll see it in the real world but you are in a controlled environment as a teacher. Is it fair to say as a teacher you just shouldn't be modelling this at all? Or do you think it's the line should be a bit further back of like guys don't rub it in their faces and eat rubbish all the time while simultaneously telling them they can't do it, But if you occasionally have something just remind them that you are an adult and you do what? You want Yeah, I think, I think, I think it has got to be moderation to A to a degree, to a degree. Like, like I said, like eating a biscuit every now and then isn't actually unhealthy, right. So eating a biscuit every now and then and the children happen to see you eating a biscuit like, OK, like I've seen some children, their pet lunch that have the healthiest thing in the world every single time. But overall, it's like a balanced meal. I think something like drinking, you know, proper Coke in front of the children.

4:15 Like I, I actually think you shouldn't do that because like that is a genuinely horrendously bad for you Drink. You can enjoy it as an adult. You can have it have it as much as you want where you're a grown adult, but in front of the kids. I do actually think that you should try and avoid. Avoid doing. I think people would say that exactly the same analogy, that they just choose that their line was not Coke but also the chocolate that's. Completely fine. And that line's going to that line is clearly going to change for everyone. And I understand that. And I'm just trying to express where my line would be. And if you wanted to have a rule in place which was easier to to administer, you might just say nothing like that. But again, I just think if you say nothing like that, your line still has to stop somewhere. Like you're OK, you're not allowed a custard cream. You are allowed of Florida broccoli, right?

4:57 So, so, so where is that line in the middle? Is it like a cheese string? Yeah, you have a cheese string. It's like it's slightly processed, but it is like cheese at the end of the day. Is that OK? So like, it it I don't think you can pretend, not you personally, but I don't think in general anyone can pretend like that. There is a clear answer here, genuinely. So I So what I would say is like, just be a professional and just use your common sense. I personally wouldn't be drinking full fat Coke in front of my class. Yeah, yeah, but I but I would have a hobnob every now and then, so. That's fair enough. I think there are some some situations where I don't think it's bad to have like a really, really hard set rule of like you can't have anything remotely unhealthy. And what is? That then to me it's, it's those schools that have like a healthy eating policy at break time or where it's like at break time, all of the children are explicitly told they can only have healthy snacks and it's really, really strict like, but. Like you list them though you have to, yeah. Exactly where they're listed, where it's like you can have fruit, basically.

5:50 You can have fruit or like a yoghurt or something but. There are other things that are healthy that aren't on that list. So what is is what you're saying adults should just follow the same policy as the children? Because there could well be a case where an adult still having something help a cracker. Is that unhealthy? Is it health? OK, whatever. But like, can you have a cracker break? Well, kids aren't allowed a cracker at break time, so you're not. I think that's a bit daft. It's weird. I'd say that my problem with that would be OK, cool, expand that. If you're going to have such a restrictive list of the kids and like it needs to be sensible. Do you know what I mean? Like that, that has to come part and pass with it. If a teacher's thinking, Oh no, I can't eat my cracker. The first thing should be I'm going to eat my cracker and immediately change this list for the children because that's. Ridiculous. I really disagree. I don't think it has to be the same. Of course it doesn't. And also like a a use, like if you're on the playground with the kids.

6:31 Fair enough. Yeah. Like, like if you're on the playground with the kids and it's like you can only have fruit kids. It would be a bit strange for a teacher to walk out of a massive biscuit. That's exactly what I'm. Saying OK, so, so but but but you can still like adults can still eat that like we're talking about in their packed lunch and they just have. It of course, yeah, no, yeah. This whole thing for me is prefaced by when you're in front of the kids, OK, sure. So if you're saying to the kids we've got this extremely harsh strict rule and I'm going to uphold it. Like there's literally a policy at the school. I think it, it just crosses the boundary to me of like complete like too hypocritical then as a teacher, I think it will be a net loss for you as a teacher. But the respect you'll have with these children if you then immediately just like you're enforcing this strict rule and you don't even follow it. That's really interesting. Because we've spoken a lot about how rules don't have to be similar for both and we've agreed on that.

