Ep 104: How Much Of An Issue Is Behaviour In School? Teacher Tapp Insights with Gráinne Hallahan

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Hello everyone, welcome back to
another episode of Teach Sleep

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Repeat.
My name is Dylan.

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And my name is Hayden.
And we're starting to sing

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because we've got to get
something that's different

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because we're over 100 episodes
in.

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And we start the same way every
single time.

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Do you ever think, like, on this
note, genuinely now that we'll

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ever run out of things to do
episodes about?

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I used to.
I used to because I feel like we

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used to be like we've got to do
1 episode on each like thing and

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if things are going to run out.
There's a behaviour thing.

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We can't do behaviour again.
Yeah, no, no, it turns out we

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can 57 times and we'll do it
again today.

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We're going to do it again
today.

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So I just think.
There's always stuff that comes

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out.
Yeah, I don't know.

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We we, you know, we famously
don't put much blood for.

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The thought, you know what I
want to have, I want to

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challenge this quickly because
we always like have this joke

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of, well, we don't have much
thought into it.

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Do you know what so much thought
into our Aperture episodes when

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we decide what we're doing?
What I mean is we don't sit

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there and plan advance.
I bet.

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I bet a lot of podcasts have
schedules.

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So like we've got our next 10
episodes planned out, whereas we

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kind of just go off of like, OK,
what's what's actually

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interesting right now?
And we'll talk about it this

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week.
Or what do we really have a

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burning desire to chat about?
And I think that's helping us

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And do you know how I know
that's helping us?

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It's boosting our reviews,
that's for sure.

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And there is just one thing.
Yeah, I know listen guys, we

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said reviews a long time for a
long time, but it really does

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help us.
So we don't have a sponsor for

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this podcast.
Yes, if I want to sponsor us,

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that's when we get in touch, but
we don't have a sponsor.

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So just a very, very quick
message from me as the host, the

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host, We've got you the the Co
host to the host.

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But as the host of this podcast,
the assistant, the assistant to

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the Co host, that made me a Co
host, wouldn't it?

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Yeah, you're a go.
That's a shame.

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Anyway, could you please use a
review because it really helps

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us and we see the numbers of
teachers listening to this

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podcast and the amount of
messages we get from people

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saying they enjoy the podcast is
insane.

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But it just doesn't quite match
up with those review numbers.

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And it really, really helps us
when someone lands in our

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podcast and they see that big
number that just gives us so

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much clout.
So it would really help us if

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you could just leave us a review
on Spotify.

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Apple Podcasts allow you to even
write a little short segment, a

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paragraph.
I can't tell you how powerful

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that is for us.
And as someone myself who used

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to ignore these messages
whenever I used to listen to

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podcasts or have businesses say
it to me.

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Now as a business owner and a
podcast owner, I.

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Still ignore them.
Sorry, that's not what you're

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going to say.
I was saying yeah.

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Yeah, yeah, yeah.
I realise how important they are

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and I do go out of my way now to
try and leave reviews on

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businesses I use etcetera
because.

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Do you know what I'd say that is
the biggest driver.

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I agree.
I did it for a kebab the other

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day.
I did.

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I had a kebab and I was like, do
you know what?

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This is such a nice kebab.
Yeah, I did because it was

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amazing.
Because it was on a delivery or

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just the weather and.
It's off at the end, doesn't it?

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Yeah, And I had that thought and
I was like, do you know what?

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Yeah, that was the best kebab
I've ever had in my life, that.

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Was a really, really nice kebab.
What made it a good kebab?

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It just tasted so.
Good.

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Can I ask you, were you sober?
Because it's very sober.

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It's, you know, kebabs when you
had a drunken.

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Yeah, it's very normal, no.
Completely sober, No.

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Every now and then we like to
treat ourselves to a chicken

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cheese wrap.
Yeah, OK, Very specific.

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Because you know what I'm like?
I'll get the same thing every

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single.
Time.

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Tell me exactly what's in it
then, OK?

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Chicken, cheese and then just it
was an option.

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All the salad or not.
I was like, yes, please.

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All the salad typically like red
cabbage and lettuce and a bit of

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cucumber, tomato sauce, onions
and then bitter chilli sauce,

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chilli sauce.
And I always get that from any

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kebab shop.
Not like kebabs that often, but

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I've been to a few and it was
just for some reason by far the

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nicest I've ever had to the
point where then a week later I

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was itching to get it again.
I ordered it again and it was

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just as nice.
Did you leave a review after the

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last time?
I did it twice.

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So happy.
I was so happy with this kebab

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the first time I left the
review.

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How did you leave a second one?
Did it?

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Let me do it.
Yeah, every time you order,

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apparently it lets you lets you
rate that order.

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Oh.
My God, imagine if every time we

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listen we could get a review.
Oh my.

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God, yeah, reviews really do
matter.

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Payback shops, podcasts,
whatever.

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If Haley can leave 2 reviews for
the same kebab, you guys can

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leave one for this podcast
forever. 100 episodes.

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That's it, right Haley?
Before we crack on, very excited

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to talk to Grenya later from
Teacher Tap and get some

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insights.
That'd be really, really good.

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Let's just chat about your week.
Had a story you want to change?

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Yeah.
Okay, so last week you know, I

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was moaning 'cause we had mock
sats.

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This week that's just gone.
We've done the mock sats and

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all.
That because you went home and

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it wasn't come out for dinner
it.

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Wasn't it wasn't come out for
dinner, It wasn't come out for

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dinner and I had loads of
marking to do.

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Not like I took it home.
It's what's still at school

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anyway, so and in the week I'll
talk, I'll talk to the kids and

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we're all very official because
there's our proper mock Sats

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and.
Which is a good thing.

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I know we're joking.
I think it's a good thing it's

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actually it.
It really just made them just

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familiarise them with the whole.
Process.

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When they do it for real, it's
not.

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Brand new, yeah.
And we have the craziest seating

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plan.
We use like 7 different rooms

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and adults everywhere.
So it actually is just kind of

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good for the kids to know in the
real one.

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By the way, we're all going to
be stressed and you just make

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sure you take your chair and you
go here, that's where you're

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going to be.
So it's good.

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Anyway.
One of the things they do, they

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fill in the papers properly as
well on the front, normally in

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mock sats.
I just say can you just put your

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first name on it?
Like I know who you are like.

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Don't do the phone number, Yeah.
Like DfE number was, oh, can I

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fill in DfE number?
What's my date of birth?

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I forgot.
I like normally I'm like, this

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is not the real thing.
So she'll just get on with it.

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This one, I made them do it
properly and I said, oh, look,

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one of my other teachers in the
eagle by our head of year, I was

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like, she I was taking the Mick
out of her because of a good

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relationship.
I was like, look, she is, she's

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like super panicky and thinks
that some of you might spell

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your names wrong.
So she has made these little

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cards.
It's got the DfE number on it

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for you.
It's got your first name, your

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middle name, your last name.
I was like, guys, like, listen,

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I know, I know you don't know
this and whatever I say, but

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they're there anyway.
I'm going to hand them out.

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Do the right thing and you just
write your names on on the thing

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and before I handed them out the
kids and I'll use a different

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name just so it's you know.
One of.

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The kids was like, yeah, I was
all laughing with me like, so

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how do you spell George, which,
you know, the middle name or the

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actual name of the child,
something else.

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But you know, we just like, OK,
well, maybe we do need these

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cards.
And I was like, OK, the exactly

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the teacher was done the exact
right thing.

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She don't know how to spell your
own names.

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Just make them.
Laugh.

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That's question one of the Sats.
That's the first Mark.

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I just play middle name.
Half of them got it wrong.

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Crikey, I just thought, here we
go.

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Do sometimes think like, how
often do you write a middle

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name?
I suppose middle names are kind

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of pointless, aren't they?
Yeah, I've got to say a bit

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weird.
It's it's very sentimental and

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people like middle name Shariz
and maybe they want to name it

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after someone when a middle
name's sentimental.

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I kind of get it.
And did you give Rory a middle?

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Name no, we didn't because
again, like who do you pick?

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You know, we could have picked
like four or five different men

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in his life who we like, we want
to, we are honour with this, you

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know, middle name.
But, you know, I don't know.

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I think when it's sentimental,
it's nice.

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When it's like aesthetic.
I I mean, I personally wouldn't

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do that.
But I know some people who

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choose a middle name because it
just flows.

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Yeah, it flows.
And they also couldn't decide

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between two.
And they're like, well, it's OK,

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you know?
What there's not much to it

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really, is there?
Like with river, we just like

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went down more the sentimental
route and a bit of that as well

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was like, oh, it flows quite
nicely.

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And it was just an Omar to
Lawrence Nat, who was quite

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young.
So it was like, OK, let's use

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that name.
We just accidentally touched

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hands and I'm contemplating
ending.

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Something start on the whole
podcast again.

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Because that's not that's
something I wanted to do.

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So I'm going to quickly talk
about my week in school again.

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I talked last week about how it
was quite normal and it plotted

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along.
I feel like I've managed to

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continue that.
It feels quite good.

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It's just going on with it.
Pretty cool.

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Not much to report.
So what I did on Instagram is I

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just put out there a question
box on our stories for all our

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followers.
If you don't follow us on

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Instagram, go over there and
have a look because we post

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loads of reels and clips from
the podcast and harvest

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information that we're about to
show you.

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And I asked for some questions
for AQ and A because it's always

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good to lead up a bank.
I don't know whether we're going

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to do AQ and a episode or are we
going to take some stuff and use

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it in this episode.
But the response is we've

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flicked through them.
We're genuinely unreal.

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Yeah.
And loads as well.

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Yeah, loads of them and loads of
questions and loads of really,

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really good questions sprinkled
in with some funny ones.

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Which is exactly, you know,
you've read us like a book every

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now and then.
Let's get a funny one up and

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what we're going to do then,
because we have so many, we'll

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bank them.
We might do AQ and a episode in

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the future.
We might like sprinkle them into

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the next few episodes and see
what works for us.

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But so we'll let you know what
we choose.

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We don't plan ahead so.
We don't know yet.

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Don't let the curtain fall.
The mask is slipping.

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But there was one question that
really stood out for a couple of

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reasons.
One, because it was a really

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good question.
I think it's something we'd like

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to talk about, but also we are
literally going to talk about

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it.
We'll go on you in a second when

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we talk about Teacher Tap.
And the question is this, it's

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from Max.
Are head teachers losing touch

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with regular teaching staff?
And a quick preface here, Hayden

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and I've spoken multiple times
off podcast because believe it

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or not, we do speak when the
microphones are off as well

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sometimes.
And do you know what is is

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sometimes we do think to
ourselves, are we portraying SLT

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as out of touch, always wrong in
a bad place, coming from a bad

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place when we don't actually
think that.

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So this question was really
interesting because.

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Well, do you?
Well, do you?

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What do you think then You're
kind of leading to the idea that

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you don't think that.
No, I'm leaning to the idea that

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I think sometimes we portrayed
the negatives too much and we

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don't let people know that there
are positives out there.

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But but, and and I think I'm
leaning into this still because

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my initial reaction to this, I
had teachers who's in touch with

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regular teaching staff is on the
whole.

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00:08:41,159 --> 00:08:42,360
Yes.
Yeah, I think because it's

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natural it's going to happen.
I'm not even blaming them or

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saying it's malicious.
I'm saying it's going to happen

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the longer you are outside of
the classroom, you're going to

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have different priorities and
different outlooks on teaching.

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Do you think that's happening?
It's like there's an element of

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00:08:56,440 --> 00:08:58,480
this question around like today.
Are they alluding to the idea

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that it's happening more now
than it used to?

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00:09:00,720 --> 00:09:03,240
So do you think that that's
always been a problem?

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Or do you think in only modern
times, head teachers are those

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in touch?
I remember being in my primary

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school when I was becoming a
teacher.

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I went back to my initial
primary school to do some like

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00:09:14,240 --> 00:09:15,720
training days or something, I
can't remember.

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00:09:15,720 --> 00:09:17,480
I think I had to get 10 days
before you went into a course.

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00:09:17,840 --> 00:09:21,480
And I remember speaking to who
was my year 6 teacher who had

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00:09:21,480 --> 00:09:22,720
become the head teacher in the
time.

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00:09:23,400 --> 00:09:25,680
So I was my year 6 teacher when
I was in year 6 and was now the

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head teacher when I was
training.

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00:09:27,040 --> 00:09:32,120
And he said about, he just said
to me, what's my job title?

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And I said, you're the head
teacher.

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And he was like, yeah, I'm the
head teacher.

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And his point was he doesn't
feel like he is a head teacher

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00:09:43,080 --> 00:09:44,600
anymore.
And if you just change how you

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00:09:44,600 --> 00:09:47,880
say the word a head teacher,
that implies that you're

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00:09:47,880 --> 00:09:51,080
teaching, you're doing lots of
teaching still, you're in charge

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00:09:51,080 --> 00:09:53,560
of the teachers and you are the
head teacher.

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00:09:53,880 --> 00:09:55,880
And he said the job's more to
more of an office job.

268
00:09:56,280 --> 00:09:58,840
His job's admin.
A lot of head teachers now,

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00:09:58,840 --> 00:10:01,360
their job is admin.
It's Sen, it's, it's logging

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00:10:01,360 --> 00:10:02,600
things.
It's logging behaviour, it's

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00:10:02,600 --> 00:10:06,000
sorting out behaviour.
It's admin and it used to be

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00:10:06,000 --> 00:10:08,560
that he was teaching half the
time or the OR the head was

273
00:10:08,560 --> 00:10:11,160
teaching half the time and was
timetabled in and would go

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around the class and do the
teaching.

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00:10:12,760 --> 00:10:15,360
I think again I'd love to see
some data on this in the future.

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00:10:16,080 --> 00:10:19,680
It seems like head teachers are
teaching less than ever, and

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because of that, the natural
outcome will be that they have

278
00:10:23,000 --> 00:10:26,720
different experiences in school
and therefore they will lose

279
00:10:26,720 --> 00:10:29,240
touch with teaching opinion
because they're not in the

280
00:10:29,240 --> 00:10:30,800
classroom teaching yeah as much.
That makes sense.

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00:10:31,000 --> 00:10:32,440
Well, you'll be, you'll be,
you're in luck because we're

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00:10:32,440 --> 00:10:33,520
going to be looking at some data
soon.

283
00:10:33,520 --> 00:10:35,320
It's not quite on exactly that,
but we're going to talk to

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00:10:35,320 --> 00:10:36,800
growing different teachers to
happen in a minute.

285
00:10:36,800 --> 00:10:39,400
And I know that she's got some
insights and more to do with

286
00:10:39,400 --> 00:10:42,320
maybe this answers your question
a bit more in a different, a

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00:10:42,320 --> 00:10:46,040
different way is, is the idea
that head teachers and maybe SLT

288
00:10:46,040 --> 00:10:49,040
in general don't think in the
same ways as teachers?

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00:10:49,040 --> 00:10:51,960
So they're losing touch because
they they no longer align, You

290
00:10:52,120 --> 00:10:54,000
know, that kind of idea.
And I know, I know that Gwenya's

291
00:10:54,000 --> 00:10:55,520
got some.
Some data on that.

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00:10:55,520 --> 00:10:57,560
I mean, I can't wait.
I think what we should do is is

293
00:10:57,560 --> 00:10:58,840
dive straight in.
So going, going.

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00:10:58,840 --> 00:11:01,440
Yeah, we've met going yeah, I
bet we had a quick chat at the

295
00:11:01,440 --> 00:11:03,040
teacher tap stand that was
really nice.

296
00:11:03,040 --> 00:11:05,440
We did short reel there.
She's amazing.

297
00:11:05,480 --> 00:11:09,400
She's so passionate.
She has got so many statistics

298
00:11:09,400 --> 00:11:11,640
from teachers.
We're going to get her to

299
00:11:11,640 --> 00:11:13,120
explain exactly what teacher tap
is.

300
00:11:13,120 --> 00:11:15,040
If you're not sure what we're
talking about when we say

301
00:11:15,040 --> 00:11:17,400
teacher tap.
And I think we should just dive

302
00:11:17,400 --> 00:11:18,200
straight into.
Chatting with her?

