Nov. 17, 2024
Ep 87: What Is A Teacher Martyr & Why Are They So Harmful To Education?
Prepare yourselves for this one...
Join us as we discuss 'teacher martyrs' - a modern term that we define early on in the episode.
It's a pretty wild ride as Hayden gets rather angry at the state of education.
Is there anything we can do or is teacher martyrdom simply too engrained in our culture?
Follow us on Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/teachsleeprepeatpodcast/
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Hello everyone, and welcome back
to another episode of Teach
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Sleep Repeat.
My name is Dylan.
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And my name is Hayden.
Quick disclaimer for this
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episode.
This episode is going to be a
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little bit unhinged because I'm
losing the will to live as a
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teacher.
How are you, Dylan?
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What a way to start.
Welcome everyone, new teachers
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alike.
I needed to say it because you
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know what?
We are going to rant in this
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episode because you're.
Very.
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Loud.
I'm not getting really angry.
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We've planned this episode and
you know what?
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It is a bit of a moaner.
It is a bit of a ranter.
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At the end, we'll try and, you
know, give some suggestions.
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We're not just moan, but this
episode is one of those episodes
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for if you are also losing the
will to live as a teacher right
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now because of the state of
teaching, then hopefully you can
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rant along with us in this
episode.
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And I just wanted to say that at
the start.
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I wanted to say something then
based on what you've just said
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that because I think you need to
calm down for a second.
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OK?
But you're absolutely right.
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And we always worry.
And I'm going to say this as my
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disclaimer.
We always worry, don't we, when
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we talk about these things.
I think we're getting over it.
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But we used to think, gosh, are
we?
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Are we being negative?
And we've had enough people tell
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us we're not now, for example,
in the last week, since we've
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chatted with Omar last week
about very specific issues that
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are quite triggering to some
people because they've gone
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through bullying in a school or
been in a toxic school.
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It's it's a sensitive subject
almost, isn't it?
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But we're talking about it
because, because we think it's
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important, because we care about
the job so much.
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And enough people have messaged
us and said, thank you for
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talking about this.
You, you are the podcast.
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Someone said this week, you
guys, this episode.
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I wish I had it in my first year
of teaching because I was in a
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toxic school.
I kind of ignored those gut
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feelings.
We talked about where you feel
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like this isn't right, but
everyone else around you just
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seems to think it is.
And that's what we're going to
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continue doing.
And we're going to talk today
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about teacher martyrdom.
And it isn't.
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It can be a touchy subject
because we are essentially
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placing some blame about the
state of education right now
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onto teachers.
Yeah.
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And we're teachers ourselves and
and we're the first people to
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defend this job and the people
who do an amazing job.
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But we have to talk about this.
Yeah, I mean, lots of our
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episodes, you know, go back and
listen to episodes where they,
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we've done loads on SLT and how
they can help and they can stop,
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you know, causing such problems
in school, the government and
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how they can help.
Do you know what this episode is
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about?
Us.
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Yeah, it is about the teachers
at the bottom and things that we
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can do to to help fix this
horribly toxic culture of
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teaching.
And yeah, specifically the
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Martin we we mentioned it with
Omar last week.
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It was a really, I mean, you
said you got, we got lots of
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nice back back section where we
just briefly touched on being a
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martyr.
Well.
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Everyone can think of 1, can't
they?
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Everyone can think of what we're
saying whilst we're doing our
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introduction.
Just have a think.
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What's martyrdom to you?
What does it look like?
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And we'll tell you what we think
it is.
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But let's just chill out for 5
minutes, have a little catch up,
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we'll play the Jingle and then
yeah, guys, stick around because
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we're going to really, really
dive into this and I'm really
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interested to hear what people
have to say about it as well.
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Hayden, let's breathe.
I'm breathing.
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And I want to know how your week
was, because for anyone who's
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new listener, we are primary
school teachers, we work in
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school.
How's it going?
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Yeah, it's, you know, it's been
a very normal nice week up until
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yesterday in which we had
parents evening and now I'm not
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one to hate parents evening.
No, it can be a little bit like
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a long, it's a long old day
because our school, I mean,
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we've probably mentioned it
before, but our school, if this
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is different, we do, we do a
really long one parenting.
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We are at school till nine
o'clock 9:00 PM.
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So it's an incredibly long day,
but we get it all done in one
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go.
So we had that yesterday and
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we're recording on a Thursday.
You guys have seen this on a
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Monday, But yeah, parents
evening, I'd say for the first
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time ever, right?
Every single appointment I had
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was extremely positive.
I didn't.
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There was absolutely nothing
because there's normally at
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least one conversation.
It's a little bit awkward, a
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little bit difficult.
You kind of want to say
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something and the parent maybe
disagrees, like, oh, no, my
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child doesn't lie.
And I'm like, oh, they do, you
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know, you have those awkward
conversations.
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But last night.
But it just went so smoothly.
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It was lovely.
Every conversation was
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constructive and it was
brilliant, so actually I had a
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really nice time.
So people listening like hear
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that and say, Oh, my parents
even didn't go like that.
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Would you?
So are you putting that down to
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chance?
Are you putting that down to the
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fact you're quite experienced
now you can handle the
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situations and and do you think
you're better at framing
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difficult conversations in a way
where it's still positive?
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Or do you think it's kind of out
of your control?
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And you know, some parents are
just going to have be really
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awkward no matter how
experienced you are.
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And you know, you shouldn't
blame yourself hearing you say
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how amazing.
I think it was 80% luck,
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genuinely 80% and complete luck,
that I just happened to have
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loads of really mature parents
who were reflective and were
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able to take criticisms.
So did you, were you still, so I
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know you said it's positive,
Were you still negative in in
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terms of did you still say
things that aren't necessarily
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nice?
Things.
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Yeah, yeah, absolutely.
I don't have 32 angels in my
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class who where I couldn't say a
possible bad thing about them.
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Do you know what I mean?
I had lots of conversations
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where I was saying negative
things about their children in
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terms of our saying things like
when the conversation comes to
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mind, oh, you know, your child
has been behaving a lot
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recently, been sent out of
class, those of times.
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Let's get to the bottom of this.
So I do think there is an
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element of you can word it in a
certain way that doesn't get
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someones back up.
Yeah.
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You know, the whole positive
sandwich approach.
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Yeah.
I knew going into that
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conversation the first thing I
was going to say was not, oh,
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your child is getting sent out
all the time.
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Sure.
You know, it was actually, we're
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really fond of your child.
We love this about them.
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They've got a really funny
personality.
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We love it when they get
involved in class, they do all
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these things in discussion,
blah, blah, blah.
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But unfortunately I don't know
what's going on.
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But they've been set out five
times this week and that's a
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really difficult thing because
obviously they're not following
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our behaviour policy.
Are you seeing it at home?
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And we quite often make it a
discussion rather than I'm
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telling you off as a parent.
I think that's a mistake I made
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earlier on in my career, which
is you just kind of go in
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straight for the conflict.
It's like they don't want that.
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This is a collective.
Experience, and you don't want
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that either.
No, absolutely not.
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But it is luck because I have
had previous years where I'm
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just as experienced really.
And in terms of my understanding
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of how to run a parents evening
where you just, there's nothing
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you can say or do, it's going to
turn into some sort of conflict
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and be awkward.
So I was very lucky this year
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that that it didn't go that way
with anybody.
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How was your parents evening?
It was good.
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My sorts of parents evening are
always twofold where in the
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build up I'm like, oh God, and
I'm interested in what people
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think because I put a story up
about the fact ours is until
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9:00 PM.
It is normal for us at this
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point.
That's just what we do.
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But we do have votes as well
that multiple times across the
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years we've had votes where it's
been asked, would you rather do
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one very long parents evening
all the way up until 9:00 PM or
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split it across 2 days and go to
six, 630, something like that.
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And once I said that to people
on Instagram, by the way, you
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can follow us at TCP Podcast.
Once I'd said that on Instagram,
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people have messaged saying 9:00
PM.
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That's disgraceful.
A lot of them changed their mind
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and said, oh, do you know what?
I might have preferred actually
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staying until 9:00 PM rather
than having to go until 6 for
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two nights in a row.
I, I think my, my, my view on
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parents evening is there's no
good option in terms of your
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time and how stressed out you
are and how, how burnt out you
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might feel.
But what I will say is I think
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parents evening is amazing.
Like I think it's so vital, so
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important and I really enjoy it.
Like when I'm in parents evening
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doing it, I think it's ace.
I love it.
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The only the only qualm we can
have is the fact that we
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basically fit 2 working days
into one day.
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Yeah, like it should replace it
in my opinion.
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You know, when schools like
start parents living at half 12
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and the, the, the kids are doing
like maybe some PPA or they're
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outside of class or something,
But then part of your day, at
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least of what you would have
done teaching is now doing
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because it's a job.
Right.
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It's a bit odd tacked on, isn't
it?
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Yeah, Evening.
It's like by default it already
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sounds terrible to me.
Yeah, an evening.
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Sorry I'm not in the evening as
well.
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Do you know what?
I know why and I agree with it
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because some parents work.
I had parents who could only
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come at like 8:00 PM and they
were really grateful.
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The fact we do a late 1.
So so absolutely I get there are
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pros and cons.
I'm not suggesting there's one
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right or one wrong way.
But my point here is I guess
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overall it's I I love it.
I like putting a face of the
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children to the face of their
adult and knowing who they are
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and you might cross their path
on the playground and kindly be
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like, oh, you think he's dad?
And now I know for sure and it
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can be really clear.
There's always so many
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similarities.
I said so yesterday and I was
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like, oh, that was weird.
Hayden, why did you say that?
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In my head I was thinking, why
did why did you say that?
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So that was just weird.
The parent came in and that kid,
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I love that.
That kid is so nice.
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Like one of like just so lovely.
And then the parent came in and
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was sort of, we were having a
bit of a joke when they came in,
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when they laughed, I went, you
laughed just like named her
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child.
And I was like, that sounds kind
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of creepy.
Actually.
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She sort of went, oh, I was
thinking, oh man, why?
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Would I say?
But it just reminded me, like
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every parent sits down and I'm
like, Oh my God, like children
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are sponges.
They just speak like they're
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into.
It's the intonation when I hear
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someone speak and I'm like, oh,
your child speaks exactly like
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that.
They sound like.
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You don't you find now that
we're parents, like probably our
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first full year, I guess as
being parents in school now
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they're growing up as well and
our children are getting a
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little bit of a personality.
Yeah.
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Don't you find I found last
night was the first time at
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Parents evening where I really,
really consciously saw I'd love
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to hear this about my child and
I really want to hear about my
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child when Rory ends up having
parents evenings and stuff.
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And my favourite part of parents
evening genuinely is making the
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00:08:50,960 --> 00:08:53,880
parents proud of their child and
telling them all the really cool
224
00:08:53,880 --> 00:08:55,840
stuff they do.
And as teachers, I think it's
225
00:08:55,840 --> 00:08:59,160
our job to find that and tell
the parents, you know, we see
226
00:08:59,160 --> 00:09:00,640
you.