7:13 So like, for example, let's take like the uniform rule or or whatever. And let's just say there's something really strict like your tie. You have to wear a tie and it has to be done up. Like do you think all teachers should have to wear a tie and it be done up perfectly as well then? Because you can't enforce this really strict rule and then not do it yourself. Like, are you going back from what you said before? No. No, I, I, I don't know why that's oh, you're just a hypocrite. OK. No, it feels different. I think it feels different. I, I felt. I don't know. It does. It does, it does. It does feel different. The hypocrisy of eating something in front of a child when you've just told them they can't eat the thing because we're a healthy school and at break times you can only have healthy snacks. It just feels. We're a smart school. You got to wait. I that way. That's how we do it. I'm, I'm, I'm forcing this down. You. You don't, Sir, much. It's different. I mean, I mean, I there's an argument to say that probably you probably will lose respect for children in that in that situation as.

7:53 Well, so so you should so so Rules should be the same for adults and kids. I don't think it's the worst thing in the world in that situation. If the rule was we're going to enforce this extremely strict policy of wearing ties, it would be a bit hypocritical, wouldn't it, of us of a school where you didn't wear ties as well. And we're saying it's smart, but we're also saying we're dressing smart, but we're not choosing to wear dress with ties. I don't think that is a crazy example of where actually probably probably should. It probably does make sense to say if we're going to have that ridiculously strict rule with kids, we probably should do it. Can you think of an example? Now then, when the rules of an adult don't laugh, don't laugh, but you can you think of an example where that's not the case, where you think actually it doesn't matter, actually, I'm gonna enforce this rule, but it doesn't matter. I do a different What would it be that that would be the case?

8:36 Sure. It's maybe just like a more strict back version of that. So yeah, the majority of schools where it's like we have a uniform, but it's quite loose. What do you mean? I think uniforms are quite set in stone. What? Kind of, I don't think they are in terms of like because most schools these days it will be like you just need to have a green jumper. So where some trousers? So is it OK for a teacher to not have a green jumper? Yeah. Why is that different? Because the teachers. Because the teacher uniform policy is different. Yeah, so so is the eating policy for children. Yeah, but, but I don't think it's hypocritical that a teacher, I don't think any, I don't think had pupils looking at a teacher and thinking, oh, wow, they don't have to wear a green jumper, so why should I? I don't think they are. I think they're just thinking, oh, they're an adult in smart dress.

9:16 We have a uniform for a different reason. Teachers don't need a uniform. They're an adult eating there. They don't need to. They're an adult eating a cracker. We have a Pollock, that's fine. We don't need to. We don't need to a cracker. We can tell a bit of fruit. Maybe, but the whole point of healthy eating is we're trying to promote healthy lifestyle. And if we are the if we are the end game for them. Like we're them when they're older and we're not remotely promoting a healthy, healthy lifestyle in a school where we're really strict on healthy lifestyle. It does just diminish the whole thing. Same for, same for uniform I. Don't think it does. I don't think it diminishes. I don't think it diminishes the point of uniform. Like it sounds like a lot of what people have said when we talk about uniforms who say teachers should be extremely smart all the time because it's the end goal for the kids and that's what they're aiming to get at the end. I don't. I just don't, I don't think. That's what people have said and we've basically said to them, no, that's fine if you don't think they're same. But I'm, I'm just trying to dig in here. Why are they not the same?

9:58 Because other than I just feel like they're not or they've just not been the same in my experience ever. So therefore literally getting it down to the bare bones, I don't think it's enough to say that the kids have the strict rules, so adults should have the same strict rule. That's not enough of a reason to do it for me. So I'm trying to dig into why you think it is for that but not for something. Else here's number 4. Then do you think it's, do you think they are of equal importance that we get kids to dress a certain way versus getting kids to eat healthily? No, no. So I think we can, I think we can be significantly more strict on one of those things than the other because one of them actually impacts their literal entire lifestyle and one of them is realistically just a clothing choice. And the reason we've done it is so that kids actually there's another reason. No, you're right. You're right. It's so that kids don't know. Yeah. Because it's fair.

10:39 It's fair because. To be fair, if a kid sees you eating an apple at break time, it definitely means when they go home and their parents serve them dinner it'll be magically healthy all the sudden. That's the wrong way around. That's the wrong way around if kids see me eating a four pack of Whisper gold whilst I'm simultaneously telling the importance of being healthy. Their dinner at home will still be the same. OK. But their but their choices might even change in terms of what they think is acceptable if we can impact them a little bit in terms of thinking about being healthy. I agree, by the way, and we should. I agree. I agree. I agree wholeheartedly with like this whole thing. And I've said at the start where my line was, there is a line. I'm just saying, I don't think it's kind of evolved into do the rules have to be the same for another just because they offer a kid and I'd I would reject that completely. The other things you've gone on to say, like what's more important we're trying to do this that's more of a reasonable. I think they justify a little bit more like I think I, I actually think that's probably the only example I can think of where I'd say I think it's acceptable when a school is quite strict on you have to do the same thing as the kids. I don't I can't actually think of any other examples where I would think that is true.