303
00:11:18,200 --> 00:11:22,960
Yeah, let's talk to her now.
So we're here, Ganya from

304
00:11:22,960 --> 00:11:25,360
Teacher Tap.
Hello, I'm so excited.

305
00:11:26,080 --> 00:11:28,680
This is a chat on a tap for a
long time.

306
00:11:28,680 --> 00:11:31,520
Could you just introduce
yourself and what Teacher Tap

307
00:11:31,520 --> 00:11:33,000
is?
For anyone who's thinking, wait,

308
00:11:33,000 --> 00:11:35,240
what is this app?
Of course.

309
00:11:35,320 --> 00:11:38,840
So I'm Gorinya Hallahan.
I was a teacher, I was an

310
00:11:38,840 --> 00:11:41,240
English teacher, which is, you
know, obviously in my opinion

311
00:11:41,240 --> 00:11:44,520
the best subject for about 10
years.

312
00:11:45,360 --> 00:11:48,640
And then I left the classroom.
I had too many children and I

313
00:11:48,640 --> 00:11:51,240
they wouldn't let me have part
time cross.

314
00:11:51,400 --> 00:11:53,600
So I left And then I was doing
things.

315
00:11:53,760 --> 00:11:56,560
I was like looking for tears and
I was doing a bit of writing and

316
00:11:56,560 --> 00:11:59,640
then Ted's were like, do you
want to be our senior, our

317
00:11:59,640 --> 00:12:01,960
content writer?
I was like, yeah, definitely.

318
00:12:01,960 --> 00:12:03,160
This sounds, this sounds like
fun.

319
00:12:03,440 --> 00:12:06,240
So I went to Ted's and I did
that for about 5 years and now

320
00:12:06,240 --> 00:12:09,880
I'm at Teacher Tap and as she
says, it's an app.

321
00:12:09,880 --> 00:12:13,320
But what is teacher tap zone?
Laura and Becky who are are

322
00:12:13,320 --> 00:12:16,920
founders, Laura McInerney and
Becky Ellen, they wanted to know

323
00:12:16,920 --> 00:12:18,600
why do so many teachers leave
the classroom?

324
00:12:18,640 --> 00:12:20,960
Teachers leave.
We can't find out why you can't

325
00:12:20,960 --> 00:12:22,600
call them up and be like, hey,
why did you go?

326
00:12:23,040 --> 00:12:26,160
So they're, they figured they
needed to work out how to talk

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00:12:26,160 --> 00:12:28,160
to teachers, how to find out
like what's going on.

328
00:12:28,800 --> 00:12:30,600
And that's why we have teach
Tap.

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00:12:30,800 --> 00:12:33,600
It's really popular.
We ask three questions once a

330
00:12:33,600 --> 00:12:35,040
day.
And those questions will be

331
00:12:35,040 --> 00:12:37,520
about your life at school, what
you think about education

332
00:12:37,520 --> 00:12:40,320
policy, what you want to see
happening in education.

333
00:12:40,680 --> 00:12:43,720
And then you get to see the
findings, which is my favourite

334
00:12:43,720 --> 00:12:47,240
bit because I'm so nosy.
I like seeing what everyone else

335
00:12:47,240 --> 00:12:49,080
said.
And we know from talking to our

336
00:12:49,080 --> 00:12:51,760
teachers that that's the bit
they often share with their

337
00:12:51,760 --> 00:12:53,440
senior leadership team, their
friends.

338
00:12:53,440 --> 00:12:55,840
And they say, hey, look, we're
doing it this way, but other

339
00:12:55,840 --> 00:12:57,560
people are doing it in different
ways.

340
00:12:58,000 --> 00:13:00,480
Teaching can be really lonely
and really isolating.

341
00:13:00,480 --> 00:13:03,000
And the Teachers Tap lets you
see what's going on in other

342
00:13:03,000 --> 00:13:06,080
schools and gives you a bit of a
bit of a chance to vent too.

343
00:13:06,080 --> 00:13:07,600
Fantastic.
I love Teachers Tap, by the way.

344
00:13:07,720 --> 00:13:09,760
I use it everyday.
I have that reminder set on my

345
00:13:09,760 --> 00:13:12,080
phone where it pings up again at
7:00 because I always forget in

346
00:13:12,080 --> 00:13:14,360
the day to do it.
So it comes up at 7:00 and I'm

347
00:13:14,360 --> 00:13:16,520
there answering those questions.
Like you said, it literally

348
00:13:16,520 --> 00:13:18,920
takes a few seconds and then you
can look at the results from

349
00:13:18,920 --> 00:13:20,840
yesterday, which I always like
doing because I like to see if

350
00:13:21,200 --> 00:13:23,000
the way I think is the same as
everybody else.

351
00:13:23,000 --> 00:13:25,200
Sometimes I'll pick something
that's like the least common.

352
00:13:25,200 --> 00:13:27,680
I'm like, oh, I've done
something different.

353
00:13:27,680 --> 00:13:30,120
I'm again, the grain everyone
else thinks this, so it's always

354
00:13:30,120 --> 00:13:31,760
really good to look at.
But you're here today, you've

355
00:13:31,760 --> 00:13:33,840
got some you've got some
insights with you.

356
00:13:33,840 --> 00:13:36,520
We would obviously just we were
just talking about sort of the,

357
00:13:36,560 --> 00:13:39,320
the differences in how we talk
about this a lot, by the way,

358
00:13:39,320 --> 00:13:42,400
about SLT and how we feel about
things as teachers and how

359
00:13:42,400 --> 00:13:44,920
sometimes that doesn't marry up.
I'm aware that you've come with

360
00:13:44,920 --> 00:13:47,040
some data today.
So can you hit us with an

361
00:13:47,040 --> 00:13:49,600
interesting insight from
teachers app that we can talk

362
00:13:49,600 --> 00:13:51,800
about?
So these are the things that I

363
00:13:51,800 --> 00:13:54,400
thought were particularly like,
oh gosh, look at this.

364
00:13:54,400 --> 00:13:56,960
And we're, we're thinking about
behaviour outside the classroom

365
00:13:56,960 --> 00:13:58,640
today.
And we, we've been asking

366
00:13:58,960 --> 00:14:01,560
teachers about what they think
their school leadership top

367
00:14:01,560 --> 00:14:03,680
priority for improvement should
be.

368
00:14:04,040 --> 00:14:06,800
And when you just look at
classroom teachers in both

369
00:14:06,960 --> 00:14:11,080
primary and secondary, they both
say it's behaviour, it's

370
00:14:11,080 --> 00:14:13,840
behaviour during lessons and
it's behaviour outside of

371
00:14:13,840 --> 00:14:15,880
lessons.
Primary school teachers are

372
00:14:15,880 --> 00:14:18,680
slightly less likely to save
behaviour outside of lessons

373
00:14:18,680 --> 00:14:21,080
compared to secondary.
And that makes sense because you

374
00:14:21,080 --> 00:14:23,880
know, there's, there's some big
differences there because you've

375
00:14:23,880 --> 00:14:26,520
got the lesson changeovers
become a more of a behaviour

376
00:14:26,520 --> 00:14:29,240
issue in secondary.
But both of them are like, yes

377
00:14:29,440 --> 00:14:34,080
behaviour middle leaders, yes,
behaviour, senior leaders.

378
00:14:35,120 --> 00:14:38,840
The most common answer there was
adaptive teaching.

379
00:14:39,120 --> 00:14:42,080
Wow.
Yeah, that's their their top.

380
00:14:42,080 --> 00:14:44,400
They think that's the top
priority for school improvement.

381
00:14:44,520 --> 00:14:45,320
So.
And we, yeah.

382
00:14:45,840 --> 00:14:50,480
Why that's so interesting.
So, you know, I think there's a

383
00:14:50,480 --> 00:14:54,000
lot to be said about when you
become a senior leader, you are

384
00:14:54,000 --> 00:14:57,360
at a point in your career where
normally behaviour is less of an

385
00:14:57,360 --> 00:15:01,400
issue for you.
Sure, you might see that

386
00:15:01,480 --> 00:15:06,000
behaviour is a problem for other
teachers, but I do think there's

387
00:15:06,000 --> 00:15:09,680
an element of I was good at it.
I found that, you know, I, I

388
00:15:09,680 --> 00:15:11,520
found behaviour something that I
could, I could conquer.

389
00:15:11,520 --> 00:15:15,840
I, I got on top of it.
Why can't other people and who

390
00:15:15,840 --> 00:15:18,760
become successful, successful
senior leaders.

391
00:15:18,760 --> 00:15:20,720
They're the people that have
stayed in the classroom, kept on

392
00:15:20,720 --> 00:15:22,920
going.
So usually have a little bit of

393
00:15:22,920 --> 00:15:25,480
sure, sure, like kudos around
the school as well.

394
00:15:25,480 --> 00:15:28,160
So when they come into a room,
behaviour looks really good.

395
00:15:28,160 --> 00:15:30,640
They are they seeing the real
picture of what behaviour is

396
00:15:30,640 --> 00:15:33,560
like.
Like if you observe a lesson,

397
00:15:33,560 --> 00:15:37,600
you never ever see that lesson
as it is normally because you

398
00:15:37,600 --> 00:15:39,640
are observing the lesson,
because you are in the room.

399
00:15:39,880 --> 00:15:42,600
Unless you're in like a secret
little backroom with A1 ways

400
00:15:42,600 --> 00:15:46,440
window, you're not going to see
like what kids behave like when

401
00:15:46,440 --> 00:15:48,360
there's not a senior leader in
the room.

402
00:15:48,840 --> 00:15:52,840
So there's also a a part of like
you don't really understand

403
00:15:52,880 --> 00:15:55,400
fully what behaviour's like and
it might be more of a problem to

404
00:15:55,400 --> 00:15:57,000
classroom teachers and senior
leaders.

405
00:15:57,600 --> 00:16:00,760
And there's a final reason why I
think we get this disconnect.

406
00:16:01,160 --> 00:16:06,280
There's an attitude perhaps that
if we get the teaching right and

407
00:16:06,280 --> 00:16:08,800
if we get the curriculum right,
then behaviour will follow.

408
00:16:09,000 --> 00:16:12,000
So for senior leaders, their
strategy might be more based on

409
00:16:12,200 --> 00:16:13,840
right, we need to get the
curriculum, we need to get

410
00:16:13,840 --> 00:16:15,720
adaptive teaching in.
If we can do all of these

411
00:16:15,720 --> 00:16:17,640
things, then behaviour will
improve.

412
00:16:17,640 --> 00:16:19,840
And that's their strategy,
that's the role that's tackling

413
00:16:19,840 --> 00:16:22,320
it.
So perhaps that's why we get

414
00:16:22,320 --> 00:16:25,120
this this disconnect there I.
Think that's a much nicer way of

415
00:16:25,120 --> 00:16:27,480
putting it because when I, when,
when I first had a look at this

416
00:16:27,480 --> 00:16:31,200
data, my first, I got my back up
straight away because my first

417
00:16:31,200 --> 00:16:33,360
thought was, Oh, it's just that
trusting like, do you know what?

418
00:16:33,360 --> 00:16:35,280
They don't know what's going on
in in the classroom, that that's

419
00:16:35,280 --> 00:16:37,240
must be what it is.
And, and SLT.

420
00:16:37,240 --> 00:16:38,320
They just want to blame
teachers.

421
00:16:38,320 --> 00:16:40,840
It was this idea of blame in my
head of like, it's just they

422
00:16:40,840 --> 00:16:42,600
want to blame teachers.
They think teachers are the

423
00:16:42,600 --> 00:16:45,280
reason that that things aren't
great in education right now.

424
00:16:45,280 --> 00:16:47,080
It's not the children.
And then the the teachers are

425
00:16:47,080 --> 00:16:49,120
saying, no, it's the children.
I can't do my job properly.

426
00:16:49,320 --> 00:16:51,520
But actually, I think the way
you've, you've said it has

427
00:16:51,520 --> 00:16:54,080
really leaned my mind a little
bit and maybe thought maybe it's

428
00:16:54,080 --> 00:16:55,280
not about blame, but you're so
right.

429
00:16:55,280 --> 00:17:00,800
Because when, when I have an
observation, in fact, whenever

430
00:17:00,800 --> 00:17:04,800
the head teacher is in my room,
obviously the kids behave

431
00:17:04,800 --> 00:17:06,560
differently that they're not,
they're not stupid.

432
00:17:06,560 --> 00:17:09,520
Like they know, they know the
hierarchy of a school as well.

433
00:17:09,800 --> 00:17:12,280
Like for the same reason, if you
know, go go in in the sort of

434
00:17:12,280 --> 00:17:14,160
opposite direction.
When it's not the classroom

435
00:17:14,160 --> 00:17:17,640
teacher and it's either a supply
teacher or a teaching assistant

436
00:17:17,640 --> 00:17:20,560
or even just an unfamiliar
teacher, I generally find that

437
00:17:20,560 --> 00:17:22,359
behaviour is worse.
Yeah, yeah.

438
00:17:22,560 --> 00:17:25,400
So yeah, I can see why that
warped opinion, that sort of

439
00:17:25,400 --> 00:17:28,960
might be there.
Kids are really oddly, strongly

440
00:17:28,960 --> 00:17:30,360
hierarchical as well, aren't
they?

441
00:17:30,400 --> 00:17:34,560
Like they really believe that
there's, there's like the, the

442
00:17:34,560 --> 00:17:38,280
respect should change depending
on who they're speaking to and

443
00:17:38,320 --> 00:17:39,920
from when I was in the
classroom, like that was

444
00:17:39,920 --> 00:17:41,800
something that I used to always
challenge.

445
00:17:41,800 --> 00:17:43,720
And it's that it doesn't matter
who you're talking to.

446
00:17:43,960 --> 00:17:45,880
You should speak to me the same
way as you speak to the head

447
00:17:45,880 --> 00:17:47,280
teacher.
You should speak to the cleaners

448
00:17:47,280 --> 00:17:51,280
and to the the serious stuff the
same way as you speak to me.

449
00:17:51,280 --> 00:17:53,600
Like you don't speak to someone
differently just because you

450
00:17:53,600 --> 00:17:56,440
perceive them to be in a
different hierarchy.

451
00:17:57,600 --> 00:18:00,560
When because I was an English
teacher, we used to talk about

452
00:18:00,560 --> 00:18:03,280
this a lot because it comes up a
lot in literature.

453
00:18:03,600 --> 00:18:06,360
But I used to find it really
funny if you ask kids where they

454
00:18:06,360 --> 00:18:08,800
put themselves in the hierarchy
of the school.

455
00:18:08,800 --> 00:18:10,120
Have you ever asked kids to do
that?

456
00:18:10,280 --> 00:18:12,560
No, I've never done that, no.
Oh, try it.

457
00:18:12,560 --> 00:18:14,480
This is my like everyone should
try this.

458
00:18:14,480 --> 00:18:17,840
Like put the put a pyramid up on
the board and say like, where

459
00:18:17,840 --> 00:18:19,120
does everyone and go in the
school?

460
00:18:19,440 --> 00:18:24,040
And every year I did this.
So we used to teach to do it for

461
00:18:24,040 --> 00:18:26,840
inspector calls.
So it came up every year, 12 sex

462
00:18:26,840 --> 00:18:29,040
every year and do it, the kids,
where do you put yourselves?

463
00:18:29,200 --> 00:18:31,240
And they would always put
themselves above the cafeteria

464
00:18:31,240 --> 00:18:32,080
staff.
Wow.

465
00:18:33,480 --> 00:18:35,360
Yeah, you're mad.
It's like, come on.

466
00:18:36,400 --> 00:18:39,440
There was, there was this moment
I remember in school so vividly

467
00:18:39,960 --> 00:18:41,720
that this is interesting you're
saying this and this is

468
00:18:41,720 --> 00:18:43,120
secondary school.
Now, obviously Hayden and I are

469
00:18:43,120 --> 00:18:44,560
primary school teachers.
You come from more of a

470
00:18:44,560 --> 00:18:47,360
background with older children,
but I vividly remember from

471
00:18:47,360 --> 00:18:53,080
secondary school my teachers
having those kind of opinions

472
00:18:53,080 --> 00:18:56,080
and telling me them.
And I do feel like it moulded my

473
00:18:56,240 --> 00:18:59,920
view on society in a good way.
In terms of I, I was sat in a

474
00:18:59,920 --> 00:19:01,760
chemistry class.
This is a chemistry class,

475
00:19:01,840 --> 00:19:02,760
right?
Not even English, you know,

476
00:19:02,760 --> 00:19:03,920
English.
You're kind of making a link

477
00:19:03,920 --> 00:19:05,920
there with the literature and
the hierarchies.