And my favourite part last
227
00:09:00,640 --> 00:09:03,480
night, a few parents said this
and it it fills you with
228
00:09:03,720 --> 00:09:04,840
happiness.
There's two things.
229
00:09:04,840 --> 00:09:07,720
One was they say things like we
never have an issue.
230
00:09:07,720 --> 00:09:10,240
They love going to school.
I'm like, as a teacher, when you
231
00:09:10,240 --> 00:09:12,560
hear that, I think I'm doing my
job.
232
00:09:12,840 --> 00:09:14,560
You know what?
I don't care if they come home
233
00:09:14,560 --> 00:09:16,160
and tell you what preposition
is, don't care.
234
00:09:16,520 --> 00:09:18,560
But the fact, the fact they're
excited and happy to go into
235
00:09:18,560 --> 00:09:20,160
school, I'm like, that's so
heartwarming.
236
00:09:20,440 --> 00:09:23,680
And the other thing was we had
multiple parents say after Amy
237
00:09:23,680 --> 00:09:27,120
and I taught Amy to my job show
and the parent would say, oh, do
238
00:09:27,120 --> 00:09:29,000
you know what?
That that fills me with pride.
239
00:09:29,000 --> 00:09:31,920
And I'm happy that you see that
part of my kid.
240
00:09:32,320 --> 00:09:33,760
So they they and they're very
honest.
241
00:09:33,760 --> 00:09:35,840
They were saying, oh, do you
know, sometimes we worry because
242
00:09:36,160 --> 00:09:38,800
the child might be a bit full on
or a bit like, you know, a bit
243
00:09:38,800 --> 00:09:40,320
much.
And in the education
244
00:09:40,320 --> 00:09:42,440
environment, the parents think,
oh God, maybe the teacher will
245
00:09:42,440 --> 00:09:45,640
get annoyed or yeah, yeah.
And and they were just so happy
246
00:09:45,640 --> 00:09:48,840
that from what Amy and I had
said, they felt like we saw
247
00:09:48,880 --> 00:09:51,160
their child and we could see
them as an individual and really
248
00:09:51,160 --> 00:09:52,640
appreciate them as an
individual.
249
00:09:53,000 --> 00:09:54,640
And the parents being happy with
that.
250
00:09:54,640 --> 00:09:56,600
I was like, OK, again, that I've
done my job.
251
00:09:56,920 --> 00:10:00,240
I see the individual child and
everyone and the parents really
252
00:10:00,240 --> 00:10:02,240
appreciate that.
And they were so nice and happy.
253
00:10:02,240 --> 00:10:04,960
And I was like, OK, this, This
is why parents evenings really
254
00:10:04,960 --> 00:10:06,760
cool.
We set ourselves on that right
255
00:10:06,760 --> 00:10:08,240
foot.
Yeah. 100%, that's really nice.
256
00:10:08,240 --> 00:10:09,560
I had a few of those experiences
as well.
257
00:10:09,840 --> 00:10:13,000
How many of those parents after
saying that, then looked at your
258
00:10:13,000 --> 00:10:16,640
displays and said, but it's a
shame because actually you're
259
00:10:16,640 --> 00:10:19,840
clearly and actually a terrible
teacher because I tell you what,
260
00:10:19,840 --> 00:10:22,600
the environment does not look as
good as I've seen on Pinterest.
261
00:10:23,080 --> 00:10:24,960
How many of them did that?
Yeah.
262
00:10:24,960 --> 00:10:26,280
Oh, none of them.
Because you know what?
263
00:10:26,280 --> 00:10:28,000
No one cares about it.
No one cares.
264
00:10:28,000 --> 00:10:29,960
They just care that their child
is valued and loved.
265
00:10:29,960 --> 00:10:31,120
That's what makes a good
teacher.
266
00:10:31,280 --> 00:10:33,760
And I'm already, I'm not going
to rent yet, but I'm already
267
00:10:33,760 --> 00:10:35,840
getting into.
I'm just, I'm so I'm just really
268
00:10:35,840 --> 00:10:37,880
annoyed at the moment.
And I think I feel like you feel
269
00:10:37,880 --> 00:10:39,760
the same as well I do.
Maybe you're trying to hold back
270
00:10:39,760 --> 00:10:41,480
a bit, but we'll talk about it
in a minute.
271
00:10:41,480 --> 00:10:43,320
But I tell you what, before we
do, because I know you've got
272
00:10:43,320 --> 00:10:45,000
some, I think you've had some
funny things happen this week.
273
00:10:45,000 --> 00:10:47,480
I want you to tell some stories,
lighten the mood a little bit
274
00:10:47,640 --> 00:10:50,320
before I spend 45 minutes going
off on one.
275
00:10:50,520 --> 00:10:53,960
Well, one thing I was going to
start by saying is we're reading
276
00:10:53,960 --> 00:10:56,360
Varjak Paul and every single
time we're reading this on the
277
00:10:56,360 --> 00:10:58,360
podcast, I just feel like I need
to talk about it.
278
00:10:58,720 --> 00:11:00,200
OK?
Because SF Saeed, who's the
279
00:11:00,200 --> 00:11:02,800
author, he's I've seen
interviews with him.
280
00:11:02,800 --> 00:11:06,360
He he just comes across as such
a lovely guy and he just loves
281
00:11:06,360 --> 00:11:07,760
writing.
And he's like one of them people
282
00:11:07,760 --> 00:11:09,480
who said everyone's a writer,
everyone's a reader.
283
00:11:09,480 --> 00:11:10,840
If you're a reader, you're a
writer, you can do it.
284
00:11:10,920 --> 00:11:13,560
It's just quite inspiring
listening to talk and when you
285
00:11:13,560 --> 00:11:17,120
read his book, their kids love
it and it's still link, link to
286
00:11:17,120 --> 00:11:18,880
what we're saying.
Again, what do we really care
287
00:11:18,880 --> 00:11:19,840
about?
It's those moments for the
288
00:11:19,840 --> 00:11:21,640
children that's the most
unbelievable part of it.
289
00:11:22,000 --> 00:11:24,480
And again at Parents Evening,
sometimes the children came with
290
00:11:24,480 --> 00:11:28,000
them and multiple times the
children would say, I love
291
00:11:28,000 --> 00:11:31,640
Vajpay and OK, cool, this is
what matters.
292
00:11:31,640 --> 00:11:34,640
Reading really good text with
your children, engaging them,
293
00:11:34,640 --> 00:11:37,680
getting them to enjoy a story.
And do you know what it's it's a
294
00:11:37,680 --> 00:11:40,320
story that a lot of them with
independent reading wouldn't be
295
00:11:40,320 --> 00:11:43,120
able to access properly.
And there's those children who I
296
00:11:43,120 --> 00:11:46,480
know wouldn't access this book
are getting so much out of as
297
00:11:46,480 --> 00:11:49,080
just cordoning off some time to
read the story.
298
00:11:49,360 --> 00:11:51,280
Can I say something cool because
you don't know this, but our
299
00:11:51,280 --> 00:11:53,280
school recently, it's good for
the listeners as well to know
300
00:11:53,280 --> 00:11:54,560
you can reflect on this with
your school.
301
00:11:54,840 --> 00:11:57,600
But our school recently has made
big changes to English and we
302
00:11:57,600 --> 00:12:00,800
have really scrapped massively
those kind of lessons where you
303
00:12:00,800 --> 00:12:02,840
just go over test style
techniques all the time for
304
00:12:02,840 --> 00:12:04,120
reading, like reading
comprehension tests.
305
00:12:04,120 --> 00:12:05,240
This is how you get 2 marks in
these.
306
00:12:05,360 --> 00:12:07,840
Yeah.
We've really just just streamed
307
00:12:07,840 --> 00:12:09,280
back on that because that's
gonna come.
308
00:12:09,360 --> 00:12:09,960
Yeah.
Do you know what?
309
00:12:09,960 --> 00:12:11,400
We'll do a little bit of that
every now and then because
310
00:12:11,400 --> 00:12:13,680
actually familiarising the kids
of the test is probably sensible
311
00:12:13,680 --> 00:12:16,320
and like, yeah, whatever.
But we've really taken it back
312
00:12:16,320 --> 00:12:19,120
and replaced it with, should we
just read really, really good
313
00:12:19,120 --> 00:12:20,080
books though?
Like really.
314
00:12:20,080 --> 00:12:22,320
And just, And actually, like you
said, cordon off time to read
315
00:12:22,320 --> 00:12:24,680
really good books all the time
and see if we can get the kids
316
00:12:24,680 --> 00:12:27,400
passionate about reading so that
they go home and books that they
317
00:12:27,400 --> 00:12:29,360
like and read.
And that's what our school been
318
00:12:29,360 --> 00:12:32,120
doing for a couple of terms now.
And I know that our SLT were a
319
00:12:32,120 --> 00:12:35,200
little bit panicked because they
were obviously rightfully
320
00:12:35,200 --> 00:12:37,000
nervous.
Like, oh, we have just cut back
321
00:12:37,000 --> 00:12:39,680
tonnes of this test style stuff.
And we do get judged on tests
322
00:12:39,680 --> 00:12:40,840
though.
So I'm a bit worried about this.
323
00:12:41,320 --> 00:12:45,280
We had our autumn, autumn data
come through and our highest
324
00:12:45,280 --> 00:12:47,800
across all four year groups in
years, above average and
325
00:12:47,800 --> 00:12:49,920
everything where before we're
typically a little bit below
326
00:12:49,920 --> 00:12:52,560
average across like a
particular, it's not national,
327
00:12:52,560 --> 00:12:53,800
but it's like a big group that
we yeah.
328
00:12:53,800 --> 00:12:56,320
Sure.
Called Pixel and I could just
329
00:12:56,320 --> 00:13:01,520
see the relief on our SLTS face
and they're like OK, maybe maybe
330
00:13:01,560 --> 00:13:03,800
this maybe this is OK.
And I was so pleased because I,
331
00:13:03,840 --> 00:13:06,560
I would have been gutted if if
it wasn't that and they started
332
00:13:06,560 --> 00:13:08,520
then justifying or maybe we
should go back to just doing
333
00:13:08,520 --> 00:13:10,320
loads of test style.
Stuff do a teacher waggle and
334
00:13:10,320 --> 00:13:11,760
then do some questions from the
teacher waggle which.
335
00:13:11,800 --> 00:13:13,880
You've written as a teacher, I
thought you don't know that yet
336
00:13:13,880 --> 00:13:15,800
and I thought you'd be pleased.
That's weird that the kids it is
337
00:13:15,800 --> 00:13:17,800
working kids just enjoying
reading.
338
00:13:17,800 --> 00:13:20,280
Really simple model.
Read good books and get them to
339
00:13:20,280 --> 00:13:23,480
enjoy it and talk about it is
actually helping them read.
340
00:13:23,560 --> 00:13:24,760
Yeah.
Yeah, I completely agree,
341
00:13:24,760 --> 00:13:26,280
Completely agree.