11:34 It is just for that one. I think if you and and I don't even think that's necessarily the way to do it. I just think if you're in a school where they say we have this really strict healthy eating policy because we're really trying to promote healthy eating at break time. If you've got an unhealthy snack, please can you just not eat it in front of the kids? Yeah, I think that's completely acceptable. Completely. I agree and I don't and I still stand by the point. I just don't think that's the same as if you're going to wear something different or, you know, hideaway from the children because you're not wearing the same blazer as that must. I think it's. I think you can easily explain to a child why the uniform policy is different between adults and children without diminishing any effects to. Them Well, now we've bored everyone to death. Interesting. Yeah. So I think basically eat what you want to eat, but in front of the kids, just be mindful, be a professional and think, oh, is this the best thing to be modelling to the children?

12:18 Probably not. Would I? Would I swear in front of the children? No, I just swear outside though, wouldn't I? Yes, I would. Yeah. Next one. I've sent this one in before, but I bet you won't answer it. I think teaching is the most ethically dubious job in the world. Do you agree straight away? Obviously not. Do you want me to list more ethically dubious jobs than than teacher? Right. Yeah. Yeah, you do. I can't think of more ethically dubious. OK. Insurance selling insurance. Car salesman completely ripping off old people just because they know they can. Being a politician. Yeah, taking bribes and and and money for talks with with different packs of people who will influence you in your role.

13:02 Jeff Bezos. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. Literally. There you go. There's a few. So the answer's no. We carrying on. We constantly ignore photocopying copyright rules and copy books so all children have extracts. We constantly use streaming sites like Disney Plus that say not for public use. Well, I don't know about constantly using Disney Plus. Yeah, I'll just say hang on a minute. I constantly use Disney Plus but. Yeah, two things. Well, three things. Number one, is it the most ethically dubious job in the world? Absolutely. No, it's not #2 is there an issue with ignoring copyright etcetera? Yes, huge issue. And just the last one very quickly. I've sent this one in before, but you won't answer it. We have literally spoken about this at least twice in the past.

13:44 So whether it was your exact question or not, I apologise. I apologise. However, we have absolutely talked about this and why wouldn't we answer it like, Oh no, big school is out to get me because I'm talking about the dubious constraints of teaching. Oh. You fall, they reverse psychology does big hard. I bet you want to ask this one. I bloody well. I bloody well. Oh, I'll answer it now. Next week, every question is going to be bet you won't answer this. I'm gonna answer them all. But yeah, for two hours, we, we, we dropped down an episode because we've got so much to do, but it just hasn't been 4 hours long. I do think though that is absolutely true that the especially copyright and stuff. Holy moly. The amount of times I've heard people just say we'll just upload the PDF of the book to the to the shared drive so all the kids can see it will we having bought 1 and therefore it's used for 100 kids at once.

14:35 That sounds extremely illegal. Oh, but budgets, budgets are so tight. Oh, is that new rule? Is it when budgets are starting, you've got no money, You can break the law, Let everyone know. I'll go and pickpocket someone because a budget. I got to steal this from the shop. OK it. Gives the same vibe and I feel like you'll you'll agree with this as well in the sats. You know what I'm going to say right? In the Sats, I know that child can do it. So I just just gave them a little nudge in the test so they can show they can do it. It's the same vibe, right? Ish. Like I'd say it's even worse than that. It's like it's basically saying, I know this, you can't do it. There are constraints in place, it's hard, you can't do it, so I'm going to cheat. Yeah. It's even further.

15:16 So yeah, I do think that, and I've seen it a lot, like, like copyright is just genuinely brushed over so much and people justify because, oh, it's for kids. Why a bit? Don't be a Nancy Fancy saying it's copyright. It's for the kids to help them and they're reading. It's for the kids. OK, go outside Waterstones with your PDF copies and hand them out for free and see what happens. I've copied this book that you could buy inside. Everyone can have it. We've got a kid. Yeah. Yeah, and it's for a school, just there are some publishers out there and some authors out there who said you can use this freely, You can use this freely. And it's like the the reason why that's so good and nice and kind is because you shouldn't be allowed to otherwise. And we can, we can go into a whole debate about what should and shouldn't be allowed and whether it's right or wrong to withhold things because of copyright.