478
00:19:06,200 --> 00:19:08,040
I was sat in a chemistry class.
I'm my chemistry teacher.

479
00:19:08,040 --> 00:19:12,160
Her name was Mrs Cousins and I
remember her saying, and I don't

480
00:19:12,160 --> 00:19:14,440
know the context, but I remember
this line so clearly.

481
00:19:14,680 --> 00:19:18,920
And she said, if you think about
what these two people do for

482
00:19:18,920 --> 00:19:21,800
society, who's actually more
important?

483
00:19:21,800 --> 00:19:25,280
And she said, is it the person
working in the bank or is it the

484
00:19:25,600 --> 00:19:27,400
the bin man collecting your
rubbish off the streets?

485
00:19:27,960 --> 00:19:31,040
And her point, her point was
naturally she knew everyone

486
00:19:31,040 --> 00:19:33,760
would think bin men, dust men
cleaning up.

487
00:19:33,760 --> 00:19:36,720
Oh, that's lower on the
hierarchy than big wigs making

488
00:19:36,720 --> 00:19:38,960
money, moving money around
wearing their suits.

489
00:19:39,320 --> 00:19:41,720
And her point was just, firstly,
that's wrong.

490
00:19:41,800 --> 00:19:43,640
Everyone, everyone's plays a
role in society.

491
00:19:43,640 --> 00:19:45,840
But secondly, actually, we're
going to make some kind of

492
00:19:45,840 --> 00:19:49,040
hierarchy here.
Sometimes the, the, the lowest

493
00:19:49,040 --> 00:19:53,560
perceived jobs and careers are
doing more of a service for you

494
00:19:53,560 --> 00:19:55,040
as a person and as an
individual.

495
00:19:55,360 --> 00:19:58,400
And that stuck in my head so
much over time.

496
00:19:58,720 --> 00:20:01,960
And yeah, I remember children in
my class, one person would

497
00:20:01,960 --> 00:20:04,360
shower and say, when I'm older,
I'm going to make more than you

498
00:20:04,360 --> 00:20:06,600
anyway as a teacher.
And I just remember seeing all

499
00:20:06,600 --> 00:20:08,400
this.
And you're, you're right,

500
00:20:08,400 --> 00:20:10,960
though, as teachers, I wonder
what role you think we have to

501
00:20:10,960 --> 00:20:15,120
play in shaping these outlooks.
And when we have SLT, these

502
00:20:15,120 --> 00:20:17,400
children will grow up to be our
SLT, These children will grow up

503
00:20:17,400 --> 00:20:18,960
to be our cleaners.
These children will grow up to

504
00:20:18,960 --> 00:20:21,720
be our cafeteria staff.
How much of an impact do you

505
00:20:21,720 --> 00:20:25,520
think us as teaching staff can
have on those outcomes and those

506
00:20:25,800 --> 00:20:27,440
those views of society as they
grow up?

507
00:20:27,600 --> 00:20:29,360
And how much do you think is
just entrenched?

508
00:20:29,360 --> 00:20:31,240
And we're kind of just fighting
a fire that won't go out?

509
00:20:31,640 --> 00:20:34,160
Oh, no, I think it's huge.
I think you are, you can be

510
00:20:34,160 --> 00:20:35,800
really influential and that's
why you've got to be really

511
00:20:35,800 --> 00:20:38,680
careful about what you say and,
and your reactions to things

512
00:20:38,680 --> 00:20:42,720
like when they tell you stuff.
And it's making sure that

513
00:20:42,720 --> 00:20:46,680
you're, that you're recognising
your own privileged position

514
00:20:46,680 --> 00:20:50,520
that you are in of having had a
degree and gone and got a job

515
00:20:50,520 --> 00:20:51,840
and you know, all of those
things.

516
00:20:52,280 --> 00:20:55,000
And I think I was really
fortunate that I went to a

517
00:20:55,000 --> 00:20:57,680
school where I mixed with a lot
of different sorts of people.

518
00:20:58,240 --> 00:21:01,480
And before I was a teacher, I
worked and did lots of different

519
00:21:01,480 --> 00:21:04,440
types of jobs.
I worked all through my, my GC

520
00:21:04,440 --> 00:21:06,520
CS and my A levels and my
degree.

521
00:21:07,080 --> 00:21:09,680
And I think it gives you a
better insight into how other

522
00:21:09,680 --> 00:21:12,400
people view education.
And there's a, there's a,

523
00:21:12,560 --> 00:21:14,720
there's a risk, there's a trap
that you can fall into as a

524
00:21:14,720 --> 00:21:16,520
teacher.
If you've been very successful

525
00:21:16,520 --> 00:21:18,800
at school and you've been very
successful when you went to

526
00:21:18,880 --> 00:21:20,760
teacher training college and
you've gone back to school and

527
00:21:20,760 --> 00:21:24,080
you, you see like school is if
you just listen, if you just

528
00:21:24,080 --> 00:21:27,840
listen, then it's fine.
My, my eldest who came home when

529
00:21:27,840 --> 00:21:29,440
she was in primary school and
said, I figured it out.

530
00:21:29,640 --> 00:21:31,760
If you just listen to what the
teacher says and you understand

531
00:21:31,760 --> 00:21:37,840
maths and that's why people,
they're just not listening, sort

532
00:21:37,880 --> 00:21:40,200
of.
I've got some data for you but.

533
00:21:43,400 --> 00:21:45,640
This, you know, you've got to
understand what it's like.

534
00:21:45,640 --> 00:21:47,280
You've got to try and put
yourself in the shoes of that

535
00:21:47,280 --> 00:21:49,720
kid who goes from lesson to
lesson to lesson and can't

536
00:21:49,720 --> 00:21:52,520
actually read and finds every
single lesson of struggle and

537
00:21:52,520 --> 00:21:55,480
goes home.
And their parents also struggle

538
00:21:55,480 --> 00:21:57,840
to read and that's why they're
not reading at home.

539
00:21:58,040 --> 00:22:00,880
And the the aspirations like
being successful at school.

540
00:22:00,880 --> 00:22:04,000
Why would they aspire to do that
when they've got no role models

541
00:22:04,240 --> 00:22:07,720
in them immediate like social
circles that value school.

542
00:22:08,040 --> 00:22:12,520
So, you know, I think I think
that's really important and I

543
00:22:12,520 --> 00:22:17,520
can but then equally, I remember
teaching war poetry and I must

544
00:22:17,520 --> 00:22:20,000
have gone like really
enthusiastic that lesson.

545
00:22:20,000 --> 00:22:22,320
I don't know, maybe I had extra
coffee, but I was really going

546
00:22:22,320 --> 00:22:25,280
like this is really important,
like these soldiers and it's so

547
00:22:25,280 --> 00:22:29,440
noble or and then it was parents
evening the next next day and

548
00:22:29,440 --> 00:22:32,160
this grandmother had brought in
little Charlie and she was like,

549
00:22:32,360 --> 00:22:37,200
he now wants to join the army.
You having an impact?

550
00:22:37,680 --> 00:22:40,920
What have I done?
That's not what I meant.

551
00:22:42,480 --> 00:22:45,120
But but you know, that's, it's
a, it's a great career.

552
00:22:45,120 --> 00:22:47,320
I grew up in a Garrison town.
So I've got loads of friends who

553
00:22:47,320 --> 00:22:50,160
went into the Army and, you
know, I, I talked about that and

554
00:22:50,160 --> 00:22:51,760
I was being like really, really
enthusiastic.

555
00:22:52,080 --> 00:22:56,480
But you know, you've, you're in
a very, very privileged position

556
00:22:56,480 --> 00:22:58,040
to have so much influence over
the kids.

557
00:22:58,040 --> 00:23:01,800
And you should always role model
how to speak to people, how to

558
00:23:01,800 --> 00:23:04,040
be respectable.
And I think they watch you for

559
00:23:04,040 --> 00:23:06,760
cues, like if you're rude to
people, they'll think that's an

560
00:23:06,760 --> 00:23:09,800
OK way to behave.
And I think all about politeness

561
00:23:09,800 --> 00:23:11,880
and manners and like what we
expect from politeness from the

562
00:23:11,880 --> 00:23:14,040
kids.
If you're not polite to other

563
00:23:14,040 --> 00:23:17,280
adults and to other people in
the room, then they'll just

564
00:23:17,280 --> 00:23:18,440
think that's an OK way to
behave.

565
00:23:18,600 --> 00:23:19,360
I.
Think that's good to hear.

566
00:23:19,360 --> 00:23:20,760
I think sometimes we take that
for granted.

567
00:23:20,840 --> 00:23:23,200
You know, there's a million as
teachers, there's a million

568
00:23:23,200 --> 00:23:24,320
jobs, you have a million hats
on.

569
00:23:24,400 --> 00:23:26,680
And I think sometimes it's easy
to to think, do you know what

570
00:23:26,680 --> 00:23:28,800
this hat's less important or I
haven't got time space for this

571
00:23:28,800 --> 00:23:29,560
hat.
Do you know what I mean?

572
00:23:29,960 --> 00:23:31,840
And actually it's just good to
hear that and remind ourselves

573
00:23:31,840 --> 00:23:33,600
it's important.
So just going going back to the

574
00:23:33,640 --> 00:23:36,480
because I'm really interested in
this data still the the top

575
00:23:36,480 --> 00:23:39,800
priorities from schools, how
it's different between SLT and

576
00:23:39,800 --> 00:23:42,200
teachers massively between
behaviour and adaptive teaching.

577
00:23:42,600 --> 00:23:44,080
Obviously teachers that's been
around a while.

578
00:23:44,080 --> 00:23:47,400
Do you have any insights on how
that has changed over time and

579
00:23:47,480 --> 00:23:49,040
is there anything interesting
that's come out of that?

580
00:23:49,680 --> 00:23:53,040
We do and I, I hate delivering
like the bad news, but there's

581
00:23:53,040 --> 00:23:57,480
bad news tied up in this.
So yourself behaviour is

582
00:23:57,480 --> 00:24:00,800
becoming more and more
concerning over time.

583
00:24:00,800 --> 00:24:04,960
So we asked this in 2023-2024
and then this year in 2025, same

584
00:24:04,960 --> 00:24:06,760
time of the year as well.
March, you know, once you're

585
00:24:06,760 --> 00:24:09,800
past that nice golden time when
they first come back in

586
00:24:09,800 --> 00:24:11,600
September, like I'll do anything
you say.

587
00:24:11,640 --> 00:24:14,920
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
Yeah, and behaviour is creeping

588
00:24:14,920 --> 00:24:16,840
up.
So we can see see an increase

589
00:24:16,840 --> 00:24:19,800
over time for behaviour becoming
more and more concerning.

590
00:24:20,040 --> 00:24:23,560
Is that across the board?
And in primary and in secondary,

591
00:24:24,120 --> 00:24:27,400
so it's we had a secondary, it's
kind of stayed a bit more

592
00:24:27,400 --> 00:24:30,520
stable, but in definitely.
Higher anyway, isn't it?

593
00:24:30,520 --> 00:24:32,600
It's more of a problem problem
anyway in secondary.

594
00:24:33,120 --> 00:24:34,360
We'll get on to that a little
bit.

595
00:24:34,360 --> 00:24:36,920
Later.
There's there is this perception

596
00:24:36,920 --> 00:24:39,080
that behaviour is a, a tough
thing in secondary.

597
00:24:39,080 --> 00:24:40,840
And so it's, it's stayed pretty
high, but it's definitely

598
00:24:40,840 --> 00:24:43,560
creeping up in primary.
And this is also reflected in

599
00:24:43,560 --> 00:24:46,280
other questions that we ask.
So we don't just ask like, what

600
00:24:46,280 --> 00:24:49,760
do you think is important?
We also ask things like, did you

601
00:24:49,760 --> 00:24:52,120
give out?
Was it, did you tell the child

602
00:24:52,120 --> 00:24:53,480
off?
Did you have to send a child out

603
00:24:53,480 --> 00:24:55,640
of the class?
Did you have to call for SLT?

604
00:24:55,920 --> 00:24:58,480
Did you give a sanction in your
last lesson?

605
00:24:58,680 --> 00:25:01,120
And in primary, it is creeping
up and up.

606
00:25:01,720 --> 00:25:04,520
So we saw a bit of a dip over
the pandemic because things were

607
00:25:04,520 --> 00:25:09,200
a bit like squirrelly then.
But it's rising up and up year

608
00:25:09,200 --> 00:25:10,880
on year since since we've
returned.

609
00:25:11,120 --> 00:25:13,560
And in secondary it seems kind
of more stable.

610
00:25:13,880 --> 00:25:17,680
So there's definitely the sense
that in primary behaviour is

611
00:25:18,280 --> 00:25:22,160
becoming increasingly more
challenging and particularly

612
00:25:22,160 --> 00:25:25,320
when we break this down further,
we can see it's more so in key

613
00:25:25,320 --> 00:25:28,600
Stage 1 than key Stage 2.
Wow, That's interesting because

614
00:25:28,720 --> 00:25:31,400
just for just for a context
here, Hayden and I key stage two

615
00:25:31,400 --> 00:25:35,560
teachers and I would say in
general, I go along with what

616
00:25:35,560 --> 00:25:37,640
the trends that we're seeing.
I think, I think if I was to

617
00:25:37,640 --> 00:25:40,880
think now as a teacher, how
often do I have to impose

618
00:25:40,880 --> 00:25:43,720
sanctions or warnings or
whatever the pay of your policy

619
00:25:43,720 --> 00:25:46,200
is in your school?
It's definitely more than I used

620
00:25:46,200 --> 00:25:49,000
to.
And I sometimes look

621
00:25:49,000 --> 00:25:51,360
introspectively at that and
think, am I getting worse as a

622
00:25:51,360 --> 00:25:53,000
teacher?
And I think that's a problem

623
00:25:53,120 --> 00:25:55,640
because you do think that You
think, what is it because of me?

624
00:25:55,720 --> 00:25:57,800
Yeah.
And I think the reason why I

625
00:25:57,800 --> 00:26:01,520
love Teacher Tap and I love data
is because it shifts from being

626
00:26:01,520 --> 00:26:04,800
anecdotal to, oh, my friend said
behaviour's fine, but I think

627
00:26:04,800 --> 00:26:06,400
it's getting worse.
Maybe I'm the problem.

628
00:26:06,680 --> 00:26:09,320
Then we see thousands of people
giving their their opinions.

629
00:26:09,320 --> 00:26:12,160
Oh, no, no, no, wait.
OK, it's not just me.

630
00:26:12,160 --> 00:26:14,360
And I think this is where the
podcast is.

631
00:26:14,360 --> 00:26:17,240
When in general people messaging
us, they go, Oh my gosh, you

632
00:26:17,240 --> 00:26:19,040
think this too?
I thought it was just me and

633
00:26:19,040 --> 00:26:20,360
this school and I'm really
struggling.

634
00:26:20,560 --> 00:26:23,880
So this data, not only do we see
the trends you're saying, do you

635
00:26:23,880 --> 00:26:26,200
find people get in touch with
you and talk to you about how

636
00:26:26,680 --> 00:26:30,040
even though it might be bad
news, it's reassuring?

637
00:26:30,240 --> 00:26:33,280
Yeah, yeah.
And I think that's the going

638
00:26:33,280 --> 00:26:35,160
back to what we said at the
start, teaching could be quite

639
00:26:35,160 --> 00:26:37,960
lonely.
Like it's, it is just you in a

640
00:26:37,960 --> 00:26:39,800
room.
There's loads of kids all day.

641
00:26:40,520 --> 00:26:42,840
And you don't get that adult
also saying to you like, oh,

642
00:26:42,960 --> 00:26:45,280
gosh, that was tough.
Yeah.

643
00:26:45,360 --> 00:26:47,440
Like, you can go into the staff
room, but everyone's got their

644
00:26:47,440 --> 00:26:48,720
different, different sort of
view.

645
00:26:48,760 --> 00:26:49,880
Like they've all had different
days.