And I just wanted to say that to
342
00:13:26,280 --> 00:13:29,320
people out there, like, don't
dismiss that time.
343
00:13:29,520 --> 00:13:31,160
Don't be convinced by the
people.
344
00:13:31,200 --> 00:13:33,000
And a big part of what we're
going to talk about later is
345
00:13:33,000 --> 00:13:35,880
you're a professional person.
I'm a professional teacher.
346
00:13:35,880 --> 00:13:39,040
I've done it for 10 years.
OK, leave me alone. 9.
347
00:13:39,680 --> 00:13:41,640
Is it 9?
You're you always think you're
348
00:13:41,640 --> 00:13:42,080
me.
I'm.
349
00:13:43,360 --> 00:13:44,600
I've said decade for the whole
year.
350
00:13:45,280 --> 00:13:47,520
I know I like decade.
I'm going to stick with decade.
351
00:13:47,640 --> 00:13:48,720
I'm going to count my training
here.
352
00:13:48,720 --> 00:13:49,560
I was teaching.
All right.
353
00:13:50,160 --> 00:13:51,680
So yeah, I've been teaching for
a decade.
354
00:13:51,960 --> 00:13:54,560
Sounds so good a decade.
Doesn't it look like leave me
355
00:13:54,560 --> 00:13:56,080
alone?
Like don't come up to me and
356
00:13:56,080 --> 00:13:57,560
tell me, Oh no, you shouldn't be
reading that book.
357
00:13:57,560 --> 00:13:58,560
Actually, you should be doing
this.
358
00:13:58,840 --> 00:14:00,680
Leave me alone.
Like I'm just going, do you know
359
00:14:00,680 --> 00:14:02,360
what I'm going to do?
Because it's the most important
360
00:14:02,360 --> 00:14:04,320
part of the job in these six
hours.
361
00:14:04,320 --> 00:14:06,520
I'm with these kids.
These kids are going to bloody
362
00:14:06,520 --> 00:14:09,040
love school and they're going to
really enjoy being here and
363
00:14:09,040 --> 00:14:10,760
they're going to be engaged in
what they're doing.
364
00:14:11,160 --> 00:14:13,160
Leave me alone.
Don't don't tell me what
365
00:14:13,160 --> 00:14:14,760
honestly, honestly, I don't
care.
366
00:14:14,760 --> 00:14:17,040
I don't care at this point.
I'm just like, we can have a
367
00:14:17,040 --> 00:14:19,800
discussion about like which what
you think is better and stuff,
368
00:14:19,800 --> 00:14:22,480
right?
But you're not always right, you
369
00:14:22,760 --> 00:14:24,280
know, just because you're
outside of the classroom
370
00:14:24,280 --> 00:14:25,160
forever.
Yeah, yeah.
371
00:14:25,160 --> 00:14:27,440
But you're not all.
I get that you're in some
372
00:14:27,440 --> 00:14:28,920
position maybe.
So do you think there's any?
373
00:14:28,920 --> 00:14:31,120
Because what you're saying to me
sounds like everyone did.
374
00:14:31,120 --> 00:14:32,560
If everyone acted like you,
they'd be anarchy.
375
00:14:32,560 --> 00:14:34,840
No one would follow any.
We're all doing exactly what we
376
00:14:34,840 --> 00:14:35,360
want.
I'm a mass.
377
00:14:35,400 --> 00:14:37,320
Lead and we put say use White
Rose.
378
00:14:37,840 --> 00:14:39,800
Don't get me wrong.
What I'm saying is if I went
379
00:14:39,800 --> 00:14:43,680
into a room and someone within a
lesson had decided today they're
380
00:14:43,680 --> 00:14:44,800
not going to do a White Rose
small step.
381
00:14:44,800 --> 00:14:46,920
They're going to do an
investigation where the children
382
00:14:46,920 --> 00:14:49,080
are looking at all possibilities
and they've got some printed out
383
00:14:49,080 --> 00:14:50,160
ice creams that they're looking
at.
384
00:14:50,520 --> 00:14:53,680
I'm not going to say to that
teacher, oh, but we did all
385
00:14:53,680 --> 00:14:55,320
agree that we're doing White
Rose all the way through.
386
00:14:55,320 --> 00:14:57,200
When the kids are enjoying.
It Yeah, the kids are loving it,
387
00:14:57,200 --> 00:14:59,040
they're engaged, they're doing
maths, they're learning stuff,
388
00:14:59,040 --> 00:15:00,280
right?
There's not one way to learn
389
00:15:00,280 --> 00:15:02,400
stuff is my point.
If you come in and we're all
390
00:15:02,400 --> 00:15:04,920
reading Vajatpur and you stay
for 10 minutes and we're just
391
00:15:04,920 --> 00:15:08,600
reading a chapter and I've not
asked the leading question in 2
392
00:15:08,600 --> 00:15:12,840
minutes, So what is my point?
But those micromanaging is what
393
00:15:12,840 --> 00:15:13,360
I'm talking.
Sure.
394
00:15:13,600 --> 00:15:15,280
The the you know, I've been told
to teach.
395
00:15:15,280 --> 00:15:16,440
Watch out for.
Yeah.
396
00:15:16,440 --> 00:15:18,720
So obviously I'm not talking
about I'm gonna do whatever I
397
00:15:18,720 --> 00:15:19,400
want all the time.
Yeah.
398
00:15:19,640 --> 00:15:22,120
I'm saying within the confines
of a classroom as a
399
00:15:22,120 --> 00:15:23,760
professional.
But I said we're just gonna read
400
00:15:23,760 --> 00:15:25,720
a book for 20 minutes.
Yeah, we're just gonna read a
401
00:15:25,720 --> 00:15:27,680
book for 20 minutes.
OK, so scenario then the kid,
402
00:15:27,840 --> 00:15:30,720
it's 2 hour afternoon, yeah,
you're one hour 45 minutes into
403
00:15:30,720 --> 00:15:31,840
it.
The kids are are bored and
404
00:15:31,840 --> 00:15:33,560
knackered at this point, right.
You've been doing, I don't know,
405
00:15:33,560 --> 00:15:34,800
some geography and then they're
just.
406
00:15:34,800 --> 00:15:37,240
Always geography.
I'm sorry, John, it's.
407
00:15:37,600 --> 00:15:39,920
Just such a boring subject.
I'm really sorry.
408
00:15:40,120 --> 00:15:41,320
I'm really sorry, John.
We're.
409
00:15:41,320 --> 00:15:43,360
Going to get some pushback here.
I'm joking.
410
00:15:43,600 --> 00:15:45,040
It's not a boring subject, but
it can be.
411
00:15:45,040 --> 00:15:46,720
It can be, depending how you
teach them what you're teaching
412
00:15:46,720 --> 00:15:47,560
do.
You want to do 2 hours on
413
00:15:47,560 --> 00:15:50,520
latitude.
Not longitude on latitude, just
414
00:15:50,520 --> 00:15:51,560
latitude.
Because we'll do 2 hours of
415
00:15:51,560 --> 00:15:52,440
longitude exactly.
And you?
416
00:15:52,640 --> 00:15:53,760
Know what?
And you as a teacher, as a
417
00:15:53,760 --> 00:15:56,680
professional, like you said,
who's nine years in as a notice,
418
00:15:57,640 --> 00:15:59,880
notice that the kids are
flagging, they're bored of this
419
00:15:59,880 --> 00:16:01,080
now.
And you've got this one last
420
00:16:01,080 --> 00:16:02,840
task that you could do.
They've done an hour and 45
421
00:16:02,840 --> 00:16:05,920
minutes of it and you decide,
you know what, just not gonna do
422
00:16:05,920 --> 00:16:06,960
it?
School policies that you gotta
423
00:16:06,960 --> 00:16:08,000
finish it, you gotta finish
that.
424
00:16:08,000 --> 00:16:10,080
They gotta have this, they gotta
have that self reflection at the
425
00:16:10,080 --> 00:16:11,800
end or whatever it's.
Because if they didn't write it
426
00:16:11,800 --> 00:16:13,360
down, they didn't possibly learn
it for an hour.
427
00:16:13,360 --> 00:16:15,280
And 45, you go now I'm gonna
read the book.
428
00:16:15,280 --> 00:16:17,360
So you're saying in that
scenario of an SLT can leave in
429
00:16:17,360 --> 00:16:19,720
it and goes, no, don't be doing
that, you need to be.
430
00:16:19,720 --> 00:16:20,960
They haven't done their self
reflection.
431
00:16:20,960 --> 00:16:23,240
I can see they've done this hour
and 45 minutes of work, but they
432
00:16:23,240 --> 00:16:25,080
haven't done this bit and that's
the policy to finish that you'd
433
00:16:25,080 --> 00:16:27,000
be like.
Yeah, I would say, look, I'm a
434
00:16:27,000 --> 00:16:29,040
professional.
Here are my reasons for doing
435
00:16:29,040 --> 00:16:31,480
it.
OK, accept them, please, because
436
00:16:31,480 --> 00:16:34,880
I'm not some player, but off the
street, like on a genuinely like
437
00:16:34,880 --> 00:16:37,240
if you've picked up a profession
off the street in a different
438
00:16:37,240 --> 00:16:39,800
career who's well switched on, I
think they could probably
439
00:16:39,800 --> 00:16:40,840
deliver a lesson you plan for
them.
440
00:16:40,840 --> 00:16:42,280
It wouldn't be the best thing in
the world, but they could
441
00:16:42,280 --> 00:16:43,920
probably go through slides and
be like, oh, I've got to do this
442
00:16:43,920 --> 00:16:44,600
next.
Got to do this.
443
00:16:44,640 --> 00:16:47,040
Yeah, formulaic, formulaic,
clunky.
444
00:16:47,040 --> 00:16:49,560
Fine, they'd get through through
it, but that's not what I am.
445
00:16:49,560 --> 00:16:51,240
I'm a teacher, so leave me
alone.
446
00:16:51,440 --> 00:16:53,920
I'm going to read to the kids
now because they want to listen
447
00:16:53,920 --> 00:16:56,080
to the rest of the story.
They're going to be inspired by
448
00:16:56,080 --> 00:16:57,120
it.
They're going to maybe make them
449
00:16:57,120 --> 00:16:59,240
pick up the next book.
The amount of children last year
450
00:16:59,240 --> 00:17:01,520
who came back and had the second
Vajrac Paul book because we
451
00:17:01,520 --> 00:17:02,920
wrote the first one that was
never have happened.
452
00:17:03,360 --> 00:17:06,480
You know what all I'm saying is
on these micromanaging parts of
453
00:17:06,480 --> 00:17:08,200
it, just let me do it.
I'm going to finish off with a
454
00:17:08,200 --> 00:17:10,440
really quick story.
It's it's really heart warming.
455
00:17:10,520 --> 00:17:14,000
It's it's quite funny and it's
one of my favourite stories to
456
00:17:14,000 --> 00:17:16,520
come out of teaching.