16:00 It's someone's piece of work. It's a privilege to be chosen, to be studied in school. It means usually that you've written an excellent piece of literature and what, you're going to get an 8 LB book sale because we've just bought one off Amazon and then photocopied onto the drive and printed it off. No, that's like, that's unacceptable. Yeah, I agree. What's just What do you think the solution is? Or is it not a solution? It's just literally schools don't have money so let's start pretending we can get around. It you know my solution to this stuff, if there is no money to get around something, it shouldn't be happening because then all that happens otherwise is we're pretending it's OK. Yeah, true. As as soon, as soon as like this, oh, we've got no money for it, so we're going to have to cut, photocopy and pretend it's not happening. Well, then down the line it would just be like, well, this school had been fine teaching how to train your dragon and Vajat Por and all these amazing novels for these children because, well, they've done is somehow, yeah, because they broke the law and and got around copyright and uploaded the PDF of a book they don't own for 100 kids.

16:54 But yeah, I've got. OK, cool. So, oh, what's the answer then? Because kids have got to do it, pay for it. Then if kids have got to do it. I just, I never understand this argument because there's always this line and it's like saying, oh, but this is something kids really need, okay. As if it's like to suggest you should therefore just make it happen. It's like if it is past that threshold of what kids really need, then we should really, we should be funding it, shouldn't we? Or they don't need it that much. Do they need it that much that is funded? No, but they need it that much that you should still do it. Incompatible. Yeah. It's even needed enough that you fund it and you make it happen or you're accepting that it won't happen. That grey area, middle ground, turn the other aisle. That's I won't look if you won't look.

17:35 I'm looking. I can barely read the photocopy. And that you've done because it's greyed out half the time and half the page is missing. Yeah, yeah, yeah. And we spent more on paper and ink than the bloody book. Oh, my God's sake. Yeah, There must be a point. I wonder what it is. There must be a point in which, like, if you're doing lots of lessons on a particular book, if you keep photocopying the book lesson 34567 and you think I'm not even doing the whole book, I'm just photocopying all the bits I need. There's got to be a point where it's like even though you only photocopied 20% it still cost you more in paper and ink and your labour time, which we never take into account, than just buying those bloody. Books, Yeah, it's insane. It's insane. Look, don't get me wrong there, there are there are things that you know, there are, there is there is actually a grey area here in terms of I've bought a book before of Amazon that I read to my class, right, right. So, OK, 32 kids are getting that story from me. I didn't buy 32 books, but still getting that story. Everyone that's but that's fine.

18:29 That is fine. Of course you can read a book to someone. When I buy a book for Rory, right? We don't buy 2 because there's two of us listening to it. I just buy it and we read it and that's fine. And I can share a book to someone else, right? How many books I've had that I've given to someone else or they've given to me that that is, of course, it's absolutely fine, right? But for systemic use in a public school, a state school, right? It is just not honest to then physically copy and upload that. Of course that's a step too far. If you had one copy of a book and you read it to the kids and then you just answer some pre written questions on the board, that's fine. Exactly. But we all know as teachers that you want to give extracts to the children.

19:11 That extract, I'm sorry, it is, it is copyrighted material. So yeah, it is ethically dubious. It is nowhere near the most ethically dubious job in the world. No, nowhere near. What if I type up the extract and I change a couple of words and say that it's my work? Yeah, that sounds a lot like you're a large language model. Yeah. Are you an AI? But. AI to rewrite the entire story but changing it by 1%. Oh dear. OK. This episode is brought to you by Mathsu. Here's something most teachers already know, but rarely say out loud. Too many children are going through primary school without solid arithmetic foundations. They can't recall key facts fluently. They're shaky on the basics. And when that trickier problem solving is introduced later on, they struggle.

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20:40 Find out more at matsu.org or by clicking the link in the description below to turbocharge your school's arithmetic. Now what classroom item will be the first you would grab in a zombie outbreak? That's a really good question. What are you grabbing first? Probably a board rubber. Quite heavy, aren't they? Order. That's rubbish. OK, go on. What? Sorry. I'll grab the AK47. What do you what do you want me to say? I know. That was going to be my joke. Ruining that. Yeah, like a meat. Stick a meat stick's really good, actually. Yeah, that's. Really sturdy enough, obviously. Yeah, yeah. And a lot of my board rubbers more recently been that foam that's not going to do anything. You're going right back to the 50s, aren't you? Here you have a board rubber that I love about. Children's heads, Yeah, Jimmy, really quite effective, I think is just the table says they are in the room. But if you if you stand like at the at the front of the room and they've got to come through.