646
00:26:49,880 --> 00:26:51,640
You can all sort of go, oh, you
know, that was difficult.

647
00:26:51,880 --> 00:26:55,120
But it's quite difficult to be
that honest among your

648
00:26:55,120 --> 00:26:58,720
colleagues because it's all
those kind of like staff from

649
00:26:58,720 --> 00:27:00,680
politics.
You might not want to expose

650
00:27:00,680 --> 00:27:02,400
yourself for saying, like, I'm
struggling.

651
00:27:02,680 --> 00:27:06,000
It can be, it can be really
difficult to speak honestly

652
00:27:06,000 --> 00:27:08,720
about your classroom among work
friends.

653
00:27:08,720 --> 00:27:10,720
So who do you talk to about like
you can go home and talk to your

654
00:27:10,720 --> 00:27:12,880
spouse, but they might or your
partner, you might or you know

655
00:27:12,880 --> 00:27:15,760
your friends and things, but
they might not all be teachers.

656
00:27:15,760 --> 00:27:17,000
They might not get what you're
talking about.

657
00:27:17,000 --> 00:27:19,240
It's it is definitely something
we see.

658
00:27:19,240 --> 00:27:22,520
We get messages in all the time
saying, you know, this is

659
00:27:22,520 --> 00:27:25,640
happening in my school.
I and people tell me how

660
00:27:26,160 --> 00:27:29,440
therapeutic it is just to be
able to go yes on the app, like

661
00:27:29,960 --> 00:27:34,840
yes, I did, it's true.
And hit me, hit me this, this,

662
00:27:35,160 --> 00:27:39,080
this, yes, they did.
And it's, it's a bit scary

663
00:27:39,080 --> 00:27:41,640
sometimes when the data is
worrying.

664
00:27:41,920 --> 00:27:44,760
But if we're all in it together
and we've all got the same

665
00:27:44,760 --> 00:27:48,520
problems and the solutions are
probably quite similar, right?

666
00:27:48,520 --> 00:27:52,840
Like there are things we can do
and it's, it's it especially

667
00:27:52,840 --> 00:27:55,120
when we talk about behaviour,
there are things that we can do

668
00:27:55,120 --> 00:28:00,480
in terms of training and
classroom adaptations and, you

669
00:28:00,480 --> 00:28:03,960
know, looking when the, the
system for diagnosing children

670
00:28:03,960 --> 00:28:05,880
with additional educational
needs.

671
00:28:06,440 --> 00:28:07,880
I mean, we all know it's.
An overhaul?

672
00:28:07,880 --> 00:28:08,160
Yeah.
Sorry.

673
00:28:08,280 --> 00:28:09,400
What system?
What system?

674
00:28:09,480 --> 00:28:11,880
Yeah, I mean, I know there's a
system, but it's.

675
00:28:11,920 --> 00:28:13,440
It's broken.
I suppose that's the thing I was

676
00:28:13,440 --> 00:28:15,800
going to come on to ask you
about IS teach tap is

677
00:28:15,800 --> 00:28:20,160
unbelievable for that pure data.
And what what role do you think

678
00:28:20,160 --> 00:28:22,840
you have in that next step?
Like you're you're mentioning

679
00:28:22,840 --> 00:28:24,400
things we can do then to fix
that.

680
00:28:24,680 --> 00:28:28,880
Do you see yourselves as like
the indicators of real life and

681
00:28:28,880 --> 00:28:30,920
we can people, other people can
go from there?

682
00:28:30,920 --> 00:28:33,480
Or do you also see it as
something that you're passionate

683
00:28:33,480 --> 00:28:35,560
about?
Is then to try and fix what we

684
00:28:35,560 --> 00:28:38,440
see?
I definitely think it's about

685
00:28:39,320 --> 00:28:41,760
saying, look, look, this is the
actual problem.

686
00:28:41,760 --> 00:28:46,200
We, we write to the DfE, we to
the Department of Education, we

687
00:28:46,200 --> 00:28:50,680
write to write them out, find
our findings and say, look, this

688
00:28:50,680 --> 00:28:52,160
is what's important.
That's brilliant.

689
00:28:52,160 --> 00:28:54,480
Every time they call for
evidence, we put our evidence

690
00:28:54,480 --> 00:28:57,280
together and submit it.
We've been on the educational

691
00:28:57,280 --> 00:29:00,600
select committees and given
evidence in Parliament, like we

692
00:29:00,600 --> 00:29:03,000
know that they listen to us.
We know that they might not

693
00:29:03,000 --> 00:29:06,240
always like what we've got to
say, but it's important that

694
00:29:06,240 --> 00:29:09,000
it's real presenting the, the
views of teachers because

695
00:29:09,000 --> 00:29:10,160
they're the ones in the
classroom.

696
00:29:10,400 --> 00:29:12,560
It's really hard to collect data
on teachers.

697
00:29:12,560 --> 00:29:15,280
Like I think what teacher tab
does, even like taking a step

698
00:29:15,280 --> 00:29:17,120
back from it.
It's amazing that we, we can do

699
00:29:17,120 --> 00:29:21,320
this because it's really
difficult to get data off

700
00:29:21,320 --> 00:29:25,280
teachers real time and, and you
know, as things are going on and

701
00:29:25,280 --> 00:29:28,040
things like the special
educational needs like

702
00:29:28,040 --> 00:29:33,800
explosion, if you like the we
can see the, the rise in the

703
00:29:33,800 --> 00:29:36,160
number of children per class
that want the send register.

704
00:29:36,360 --> 00:29:41,280
The send register is a Wild West
like there's no standardised

705
00:29:41,280 --> 00:29:43,640
like to send register, you need
to have this.

706
00:29:43,760 --> 00:29:45,080
Every school does it
differently.

707
00:29:45,120 --> 00:29:49,240
So true.
And when and when you make EHDPS

708
00:29:49,240 --> 00:29:53,640
harder to get and make the send
register completely like free

709
00:29:53,640 --> 00:29:58,120
for all, all of those children
who don't meet the threshold for

710
00:29:58,120 --> 00:30:00,560
an HCP, which is loads of them
absolutely loads.

711
00:30:01,600 --> 00:30:03,800
And then on the send register,
but no one's collecting that

712
00:30:03,800 --> 00:30:08,840
data on the send register.
So it, we, we have data on this

713
00:30:08,840 --> 00:30:12,320
and we can see and we can even
see things like class size and

714
00:30:12,320 --> 00:30:14,360
the number of children that are
on the said register versus

715
00:30:14,360 --> 00:30:16,360
class size.
And we're doing work at the

716
00:30:16,360 --> 00:30:18,480
moment, actually looking at this
in more detail.

717
00:30:19,000 --> 00:30:23,480
And it means that we can then
say these are the problems that

718
00:30:23,720 --> 00:30:25,880
schools are seeing.
This is where we need help.

719
00:30:25,880 --> 00:30:28,840
These many classes didn't have a
teaching assistant.

720
00:30:29,360 --> 00:30:32,640
Whenever we say or put out
questions about like if you

721
00:30:32,640 --> 00:30:35,680
could employ another member of
staff or give like give money in

722
00:30:35,680 --> 00:30:39,160
this area, teaching assistants
is always like #2 or #3 option.

723
00:30:39,160 --> 00:30:44,080
That's really, really high, and
I think that speaks to the loss

724
00:30:44,080 --> 00:30:46,480
that teachers who've been
teaching for enough time to

725
00:30:46,480 --> 00:30:48,920
remember what it was like to
have teaching assistants,

726
00:30:49,080 --> 00:30:51,800
sometimes multiple teaching
assistants in your classroom.

727
00:30:53,200 --> 00:30:56,000
Remember those dizzy?
What more help?

728
00:30:56,480 --> 00:30:58,240
Geez.
That was great.

729
00:30:58,240 --> 00:31:00,720
And having somebody that you
regularly worked with and you

730
00:31:00,720 --> 00:31:02,960
would sit with your lesson plans
and say, look, I would like you

731
00:31:02,960 --> 00:31:05,720
to do this and this and this.
You had this opportunity to work

732
00:31:05,720 --> 00:31:08,720
with another professional with
your children.

733
00:31:09,240 --> 00:31:12,080
And you know, I accept some of
the criticisms about the system

734
00:31:12,080 --> 00:31:14,680
that we had when we had more
classroom assistants and it

735
00:31:14,680 --> 00:31:17,120
didn't always work well.
Not everyone worked well with

736
00:31:17,120 --> 00:31:22,760
their TAS, etcetera, etcetera.
But but it did do a lot of good

737
00:31:22,760 --> 00:31:25,840
too.
And it it made it possible to

738
00:31:25,840 --> 00:31:28,680
manage a class when you had
children with additional needs.

739
00:31:29,120 --> 00:31:31,720
Whereas now I would think many
teachers say it's actually

740
00:31:31,720 --> 00:31:36,200
impossible to teach, you're just
managing behaviour and isn't

741
00:31:36,200 --> 00:31:38,640
that bleak?
Was was the solution to the

742
00:31:38,640 --> 00:31:41,000
broken system to get rid of the
support?

743
00:31:41,600 --> 00:31:44,120
I I don't think it was it.
Did more good?

744
00:31:44,160 --> 00:31:44,960
Yeah.
I mean, that's, that's the way

745
00:31:44,960 --> 00:31:45,640
to put it, isn't it?
Yeah.

746
00:31:45,800 --> 00:31:47,560
Was there, were there some
negative elements?

747
00:31:47,560 --> 00:31:48,080
Yeah, mate.
Yeah.

748
00:31:48,080 --> 00:31:50,120
OK, yeah.
But did they do more good than

749
00:31:50,120 --> 00:31:52,080
bad?
But yes, like astronomically.

750
00:31:52,080 --> 00:31:53,360
Do you know what I find tricky
now?

751
00:31:53,360 --> 00:31:55,480
It might be interesting to see
the date if you're pulling data

752
00:31:55,480 --> 00:31:56,760
from this.
Maybe we'll talk talk in the

753
00:31:56,760 --> 00:31:58,120
future as well.
We'll have another chat.

754
00:31:58,400 --> 00:32:01,960
But what I find more trickier
than ever is managing my

755
00:32:01,960 --> 00:32:04,240
teaching assistant.
And maybe newer teachers will

756
00:32:04,240 --> 00:32:06,880
find that where it's so
inconsistent, the support that

757
00:32:06,880 --> 00:32:09,800
I'm getting as a teacher, that
there will be days where I have

758
00:32:09,800 --> 00:32:12,200
no one and there'll be lessons
where I have no one.

759
00:32:12,200 --> 00:32:14,320
And then maybe I'll get a
teaching assistant for maths,

760
00:32:14,320 --> 00:32:15,320
which is halfway through the
day.

761
00:32:15,320 --> 00:32:16,920
Then I'll go again for the
afternoon.

762
00:32:17,240 --> 00:32:21,600
I'm really struggling to.
I feel like my management of a

763
00:32:21,600 --> 00:32:24,560
teaching assistant is worse than
ever before, even though I'm

764
00:32:24,560 --> 00:32:26,280
more experienced in your skill
of doing that.

765
00:32:26,280 --> 00:32:29,840
Yeah, because I it's so sporadic
when I'm not to do it, if that

766
00:32:29,840 --> 00:32:30,800
makes.
Sense and just add on that

767
00:32:30,800 --> 00:32:32,920
sometimes you said you won't go
days where it's you're talking

768
00:32:32,920 --> 00:32:34,680
about the sort of
inconsistencies in the in the

769
00:32:34,680 --> 00:32:36,800
sort of week.
Sometimes I go a whole year

770
00:32:37,000 --> 00:32:38,720
yeah.
I like this year I don't have

771
00:32:38,720 --> 00:32:41,160
ATA, Yeah, in any subject at any
point in the day.

772
00:32:41,200 --> 00:32:43,640
Yeah.
So it's like next year, would I,

773
00:32:43,640 --> 00:32:45,760
would I, would I be a bit more
deskilled like probably, yeah.

774
00:32:45,760 --> 00:32:47,720
I won't, I won't.
I won't have interacted or

775
00:32:47,720 --> 00:32:50,080
managed a a teaching assistant
for an entire year.

776
00:32:50,160 --> 00:32:53,400
And, and that's where schools
try and put teaching assistants

777
00:32:53,400 --> 00:32:55,000
in places they think they need
the most.

778
00:32:55,000 --> 00:32:56,800
And that's the right way to do
it because there's trapped for

779
00:32:56,800 --> 00:32:58,200
cash.
And let's say we don't have

780
00:32:58,200 --> 00:33:00,720
enough for everyone.
That what, what issue we have

781
00:33:00,720 --> 00:33:04,640
here is there's a, there's a,
there's a separation between the

782
00:33:04,640 --> 00:33:07,200
need of assistant and assistance
and help because of your

783
00:33:07,200 --> 00:33:10,240
attainment levels and the need
for assistant and help because

784
00:33:10,240 --> 00:33:12,600
of your special educational
needs or educational healthcare

785
00:33:12,720 --> 00:33:14,520
plan.
And those don't always overlap.

786
00:33:14,560 --> 00:33:18,240
Like how often have you heard
someone say, Oh, they're,

787
00:33:18,240 --> 00:33:20,400
they've got an education
healthcare plan, but they don't

788
00:33:20,400 --> 00:33:21,880
really need support because
they're quite intelligent.

789
00:33:21,880 --> 00:33:24,160
They just crack on themselves.
But they might need that for a

790
00:33:24,160 --> 00:33:25,880
different reason.
You might have a child with

791
00:33:25,880 --> 00:33:29,000
diabetes who needs a one to one
to keep them alive in those

792
00:33:29,000 --> 00:33:30,560
situations where they have
hypos.

793
00:33:30,960 --> 00:33:34,200
So it doesn't always overlap.
And what I see a lot is maybe

794
00:33:34,200 --> 00:33:36,880
schools are more worried about
attainment and putting teaching

795
00:33:36,880 --> 00:33:39,720
assistants and classroom helpers
in places where they want a

796
00:33:39,720 --> 00:33:43,320
lower ratio to get better SAT
results at the detriment of

797
00:33:43,560 --> 00:33:46,400
there are some children who
maybe are going to get expected,

798
00:33:46,400 --> 00:33:49,160
but and it's not the best use of
our money because we want to get

799
00:33:49,160 --> 00:33:51,640
SAT results higher.
So we'll move that teaching

800
00:33:51,640 --> 00:33:53,640
assistant away from someone who
needs it, even though it won't

801
00:33:53,640 --> 00:33:56,240
move them attainantly.
And that pastoral support, I

802
00:33:56,240 --> 00:33:57,960
don't know if you've got any
data on this or seen this.

803
00:33:58,360 --> 00:34:01,560
Ronya is I.
I feel like he's at an all time

804
00:34:01,560 --> 00:34:04,080
low.
Yeah, yeah, we've, we've been

805
00:34:04,080 --> 00:34:05,800
asking about teaching assistants
for a while.

806
00:34:05,800 --> 00:34:09,880
It's really tricky.
Like I'm not 100% happy with our

807
00:34:09,880 --> 00:34:12,400
teaching assistant questions.
So people who've got teaching

808
00:34:12,400 --> 00:34:14,560
assistant questions they want to
send in, I've just scribbled

809
00:34:14,560 --> 00:34:15,880
down to three from what you've
said.

810
00:34:16,280 --> 00:34:21,639
But we, we, we, it's really hard
to capture that the if we ask it

811
00:34:21,639 --> 00:34:24,480
was a teaching assistant in your
classroom for the last lesson or

812
00:34:24,480 --> 00:34:28,000
like or in it today, they might
have been in for like minutes.

813
00:34:28,080 --> 00:34:29,120
Sure.
Right.

814
00:34:29,120 --> 00:34:32,440
So it's that doesn't, so they
might be saying, Oh yeah, I've

815
00:34:32,440 --> 00:34:34,480
still got one.
And we're, we've been looking

816
00:34:34,480 --> 00:34:36,880
at, there has been a reduction
in the number of teaching

817
00:34:36,880 --> 00:34:39,440
assistants.
But I think the problem is that

818
00:34:39,440 --> 00:34:42,360
they're the ones we've got left
are being spread out really

819
00:34:42,360 --> 00:34:44,080
thinly.
Completely, yeah.