Recently, we were doing English.
457
00:17:16,520 --> 00:17:19,640
We were looking at root words.
OK, so we, we were given a word
458
00:17:19,640 --> 00:17:22,119
and we were discussing with the
children how you can add a
459
00:17:22,119 --> 00:17:24,640
suffix to the end of a word, how
you can add a prefix.
460
00:17:24,920 --> 00:17:28,119
And the idea that from one word,
if we learn that spelling, we
461
00:17:28,119 --> 00:17:29,720
can kind of learn lots of
spellings from it.
462
00:17:30,000 --> 00:17:32,840
So we're doing Ed for past
tense, we're doing ING.
463
00:17:33,040 --> 00:17:34,720
We're thinking about how that
might change the spending of the
464
00:17:34,720 --> 00:17:36,600
word, etcetera.
So we're putting it all into one
465
00:17:36,720 --> 00:17:39,640
kind of lesson now.
And for example, we'd give them
466
00:17:39,640 --> 00:17:42,680
the word like and then the
children around like would have
467
00:17:42,680 --> 00:17:44,760
to write all the words they can
think of with that root word
468
00:17:45,000 --> 00:17:48,120
liking, liked, likes and then
dislike.
469
00:17:48,480 --> 00:17:51,360
And we kind of realised after a
few together that it's harder to
470
00:17:51,360 --> 00:17:54,240
think of a prefix than it is a
suffix because we're doing loads
471
00:17:54,240 --> 00:17:56,880
of spelling rules, so and they
tend to be suffixes in general.
472
00:17:57,240 --> 00:18:00,000
So I was saying to the children,
OK, look on this next one, I
473
00:18:00,000 --> 00:18:03,000
want you to really think hard.
Can you think of a prefix,
474
00:18:03,000 --> 00:18:05,080
something to go before OK,
right.
475
00:18:05,520 --> 00:18:08,720
The next word is appear.
And again, that's a good one
476
00:18:08,720 --> 00:18:11,440
because you've got loads that go
in the end appearing appeared
477
00:18:11,800 --> 00:18:15,000
like appears.
But this to me, I thought quite
478
00:18:15,000 --> 00:18:17,640
a very obvious prefix
disappeared.
479
00:18:17,840 --> 00:18:19,480
So I thought loads of children,
I think of that.
480
00:18:19,480 --> 00:18:20,880
That's great.
So they were writing stuff down.
481
00:18:20,880 --> 00:18:24,280
I was going around the room and
I went back to the front and I
482
00:18:24,280 --> 00:18:27,280
said, OK, I've seen loads of
words, lots of suffixes still,
483
00:18:27,280 --> 00:18:31,040
but can anyone think of a prefix
for appear?
484
00:18:31,560 --> 00:18:32,680
And there wasn't that many hands
up.
485
00:18:32,680 --> 00:18:34,360
They were really just thinking
about I was like, God, I really
486
00:18:34,400 --> 00:18:36,920
thought someone would get this
appear And one of my children at
487
00:18:36,920 --> 00:18:40,480
the front, his kind of eyes lit
up and his his hand shot up
488
00:18:40,480 --> 00:18:41,840
straight away.
And I was like, yes, cool.
489
00:18:42,280 --> 00:18:44,360
And he went, I know, I know.
And I yes, what do you think?
490
00:18:44,360 --> 00:18:46,920
What's your prefix for appear?
What's your new word?
491
00:18:47,080 --> 00:18:52,800
And he went on a matter appear.
He's like reappear or something
492
00:18:52,800 --> 00:18:55,360
like different like Oh well done
automatic is.
493
00:18:56,160 --> 00:18:59,400
Like, Oh my God, that is 10 out
of 10.
494
00:18:59,520 --> 00:19:02,800
Unbelievable.
Like even no automatic.
495
00:19:02,800 --> 00:19:05,280
I was like, you thought you've
gone back to time 1 when we did
496
00:19:05,280 --> 00:19:08,000
poetry and we, we, we talked
about automatic beer and he was
497
00:19:08,000 --> 00:19:11,040
so, so impressed with himself.
And I was like, mate, I
498
00:19:11,040 --> 00:19:13,440
honestly, I laughed and he
laughed and then we all thought
499
00:19:13,440 --> 00:19:15,600
it was funny.
And I went, I said to him, that
500
00:19:15,600 --> 00:19:19,120
is an unbelievable answer.
I was like, that is such a good
501
00:19:19,120 --> 00:19:21,280
answer because you know what?
It has the sound of appear at
502
00:19:21,280 --> 00:19:23,120
the end, doesn't it?
And you've put in the front on a
503
00:19:23,120 --> 00:19:25,080
mat.
I was like, Oh my God, it's so
504
00:19:25,080 --> 00:19:27,080
good.
I got to explain to him the
505
00:19:27,080 --> 00:19:29,960
spelling was off, but Oh my God,
it cracked me up so much.
506
00:19:29,960 --> 00:19:31,280
I just wasn't expecting it.
Yeah.
507
00:19:31,400 --> 00:19:34,800
And my TA was doing something
else, so I just said, oh, miss,
508
00:19:34,840 --> 00:19:37,320
and we've got a really good idea
here for a beer.
509
00:19:37,680 --> 00:19:39,240
She was like, oh, yeah.
And I was like, yeah, someone
510
00:19:39,240 --> 00:19:42,480
said on a mat appear, she was
just like, cracking up as well.
511
00:19:42,720 --> 00:19:44,320
But the kid, like, absolutely
loved it.
512
00:19:44,560 --> 00:19:45,920
He could tell.
Do you know when children pick
513
00:19:45,920 --> 00:19:47,320
up something's funny?
Yeah.
514
00:19:47,480 --> 00:19:49,040
And they know it's made you
laugh in a good way.
515
00:19:49,040 --> 00:19:50,360
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
That's all he said.
516
00:19:50,360 --> 00:19:51,720
For the rest, I.
Was gonna say did he just keep
517
00:19:51,720 --> 00:19:53,240
saying Oh yeah, remember,
remember, Yeah.
518
00:19:53,240 --> 00:19:55,280
Do you remember that from 10
seconds ago on about the pier
519
00:19:55,280 --> 00:19:56,200
though?
That's funny, wasn't it, Sir?
520
00:19:56,200 --> 00:19:57,880
The.
Kid next to him.
521
00:19:57,880 --> 00:19:59,680
You've seen that I'd laughed
because it was nonsense.
522
00:20:00,080 --> 00:20:01,520
He started going I've got one,
I've got one.
523
00:20:01,680 --> 00:20:02,760
Hello.
Appear I was.
524
00:20:03,280 --> 00:20:05,600
Like no ruined it.
Just say.
525
00:20:08,520 --> 00:20:11,440
Yeah, they have to just jump in
there, try and get some still
526
00:20:11,480 --> 00:20:13,920
some of the limelight.
So on a matter beer that's
527
00:20:13,920 --> 00:20:18,040
pretty new spelling and an
APPEAR much easier to remember.
528
00:20:18,160 --> 00:20:20,680
I presume you didn't then go and
model how to spell that word on
529
00:20:20,680 --> 00:20:22,280
the board, so it is impossible
to spell.
530
00:20:22,560 --> 00:20:25,360
No, I was like on a matter put
the vowels on some kind of.
531
00:20:25,360 --> 00:20:26,720
Order.
It just smells exactly how we
532
00:20:26,720 --> 00:20:28,000
said it.
Yeah, you're right, actually.
533
00:20:28,000 --> 00:20:29,680
You know what, kid?
Actually, kid, you're right.
534
00:20:31,120 --> 00:20:34,080
Because I don't know.
Well, it's just honestly, I, I,
535
00:20:34,240 --> 00:20:35,600
I was like, that's the story I'm
gonna remember.
536
00:20:35,600 --> 00:20:36,360
Forever.
Yeah, they never.
537
00:20:36,360 --> 00:20:38,960
One of them failed to amaze
them, if you ask me, like, what
538
00:20:38,960 --> 00:20:39,760
do you think?
What prefix?
539
00:20:39,760 --> 00:20:42,440
I never in a million years would
have guessed on a matter.
540
00:20:42,520 --> 00:20:43,160
Never.
I would have.
541
00:20:43,160 --> 00:20:45,000
I was literally thinking like
this real.
542
00:20:45,000 --> 00:20:46,120
I was not that many.
Years.
543
00:20:46,120 --> 00:20:48,840
No, but I just thought, you see
a peer.
544
00:20:48,840 --> 00:20:50,040
I just thought the kids will
think.
545
00:20:50,040 --> 00:20:51,120
Disappeared.
Yeah, I thought, of course.
546
00:20:51,320 --> 00:20:52,760
The obvious one, that's
brilliant.
547
00:20:52,840 --> 00:20:55,040
Love that.
Right, let's we've had our
548
00:20:55,080 --> 00:20:57,320
little calm down, thanks.
For attempting to cheer me up.
549
00:20:57,400 --> 00:21:00,240
I did try.
We are going to now crack on
550
00:21:00,240 --> 00:21:03,800
with teacher martyrdom, guys.
We're going to have a go at
551
00:21:03,800 --> 00:21:05,640
ourselves here a little bit in
terms of profession.
552
00:21:05,640 --> 00:21:10,280
So just buckle up.
When we spoke to Omar last week,
553
00:21:10,560 --> 00:21:12,480
he touched upon teacher
martyrdom.
554
00:21:13,040 --> 00:21:16,760
And for a lot of people, they
know that term and something
555
00:21:16,760 --> 00:21:18,800
straight away comes to mind or
someone, Right?
556
00:21:18,920 --> 00:21:20,440
Yeah.
But what I think's interesting
557
00:21:20,440 --> 00:21:22,080
is I think people have different
definitions.
558
00:21:22,080 --> 00:21:24,440
I know you and I differ on what
we think of straight away.
559
00:21:24,600 --> 00:21:26,640
So before we get into this whole
conversation about what teacher
560
00:21:26,640 --> 00:21:29,400
martyr it is, how it's, you
know, ruining the profession in
561
00:21:29,400 --> 00:21:32,840
a way and how it's really, you
know, impacting the job, let's
562
00:21:32,840 --> 00:21:35,560
try and define it.
So I want to hear when I say
563
00:21:35,560 --> 00:21:37,440
teacher martyr, what do you
think?
564
00:21:37,440 --> 00:21:41,840
OK, So OK, I think a teacher
martyr is someone who obviously
565
00:21:41,840 --> 00:21:45,520
in teaching, in education,
education thinks that they're
566
00:21:45,520 --> 00:21:49,160
only worthwhile in this job if
they make considerable personal
567
00:21:49,160 --> 00:21:51,200
sacrifices.
So they have to make sacrifices
568
00:21:51,200 --> 00:21:54,240
outside of the job to consider
themselves as a good teacher, as
569
00:21:54,240 --> 00:21:56,480
good at the job.
And and I always think that
570
00:21:56,480 --> 00:21:59,160
those people probably look at
look at other people who aren't
571
00:21:59,160 --> 00:22:00,880
doing that and think they're
they're not as good teachers as
572
00:22:00,880 --> 00:22:02,560
me.