21:31 The tables are good because I'm slowing down, but also inevitably, like I did every single day of my career, bash my knee into like the side of one of them. That that means a dump. Yeah, exactly. I'll just get exactly that. Yeah. So I think yeah, a metre stick break off a table leg break off a table that's like a metre stick. Something famously lots of people can do Yeah, great advice. I can yeah. Break off a table leg with a metre stick There's a video of me actually doing it as well. Record. Is that breaking off? Sure. Oh, you're. Carrying on with this. Oh, OK, cool. Staple gun. That'll do it. Yeah. Ah, a zombie ass. Oh, so you just got me in the night there. They're eyes. That's not fair. She turns around. Come on. I don't know.

22:13 Their their heads are the weak, weak spot. Aren't they in a zombie apocalypse? Right. Yeah. Like imagine now it's an actual zombie apocalypse, no jokes. Like genuinely, if you get caught and bitten you get turned and eventually the whole world will turn but you'll try to survive as long as possible. How long do you actually think you'll last? Because I think you're pathetic. What pre pre bitter? You're not saying how long I'd last. No, no, no. So, so let's say we're in this house now and it's like, oh, it's happened. It's, it's like, it's like, it's like the other side of the country, the other side of the country. I reckon I was in that situation. I'd probably trip down the stairs and that's it. I'm done and. Then for some reason just turn into a zombie anyway. Like I didn't even get a bit. The zombie had nothing to do.

22:56 I just fell down the stairs because I'm so unfit. I don't know how long would I last? I reckon I'd be pretty good, yeah, All the games I've played over the years. Yeah. Do you think that remotely translates into? Everything. No, probably not. No, because I because I don't think I have like a nine millimetre gun in my. Drawer exactly that you just pick up an Xbox controller and I've got you and you realise there's nothing in real life I don't know I think we'd be pretty cooked I. Think so as well, Yeah. What would you do if you got bit? I've always, I always find it. Interesting, I turn into a zombie. I know, but like in the in the movies, I'm always like, oh, people always like try to hide it. They're like, oh, no, I've been bitten. Like because they obviously can't. They're denying the fact that they're about to die. I'd, I'd, I'd, I'd hide it. Be a pure narcissist. Yeah. Stay in the middle of a big group, hide it. Hide it, hide it, hide it. And then when I'm gone, I'm gone. So who cares?

23:36 I wouldn't know anyway. Right, and then they've got to deal with you. Exactly. OK, I'd probably just for the lols, bite as many people as I could like whilst I was still me. Imagine if I was a zombie. Imagine if you got infected from that and we all get infected. Oh no, where's that kid? That's really annoying. So funny, sorry I've been a bit. I've just got to pop into school though during this zombie apocalypse, and I've just got to see a couple of. Kids and a few members of leadership. Not me personally. This is a joke. Yes, because I'm a leadership was actually very lovely. But yeah, absolutely, I'll come to your school and do it. Yeah, give us a list. There you go, listeners. Give us a list of people who in a zombie apocalypse, if we've been bitten before, we turned in that sweet spot. 20 minutes.

24:20 Who'd you want us to infect? OK, wowzers. Right. So move on to the. Next question, what's the quickest you've seen someone start their career in teaching and quit? I once knew an ECT who left school by the end of the second week of the 1st. No, I mean, I can't beat that. That's crazy. It's two weeks. That's that's I've not seen sooner than that. The quickest I've actually in real life worked with someone is one year yeah, ECT. And well it was called NQT and they were just like, Nah, not for me. And they stopped. But I did see a lot of, I think it's quite hard to get to being an ECT and then being two weeks down the line, like, Oh no, this isn't for me. Like, I'm not saying that doesn't happen.

25:01 Obviously it does. Yeah, yeah, yeah. But I, I saw a lot more people who dropped out in the middle of training. Yeah. Because like training kind of it, obviously it wasn't the full whack that you end up doing. I can see why it might be a bit of a culture shock to actually go into being a full time teacher and it was for me. But I found especially during the PGCAI was I was brought up to that speed quite quickly and that process I saw a lot of people in my course drop out. Yeah, that's because it's probably enough, isn't it, to get up to speed, like you said, to know if you're going to immediately not want to do this. Exactly. Immediately, like immediately, yeah, you get an idea because you're surrounded by the people who are doing the job full time and you go to meetings and stuff. The only reason I might think that happens is is more that is just passed your line for every reason like that jump up that is just passed your line. And just like, Oh my God, I actually just can't do this. Yeah, yeah, yeah.