820
00:34:44,520 --> 00:34:48,080
So yeah, it's tricky one to
capture, but it's definitely

821
00:34:48,080 --> 00:34:50,800
something that we can see.
There's still classes that have

822
00:34:50,800 --> 00:34:53,560
got several members of that
class on the on the send

823
00:34:53,560 --> 00:34:56,280
register and no teaching
assistant.

824
00:34:56,560 --> 00:34:58,560
Very, very normal.
Yeah, I really want to.

825
00:34:58,560 --> 00:35:00,840
I want to highlight what you
said for our listeners again and

826
00:35:00,840 --> 00:35:02,480
just really draw people's
attention to it because I'd love

827
00:35:02,480 --> 00:35:04,440
to hear what people say because
you have hit the nail on the

828
00:35:04,440 --> 00:35:08,760
head with the SEM register.
It's so sporadic and seemingly

829
00:35:08,760 --> 00:35:11,680
random score from school.
I've moved schools, I've been in

830
00:35:11,680 --> 00:35:14,040
different schools and every
single school seems to have a

831
00:35:14,040 --> 00:35:16,360
different way recording.
It seems to have a different

832
00:35:16,360 --> 00:35:19,320
definition of what a child would
need to be on the list.

833
00:35:19,600 --> 00:35:24,160
That SCN register is so separate
to that EHCP like you said

834
00:35:24,160 --> 00:35:27,440
because it feels like the EHCP
boundary is way too high for

835
00:35:27,440 --> 00:35:30,520
children getting support and the
SCN register is just filling up

836
00:35:30,520 --> 00:35:32,840
with children.
Where as a class teacher it

837
00:35:32,840 --> 00:35:36,120
feels like I'm given a list and
then said good luck.

838
00:35:37,880 --> 00:35:39,160
They all, they all need support.
What?

839
00:35:39,160 --> 00:35:40,000
The same support?
No.

840
00:35:40,200 --> 00:35:42,000
Yeah, they're different because
this children, this child needs

841
00:35:42,000 --> 00:35:43,160
that.
And and you know what, as a

842
00:35:43,160 --> 00:35:45,040
teacher, last thing I'm going to
say because I'd love to crack on

843
00:35:45,040 --> 00:35:47,280
with some data growing, I'm
sorry, but last thing on this,

844
00:35:47,280 --> 00:35:49,400
because as a classroom teacher,
the thing that frustrates me the

845
00:35:49,400 --> 00:35:52,080
most is the only reason I'm a
teacher is because I want to

846
00:35:52,080 --> 00:35:54,520
help children.
And when I'm given a list of

847
00:35:54,680 --> 00:35:58,560
children who need extra help and
I physically can't do that, I've

848
00:35:58,560 --> 00:36:01,120
got one of two options.
I completely burn out and then

849
00:36:01,120 --> 00:36:04,160
fail anyway because I've not got
the support I need to do it or I

850
00:36:04,160 --> 00:36:06,760
have to, I have to not give them
the support.

851
00:36:06,760 --> 00:36:08,840
I know they need and both are
devastating.

852
00:36:09,600 --> 00:36:12,040
I think we don't talk enough
about the fact that you often

853
00:36:12,040 --> 00:36:14,160
have given a list of children
that you're going to teach in

854
00:36:14,160 --> 00:36:17,440
your class and their needs
don't, like, they're not just,

855
00:36:17,440 --> 00:36:19,400
they don't overlap.
Like they're actually in

856
00:36:19,400 --> 00:36:22,280
contradiction of each other.
But you know, you're told that

857
00:36:22,280 --> 00:36:26,080
this child needs to have regular
changing tasks because they're,

858
00:36:26,160 --> 00:36:27,600
you know, they're.
Yeah, yeah.

859
00:36:28,080 --> 00:36:31,840
This child needs to have long
times, like settled into a task

860
00:36:31,840 --> 00:36:34,280
and like time to develop.
Like, well, I can't do both of

861
00:36:34,280 --> 00:36:36,200
those things.
Like those two very, very

862
00:36:36,200 --> 00:36:37,920
different.
And one like needs to be able to

863
00:36:37,920 --> 00:36:39,320
work with like noise in the
background.

864
00:36:39,320 --> 00:36:41,760
And the other one needs to have
silence like, well, I can't, I

865
00:36:41,760 --> 00:36:44,760
can't do both of these things.
The rise of ear defenders.

866
00:36:44,760 --> 00:36:47,240
We're going to ask again about
the ear defenders because that

867
00:36:47,240 --> 00:36:50,520
was something that really like
flew up over COVID.

868
00:36:50,720 --> 00:36:53,600
Yeah, that's increased.
But has it, is it going back

869
00:36:53,600 --> 00:36:56,920
down again now or are we using
those ear defenders to try and

870
00:36:56,920 --> 00:36:59,040
balance those kinds of
situations where there's

871
00:36:59,040 --> 00:37:01,560
children that do make a lot of
noise and have to be allowed to

872
00:37:01,560 --> 00:37:04,960
make that noise and there's
children who who can't tolerate

873
00:37:04,960 --> 00:37:07,280
noise?
Like what is that classroom

874
00:37:07,280 --> 00:37:09,960
experience like then for that
child who can't tolerate noise?

875
00:37:09,960 --> 00:37:14,000
And in this sort of artificial
deafness, like that's, that's a

876
00:37:14,000 --> 00:37:15,920
real concern.
And.

877
00:37:15,920 --> 00:37:19,720
How does that be is for them to
then move on to other parts of

878
00:37:19,960 --> 00:37:22,640
other parts of their life.
Just generally, anyway, It's

879
00:37:22,640 --> 00:37:24,080
yeah.
You'll have to let us know when

880
00:37:24,080 --> 00:37:24,480
you find.
Out.

881
00:37:24,480 --> 00:37:27,440
Yeah, yeah.
There is there is one piece of

882
00:37:27,440 --> 00:37:28,760
data you sent for.
I'm itching to talk about it

883
00:37:28,760 --> 00:37:31,160
because I, I just, I want to
know what you think about this

884
00:37:31,160 --> 00:37:32,960
because I was just looking at
the numbers and it was about the

885
00:37:32,960 --> 00:37:34,440
equipment.
It was about break times and

886
00:37:34,440 --> 00:37:37,680
lunch times and how you've got
some data over sort of six year

887
00:37:37,680 --> 00:37:42,200
period here on how and what
equipment students use during

888
00:37:42,200 --> 00:37:44,200
break times and play times.
Can you just break down some of

889
00:37:44,200 --> 00:37:46,200
this data for us and tell us
what you think?

890
00:37:46,560 --> 00:37:48,800
OK, so we asked teachers about
the typical things you might

891
00:37:48,800 --> 00:37:52,920
find in the playground.
So ropes for jump, for doing

892
00:37:52,920 --> 00:37:57,160
jump rope, like skipping,
bringing your own ball, having

893
00:37:57,760 --> 00:37:59,840
hopscotch marked out and things
like that.

894
00:37:59,840 --> 00:38:02,480
Like the old snail.
Who knows what game you meant to

895
00:38:02,520 --> 00:38:04,600
plan that snail, but we invent
loads right it.

896
00:38:04,880 --> 00:38:06,680
Doesn't matter, just run.
Run around in circles.

897
00:38:07,080 --> 00:38:09,600
The obstacle course which at my
daughter's school is always

898
00:38:09,600 --> 00:38:11,880
roped off and taped off and
normally due to my middle

899
00:38:11,880 --> 00:38:16,040
quarter breaking it.
The climbing equipment providing

900
00:38:16,040 --> 00:38:19,240
balls for the kids, footballs,
tennis balls, netballs,

901
00:38:19,240 --> 00:38:23,400
basketballs, and then providing
ropes and elastics for jumping

902
00:38:23,400 --> 00:38:28,280
games.
Now we saw a drop in every

903
00:38:28,280 --> 00:38:30,120
single area.
Wow.

904
00:38:30,920 --> 00:38:32,360
Over what?
Over the six year period.

905
00:38:32,360 --> 00:38:34,960
Over the six year period, it's
gone down and it's gone down

906
00:38:34,960 --> 00:38:38,720
further, so there's fewer
schools that are providing these

907
00:38:38,720 --> 00:38:40,600
things for the children.
What?

908
00:38:40,600 --> 00:38:44,440
Does that tell you?
Well, we also asked, have you

909
00:38:44,440 --> 00:38:47,040
noticed there's a reduction of
children playing playground

910
00:38:47,040 --> 00:38:51,520
games like hotspot skipping?
And the older you were, the more

911
00:38:51,520 --> 00:38:53,920
likely you are to say, yes,
definitely.

912
00:38:53,920 --> 00:38:56,880
It's decreased significantly.
And we're stuck in an open

913
00:38:56,880 --> 00:38:59,200
question because we're like,
what's going on here, guys?

914
00:38:59,200 --> 00:39:04,640
Like tell us the story.
And it seems that there's been a

915
00:39:04,640 --> 00:39:07,480
drop in kids knowing these games
already when they came to

916
00:39:07,480 --> 00:39:09,040
school.
So like previously, kids knew

917
00:39:09,040 --> 00:39:11,560
how to play hopscotch, kids knew
how to skip and it was something

918
00:39:11,560 --> 00:39:13,880
that they played elsewhere and
they were playing when they got

919
00:39:13,880 --> 00:39:15,800
to school.
That's changed.

920
00:39:16,080 --> 00:39:19,000
Lots of teachers said that
children are more interested in

921
00:39:19,000 --> 00:39:22,640
having tablets and they'll be,
that's, that's what they that's

922
00:39:22,640 --> 00:39:25,040
how they play now.
So playing physically playing

923
00:39:25,040 --> 00:39:26,680
just isn't the thing that they
want to do.

924
00:39:27,160 --> 00:39:29,960
Lots said they don't have the
staff to teach them how to do

925
00:39:29,960 --> 00:39:32,000
these games, to supervise these
games.

926
00:39:32,880 --> 00:39:35,680
And then of course, this won't
surprise you, but money.

927
00:39:35,680 --> 00:39:39,240
So balls, skipping ropes, all
that equipment, it costs money.

928
00:39:39,240 --> 00:39:40,920
And if it breaks, you've got to
replace it.

929
00:39:40,920 --> 00:39:42,440
And then just not getting
replaced.

930
00:39:42,920 --> 00:39:46,080
I had reply after reply after
reply saying our equipment's

931
00:39:46,080 --> 00:39:47,680
broken and we can't afford to
fix it.

932
00:39:48,920 --> 00:39:51,200
Do you, do you think it's just a
mixture of all those things?

933
00:39:51,200 --> 00:39:53,520
Like do you think all of those
responses that you got there are

934
00:39:53,520 --> 00:39:56,480
just valid and they're all just
contributing to why those

935
00:39:56,480 --> 00:39:57,880
numbers have just gone down and
down and down?

936
00:39:57,880 --> 00:40:01,040
Or do you think there's like a
particular prevalent cause for

937
00:40:01,040 --> 00:40:05,400
this number going down?
I think that people are

938
00:40:05,400 --> 00:40:09,280
generally a lot more sedentary
and I think children generally

939
00:40:09,280 --> 00:40:13,960
copy what they see around them.
And so it's like, you don't,

940
00:40:14,440 --> 00:40:16,520
it's a it's a trend that just
grows.

941
00:40:16,520 --> 00:40:21,320
So if the majority aren't
playing, then everyone's going

942
00:40:21,320 --> 00:40:25,240
to follow it.
You can't play many games just

943
00:40:25,240 --> 00:40:27,400
on your own.
You don't want to be that kid is

944
00:40:27,400 --> 00:40:30,440
just playing on their own.
Also I think kids use parks

945
00:40:30,440 --> 00:40:34,400
less.
I think actually playing is less

946
00:40:34,480 --> 00:40:36,200
common.
Children don't have the same

947
00:40:36,200 --> 00:40:39,760
freedom as they did 5-10 years
ago of being able to take

948
00:40:39,760 --> 00:40:42,080
themselves off to the park and
playing unsupervised.

949
00:40:42,400 --> 00:40:46,040
As a society we're much more
like scathing and sceptical

950
00:40:46,040 --> 00:40:48,320
about children that are out on
their own.

951
00:40:49,040 --> 00:40:51,200
You, you know, you only have to
be on a couple of Facebook

952
00:40:51,200 --> 00:40:54,080
groups for your local news that
there's children out there.

953
00:40:54,840 --> 00:40:56,080
Yeah.
And children are.

954
00:40:56,080 --> 00:40:58,360
Existing in this world and doing
fun things.

955
00:40:58,360 --> 00:41:00,280
That they were kicking a ball
around and actually I don't like

956
00:41:00,280 --> 00:41:01,360
that, Yeah.
Honestly.

957
00:41:02,400 --> 00:41:06,320
Teenager looked at me the the
other week something really

958
00:41:06,320 --> 00:41:08,840
kicked off at our on our local
Facebook groups and children

959
00:41:08,840 --> 00:41:11,520
have been playing by the beach
and had left some things on the

960
00:41:11,520 --> 00:41:13,640
wall.
Went to the shop and came back

961
00:41:13,640 --> 00:41:16,600
and there was like 100 comments
about his kids who'd left their

962
00:41:16,600 --> 00:41:19,280
things on the on the wall to go
to the shop and come the back.

963
00:41:19,280 --> 00:41:21,520
Like this is outrageous.
They left all that.

964
00:41:22,520 --> 00:41:26,600
Yeah, honestly.
They are just existing.

965
00:41:27,640 --> 00:41:32,600
So I think that's a.
That's a big, big part of it

966
00:41:32,600 --> 00:41:37,000
too.
But and also like the the, the

967
00:41:37,000 --> 00:41:41,200
amount of time that kids do
spend on screens has risen

968
00:41:41,200 --> 00:41:44,560
massively and we can't
underestimate the impact that

969
00:41:44,560 --> 00:41:45,160
has on them.
I mean.

970
00:41:45,160 --> 00:41:47,920
This will be probably an obvious
answer to this question, but do

971
00:41:47,920 --> 00:41:52,880
you, do you think that this is
this is intrinsically bad and we

972
00:41:52,880 --> 00:41:54,800
should do something about it?
Or do you or how much of this do

973
00:41:54,800 --> 00:41:56,400
you think is just a culture
change?

974
00:41:56,880 --> 00:41:59,040
And therefore it's just classic,
we know we're older, they're

975
00:41:59,040 --> 00:42:00,840
younger.
Every, every older generation

976
00:42:00,840 --> 00:42:02,720
thinks the next generation.
Oh, they don't do it like we did

977
00:42:02,720 --> 00:42:04,720
back in our day.
Do you think there's an element

978
00:42:04,720 --> 00:42:06,160
of that?
Or do you think, no, this is

979
00:42:06,160 --> 00:42:09,560
just bad and we need to, we need
to intervene and help children?

980
00:42:10,080 --> 00:42:11,520
No, I think this is
catastrophic.

981
00:42:11,640 --> 00:42:15,200
I think really, really bad.
So in my other life, I coach

982
00:42:15,200 --> 00:42:18,720
athletics and I see little
children.

983
00:42:18,720 --> 00:42:21,680
I, I, I teach what we call
fundamentals because we're being

984
00:42:21,680 --> 00:42:23,080
fun.
It's all fun.

985
00:42:23,920 --> 00:42:25,440
Love that that's.
The teacher shining through,

986
00:42:25,560 --> 00:42:27,000
Yeah.
Yeah, I love it.

987
00:42:27,600 --> 00:42:30,280
But getting them, so one of the
first things we get them to do

988
00:42:30,280 --> 00:42:33,040
is to do hopscotch because
hopscotch is really good for

989
00:42:33,040 --> 00:42:36,000
balance and coordination.
And obviously, eventually it's

990
00:42:36,000 --> 00:42:39,040
like we lead it leads on to a
long jump, triple jump, et

991
00:42:39,040 --> 00:42:40,320
cetera, et cetera.
Yeah.

992
00:42:40,720 --> 00:42:43,800
And I'm always horrified at the
number of kids that can't

993
00:42:43,800 --> 00:42:47,680
hopscotch and don't have the
coordination, don't have

994
00:42:47,680 --> 00:42:49,560
balance.
And when I talk to other coaches

995
00:42:49,560 --> 00:42:52,160
about this, it's something that
we all agree that we've seen a

996
00:42:52,280 --> 00:42:55,400
massive increase in kids that
can't balance on one leg.