They they really, really have
573
00:22:02,560 --> 00:22:04,920
gasoline themselves into
thinking I'm only a good teacher
574
00:22:05,280 --> 00:22:08,000
if my work life balance is
terrible, if I'm burning out,
575
00:22:08,000 --> 00:22:09,280
because that's what good
teachers do.
576
00:22:09,280 --> 00:22:10,800
They sacrifice themselves for
the job.
577
00:22:11,440 --> 00:22:12,800
That's what a teacher martyr is
to me.
578
00:22:13,040 --> 00:22:14,640
Is your definition a bit
different?
579
00:22:14,640 --> 00:22:17,080
Yes, I guess slightly I, I get
what you're saying.
580
00:22:17,080 --> 00:22:19,920
I don't disagree with it.
But to me, I think what's
581
00:22:19,920 --> 00:22:22,480
important when we think about
teacher martyrdom is I think
582
00:22:22,680 --> 00:22:25,840
they actively relish in feeling
annoyed.
583
00:22:26,240 --> 00:22:28,760
Like if it feels to me when I
think of teacher martyrs,
584
00:22:28,760 --> 00:22:31,760
they're the kind of people who
will sit and moan about
585
00:22:31,760 --> 00:22:33,400
something like, oh gosh, yeah,
I'll go.
586
00:22:33,400 --> 00:22:36,440
I took these home the other day.
I did, you know, you did, you
587
00:22:36,440 --> 00:22:38,360
did 10 hours on mark and I did
11.
588
00:22:38,360 --> 00:22:41,160
And I like they relish in the
fact that they are bad.
589
00:22:41,160 --> 00:22:41,800
They've got it.
Worse.
590
00:22:41,800 --> 00:22:44,040
Yeah, they've got it worse.
And they think, gosh, aren't
591
00:22:44,040 --> 00:22:45,920
aren't I really putting myself
out there?
592
00:22:45,920 --> 00:22:47,680
And that's where your definition
comes in, I suppose.
593
00:22:47,720 --> 00:22:49,120
Aren't I an amazing teacher?
Because.
594
00:22:49,320 --> 00:22:52,960
But it's not always even that.
It's just the people who seem to
595
00:22:52,960 --> 00:22:55,880
want to let everyone know how
much they're letting this job
596
00:22:55,880 --> 00:22:58,840
take over their life and wear it
almost like a badge of honour.
597
00:22:58,920 --> 00:23:01,080
To me, that's what a teacher.
I guess that's quite similarly.
598
00:23:01,080 --> 00:23:03,520
So we're really just in the
whole, we're talking about
599
00:23:03,520 --> 00:23:06,240
people who do, who basically
sacrifice their own time at
600
00:23:06,240 --> 00:23:07,440
home.
They think they should, they
601
00:23:07,440 --> 00:23:10,080
think they have to, and they
wear it as a bit of a badger
602
00:23:10,120 --> 00:23:12,320
wanna and yeah.
So when, when, when I say
603
00:23:12,320 --> 00:23:15,800
teacher martyr, people listening
now might be thinking of someone
604
00:23:15,800 --> 00:23:18,280
straight away.
I, I have a very specific set of
605
00:23:18,280 --> 00:23:20,040
things in my mind when I think
about it.
606
00:23:20,040 --> 00:23:23,600
So before we go on to, you know,
why it's a problem, the impact
607
00:23:23,600 --> 00:23:26,600
it's having in a job, What does
it look like?
608
00:23:26,600 --> 00:23:27,960
What does teacher martyrdom look
like?
609
00:23:27,960 --> 00:23:30,320
Because we, we need to try and
cut it out.
610
00:23:30,320 --> 00:23:32,520
So let's define first, what do
we see?
611
00:23:32,520 --> 00:23:37,400
Because the first thing I think
of is touching upon what we just
612
00:23:37,400 --> 00:23:39,840
said it.
You'll know who a teacher martyr
613
00:23:39,840 --> 00:23:41,400
is because they'll tell you they
took their marking home.
614
00:23:42,000 --> 00:23:43,960
They'll let you know that.
Oh, God, yeah.
615
00:23:44,320 --> 00:23:47,080
I left at six the other day and
I had to take all my marking
616
00:23:47,080 --> 00:23:49,280
home.
Why, Yeah.
617
00:23:49,280 --> 00:23:50,160
Did you had to?
Did you?
618
00:23:50,160 --> 00:23:51,880
Did you mean to say had?
Yeah.
619
00:23:52,000 --> 00:23:53,080
You had to take away your
marking.
620
00:23:53,080 --> 00:23:54,560
I don't think you had to take
away your marking home.
621
00:23:54,560 --> 00:23:55,960
You choose to take away your
marking because I'll tell you
622
00:23:55,960 --> 00:23:58,240
what, mate, I didn't.
Yeah, I agree.
623
00:23:58,360 --> 00:24:00,160
Teachers that take home them, I
was it.
624
00:24:00,400 --> 00:24:01,640
It was me.
I was that person.
625
00:24:01,640 --> 00:24:03,160
Like I'm not going to pretend.
I'm going to sit in my high
626
00:24:03,160 --> 00:24:04,440
horse and be like, yeah,
everyone's like this.
627
00:24:04,440 --> 00:24:05,840
And I've always been not like
this.
628
00:24:05,880 --> 00:24:08,280
I was like that for years.
Absolutely a teacher martyr.
629
00:24:08,280 --> 00:24:10,040
And I totally relished in it.
So I know it's true.
630
00:24:10,280 --> 00:24:12,640
I totally went home and I tell
my mates who had other jobs
631
00:24:12,640 --> 00:24:15,080
because I thought my job was
more prestigious than I'm
632
00:24:15,080 --> 00:24:17,480
working jobs that I didn't think
it were as prestigious because I
633
00:24:17,480 --> 00:24:19,120
was in my early 20s.
Oh yeah.
634
00:24:19,120 --> 00:24:20,800
I can't come out tonight, mate.
Can't come out.
635
00:24:20,800 --> 00:24:21,960
Do you know why?
I didn't ask?
636
00:24:22,080 --> 00:24:23,360
Do you know why?
Can't come out tonight, mate?
637
00:24:23,520 --> 00:24:25,000
I was a markings dude.
I'm a teacher.
638
00:24:25,000 --> 00:24:27,760
Did You Know?
I help kids, I love kids.
639
00:24:27,840 --> 00:24:29,240
Do it for the money.
Don't think so.
640
00:24:29,240 --> 00:24:30,600
I do it for the money.
I'm bloody good at it though.
641
00:24:30,800 --> 00:24:32,040
Now do you know?
Do you know how you know?
642
00:24:32,040 --> 00:24:33,440
I'm good.
Got all those markets do
643
00:24:33,440 --> 00:24:34,400
tonight.
Can't come to the pub.
644
00:24:34,400 --> 00:24:37,120
See you later mate.
I live that and I think that is
645
00:24:37,640 --> 00:24:40,040
a huge sign.
I think there's a big
646
00:24:40,040 --> 00:24:41,600
discrepancy here.
Then we're going to come on to
647
00:24:41,600 --> 00:24:43,200
this, I think, in a minute and
have a real discussion about
648
00:24:43,200 --> 00:24:44,640
this.
To me, there's a huge
649
00:24:44,640 --> 00:24:47,160
discrepancy, and what makes a
martyr is someone who doesn't
650
00:24:47,160 --> 00:24:49,800
stop going on about it.
I know some teachers who go
651
00:24:49,800 --> 00:24:53,160
above and beyond every day, like
way more than they need to in
652
00:24:53,160 --> 00:24:55,280
the job.
And they'll do marking at home,
653
00:24:55,280 --> 00:24:57,600
or they'll, they'll take stuff
or they'll do something, but you
654
00:24:57,600 --> 00:24:59,520
will never know about it.
Yeah, you only know about it
655
00:24:59,520 --> 00:25:01,400
because you've seen them do it.
They'll they'll never, ever,
656
00:25:01,400 --> 00:25:02,880
ever walk through and say, I've
done this.
657
00:25:02,880 --> 00:25:04,600
By the way, to me, they're not
martyrs.
658
00:25:04,960 --> 00:25:07,160
Yeah, that's a different problem
that we're talking about there.
659
00:25:07,400 --> 00:25:09,760
A teacher martyr is someone who
honestly like, wears it like a
660
00:25:09,760 --> 00:25:11,520
badge of honour.
Yeah, you will know they're
661
00:25:11,520 --> 00:25:14,240
doing extra because they just
won't ever stop talking about
662
00:25:14,240 --> 00:25:14,880
it.
Yeah, yeah.
663
00:25:15,240 --> 00:25:16,440
OK.
Listen to some more things that
664
00:25:16,440 --> 00:25:18,160
define it because I really want
to build a picture.
665
00:25:18,400 --> 00:25:21,520
I want people to who listen to
this to understand like, oh,
666
00:25:21,680 --> 00:25:23,280
those kind of people.
I get it now.
667
00:25:23,440 --> 00:25:27,440
So another sign of a teacher
martyr is someone who undermines
668
00:25:27,440 --> 00:25:29,920
others who do less.
So it's like when someone is
669
00:25:29,920 --> 00:25:32,760
actually trying to stand up for
themselves or I don't know, just
670
00:25:32,760 --> 00:25:34,640
has a lot, has an appointment to
go to.
671
00:25:34,920 --> 00:25:37,280
It's just that just has a life
outside of teaching, right?
672
00:25:37,600 --> 00:25:39,760
Who says something and then
someone else, rather than just
673
00:25:39,760 --> 00:25:43,360
letting them be that person,
they have to say something.
674
00:25:43,520 --> 00:25:44,960
It's like, oh, well, I don't
know.
675
00:25:44,960 --> 00:25:46,680
I wouldn't do that.
I don't think I do that.
676
00:25:46,680 --> 00:25:49,640
I tell you what, I think it's
more important that we that we
677
00:25:49,640 --> 00:25:51,640
put the kids first.
So I will be doing this work
678
00:25:51,640 --> 00:25:54,360
that you just said you can't do.
It's those kind of people
679
00:25:54,360 --> 00:25:55,680
actually.
I've, I've got, I've got to
680
00:25:55,680 --> 00:25:57,600
share this with you because I
know you don't always like me
681
00:25:57,600 --> 00:26:00,800
sharing posts from Facebook and
things, but this I can't not I
682
00:26:00,840 --> 00:26:02,560
can't.
Keyboard warrior unlocked.
683
00:26:02,720 --> 00:26:05,600
You know, I'm trying so hard at
the moment to just not get as
684
00:26:05,600 --> 00:26:06,680
involved.
So there used to be a proper
685
00:26:06,680 --> 00:26:07,960
keyboard barrier.
Get involved in everything.
686
00:26:08,000 --> 00:26:10,600
But don't you find before you go
into this, don't you find that
687
00:26:10,600 --> 00:26:14,560
it's I, I I feel helpless.