25:43 Or you've got a job in a school you've not been in before. It's brand new and it's a, it's a poorly run school. And you're just like, oh, this is much worse than my training because I trained in a lovely school and now the expectations are just through the roof and it's too much and. You might have even already been on the edge, but you're thinking. But your lovely school came in clutch and made you think, oh, maybe I can do this. And then that school just instantly tipped you over the edge. You think no way, no way can I do this? I've got a lot of respect for people who do that kind of thing. Like, I know the people. Oh, and you quit. Teaching is not for everyone. I've taught for 24 years. Teaching is not for the weak hearted. Shut up, shut. You must say that when you because you quit mate. Yeah, no, yeah, true. But I never said it because, you know, it's, it's it's it doesn't mean they're weak, doesn't mean you're better than them.

26:28 They're just, there is such a smile me like not from everyone. Don't get me, don't get me wrong. But I see, obviously I see a lot of comments on the stuff we post on socials. There's a lot of like, it's not for everyone. Like whenever when I said I was, I was leaving and and one of the comments was just like, it must be a good thing because if you feel like this, well, teaching is just not for everyone. It's not for the faint hearted. And I was just like, shut up. I could have left. Four years ago, I could have left. Five years ago it was the same thing where I liked it and I could have carried on. I've chosen not to. Oh, hell ye, O martyr, aren't you the best thing since sliced bread? It's the same kind of attitude I've got from people who you know. I talk about that recent research last week about how set can be quite good for children, right? Yeah, it can be quite good people, good teachers bring the tops up with them in mixed ability.

27:12 Yeah. Great. Good teachers get even more out of them when they set as well. Are we going on just good teachers for the one you like and bad teachers are on that? We don't. Because if that same good teacher was in both sets, the research is saying that you get more progress at your tops when they aren't set by ability, by attainment, that is Exactly. It doesn't make sense to me. Yeah. Yeah, of course. Do you OK, My someone getting, getting marked up here? Someone, someone literally said, you know, we, we do mixed ability and you should see we've got 90% expected and greater depth is through the roof. It's like, OK, do you think that if those children who are greater depth were just on their own, that you would have fewer greater depth children? No, Sounds like you're a fantastic maths teacher. They go even further with.

28:01 That's the point. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Good teachers make mixed ability work. Yeah, they do. They they absolutely do. There's up and down. There's so many people listening right now. It's the, it's the vast majority of primary schools do mixed. Of course good teachers make it work. Of course they do. It's not the point. Like just just to take it as an opportunity to do a humble brag. Yeah. Oh my. Good teachers also make setting work. That was the kind of whole point of. That that's exactly it. It's. Not just one. Is and it can be better for this it can be better. It's not always. Worse. Anyway, back to that one we're talking about. ECT's great. I don't know, end up there. But yeah, I don't know. I've got respect for those people. Yeah, Going back to something, I'm maybe going to trigger you here a little bit. Even though people are on the high horse when they say stuff like it's not for everyone teaching if we just take out their attitudes and like what they're trying to get across by that because they are just trying to be smart.

28:48 I mean, right. Do you think there is truth in that though? Yeah, of course it's not. For everyone, of course, teach not for everyone. But the reason that annoyed me is because they are basically saying, therefore it's not for you. And it's like I absolutely in some time my life will go back to teaching and teaching is for me. And if I continued teaching, it wouldn't be like it's either for me or not, whether I've quit or not, right? So I could have stayed in the role and is that person saying, Oh, now it is for me, like I'm exactly the same teacher I would have been. So my point with that is like, it's it's basically saying if you do make that decision to change queries or quit teaching wasn't for you, then it's not your calling. It's not essentially saying not what you're good at. No, no, that's that's what that's what frustrated me because absolutely right. Teaching isn't for everyone. Completely right.