997
00:42:55,680 --> 00:42:57,160
So true.
It's so true.

998
00:42:57,160 --> 00:42:59,800
These basic coordination skills.
As as, as teacher, we, we

999
00:42:59,800 --> 00:43:01,720
obviously as primary school, we
teach everything in the end.

1000
00:43:01,720 --> 00:43:05,000
So every and every primary
school teacher has taught PE and

1001
00:43:05,000 --> 00:43:08,000
where it's not a specialism and
we're kind of just doing what we

1002
00:43:08,000 --> 00:43:10,800
can do.
I am consistently shocked to the

1003
00:43:10,800 --> 00:43:13,360
point now where it actually
doesn't shock me anymore, where

1004
00:43:13,600 --> 00:43:16,840
I'll be teaching year 4 or five
APE lesson and I'll just look

1005
00:43:16,840 --> 00:43:17,960
and I'll be like, oh, there's a
warm up.

1006
00:43:17,960 --> 00:43:19,160
We're throwing the ball to each
other.

1007
00:43:19,280 --> 00:43:21,120
OK, cool, what a lovely warm up
because we're going to end up

1008
00:43:21,120 --> 00:43:22,280
doing some different types of
throwing.

1009
00:43:23,120 --> 00:43:26,080
Here you go, kids, here's a
ball, get 2 metres apart, 5

1010
00:43:26,080 --> 00:43:28,080
metres apart, if you're a bit
more confident, whatever it is,

1011
00:43:28,080 --> 00:43:31,280
and just throw a ball at each
other and over half of them

1012
00:43:31,280 --> 00:43:33,240
can't throw a ball.
And I'm not, I'm not even

1013
00:43:33,240 --> 00:43:36,240
exaggerating genuinely like I'm,
it's, I'm sounds like I'm making

1014
00:43:36,240 --> 00:43:38,720
a joke.
I'm being deadly serious where I

1015
00:43:38,720 --> 00:43:42,000
look at how they throw a ball.
I look at literally how they

1016
00:43:42,000 --> 00:43:44,640
run.
OK, and these some children get

1017
00:43:44,640 --> 00:43:48,640
to seven, 8-9 years old and they
cannot run.

1018
00:43:48,680 --> 00:43:51,280
But it's not running.
It's it's like stumbling.

1019
00:43:51,280 --> 00:43:52,720
It's like they've never done it
before.

1020
00:43:53,040 --> 00:43:56,840
And that is, like you said,
catastrophic.

1021
00:43:56,840 --> 00:44:00,120
And I think this is all linked
is the point I'm making.

1022
00:44:00,120 --> 00:44:01,400
I think.
I think you're absolutely right,

1023
00:44:01,400 --> 00:44:04,880
Gwenya, that the fat children
aren't doing this outside of

1024
00:44:04,880 --> 00:44:08,000
school enough is impacting what
we see in school.

1025
00:44:08,000 --> 00:44:10,440
Because in school, we've always
done one or two PE lessons a

1026
00:44:10,440 --> 00:44:11,880
week in school, that's always
what's happened.

1027
00:44:11,920 --> 00:44:13,760
We're not we're not doing way,
way less PE.

1028
00:44:13,760 --> 00:44:16,840
Maybe we're doing a bit less.
But this is fundamentally from I

1029
00:44:16,840 --> 00:44:18,560
think society and having an
impact.

1030
00:44:18,560 --> 00:44:22,280
So as teachers, So what?
What can we do?

1031
00:44:22,280 --> 00:44:24,400
Where do we go from here?
Because I don't want to just

1032
00:44:24,400 --> 00:44:28,400
accept it, but like with so much
in teaching as a teacher, I end

1033
00:44:28,400 --> 00:44:30,600
up getting frustrated and burnt
out because I'm trying to change

1034
00:44:30,600 --> 00:44:32,200
things that I don't have the
power to change.

1035
00:44:32,200 --> 00:44:34,200
So like what?
What do you think the small

1036
00:44:34,200 --> 00:44:37,240
steps we could do to try and
make children better at this and

1037
00:44:37,240 --> 00:44:39,920
try and solve this problem?
I think we've got some really

1038
00:44:39,920 --> 00:44:44,840
good news coming with the
there's an opportunity of how we

1039
00:44:44,840 --> 00:44:48,880
could help this Now I'm almost
loathed to say it because I know

1040
00:44:48,880 --> 00:44:53,600
we're all just going to go, but
the 30 minute free breakfast

1041
00:44:53,600 --> 00:44:59,320
club funding, what are you doing
to us?

1042
00:44:59,320 --> 00:45:01,280
This is this is not well thought
through.

1043
00:45:01,440 --> 00:45:06,520
But you got. 30 minutes before
school that you could do outdoor

1044
00:45:06,520 --> 00:45:11,720
PE with them or not even just
games, just games.

1045
00:45:11,960 --> 00:45:13,920
Just get them to do little
running games.

1046
00:45:14,200 --> 00:45:16,880
And I think the Youth Sports
Trust has already got behind

1047
00:45:16,880 --> 00:45:20,200
like got onto this and they're,
I've seen things from them

1048
00:45:20,360 --> 00:45:24,040
suggesting how you can make your
30 minute breakfast club an

1049
00:45:24,040 --> 00:45:25,680
active one.
Amazing.

1050
00:45:26,120 --> 00:45:29,320
Reasonably cheap to do like I do
a running club for my daughter's

1051
00:45:29,320 --> 00:45:33,080
school once a morning, like once
a week in the morning and we

1052
00:45:33,080 --> 00:45:37,840
just do I probably take the same
for four sessions and they don't

1053
00:45:37,840 --> 00:45:39,760
care they.
Don't care, they're just.

1054
00:45:39,760 --> 00:45:42,640
Happy we do hare and tortoise.
We do like running around the

1055
00:45:42,640 --> 00:45:45,640
cone like 1-2 drops so you get
increasingly shorter intervals.

1056
00:45:45,640 --> 00:45:47,320
We do like balance stuff in
between.

1057
00:45:47,400 --> 00:45:49,840
We call it the hex games
copyright me.

1058
00:45:50,720 --> 00:45:52,720
But we do like a little run and
then they balance and they do a

1059
00:45:52,720 --> 00:45:54,120
run.
They do some jobs and like it's

1060
00:45:54,120 --> 00:45:57,040
just fun and they're moving and
they go in with really red

1061
00:45:57,040 --> 00:45:59,680
cheeks and they've got time just
to get changed out of their

1062
00:45:59,680 --> 00:46:03,000
bunning stuff into their the
school uniform is done.

1063
00:46:03,000 --> 00:46:05,280
It's so it doesn't cost
anything.

1064
00:46:05,400 --> 00:46:08,880
No, it's really simple.
You don't need to be very like

1065
00:46:08,880 --> 00:46:12,920
highly trained to do it.
Don't damn yourself going yeah,

1066
00:46:12,920 --> 00:46:17,240
you're highly trained.
I like the idea though, like you

1067
00:46:17,320 --> 00:46:19,240
know, breakfast, breakfast club
being that.

1068
00:46:19,680 --> 00:46:21,120
That.
Time for activity.

1069
00:46:21,120 --> 00:46:22,280
You know what we'll turn into,
don't you?

1070
00:46:22,280 --> 00:46:23,480
We all know what this will turn
into.

1071
00:46:23,480 --> 00:46:24,760
Go on.
Let's all be realistic for a

1072
00:46:24,760 --> 00:46:25,960
second, because this is
fantastic.

1073
00:46:25,960 --> 00:46:27,800
And it's it's one of those
things where like, yeah, we all,

1074
00:46:27,800 --> 00:46:29,680
we should do that.
Give it three years.

1075
00:46:29,680 --> 00:46:33,400
There'll be SAT boosters that'll
be SATS boost year 6 like, well,

1076
00:46:33,480 --> 00:46:36,120
you know, we all know this will
this and it's horrendous.

1077
00:46:36,480 --> 00:46:39,440
We know that moving, we know
that moving before school and

1078
00:46:39,440 --> 00:46:42,560
doing like movement and activity
and getting your heart racing

1079
00:46:42,760 --> 00:46:45,040
improves your educational
outcomes.

1080
00:46:45,040 --> 00:46:48,280
We know it.
That's an English so to ignore

1081
00:46:48,280 --> 00:46:51,480
it is just to at our peril and
kids will concentrate a lot

1082
00:46:51,480 --> 00:46:53,840
better, the mums and the little
kids.

1083
00:46:53,840 --> 00:46:56,120
The group that I do always say,
oh they slept really well last

1084
00:46:56,120 --> 00:46:59,200
night.
Like how about there'll be

1085
00:46:59,200 --> 00:47:01,240
better behaviour?
How you sleep when you have no

1086
00:47:01,240 --> 00:47:05,160
energy.
My kids just aren't sleeping.

1087
00:47:05,360 --> 00:47:06,600
Yeah.
Oh, have they done any exercise?

1088
00:47:06,600 --> 00:47:08,040
And have they played video games
all night?

1089
00:47:08,200 --> 00:47:10,800
I wonder why?
Mystery.

1090
00:47:12,440 --> 00:47:15,800
Hopefully, you know, like we've
teach that's amazing, right?

1091
00:47:15,800 --> 00:47:19,000
And I really hope that when all
of this Breakfast Club stuff

1092
00:47:19,000 --> 00:47:22,040
comes in into action, we can
harvest some actual information

1093
00:47:22,040 --> 00:47:24,560
and hopefully, you know, not see
what the what Dylan?

1094
00:47:24,600 --> 00:47:26,560
Hey, hey, I don't want this.
I know we don't, but.

1095
00:47:26,760 --> 00:47:28,200
You know, I hope we won't do
that and.

1096
00:47:28,240 --> 00:47:30,920
Yeah, you might be right.
And it'll be interesting to find

1097
00:47:30,920 --> 00:47:32,560
out, you know, exactly what how
that time actually.

1098
00:47:32,560 --> 00:47:34,160
Gets Yeah.
I wanted to mention one thing on

1099
00:47:34,160 --> 00:47:36,840
you that you you'd had said to
us about some kind of survey

1100
00:47:36,840 --> 00:47:38,240
that you're doing in terms of.
Yes.

1101
00:47:38,240 --> 00:47:40,800
So one way that you can find out
what's going on in your school

1102
00:47:40,800 --> 00:47:43,640
is to ask the children.
We have got this, it's called

1103
00:47:43,640 --> 00:47:46,720
lunchtime and listen.
And it's not about moaning to

1104
00:47:46,720 --> 00:47:48,760
your colleagues about, you know,
your last lesson.

1105
00:47:48,960 --> 00:47:52,080
It's all about what are kids
doing in lunchtimes and break

1106
00:47:52,080 --> 00:47:53,520
times.
It's a short survey.

1107
00:47:53,520 --> 00:47:55,600
You get to pick.
We've got like all our best

1108
00:47:55,600 --> 00:47:57,280
questions for the kids to
answer.

1109
00:47:57,280 --> 00:48:01,120
You can pick them out, stick
them on a computer and get them

1110
00:48:01,120 --> 00:48:03,560
or do them like 1 by 1, throw
them through it.

1111
00:48:03,840 --> 00:48:07,640
But the fun thing, you get to
compare how your school answers

1112
00:48:07,880 --> 00:48:11,120
versus the rest of the country.
So the more schools we've got

1113
00:48:11,160 --> 00:48:13,840
who sign up to it, the better
the data for your school is.

1114
00:48:14,400 --> 00:48:18,560
And it might, by asking these
questions, help you see the

1115
00:48:18,560 --> 00:48:21,360
places where you can improve
your lunchtime and break times.

1116
00:48:22,320 --> 00:48:25,760
And yeah, that's, you know, if
we can't, if we, it's really

1117
00:48:25,760 --> 00:48:27,920
hard to find the time to stop
and think like, how can we do

1118
00:48:27,920 --> 00:48:29,720
this better?
School's so busy.

1119
00:48:29,720 --> 00:48:31,400
Everything's so busy.
There's like lots and lots of

1120
00:48:31,400 --> 00:48:32,640
pressure and lots of pressure
points.

1121
00:48:32,880 --> 00:48:35,560
But here's a chance where you
can get some really good data to

1122
00:48:35,560 --> 00:48:37,240
compare your school to everyone
else.

1123
00:48:37,360 --> 00:48:39,920
What's going on here?
What can we do to do do things

1124
00:48:39,920 --> 00:48:41,520
better?
I think you're absolutely right

1125
00:48:41,520 --> 00:48:44,320
when you say it's at our peril
when we ignore this data.

1126
00:48:44,440 --> 00:48:47,560
I think my, I guess my last
point on this wider scope of all

1127
00:48:47,560 --> 00:48:50,600
this, all this data we've looked
at today is there are some

1128
00:48:50,600 --> 00:48:54,560
people who will listen to all of
this and kind of go, Oh yeah,

1129
00:48:55,120 --> 00:48:58,160
anyway, crack on.
I think one thing we need to do

1130
00:48:58,160 --> 00:49:01,360
as educators and people in
school is harvest.

1131
00:49:01,400 --> 00:49:03,160
Not only harvest.
This data, which Teach TAP is

1132
00:49:03,160 --> 00:49:07,680
doing unbelievably, I think it's
now our job to actually action

1133
00:49:07,720 --> 00:49:11,840
what we see as the problems and
to do change for good reasons.

1134
00:49:11,880 --> 00:49:12,800
Oh, stop.
Dismissing it as well.

1135
00:49:12,800 --> 00:49:14,800
Yeah, it's easy to dismiss it.
I don't see it in my school.

1136
00:49:14,960 --> 00:49:17,240
And All right, OK, well, here's
you know, here's 10.

1137
00:49:17,320 --> 00:49:20,080
Thousand other people.
So I had someone I had someone

1138
00:49:20,080 --> 00:49:22,320
message sorry, leave a comment
on a real saying.

1139
00:49:22,520 --> 00:49:24,840
I don't think teaching has
changed much in the last 31

1140
00:49:24,840 --> 00:49:26,080
years.
I think maybe the younger

1141
00:49:26,080 --> 00:49:27,680
generation are just less
resilient.

1142
00:49:28,000 --> 00:49:31,440
And I just had to comment
because I said, you know what,

1143
00:49:31,640 --> 00:49:34,200
you've got a valid opinion.
Fine, OK, I disagree with you.

1144
00:49:34,200 --> 00:49:36,760
You might not think teaching's
changed, but there does come a

1145
00:49:36,760 --> 00:49:40,440
point where you are just wrong.
So you know there there is,

1146
00:49:40,560 --> 00:49:42,480
there is a point where in this
live in this society where like

1147
00:49:42,480 --> 00:49:43,840
we've got to have both sides,
haven't we?

1148
00:49:43,840 --> 00:49:46,320
We've got to talk about it and
it's got to be 5050 that.

1149
00:49:46,440 --> 00:49:48,360
But why?
Why aren't teach stick repeat

1150
00:49:48,360 --> 00:49:50,520
talking to someone who said that
playground games haven't changed

1151
00:49:50,520 --> 00:49:53,240
over time because they have
because it's a fact.

1152
00:49:53,440 --> 00:49:55,200
We don't need both sides all the
time.

1153
00:49:55,200 --> 00:49:58,200
So that person you said, I don't
think teaching's changed in 31

1154
00:49:58,200 --> 00:49:59,680
years.
You're a completely entitled to

1155
00:49:59,680 --> 00:50:03,760
your opinion and you're wrong
because we have solid data that

1156
00:50:03,760 --> 00:50:05,960
it has.
So I guess that's my frustration

1157
00:50:05,960 --> 00:50:08,920
and maybe a someone who works at
Teacher Tap sometimes, I know

1158
00:50:08,920 --> 00:50:11,360
you've got to say the right
thing etcetera, but I'm sure you

1159
00:50:11,360 --> 00:50:12,720
sometimes feel that frustration
too.

1160
00:50:14,600 --> 00:50:17,120
And also, I think like, they're
not wrong.

1161
00:50:17,480 --> 00:50:20,960
Some things haven't changed in
30 years, but lots have.

1162
00:50:21,960 --> 00:50:23,360
What you're looking at, doesn't
it?