Yeah.
688
00:26:14,560 --> 00:26:15,680
And and annoyed.
Yeah.
689
00:26:15,680 --> 00:26:19,640
Because when I bring stuff up,
the teacher, master them crusade
690
00:26:19,640 --> 00:26:22,280
come out and say, oh, aren't you
a good teacher, don't you?
691
00:26:22,280 --> 00:26:24,680
But what do you mean?
You care about this or you want
692
00:26:24,680 --> 00:26:27,320
money or you think you should
get time, blah, blah, blah.
693
00:26:27,360 --> 00:26:30,400
Yeah, shut up.
It's like, honestly, no, sorry,
694
00:26:30,400 --> 00:26:32,240
but just shut up.
Like leave me alone.
695
00:26:32,680 --> 00:26:35,360
It does not define how good I am
as a teacher because I'm not
696
00:26:35,360 --> 00:26:38,840
willing to sacrifice my evenings
to do stuff, which I think is
697
00:26:38,840 --> 00:26:42,280
pointless because like I said
before, I'm a professional and I
698
00:26:42,280 --> 00:26:44,160
know it won't have an impact on
the children.
699
00:26:44,160 --> 00:26:45,400
So you've got some.
Ready to link?
700
00:26:45,480 --> 00:26:47,760
I purposely not showing you this
because I wanted to rile you up.
701
00:26:47,800 --> 00:26:50,840
Remember old section is riling
you up on the podcast very early
702
00:26:50,840 --> 00:26:52,520
days.
I purposely leave things just to
703
00:26:52,520 --> 00:26:55,040
get him annoyed.
So someone just asked a genuine
704
00:26:55,040 --> 00:26:57,240
question right on on this group
it's about mass leads right?
705
00:26:57,600 --> 00:27:01,040
And it says can I just ask if
I'm not paid for a TLR to be
706
00:27:01,040 --> 00:27:02,600
mass lead, does it mean I'm
accountable?
707
00:27:02,600 --> 00:27:05,280
Basically when off to come in am
I ultimately the the most
708
00:27:05,280 --> 00:27:08,080
accountable person?
I'm not being paid a TLR, just a
709
00:27:08,080 --> 00:27:09,880
genuine question.
The answer is the answer is no.
710
00:27:09,880 --> 00:27:13,000
The answer is no, and it's a
it's a hard one because the real
711
00:27:13,000 --> 00:27:15,520
answer is you're responsible
because you have literally got
712
00:27:15,520 --> 00:27:16,880
the job title and that is what
you're doing.
713
00:27:16,880 --> 00:27:19,400
So you're if you're the person
who has been named responsible
714
00:27:19,400 --> 00:27:22,720
for organising maths and
monitoring books, then yeah,
715
00:27:22,720 --> 00:27:25,240
they're going to talk to you,
but you're not ultimately
716
00:27:25,240 --> 00:27:27,080
accountable.
Good for the outcomes of it.
717
00:27:27,080 --> 00:27:28,360
Yeah, that's the that was the
real.
718
00:27:28,360 --> 00:27:30,720
That's what I wanted to know
because it's quite clearly.
719
00:27:31,240 --> 00:27:32,960
So if if it is a.
Responsibility.
720
00:27:32,960 --> 00:27:34,560
If only we had some kind of
teaching and learning
721
00:27:34,560 --> 00:27:35,520
responsibility.
Money.
722
00:27:35,520 --> 00:27:37,760
I know, I know.
It's like honestly, in my
723
00:27:37,760 --> 00:27:40,280
opinion, as soon as you're not
paid the TLR, yeah, teaching and
724
00:27:40,280 --> 00:27:43,560
learning responsibility.
In my head I think it's fair
725
00:27:43,560 --> 00:27:45,160
enough to say no, it's not my
responsibility.
726
00:27:45,320 --> 00:27:46,400
Do you know what?
I might help.
727
00:27:46,840 --> 00:27:49,680
I might accept being masted.
Lots of people in small schools
728
00:27:49,680 --> 00:27:51,760
probably shouting now going,
well someones got to do it,
729
00:27:51,840 --> 00:27:53,240
sure.
But you know what?
730
00:27:53,320 --> 00:27:56,480
Someones also got to say no at
some point and then we'll
731
00:27:56,480 --> 00:27:59,480
realise the system is broken
completely built on goodwill.
732
00:27:59,600 --> 00:28:01,720
I always think of the bar
someone's got to do, OK,
733
00:28:01,720 --> 00:28:03,560
someone's got to teach, but we
all accept we get paid for that
734
00:28:03,560 --> 00:28:04,240
one.
Exactly.
735
00:28:04,320 --> 00:28:05,960
OK.
If they took that away, yeah.
736
00:28:06,240 --> 00:28:08,520
Would you accept someone saying,
well, someone's got to teach the
737
00:28:08,520 --> 00:28:09,360
kids?
That's a good point.
738
00:28:09,480 --> 00:28:11,160
So I will have to bloody do it
for free?
739
00:28:11,320 --> 00:28:13,760
No, you wouldn't.
So why do we just have a weird
740
00:28:13,760 --> 00:28:15,600
bar?
Someone's got to scan the
741
00:28:15,600 --> 00:28:18,600
groceries at Asda.
Yeah, well, yeah, of course they
742
00:28:18,600 --> 00:28:20,000
do.
Yeah, that's a society.
743
00:28:20,120 --> 00:28:22,440
Get over it.
We live in a society where you
744
00:28:22,440 --> 00:28:24,800
need to be.
You've given money for what
745
00:28:24,800 --> 00:28:26,520
you're doing.
Someone's got to do this job.
746
00:28:26,520 --> 00:28:29,760
Yes, we have job.
We pay people to do jobs anyway.
747
00:28:29,920 --> 00:28:31,960
So this person and I couldn't, I
couldn't not buy.
748
00:28:31,960 --> 00:28:33,400
I ready.
Someone, someone replied.
749
00:28:33,400 --> 00:28:35,960
Commented on this person's post
right I was thinking that the
750
00:28:35,960 --> 00:28:37,840
suitable The only thing that
people should be commenting on
751
00:28:37,840 --> 00:28:40,760
this is an answer with either
yes or no and why sure this
752
00:28:40,760 --> 00:28:42,560
person put here we.
Go.
753
00:28:42,600 --> 00:28:44,000
I know it's going to.
I can fill myself.
754
00:28:44,000 --> 00:28:44,800
Yeah.
Ready.
755
00:28:45,360 --> 00:28:48,080
I've been a mass lead since I
was on M2M2.
756
00:28:48,080 --> 00:28:50,240
For those that aren't in
teaching, is a pay scale quite
757
00:28:50,240 --> 00:28:52,000
early on in the pay scale.
Two years in, two years into
758
00:28:52,000 --> 00:28:55,120
teaching, still on main pay
scale now and also key stage
759
00:28:55,120 --> 00:28:57,200
lead.
Proud to be in a position of
760
00:28:57,200 --> 00:29:00,520
responsibility and only want to
do the best for my school.
761
00:29:00,800 --> 00:29:03,200
Whether it's Ofsted or my
day-to-day kids, they'll see the
762
00:29:03,200 --> 00:29:06,640
best of me and my school.
Happy to be held accountable for
763
00:29:06,640 --> 00:29:09,080
the work I do.
That's teacher Marta.
764
00:29:10,280 --> 00:29:13,200
That's teacher Marta.
Exactly what it is that is
765
00:29:13,280 --> 00:29:15,320
wearing it as a badge of pride.
That's my whole point.
766
00:29:15,320 --> 00:29:16,200
And do you know what?
Really?
767
00:29:16,200 --> 00:29:17,520
Do you know what annoyed me even
more?
768
00:29:17,760 --> 00:29:20,760
It was the most liked response
on that whole post and there was
769
00:29:20,760 --> 00:29:22,520
loads of interaction.
OK, I'm going to play devil's
770
00:29:22,520 --> 00:29:24,720
advocate slightly, OK?
Because do you know what?
771
00:29:24,720 --> 00:29:29,400
I know we think the same thing
about this, but is that a bad
772
00:29:29,400 --> 00:29:31,760
thing to say?
You know, why is it a bad thing
773
00:29:31,760 --> 00:29:33,800
to say specifically?
Because if someone wants to do
774
00:29:33,800 --> 00:29:37,400
that, if someone feels like, OK,
look, I am actually, I'm proud,
775
00:29:38,200 --> 00:29:41,080
why is that problematic?
OK, because pride doesn't pay
776
00:29:41,080 --> 00:29:44,200
the bills.
Pride doesn't pay the bills and
777
00:29:44,320 --> 00:29:47,160
it sets a rubbish example to
others.
778
00:29:47,520 --> 00:29:51,760
If, if, if we want to, if we
collectively agree that teaching
779
00:29:51,760 --> 00:29:54,000
is dire at the moment, it's in a
dire state that people don't
780
00:29:54,000 --> 00:29:55,320
want to do it.
People are leaving the job.
781
00:29:55,320 --> 00:29:57,480
If we agree that that is a
problem and it's a problem we
782
00:29:57,480 --> 00:30:00,360
need to fix.
We just can't accept opinions
783
00:30:00,360 --> 00:30:01,320
like that.
We can't.
784
00:30:01,480 --> 00:30:04,400
We can't have people coming in
with smarmy high horse opinions
785
00:30:04,640 --> 00:30:07,680
to people who are just asking a
genuine question and say and not
786
00:30:07,680 --> 00:30:10,840
even answer it and just be like,
I wouldn't even ask that
787
00:30:10,840 --> 00:30:13,520
question because actually I just
do it because I love it.
788
00:30:13,520 --> 00:30:15,800
Yeah, it's like, no, it's not
acceptable.
789
00:30:15,800 --> 00:30:18,360
So I'm I'm very much of the
opinion of no, it's not.
790
00:30:18,360 --> 00:30:20,280
That's not OK to do that.
I actually replied, I'm going to
791
00:30:20,280 --> 00:30:22,840
read my reply.
And I put you could also just do
792
00:30:22,840 --> 00:30:25,800
it not for free, though.
We should all set the example
793
00:30:25,800 --> 00:30:28,480
that our time is valuable and
not to be taken for granted and
794
00:30:28,480 --> 00:30:30,680
pride doesn't pay the bills.
And I thought, I'm going to say
795
00:30:30,680 --> 00:30:31,240
it.
And you know what?
796
00:30:31,240 --> 00:30:32,840
I know people disagree.
And then someone underneath it
797
00:30:32,840 --> 00:30:34,520
commented and I thought, oh,
maybe they're maybe they're
798
00:30:34,520 --> 00:30:36,920
agreeing with me and said it's
so wonderful to see your level
799
00:30:36,920 --> 00:30:38,840
to the the original person, your
level of commitment and
800
00:30:38,840 --> 00:30:40,880
enthusiasm.
Unfortunately, budgets in
801
00:30:40,880 --> 00:30:42,520
schools just don't allow for
TLRS.