29:29 But you can't just say therefore it's not for you because of. That situation, they're assuming that everyone that quit is because they're worse teachers than they are. Yeah, exactly. You couldn't handle. It and I hacked it and you couldn't. It's like I you don't know that you've no idea like I I did hack it and could hack it talk for 10 years, right? If I couldn't hack it, I wouldn't have done 10 years, me doing me doing 11 years or me doing 6 years and me doing 15 years. There's not a level of hack that I couldn't take anymore. It was just simply that I didn't want to the. Perfect scenario would be someone who's quit teaching and the other person that says this doesn't know what they're quit teaching for and they've gone to quit teaching to do some like 150 KA year job like crazy job. And it's like yeah, no, no, no, I quit because I can earn it significantly more over here. It's not because I couldn't do teaching. I've gone to do this other job. Actually shut up. You couldn't handle it which Which? Is not what I did I.

30:14 Like to dream, I like. To dream right next one. I don't know who's it is to read Adam, but go for it. I'm going to read it anyway. It's been years since I've seen anyone buy a copy of Tez. Oh, the magazine. What does Tez stand for? I was just thinking Tez CEST. It's got to be a teacher teachers teachers excellent survey teachers education service the excellent why do I not know the. Service. Anyway, you look at us, I keep reading and to my knowledge no one ever reads those magazines that the trade unions send out. That is so true. I'm not going to lie. Mine much straight into the bin. Is there a print that print media that you can recommend for teachers that is actually any good? And while we're at it, can you tell me all of the good teaching podcasts and websites for news?

30:59 Because I am a massive nerd when it comes to teaching. Well, firstly, we were miles off. We were miles off. Tez stands for Times Educational Supplement of. Course it does, because it's from the. Yeah, yeah, I do. You know what? I know it's classic to say when someone reads it, you're like, you know. I knew that. No, yeah, I'm not going to say that because it's annoying, but as soon as you said that, I was like, of course it's the times. I knew. I knew. It was the Times. Which I also knew for sure. Anyway, back to the. Question. OK, Yeah, you went to question. Can you tell me all the good teacher podcasts? Well, you press play on one. There's loads out there. To be fair though, teacher Tap did that survey recently.

31:41 So go and see teacher Tap. We were second in primary Primary podcast just. Get that in there. Who? Who was first? Ellen. Don't know, don't remember. Can't remember. I don't remember if it was the two Mr PS or not, I don't. Remember, it was the biggest podcast that we've all known in the podcast for the last 10 years. #2 that was good. Like, I'm not even digging anyone out now before anyone because people always assume I'm digging people out, but I'm not. I see so many podcasts pop up and go and pop up and go and pop up and go. I am actually quite proud of what we've built. So well done. Yeah, big time free time. I'm really proud as well. Like I like we've slogged at this. To be fair, we've put some serious time into it. We.

32:22 No, I'm joking. Actually, there's only so many I can edit before you stop. Playing and do you do? I'm in the bar. But anyway, like you said, like loads of podcasts come and go, we've seen lots set up and when we've met people on the way, like we've got our friends up in Scotland, teacher of Mrs F and organised educators. Well, to me, to me it's Laura and Laura and Davis, Lauren Davis. Sorry, Lauren, David, my friends. Inside Voices and I know they've just built a whole new studio for their podcast, so go and check them out. And also just, you know, whilst we're just. After you've watched that one. After you've. Watched that one. Obviously whilst I've been nice, I've got that Teacher Tap list up, so here's some other ones that I I haven't listened to all of these, but Teacher Tap have said that they are. When you say I haven't listened to all of them, yeah. Be honest, OK, I don't listen you. Don't listen to podcasts. I'm just trying to be kind there. Right?

33:03 So obviously, yeah. And 22 Mr Peas in the pod. We know that. And ask come a second. Woo Hoo. But thinking deeply about primary education. I heard a lot of people mention that one. Yeah. That'll be good, especially for this person they really dive into like a. 100% they behave for me. Mr Barton's podcast and Mind the Gap all came in for the secondary teachers top favourites for podcasts and yeah, that was it. That was the whole list. So yeah, go and check them out. Why not? So nonchalant, baby. Yeah. Me being Chalant. Can you be chalant? Chalant. Yeah, I've seen a lot of that lately. Nonchalant is like, you don't care. Me being Chalant is like what? Yeah, I do care. I care about everything, Isn't it? Timothy Chalant? Timothy Chalant Malay. Yeah, some of that, yeah. OK. All right.

33:43 So there's quite a few there just very, very, very, very, very quickly on websites. I think Schools Week is phenomenal. I love Schools Week. I get, I get most of my news from there for education. I've also set up like a little alert notification every day. It comes through like top education, like articles. So that's that's cool because it just, it just keeps you up to date basically, which can be hard to fall behind. Definitely. Last question, what's your opinion on people with life experience of SEND? For example being autistic, working as SEND support staff but without an official qualification? That's that's an odd one. Is is the question like basically is it, is it, are they then qualified because?