1163
00:50:23,360 --> 00:50:28,440
Like the chairs are the same.
And that might not be a good

1164
00:50:28,560 --> 00:50:29,080
thing.
OK.

1165
00:50:29,240 --> 00:50:31,880
All the equipment's the same as
it was one years ago because we

1166
00:50:31,880 --> 00:50:32,880
haven't bought any new stuff,
but.

1167
00:50:33,320 --> 00:50:34,920
Everything.
Else the stuff that shouldn't be

1168
00:50:34,920 --> 00:50:38,840
the same is the time that's.
What you meant it's not changed,

1169
00:50:38,840 --> 00:50:40,160
we're still using the same text
group.

1170
00:50:40,960 --> 00:50:42,800
Yeah, I've got an overhead
projector.

1171
00:50:42,800 --> 00:50:43,880
Oh God, it's not changed at.
All.

1172
00:50:43,880 --> 00:50:45,560
Does it work?
No, and it never did, so it

1173
00:50:45,760 --> 00:50:48,680
doesn't.
Matter right go on yeah, go on

1174
00:50:48,680 --> 00:50:50,280
yeah I've.
This has been, I've absolutely

1175
00:50:50,280 --> 00:50:53,000
loved this because I, I like, I
think we're like you, we're data

1176
00:50:53,000 --> 00:50:54,720
nerds.
We love maths and numbers and

1177
00:50:55,080 --> 00:50:57,360
taking things in.
I, I know I'm, and this is, I

1178
00:50:57,360 --> 00:50:59,600
think I'm more excited than
anything about, about this as

1179
00:50:59,600 --> 00:51:00,600
well.
I'm not going to lie, because

1180
00:51:00,880 --> 00:51:02,440
any listeners know we love a
quiz.

1181
00:51:02,520 --> 00:51:05,000
And Groni said to us, I've
prepared you a quiz.

1182
00:51:05,000 --> 00:51:07,400
And I was like, Oh my gosh.
I'm sold.

1183
00:51:07,560 --> 00:51:08,360
I'm.
So ready?

1184
00:51:08,520 --> 00:51:11,240
I know, right?
So do you want to what?

1185
00:51:11,240 --> 00:51:14,480
What have you got for us?
This is our behaviour quiz, so

1186
00:51:14,480 --> 00:51:18,960
you're going to have to guess.
We're going to do like vote one

1187
00:51:18,960 --> 00:51:22,840
or vote 2.
So 1-2 you're going to vote your

1188
00:51:22,840 --> 00:51:28,880
hands or you can say it OK And
who faces the most disruptive

1189
00:51:28,880 --> 00:51:31,960
behaviour?
Is it primary or secondary?

1190
00:51:33,280 --> 00:51:37,680
Secondary, Yeah, going to #2.
You're so wrong.

1191
00:51:39,000 --> 00:51:42,880
It's primary.
It's primary all the time.

1192
00:51:43,080 --> 00:51:47,000
Every time it's primary, and not
just by a little bit.

1193
00:51:47,040 --> 00:51:49,600
It's primary.
Primary are more likely to hit

1194
00:51:49,920 --> 00:51:54,160
bite.
Gosh, yeah, that's true.

1195
00:51:54,200 --> 00:51:55,440
Yeah.
And it makes sense.

1196
00:51:55,440 --> 00:51:57,800
Like if you go to secondary
school and you start doing that

1197
00:51:57,840 --> 00:52:02,280
and you know, you get shit.
Primary school teachers face far

1198
00:52:02,280 --> 00:52:05,840
more disruptive behaviour than
secondary schools every time we

1199
00:52:05,920 --> 00:52:07,600
ask.
Do you know what I thought that?

1200
00:52:07,600 --> 00:52:08,960
Do you know what I think that
might be down to?

1201
00:52:08,960 --> 00:52:10,040
Because we're primary school
teachers.

1202
00:52:10,040 --> 00:52:12,680
So, you know, that person we
just said was wrong, Well, let

1203
00:52:12,680 --> 00:52:14,520
me eat some humble pie because
I'm wrong on this as well.

1204
00:52:14,520 --> 00:52:17,960
Clearly.
I think sometimes we take what

1205
00:52:17,960 --> 00:52:20,440
is clearly disruptive behaviour
and because it's so normal to

1206
00:52:20,440 --> 00:52:23,280
us, maybe we just think to
ourselves, yeah, that's normal.

1207
00:52:23,280 --> 00:52:24,280
Yeah, okay.
They're five.

1208
00:52:24,280 --> 00:52:25,480
That's.
I don't think that is a

1209
00:52:25,480 --> 00:52:27,280
disruption, but actually, yeah,
of course it does disrupt me.

1210
00:52:27,280 --> 00:52:29,600
I'm constantly disrupted when
I'm trying to teach you that.

1211
00:52:29,600 --> 00:52:33,040
True, I am constantly
firefighting stuff, but I see

1212
00:52:33,040 --> 00:52:34,640
that as part of my job in
normal.

1213
00:52:34,880 --> 00:52:36,960
But actually if someone was to
came in, they go wow, that's so

1214
00:52:36,960 --> 00:52:38,600
disruptive.
And I was like, Oh yeah, it is

1215
00:52:38,600 --> 00:52:41,880
actually.
I've just got used to having

1216
00:52:41,920 --> 00:52:43,360
this.
Yeah, no, they always put the.

1217
00:52:43,360 --> 00:52:46,960
Chair in No, nothing's changed.
Well, that's a good one.

1218
00:52:47,040 --> 00:52:48,200
Well, that's blow my mind.
Go on.

1219
00:52:48,720 --> 00:52:50,680
You're 1 down so far.
Questions soon.

1220
00:52:51,320 --> 00:52:54,520
When is behaviour at its worst
in a school?

1221
00:52:54,640 --> 00:52:58,280
Is it during lessons?
Oh no sorry, is it between?

1222
00:52:58,280 --> 00:53:02,520
Is it between where you're doing
like changeover, between

1223
00:53:02,960 --> 00:53:05,880
teaching one topic to the next
topic or one lesson to the next

1224
00:53:05,880 --> 00:53:08,160
lesson?
Or is it at lunchtime?

1225
00:53:11,000 --> 00:53:15,320
I'm going to say ready.
I'm going to vote for one.

1226
00:53:15,640 --> 00:53:17,600
Yeah.
In between changeovers, yeah.

1227
00:53:18,120 --> 00:53:18,560
No.
Oh, we're.

1228
00:53:19,240 --> 00:53:21,000
Rubbish at this and we need to
go with the thing we don't

1229
00:53:21,040 --> 00:53:24,480
think.
Lunchtime is by far the time

1230
00:53:24,480 --> 00:53:26,720
when behaviour is it's worse.
Gosh.

1231
00:53:26,880 --> 00:53:28,440
By far as well, we've been
humbled.

1232
00:53:28,520 --> 00:53:31,320
We've been humbled.
We think this is to do with

1233
00:53:31,320 --> 00:53:34,600
lunchtime assistance and to do
with how kids are supervised at

1234
00:53:34,600 --> 00:53:39,120
lunch and the the ratios
dropping of the number of

1235
00:53:39,120 --> 00:53:41,560
lunchtime assistance that you
used to have first have now.

1236
00:53:41,960 --> 00:53:44,800
And yeah.
Or maybe that hierarchy again,

1237
00:53:44,800 --> 00:53:46,600
children not respecting people
because they think, oh,

1238
00:53:46,600 --> 00:53:48,320
lunchtime assistants.
Yeah, yeah, maybe.

1239
00:53:50,360 --> 00:53:51,000
Yeah.
Wow.

1240
00:53:51,120 --> 00:53:53,280
And again, from our point of
view as primary school teachers,

1241
00:53:53,280 --> 00:53:54,760
because.
Because we've got them wrong and

1242
00:53:54,760 --> 00:53:57,280
he's trying to justify this
somehow, I think.

1243
00:53:57,360 --> 00:53:59,800
Again, I think it's because
we're not remotely involved in

1244
00:53:59,800 --> 00:54:02,440
that, in that lunchtime.
So, you know, out of sight,

1245
00:54:02,440 --> 00:54:04,760
sometimes out of mind.
We hear someone say, oh, this

1246
00:54:04,760 --> 00:54:06,440
happened at lunch and I've
sorted it.

1247
00:54:06,440 --> 00:54:08,720
I was like, OK, where is that
changeover?

1248
00:54:08,840 --> 00:54:11,200
We're in control then of that,
especially as primary school,

1249
00:54:11,200 --> 00:54:13,360
we're like, excuse me, what's
going on here?

1250
00:54:15,640 --> 00:54:18,520
OK, this is a very secondary 1,
so put on your secondary.

1251
00:54:18,520 --> 00:54:20,960
Imagine you're in a secondary
classroom.

1252
00:54:21,520 --> 00:54:25,160
What do teachers find more
annoying?

1253
00:54:25,560 --> 00:54:29,520
Kids with mobile phones or kids
answering back?

1254
00:54:32,160 --> 00:54:35,320
I would go for #1.
OK.

1255
00:54:36,240 --> 00:54:38,680
I think kids answering back.
And I think kids with phones

1256
00:54:38,680 --> 00:54:41,080
would be what I know.
It's answering back.

1257
00:54:42,680 --> 00:54:43,640
That does mean I'm.
Better.

1258
00:54:43,640 --> 00:54:45,680
Why did you think that?
I don't know, I just feel like

1259
00:54:46,080 --> 00:54:48,240
mobile, I can imagine mobile
phones are much easier to

1260
00:54:48,240 --> 00:54:50,360
control, whereas answering back
I feel like it's intrinsically

1261
00:54:50,360 --> 00:54:53,040
rude and like, I don't know, I
guess having mobile phones out

1262
00:54:53,040 --> 00:54:55,760
is rude, but I think I'd be, I'd
personally would be less annoyed

1263
00:54:55,760 --> 00:54:56,720
by that.
I don't know, maybe that's what

1264
00:54:56,720 --> 00:54:58,080
I thought.
Could you let your phone out?

1265
00:55:00,880 --> 00:55:04,160
Deep rudeness that is answering
and how it's a much more

1266
00:55:04,160 --> 00:55:07,280
heightened situation and like
that's it answering you back.

1267
00:55:07,280 --> 00:55:09,440
It's normally like in front of
the rest of the class.

1268
00:55:09,440 --> 00:55:11,640
You're like, I cannot, I cannot
stand for this.

1269
00:55:12,120 --> 00:55:15,920
My current obsession is the
politeness theory, like positive

1270
00:55:15,920 --> 00:55:19,080
face and negative face.
And this is like what I'm

1271
00:55:19,160 --> 00:55:21,000
currently like reading lots of
blogs about.

1272
00:55:21,000 --> 00:55:24,120
I used to teach it when I was
teaching English language, but

1273
00:55:24,120 --> 00:55:25,680
I've think about it all the
time.

1274
00:55:25,680 --> 00:55:28,720
It's this idea that you have two
faces, like you show positive

1275
00:55:28,720 --> 00:55:30,440
face and you can show negative
face.

1276
00:55:30,800 --> 00:55:35,120
And negative face is like not
wanting to be seen to be weak.

1277
00:55:35,240 --> 00:55:37,920
So you won't ask for something
directly.

1278
00:55:38,040 --> 00:55:41,360
You'll be like, oh, you know, I
need to have this, but you

1279
00:55:41,360 --> 00:55:42,320
don't.
You know you don't have to do

1280
00:55:42,320 --> 00:55:44,760
it, but like if you could like
because you don't want to be

1281
00:55:44,760 --> 00:55:48,920
told no and not wanting to be
given an instruction.

1282
00:55:48,920 --> 00:55:50,600
It's all about like self
protection.

1283
00:55:51,080 --> 00:55:55,840
But positive face can like be
equally insince, like insincey.

1284
00:55:55,840 --> 00:55:57,640
It can be almost like over the
top.

1285
00:55:58,000 --> 00:56:01,520
Like you want to be seen as
being easy going and nice and so

1286
00:56:01,520 --> 00:56:03,080
you're giving like positive
face.

1287
00:56:03,160 --> 00:56:04,240
I can think.
I can think of that.

1288
00:56:04,240 --> 00:56:06,760
Actually, like underneath
there's like seething.

1289
00:56:08,480 --> 00:56:12,920
I'm so angry right now.
You know, you don't want to be

1290
00:56:12,920 --> 00:56:17,120
seen as being weak or vulnerable
or would possibly be upset by

1291
00:56:17,120 --> 00:56:19,720
something.
So I'm sure this answering back

1292
00:56:19,720 --> 00:56:25,960
taps into that real deep, like
very human, very like part of us

1293
00:56:25,960 --> 00:56:28,040
that doesn't like being shown
up.

1294
00:56:28,520 --> 00:56:29,920
What was that whole?
I want to go look at mock.

1295
00:56:29,920 --> 00:56:31,840
I'm so fascinated by that.
What was it called positive?

1296
00:56:31,840 --> 00:56:35,160
It's brown and neverson,
positive face, negative face,

1297
00:56:35,160 --> 00:56:37,520
and it's like that and
politeness theory, but it's all

1298
00:56:37,520 --> 00:56:40,040
this sort of ecology that's.
Really interesting.

1299
00:56:40,040 --> 00:56:41,280
Yeah.
Because when you were saying

1300
00:56:41,280 --> 00:56:42,880
those things, I was like, I was
just, you know, inspecting

1301
00:56:42,880 --> 00:56:44,720
myself, thinking, yeah, I've
absolutely been in situations

1302
00:56:44,720 --> 00:56:46,600
where I've done all of these
things and not done these

1303
00:56:46,600 --> 00:56:48,960
things.
And yeah, that's not psychology.

1304
00:56:48,960 --> 00:56:52,840
That's great.
On Sunday, all of our questions

1305
00:56:52,840 --> 00:56:54,800
are about politeness and mate.
Oh.

1306
00:56:55,280 --> 00:56:58,640
There you go, a.
Bit of a theme on Sunday for.

1307
00:56:58,640 --> 00:57:01,040
Amazing.
We'll make sure to answer.

1308
00:57:01,040 --> 00:57:06,080
That well, I'm I'm 01.
So infinitely better than you at

1309
00:57:06,280 --> 00:57:06,800
the moment.
Well.

1310
00:57:07,600 --> 00:57:08,880
That's it.
There's there's a short

1311
00:57:08,880 --> 00:57:10,960
audience.
You're the winner.

1312
00:57:11,720 --> 00:57:13,680
That is well done, Hayden.
You won the award.

1313
00:57:13,680 --> 00:57:15,160
I mean, between us we did
awfully.

1314
00:57:15,160 --> 00:57:16,200
We've got one out of six.
Got one?

1315
00:57:16,200 --> 00:57:16,760
Out.
Yeah, Yeah.

1316
00:57:18,040 --> 00:57:19,520
But there we go.
It's very interesting, though.

1317
00:57:19,560 --> 00:57:20,840
I'm glad you asked those
questions because they

1318
00:57:20,840 --> 00:57:23,840
definitely, Yeah, when you asked
that first question, I thought,

1319
00:57:23,840 --> 00:57:25,160
here we go.
Easy easy mode.

1320
00:57:25,960 --> 00:57:28,720
You got it wrong and I was like.
OK let's challenge everything I

1321
00:57:28,720 --> 00:57:31,080
need to go with that guy on on a
TikTok who left me a message.

1322
00:57:31,080 --> 00:57:33,560
I'm.
Sorry mate, sorry, sorry pal.

1323
00:57:34,040 --> 00:57:36,600
I get what it's like to be wrong
now, finally, after all these

1324
00:57:36,600 --> 00:57:38,600
years.
Oh.

1325
00:57:39,800 --> 00:57:42,760
Dear oh gosh, well I must say
thank you so much.

1326
00:57:42,760 --> 00:57:45,120
Before we do hop off, was there
anything you wanted to finish

1327
00:57:45,120 --> 00:57:47,680
off or mention at all?
No, that's it.

1328
00:57:47,720 --> 00:57:50,600
If just if you haven't got
teacher, tap download the app,

1329
00:57:50,600 --> 00:57:53,600
try it, see if you like it, tell
your friends about it.

1330
00:57:53,880 --> 00:57:56,160
It's it's good fun.
And if you do have a question

1331
00:57:56,160 --> 00:57:57,640
you want to put in the app,
message me.