802
00:30:42,880 --> 00:30:44,960
Thanks for going above and
behalf above and beyond.
803
00:30:45,040 --> 00:30:46,680
Yeah, cool.
What do you mean?
804
00:30:46,680 --> 00:30:48,000
OK, so we're all accepting it
then, are we?
805
00:30:48,160 --> 00:30:51,720
Unfortunately, we don't have
money anymore, but we still need
806
00:30:51,720 --> 00:30:53,040
to do the job.
So we're all going to do it for
807
00:30:53,040 --> 00:30:54,880
free.
Yeah, unbelievable.
808
00:30:54,880 --> 00:30:56,440
What are you talking about?
And there was something in
809
00:30:56,440 --> 00:30:58,680
there, I can't remember what it
was now, but towards the end it
810
00:30:58,680 --> 00:31:01,000
kind of it.
There's a huge inference in what
811
00:31:01,000 --> 00:31:04,760
he said there, which is I I care
about my kids.
812
00:31:04,760 --> 00:31:06,360
Yeah.
Yeah, I care about my school.
813
00:31:06,360 --> 00:31:07,720
See the best of me, they'll see
the best.
814
00:31:07,760 --> 00:31:12,360
Therefore I'll do this.
And what that infers is all well
815
00:31:12,360 --> 00:31:13,480
and good.
You want to go up and beyond,
816
00:31:13,480 --> 00:31:13,800
right?
Yeah.
817
00:31:14,080 --> 00:31:17,240
But don't you dare put comments
like that in a teacher group,
818
00:31:17,400 --> 00:31:19,800
which is essentially inferring
if anyone has any kind of
819
00:31:19,800 --> 00:31:21,920
inference schools, which I hope
you do as a teacher in a teacher
820
00:31:21,920 --> 00:31:26,040
group, you are honestly saying,
therefore, if you don't, you are
821
00:31:26,040 --> 00:31:27,520
not on my level of caring.
Yeah.
822
00:31:27,680 --> 00:31:30,280
Martyrdom completely.
If you don't do it, it is that
823
00:31:30,280 --> 00:31:32,280
first thing I said.
It is that like, you're only
824
00:31:32,280 --> 00:31:35,080
worthwhile if you make personal
sacrifices, and therefore if you
825
00:31:35,080 --> 00:31:37,200
see other people who aren't
doing those same sacrifices, you
826
00:31:37,200 --> 00:31:38,120
think they're not as good as
you.
827
00:31:38,200 --> 00:31:39,640
I hate it.
Completely.
828
00:31:39,800 --> 00:31:42,040
And that's kind of the other end
here of what we're going to say
829
00:31:42,040 --> 00:31:44,120
in terms of like teacher
martyrdom.
830
00:31:44,440 --> 00:31:46,000
There are two types.
They're that type where this
831
00:31:46,000 --> 00:31:48,240
guy's just happy to do it, still
a martyr.
832
00:31:48,560 --> 00:31:50,720
There's the other type where
they they, they're burnt out
833
00:31:50,720 --> 00:31:52,720
because of it.
They let themselves get burnt
834
00:31:52,720 --> 00:31:54,560
out.
They know it's bad for them.
835
00:31:54,560 --> 00:31:57,520
They complain about it, but they
still wear it as a badge of
836
00:31:57,520 --> 00:31:59,040
honour.
They still say, but you know
837
00:31:59,040 --> 00:32:01,400
what?
I'm tough, stiff up a lip.
838
00:32:01,400 --> 00:32:04,440
I'm going to wear it like about
I am burnt out and I know it's a
839
00:32:04,440 --> 00:32:06,160
problem, but you know what?
I'm not one of them quitters.
840
00:32:06,160 --> 00:32:08,160
Yeah, yeah, we talk about
retention crisis, but I'm not
841
00:32:08,160 --> 00:32:09,440
one of them quitters.
I'm burnt out.
842
00:32:09,720 --> 00:32:13,000
That's so unhealthy.
It's so unhealthy.
843
00:32:13,000 --> 00:32:15,880
That badge of honour is probably
our next identifier, isn't it,
844
00:32:15,920 --> 00:32:17,400
of what so we're going through
right now What?
845
00:32:17,400 --> 00:32:20,520
How can you identify someone who
is this martyr, Right?
846
00:32:20,520 --> 00:32:23,200
And they take home, they take
loads of homework regularly, all
847
00:32:23,200 --> 00:32:24,720
the time, and they always talk
about it.
848
00:32:24,720 --> 00:32:26,960
Like you said, they mention the
fact they do that they undermine
849
00:32:26,960 --> 00:32:29,160
others who aren't martyring
themselves for some reason
850
00:32:29,160 --> 00:32:31,320
rather than just letting them be
or even sticking up for them.
851
00:32:32,040 --> 00:32:33,960
And also they wear their burnout
as a badge of honour.
852
00:32:34,120 --> 00:32:36,880
Another thing they do is they
don't remotely try and solve the
853
00:32:36,880 --> 00:32:38,760
issue, so they all moan about
the stuff.
854
00:32:39,240 --> 00:32:40,640
So a teacher might just think
about it.
855
00:32:40,640 --> 00:32:43,200
I'm sorry if we're like hitting
home with this and maybe you do
856
00:32:43,200 --> 00:32:44,640
some of these things.
I certainly have done all these
857
00:32:44,640 --> 00:32:46,360
things in my career.
Of course, I'm not sat here in
858
00:32:46,360 --> 00:32:50,680
my high horse, I promise you.
But people who moan about stuff
859
00:32:50,680 --> 00:32:52,240
to you as another teacher.
Teacher.
860
00:32:52,520 --> 00:32:54,480
Oh, God, have you seen SLT have
done this now?
861
00:32:54,480 --> 00:32:56,360
As if we haven't got enough work
going on.
862
00:32:56,520 --> 00:32:58,200
Moan, moan, moan, moan, moan.
SLT.
863
00:32:58,200 --> 00:32:59,280
Come along.
Is everyone all right?
864
00:32:59,320 --> 00:33:00,000
Yeah.
Doing great.
865
00:33:00,000 --> 00:33:01,320
We're fine.
We're absolutely fine.
866
00:33:01,320 --> 00:33:02,880
Completely fine.
They don't say anything.
867
00:33:02,880 --> 00:33:04,120
It's like, what do you want
then?
868
00:33:04,840 --> 00:33:06,760
It's like, it's like that, that
mean the whole thing of like
869
00:33:06,760 --> 00:33:08,760
you're in a staff meeting.
You're like, are you going to
870
00:33:08,760 --> 00:33:09,960
say it?
I'll say it if you say it.
871
00:33:10,160 --> 00:33:11,840
I'll say if you say you're going
to say something about it.
872
00:33:11,840 --> 00:33:13,240
Yeah, I'll do that.
OK, no problem.
873
00:33:13,480 --> 00:33:14,960
All right, guys.
So that's a new initiative.
874
00:33:14,960 --> 00:33:19,880
Any problems sat there silently?
Yeah, no, Listen, be a
875
00:33:19,880 --> 00:33:21,880
professional.
And do you know what?
876
00:33:21,880 --> 00:33:24,240
Solving the issue.
Again, you're talking a lot
877
00:33:24,240 --> 00:33:27,400
about people who moan about it.
I think after hearing that post,
878
00:33:27,400 --> 00:33:29,120
we need to include the people
who don't moan about it.
879
00:33:29,360 --> 00:33:31,240
They're almost more toxic,
genuinely.
880
00:33:31,240 --> 00:33:33,320
Like, I get people in moaning
and bring people down and not
881
00:33:33,320 --> 00:33:34,440
fixing.
That's really frustrating.
882
00:33:35,040 --> 00:33:37,200
At least you feel like you can
kind of be on the level and kind
883
00:33:37,200 --> 00:33:39,400
of maybe you can work together
with them to say, let's, let's,
884
00:33:39,440 --> 00:33:41,320
let's try and solve this then.
Maybe that's your voice.
885
00:33:41,320 --> 00:33:42,200
Yeah, completely.
Maybe.
886
00:33:42,200 --> 00:33:44,400
And they're just a bit, maybe
they are nervous about speaking
887
00:33:44,400 --> 00:33:46,280
up.
OK, it's still a problem, still
888
00:33:46,280 --> 00:33:48,360
problematic.
The people like that person on
889
00:33:48,360 --> 00:33:51,200
the post, they're more of a
problem because they are
890
00:33:51,200 --> 00:33:52,760
championing at it.
They're saying no, no, no.
891
00:33:52,760 --> 00:33:54,440
This is what teaching.
Putting you down for.
892
00:33:54,440 --> 00:33:56,520
Yeah.
And and what winds me up, I'll
893
00:33:56,520 --> 00:33:58,080
make this.
It's a slightly separate point,
894
00:33:58,080 --> 00:33:59,840
but it's linked to what this
guy's talking about.
895
00:34:00,400 --> 00:34:03,840
It's that kind of attitude where
people who aren't in school will
896
00:34:03,840 --> 00:34:06,880
look at it, congratulate it, say
well done, that's right, that's
897
00:34:06,880 --> 00:34:08,639
why you get into teaching.
We need more of the.
898
00:34:08,639 --> 00:34:11,600
Amount of people who've said to
me, why did you get into
899
00:34:11,600 --> 00:34:14,040
teaching if you're worried about
the money, What do you why you
900
00:34:14,040 --> 00:34:15,639
might well do you not care about
the kids?
901
00:34:15,920 --> 00:34:17,600
And I'm just like, you're so
toxic.
902
00:34:17,920 --> 00:34:19,400
You are.
This is a job.
903
00:34:19,560 --> 00:34:21,679
What you're doing is horrendous.
I'm a human being.
904
00:34:21,960 --> 00:34:23,960
I've got a family, I've got
interests.
905
00:34:24,120 --> 00:34:26,840
This is my job.
OK, get over it.
906
00:34:26,840 --> 00:34:31,199
The fact that I am not going to
sacrifice my entire life because
907
00:34:31,199 --> 00:34:34,120
I like children.
Why should someone who's in a
908
00:34:34,120 --> 00:34:36,840
job like teaching nursing, being
a doctor, being a public
909
00:34:36,840 --> 00:34:39,239
servant, doing a job which we
all collectively agree is really
910
00:34:39,239 --> 00:34:41,159
important and goes above what
other jobs do?
911
00:34:41,520 --> 00:34:45,239
Why should that person then as a
result of that also be put in
912
00:34:45,239 --> 00:34:47,239
this benchmark of which means
you don't care about money or
913
00:34:47,239 --> 00:34:48,440
you shouldn't be like
represented.
914
00:34:48,440 --> 00:34:50,080
Well, you shouldn't be given
money to like because you've
915
00:34:50,080 --> 00:34:52,920
gone above and beyond.
What an insane dichotomy we
916
00:34:52,920 --> 00:34:53,280
have.
Yeah.
917
00:34:53,480 --> 00:34:55,480
Yeah.