34:27 The question what's your opinion? Well. Yeah, but it's just it's like, is that the loadedness of it? Like if to me it just feels black and white, like we just need the qualification. Like, yeah, definitely. Like I don't, I don't want to say I don't care if they've got this SND because I'm sure lived experience obviously had like in all walks of life, experience is obviously useful in terms of imparting wisdom and teaching other people. But end of the day, the qualifications, the qualification. Yeah, you can learn more about it and become an expert like I I don't necessarily think that just because you have SEND it, like for example if you are autistic, it does not mean you understand all autism. Yes, I think that's kind of. What I think so, so like it is in it is in the same way that a, let's say a neurotypical teacher can learn about how to support children with different needs, then someone who does have experience with SEND themselves can also learn about all of the children's needs. There might be some overlap where you go, oh, actually I went through this as well.

35:17 I struggled with this and you struggled with this that that bond can be quite, you know, positive for the child especially and and the the the assistant can really impart their knowledge there and help them. Yeah, of course. But like overall as a role, we can't just match people up with exactly the same exactly. So like in general, if you are SND support staff, I do think that that a qualification is something that is really good, not just for you as a person, but for the children you'll be working with. We can't just hang our hat on the hope that your lived experience is exactly what their children. That's that's the answer, isn't it? The whole point of the qualification is to broaden your understanding of everybody else. It's like, OK, if if the if the comparison was like, would you rather have someone if they're they're both unqualified and one person has a bit of lived experience that might overlap with some of these children, The other one has none.

36:02 Like like it just seems like a silly. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Question almost. It's like, well, they're not really that. Like you want the qualification. That's the whole point, yeah. Of course, of course, of course, and you might, you might definitely, you might have a preference there that makes more sense. But at the end of the day, my, my personal opinion is that if you're working with children with these needs, then you should be qualified in, you know, delivering those needs. There's a whole another conversation in here about what the qualification looks like, what kind of role they might have, what kind of salary they might be on all of this. We don't need to get into that right now, but it comes down to the nitty gritty of I think qualifications in specific parts of education like this are beneficial for everyone. Wider point, it is nice, isn't it, in general, when you can bond over a lived experience of a kid, like if you struggle with something.

36:47 So I totally understand it because I can imagine some people listening, thinking, oh, I've got this person at my school who's who's incredible because they struggled when they were a kid with all of these things in in their life. And actually having having gone through that, they can say to their children, oh, when I was young, like I also really struggle with this. And that's obviously really good. But yeah, like I just don't think it Trump's. I'm still come keep coming back around to it because I'm like, is there a situation where Trump's having a qualification? I don't I don't think so. I don't think so. No, I, I think what comes at the top layer is do you think that that role should have a qualification or not? Yeah, if the answer is yes, then it's, it's like it's, it's a separate conversation, a predecessor. However, if your answer's no to that, if your answer is no, I don't think you need qualifications for this role. Actually, I think that this person becomes maybe more favourable. Yeah, sure. Because then it's just like, well, actually do you know what, Even if it's just a few children rather than all the children they work with, there might be some kind of benefit there. Oh, but I think there's so many other parts of the role as well that are just, you know, sharing of the experience. You could both be unqualified, but the other person have way more in terms of their ability to fulfil the wider role of the job.

37:44 Sure. So obviously, yeah, we can't, we can't just, we can't just employ people. I think off the fact that they've gone through something when they were younger. I think there's way more that has to go into it. That's my personal opinion. All right, let's finish up there. Dylan, we've done all our questions this week. We actually actually managed to do them all and didn't leave anything next week that we sometimes forget. Anyway, those of you are doing SAS this week, I hope it's all going well. Dylan, any advice? Don't. Cheat. It's very tempting, isn't it? A little tappy tappy tappy. Rubbie. Rubbie, rubbie. No, don't cheat. Oh, but pressure from the top. You're a grown adult. Don't cheat, don't cheat. Just go and photocopy some books instead. So you can use them with. Your for your next English unit. Maybe it is the most morally dubious job in the world.

38:24 Yeah, yeah, yeah. Anyway, guys, yeah, that that's plenty worse that you could do, but. You know, you know what they say, don't you? There's plenty more fish in the sea. See you next time.