1332
00:57:57,640 --> 00:58:00,280
You can message me straight
through the app and we can put

1333
00:58:00,280 --> 00:58:02,360
it in and put it to the put it
to our teachers.

1334
00:58:02,680 --> 00:58:04,120
Brilliant.
Thank you so much.

1335
00:58:04,680 --> 00:58:10,480
No, thank you.
I loved that.

1336
00:58:10,880 --> 00:58:16,080
Statistics, pure data.
And yes, I know, look, yes, I

1337
00:58:16,080 --> 00:58:17,520
got every single question on the
quiz wrong.

1338
00:58:17,960 --> 00:58:19,560
But you know what?
I can accept it because it's

1339
00:58:19,560 --> 00:58:21,440
rooted in data.
It's the actual experiences of

1340
00:58:21,440 --> 00:58:23,440
what people have.
What did you think?

1341
00:58:23,480 --> 00:58:25,280
Do you know what?
Just think about that very last

1342
00:58:25,280 --> 00:58:26,360
thing.
First of all, the chat.

1343
00:58:26,360 --> 00:58:28,000
The chat was amazing.
I feel I felt like we had really

1344
00:58:28,000 --> 00:58:29,520
good conversations about that
data.

1345
00:58:29,520 --> 00:58:31,680
But that very last bit there and
even, you know, you're joking

1346
00:58:31,680 --> 00:58:33,200
about getting the questions
wrong.

1347
00:58:33,600 --> 00:58:39,080
It just it just reminds me that
perceived reality, it's not all

1348
00:58:39,080 --> 00:58:40,360
you're not always right.
You know what I mean?

1349
00:58:40,360 --> 00:58:42,520
And I know you talk about the
Instagram comment, but it just,

1350
00:58:42,520 --> 00:58:46,200
it just highlights to me as even
as a teacher, I was getting this

1351
00:58:46,400 --> 00:58:47,760
teacher insight wrong.
Right?

1352
00:58:48,200 --> 00:58:51,480
When when I get mad at the
public for, for not

1353
00:58:51,480 --> 00:58:52,800
understanding teaching.
Do you know what?

1354
00:58:52,800 --> 00:58:55,160
I get it because they're so much
further removed, right?

1355
00:58:55,600 --> 00:58:57,520
Of course, that of course
they're just getting things

1356
00:58:57,520 --> 00:58:59,000
completely wrong.
They probably look at secondary

1357
00:58:59,000 --> 00:59:00,480
schools and go, yeah, behaviours
getting well, worse.

1358
00:59:00,480 --> 00:59:01,760
What is getting worse than ever
before.

1359
00:59:01,880 --> 00:59:03,800
And you know what, they could
actually be completely wrong

1360
00:59:03,800 --> 00:59:05,080
because I was clearly completely
right.

1361
00:59:05,080 --> 00:59:07,480
I was very confidently correct
with that, like in my head of

1362
00:59:07,480 --> 00:59:10,480
that first answer, like of
course secondary school pupils

1363
00:59:10,480 --> 00:59:12,920
are worst behaved.
I know they are in my heart

1364
00:59:12,920 --> 00:59:14,320
there.
But oh, no, actually, yeah, it's

1365
00:59:14,360 --> 00:59:16,440
it's it's that that's a
different reality to that.

1366
00:59:16,880 --> 00:59:19,840
So it just makes me think we
need more of this data, like if

1367
00:59:19,840 --> 00:59:24,000
we're ever going to get the
public to actually understand

1368
00:59:24,000 --> 00:59:27,240
what this job is and not hate
teachers, which seems to be

1369
00:59:27,520 --> 00:59:30,400
happening, we need more of this.
We need, we need teacher tap to

1370
00:59:30,400 --> 00:59:34,080
be out there all the time, like
presenting real data and kind of

1371
00:59:34,080 --> 00:59:36,560
doing what you did have been
like, yeah, OK, your opinions

1372
00:59:36,560 --> 00:59:38,160
are great.
But here's the truth though.

1373
00:59:38,640 --> 00:59:40,200
Like, I love your opinions.
They're really nice.

1374
00:59:40,200 --> 00:59:41,480
Thank you for having your
opinions.

1375
00:59:41,480 --> 00:59:44,080
But here's the reality.
Like this is the data.

1376
00:59:44,080 --> 00:59:45,920
This you can't actually argue
with this.

1377
00:59:46,200 --> 00:59:49,040
You can, you can argue about
what it means, but you can you

1378
00:59:49,040 --> 00:59:51,000
stop saying this data doesn't
exist though, because here it

1379
00:59:51,000 --> 00:59:51,720
is.
Look.

1380
00:59:51,960 --> 00:59:53,480
Yeah, it's, it's exactly the
same.

1381
00:59:53,480 --> 00:59:56,080
When we looked at the data of
how many hours teachers work,

1382
00:59:56,480 --> 00:59:59,040
every single excuse you've come
up with from people trying to

1383
00:59:59,040 --> 01:00:01,160
say why it's wrong, it was like,
cool.

1384
01:00:01,720 --> 01:00:03,000
It's not, though.
Yeah, yeah, yeah.

1385
01:00:03,400 --> 01:00:05,600
You can have an opinion that
that table in front of you is

1386
01:00:05,600 --> 01:00:06,240
yellow.
Yeah.

1387
01:00:06,680 --> 01:00:08,920
It's not you can't have an
opinion on on how averages work.

1388
01:00:09,440 --> 01:00:10,720
Yeah, it's just how they work.
Yeah.

1389
01:00:10,720 --> 01:00:12,320
Yeah.
I, I, I think I'm going to pick

1390
01:00:12,320 --> 01:00:15,080
up on what you said.
It's actually what Teacher Tap

1391
01:00:15,080 --> 01:00:17,880
does, which I think is super
powerful, which kind of we gloss

1392
01:00:17,880 --> 01:00:21,160
over is it?
It would allow teachers to be on

1393
01:00:21,160 --> 01:00:23,640
the same page.
Like you said, how can we expect

1394
01:00:23,640 --> 01:00:26,200
people outside of education to
have a real understanding of

1395
01:00:26,200 --> 01:00:30,160
what's going on if even within
education, teachers themselves

1396
01:00:30,160 --> 01:00:31,960
have different opinions and
think that each other are

1397
01:00:31,960 --> 01:00:34,160
already wrong.
So I think what that objective

1398
01:00:34,160 --> 01:00:38,000
data does on large scale, on a
large scale like Teach Tap is,

1399
01:00:38,480 --> 01:00:43,040
is it does just provide you with
that backbone to say, OK, look,

1400
01:00:43,120 --> 01:00:46,240
my management are doing this.
They're saying it's because of

1401
01:00:46,240 --> 01:00:47,640
that.
I disagree with that.

1402
01:00:47,880 --> 01:00:49,520
Where do we go from here?
Well, I guess I've just got to

1403
01:00:49,520 --> 01:00:51,520
do what a manager says, OK,
well, actually do you know what

1404
01:00:51,520 --> 01:00:54,720
it brings in that third party,
which is pure empirical data and

1405
01:00:54,720 --> 01:00:57,480
it says, well, do you know what
95% of schools are doing it this

1406
01:00:57,480 --> 01:00:59,560
other way.
So that's clearly OK as well.

1407
01:00:59,960 --> 01:01:02,760
So in this world of where
everyone seems to have to be

1408
01:01:02,760 --> 01:01:05,280
right or wrong on the right
politically, on the left

1409
01:01:05,280 --> 01:01:09,360
politically, I'm, I argue this,
you argue that private schools

1410
01:01:09,360 --> 01:01:12,240
should get VAT funding, should,
should get a VAT break.

1411
01:01:12,400 --> 01:01:15,280
They shouldn't.
Where it's so binary.

1412
01:01:15,960 --> 01:01:20,160
What I think this opens up is
there's been so many times as a

1413
01:01:20,160 --> 01:01:22,960
teacher where there have been
five options as to what to do.

1414
01:01:23,680 --> 01:01:25,960
And I think none of them are
wrong.

1415
01:01:26,440 --> 01:01:28,160
I think none of the options are
incorrect.

1416
01:01:28,440 --> 01:01:30,120
Yeah, sure.
We could replan this English

1417
01:01:30,120 --> 01:01:31,600
around this text.
It might be good for that

1418
01:01:31,600 --> 01:01:33,320
reason.
We could also keep the planning

1419
01:01:33,320 --> 01:01:35,720
from last year because actually
it was really good and it and it

1420
01:01:35,720 --> 01:01:38,880
hooked them on this video link
that that that was really

1421
01:01:38,880 --> 01:01:40,560
inspiring for them and we got
some really good data out of

1422
01:01:40,560 --> 01:01:42,160
that.
We could also actually just go

1423
01:01:42,160 --> 01:01:44,560
into a brand new book because
we've not done picture books in

1424
01:01:44,560 --> 01:01:46,720
a while and this picture book
could invoke that kind of

1425
01:01:47,000 --> 01:01:49,440
inference skill that we don't
get in text as much, but.

1426
01:01:49,440 --> 01:01:51,640
Which one's right, Dylan?
Which one's the right, exactly?

1427
01:01:51,680 --> 01:01:54,240
We could get some amazing data
and some amazing lessons out of

1428
01:01:54,240 --> 01:01:58,400
all of these choices.
So let's go deeper then into why

1429
01:01:58,440 --> 01:02:01,320
we're going to pick them and
what impact picking them will

1430
01:02:01,320 --> 01:02:03,040
have.
Because if we have lots of right

1431
01:02:03,040 --> 01:02:06,400
options, but one of them's going
to lead to teacher burnout and

1432
01:02:06,400 --> 01:02:08,600
the other one's going to lead to
teacher confusion because it's

1433
01:02:08,600 --> 01:02:11,240
not quite cohesive, Maybe we go
for the third option then.

1434
01:02:11,360 --> 01:02:13,760
Because actually the outcomes
are going to be just the same.

1435
01:02:14,040 --> 01:02:16,680
But the way we get there might
be a way which is better for

1436
01:02:16,680 --> 01:02:18,600
teachers and staff in general.
That's something that's been

1437
01:02:18,600 --> 01:02:20,160
lost, isn't it?
And yeah, do you know what?

1438
01:02:20,160 --> 01:02:22,520
I hope Teacher Tap carries.
I hope you guys download Teacher

1439
01:02:22,520 --> 01:02:24,240
Tap as well like you genuinely I
do it everyday.

1440
01:02:24,240 --> 01:02:27,240
It honestly takes like I'm
joking it takes a minute if

1441
01:02:27,240 --> 01:02:28,760
anything, like less.
And like you said, the most

1442
01:02:28,760 --> 01:02:30,360
powerful thing is you don't get
to see the data.

1443
01:02:30,360 --> 01:02:32,040
Yeah, I know I love looking.
So you can always look at the

1444
01:02:32,040 --> 01:02:34,040
results tab at the bottom and
see yesterday's.

1445
01:02:34,040 --> 01:02:36,480
And sometimes I'm in the
minority and but oftentimes,

1446
01:02:36,480 --> 01:02:37,960
sometimes you're wrong.
Sometimes.

1447
01:02:37,960 --> 01:02:39,320
No, not wrong, not in the
minority.

1448
01:02:39,320 --> 01:02:40,880
Thank you, Dylan, correct you
there.

1449
01:02:40,880 --> 01:02:43,160
Thank you.
Sometimes I'm in the minority

1450
01:02:43,160 --> 01:02:45,360
and it does ground me though,
because I'm like, oh, OK.

1451
01:02:45,600 --> 01:02:46,920
Because it might be a privilege.
It might be.

1452
01:02:47,160 --> 01:02:49,160
It might be that I'm saying
something like the question

1453
01:02:49,160 --> 01:02:50,480
might, you know, does this thing
happen in your school?

1454
01:02:50,480 --> 01:02:53,360
And I'm like, no, not really.
And then I realise most people

1455
01:02:53,360 --> 01:02:55,120
are saying, yes, this is a
nightmare, It happens in my

1456
01:02:55,120 --> 01:02:57,280
school and it doesn't in ours.
And I'm like, Oh yeah, I should

1457
01:02:57,280 --> 01:02:59,240
appreciate that a bit more.
And you might go on the Internet

1458
01:02:59,240 --> 01:03:00,800
and say this doesn't happen.
Yeah.

1459
01:03:00,880 --> 01:03:02,400
Yeah, exactly.
No, no, no it doesn't.

1460
01:03:02,400 --> 01:03:03,880
Happen for you.
You're the minority.

1461
01:03:04,160 --> 01:03:06,120
Yeah, because you would be wrong
to say this is this is where I'm

1462
01:03:06,120 --> 01:03:09,080
going to draw this distinction
of this comment, because the

1463
01:03:09,080 --> 01:03:12,200
comment said I don't think
teaching hasn't changed much in

1464
01:03:12,200 --> 01:03:14,560
31 years.
I think it's down to resilience

1465
01:03:14,560 --> 01:03:17,640
of people.
If he'd said something like,

1466
01:03:18,200 --> 01:03:21,080
from my point of view, what I've
done over the years hasn't

1467
01:03:21,080 --> 01:03:24,200
changed that I can't argue with
that.

1468
01:03:24,520 --> 01:03:25,880
That's fine.
Maybe for you it hasn't.

1469
01:03:26,120 --> 01:03:29,400
But to say teaching has not
changed over 31 years statement

1470
01:03:29,720 --> 01:03:31,960
is just wrong.
Yeah, it is just wrong.

1471
01:03:31,960 --> 01:03:34,560
And then he called me blinkered
for saying that we shouldn't put

1472
01:03:34,560 --> 01:03:36,560
it down to resilience.
And I was like, oh, can we not

1473
01:03:36,560 --> 01:03:40,040
see the hypocrisy here?
You saying it's not this massive

1474
01:03:40,040 --> 01:03:41,880
thing, Nothing has changed at
all.

1475
01:03:42,520 --> 01:03:44,800
So I guess, yeah, The point is
teaching has changed.

1476
01:03:45,000 --> 01:03:48,160
Your individual experience is
incredibly important, but when

1477
01:03:48,160 --> 01:03:50,360
backed up with thousands of
people we can get a wider

1478
01:03:50,360 --> 01:03:53,040
picture of the general vibe.
Yeah, definitely, definitely.

1479
01:03:53,120 --> 01:03:56,760
What I've learned is as well a
joking point now is that if we

1480
01:03:56,760 --> 01:03:59,240
want more episodes of this, just
leave really annoying comments

1481
01:03:59,240 --> 01:04:01,480
on our Instagram because Dylan
will get riled up.

1482
01:04:01,480 --> 01:04:02,920
But I'll talk about it so.
Much better.

1483
01:04:02,920 --> 01:04:07,000
It's so much better, but some
whenever people who are slightly

1484
01:04:07,000 --> 01:04:08,920
older, all the younger
generation less resilient.

1485
01:04:08,920 --> 01:04:13,360
I'm just like I just can't
resist it anyway, thank you so

1486
01:04:13,360 --> 01:04:14,520
much.
I really enjoyed that guys these

1487
01:04:14,520 --> 01:04:16,120
are leave as a review that asked
you earlier.

1488
01:04:16,120 --> 01:04:17,520
Please do it.
It really helps us I already.

1489
01:04:17,520 --> 01:04:18,920
Have Dylan.
They did it at the start.

1490
01:04:18,920 --> 01:04:20,240
Oh.
They did, they did.

1491
01:04:20,520 --> 01:04:22,120
But we can leave 2 reviews for
two kebabs.

1492
01:04:22,640 --> 01:04:25,480
So get, get, get, get a
different device.

1493
01:04:26,440 --> 01:04:27,760
Yeah, you'll get someone's
device.

1494
01:04:27,960 --> 01:04:29,560
Pick up your mum's phone or
something.

1495
01:04:29,560 --> 01:04:31,240
And order a kebab.
Or.

1496
01:04:31,760 --> 01:04:33,560
Yeah, that's what we want.
Wait, what did we want?

1497
01:04:33,600 --> 01:04:34,520
Reviews or kebabs?
Kebabs.

1498
01:04:34,800 --> 01:04:35,520
Cheers.
See.

1499
01:04:35,520 --> 01:04:36,320
You at the cabbage shop.
Bye.