Where we we all agree being an
918
00:34:55,480 --> 00:34:58,480
insurance broker and A and a
quantity surveyor.
919
00:34:58,640 --> 00:34:59,760
We all agree.
Oh, yeah.
920
00:35:00,240 --> 00:35:01,600
I couldn't be a teacher.
That's like you.
921
00:35:01,600 --> 00:35:03,440
That's the love for the job.
And nurses have worked to the
922
00:35:03,440 --> 00:35:05,160
bone.
But we then also collectively
923
00:35:05,160 --> 00:35:06,160
agree.
Yeah, you should be.
924
00:35:06,160 --> 00:35:07,360
Yeah.
They get much more money than a
925
00:35:07,360 --> 00:35:09,520
teacher.
What are you talking about?
926
00:35:09,880 --> 00:35:12,080
Of course we should stand up for
ourselves and get paid for
927
00:35:12,080 --> 00:35:12,720
stuff.
Yeah.
928
00:35:13,160 --> 00:35:15,520
No one's walking around a
building site with a badge
929
00:35:15,520 --> 00:35:16,320
going.
I'm a builder.
930
00:35:16,760 --> 00:35:18,400
Someone's got to build this
nursery.
931
00:35:18,800 --> 00:35:20,400
Yeah, they have.
And you should get paid for it.
932
00:35:20,680 --> 00:35:21,520
Yeah, of course you should.
Yeah.
933
00:35:21,760 --> 00:35:23,200
Tell you what, that doesn't
happen anywhere else.
934
00:35:23,280 --> 00:35:25,920
Is it exactly Someone's got to
pay there, Someone's got to be
935
00:35:25,920 --> 00:35:28,040
an accountant to sort those
bills out, haven't they?
936
00:35:28,040 --> 00:35:29,680
Yeah, yeah.
And you'd never do.
937
00:35:29,720 --> 00:35:31,280
And I'm proud of my work.
Yeah.
938
00:35:31,280 --> 00:35:33,120
Once again, I'm going to mention
this bargain because I feel like
939
00:35:33,120 --> 00:35:35,080
it's the easiest analogy to get
through to people, right?
940
00:35:35,360 --> 00:35:36,840
It is just whatever you think
you're.
941
00:35:36,840 --> 00:35:39,520
But if you are a teacher martyr,
if you agree with that person,
942
00:35:39,680 --> 00:35:41,240
that's like, well, you know,
like the one that said, oh,
943
00:35:41,240 --> 00:35:44,760
there's no budget for the TLRS,
OK, All right, Suddenly we're in
944
00:35:44,760 --> 00:35:45,760
a new world now.
Ready.
945
00:35:45,800 --> 00:35:48,040
Oh, there's no budget for
teaching anymore.
946
00:35:48,040 --> 00:35:50,040
It's been halved.
Will you do your job?
947
00:35:50,080 --> 00:35:52,640
I'm asking you, the listener,
would you do your job?
948
00:35:52,640 --> 00:35:54,440
Whatever it is, if it's
teaching, whatever for half the
949
00:35:54,440 --> 00:35:56,520
pay right now, cut in half,
would you do it?
950
00:35:56,760 --> 00:36:00,320
If the answer is no, which it
probably is, OK, maybe have some
951
00:36:00,320 --> 00:36:02,400
envy for those other people who
are just higher.
952
00:36:02,400 --> 00:36:04,640
They just have a slightly higher
bar than you who are thinking,
953
00:36:04,720 --> 00:36:08,360
no, I won't also be a mass lead
for free on top it needs it's a
954
00:36:08,360 --> 00:36:10,880
part of the job is extra.
I need to be paid for it.
955
00:36:11,800 --> 00:36:13,920
Oh, well, you know, you get paid
a lot as you.
956
00:36:13,960 --> 00:36:17,160
You just do what you can.
I'm, I'm proud of what I do.
957
00:36:18,120 --> 00:36:19,760
I just, I don't know.
It drives me crazy.
958
00:36:19,760 --> 00:36:21,520
Yeah, yeah, yeah, I agree.
I completely agree.
959
00:36:21,880 --> 00:36:24,000
And and on that, do you know
what all you need to think about
960
00:36:24,000 --> 00:36:25,720
is the strikes.
I keep going back to the strikes
961
00:36:25,720 --> 00:36:26,880
and this lifts ramp free in my
head.
962
00:36:27,080 --> 00:36:29,680
OK, think about your score,
right.
963
00:36:29,680 --> 00:36:32,640
If you're listening right now,
think about when you went on
964
00:36:32,640 --> 00:36:34,440
strike last year, if you did or
not, whatever.
965
00:36:34,440 --> 00:36:36,480
But think about that process
when people were deciding
966
00:36:36,480 --> 00:36:39,440
whether to go on strike or not.
OK, so there are three, There
967
00:36:39,440 --> 00:36:41,520
are three camps.
They're the people who decided
968
00:36:41,520 --> 00:36:44,960
not to go on strike.
You know what, at least they're
969
00:36:44,960 --> 00:36:46,640
holding their head above and
say, no, I don't want to go on
970
00:36:46,640 --> 00:36:48,520
strike, blah, blah for the kids.
We can fix it.
971
00:36:49,280 --> 00:36:51,160
I can have a debate with you.
At least I don't, I don't agree
972
00:36:51,160 --> 00:36:52,800
with you.
Obviously there's the people
973
00:36:52,800 --> 00:36:56,040
like us who from the offset, as
the second group were saying,
974
00:36:56,040 --> 00:36:57,520
OK, I'm going on strike.
Of course I am.
975
00:36:57,600 --> 00:36:59,480
This is completely broken.
I'm going on strike.
976
00:36:59,640 --> 00:37:01,440
We're going to, I'm going to
hold my head above the parapet.
977
00:37:01,440 --> 00:37:03,880
I'm going to lose hundreds of
pounds out of my pay packet
978
00:37:04,080 --> 00:37:06,720
because I want to make the point
that this is completely broken
979
00:37:06,720 --> 00:37:09,920
and we need to fix something.
Now think of that third group.
980
00:37:10,160 --> 00:37:12,840
And that third group of people
were the ones who didn't really
981
00:37:12,840 --> 00:37:14,520
talk about strike, a bit more
reluctant.
982
00:37:14,520 --> 00:37:16,640
And it might be for a lot of
reasons, by the way, not just
983
00:37:16,640 --> 00:37:18,880
because they're a martyr, might
be because they're struggling
984
00:37:18,880 --> 00:37:21,520
with finances at home, all, all
legitimate reasons.
985
00:37:21,760 --> 00:37:23,040
But just think of that third
group.
986
00:37:23,400 --> 00:37:25,760
And within that third group, I
bet you find the martyrs.
987
00:37:26,120 --> 00:37:27,760
I bet you find those martyrs
who.
988
00:37:27,760 --> 00:37:29,720
Yeah, OK, some of them might be
the ones who didn't go on
989
00:37:29,720 --> 00:37:31,600
strike, but at least they're
holding their convictions and
990
00:37:31,600 --> 00:37:33,160
that you can have a SO.
Make this group really clear.
991
00:37:33,160 --> 00:37:34,880
So these are people who who are
not.
992
00:37:34,880 --> 00:37:36,720
Sure.
Yeah, unlike us who still went
993
00:37:36,720 --> 00:37:39,640
on strike in the end, right?
But these are the people who
994
00:37:39,640 --> 00:37:41,960
were waiting to see what
everyone did, OK?
995
00:37:42,160 --> 00:37:44,160
They're the people.
I bet you can all think of
996
00:37:44,160 --> 00:37:46,680
someone who went up to you or
other people in the school went,
997
00:37:46,680 --> 00:37:49,600
are you going on strike?
Because that was the thing they
998
00:37:49,600 --> 00:37:52,920
needed to decide themselves.
And if everyone said no, these
999
00:37:52,920 --> 00:37:54,640
people probably would have said
no as well.
1000
00:37:54,640 --> 00:37:55,760
If everyone said yes, they said
yes.
1001
00:37:55,760 --> 00:37:57,280
So they're kind of on the fence
and they don't.
1002
00:37:57,280 --> 00:37:59,520
They need that.
And that's why a lot of schools,
1003
00:37:59,960 --> 00:38:02,960
95% of the teachers went on
strike or 10% of the teachers
1004
00:38:02,960 --> 00:38:05,680
went on strike, because that
middle group, the ones who can
1005
00:38:05,680 --> 00:38:08,840
be swayed for collective action,
are the ones because that needed
1006
00:38:08,840 --> 00:38:12,080
to be LED a certain way.
And in there, I can think of
1007
00:38:12,080 --> 00:38:16,120
people who I know of from other
schools, from my profession, I
1008
00:38:16,120 --> 00:38:21,080
see on online all the time who I
know went on strike but now do
1009
00:38:21,160 --> 00:38:24,560
absolutely nothing to try and
reduce their workload and almost
1010
00:38:24,560 --> 00:38:26,160
thrive in it and say, oh, it's
just a job, isn't it?
1011
00:38:26,680 --> 00:38:29,360
So you were willing to lose
hundreds of pounds from your pay
1012
00:38:29,360 --> 00:38:30,120
packet.
Yeah.
1013
00:38:30,240 --> 00:38:33,280
And the face of going on strike
and saying this to me, the
1014
00:38:33,280 --> 00:38:35,800
ultimate action to say that this
is a completely broken system.
1015
00:38:35,800 --> 00:38:37,280
Yeah.
But you're not willing to now
1016
00:38:37,280 --> 00:38:39,520
say, oh, actually, I think that
thing you're asking me to plan
1017
00:38:39,520 --> 00:38:40,520
out the weekend is a bit too
much?
1018
00:38:40,520 --> 00:38:41,640
Which I've been on strike for
last year.
1019
00:38:41,640 --> 00:38:43,080
Completely.
I think it's insane.
1020
00:38:43,200 --> 00:38:45,440
And I think if you if you go to
the level where you're going to
1021
00:38:45,440 --> 00:38:47,160
lose hundreds of pounds every
month because you're willing to
1022
00:38:47,160 --> 00:38:49,280
go on strike, yeah.
But you can't then say to your
1023
00:38:49,280 --> 00:38:52,520
SLT, I'm a professional and this
is not acceptable.
1024
00:38:52,840 --> 00:38:54,880
What on earth is going on?
And it comes down to that
1025
00:38:54,880 --> 00:38:56,440
collective action.
Yeah, yeah.
1026
00:38:56,560 --> 00:38:59,000
The power of collective action.
I think we've kind of defined
1027
00:38:59,520 --> 00:39:01,680
what teacher Marthas are they?
Look, I think we should move on
1028
00:39:01,680 --> 00:39:04,600
to why?
Like really why it's a problem?
1029
00:39:04,600 --> 00:39:07,560
Because when we said we're
ranting a lot and I really want
1030
00:39:07,560 --> 00:39:08,880
to get into because.
Someone.
1031
00:39:08,880 --> 00:39:10,480
Yeah, go on.
It's not, it's not just that.
1032
00:39:10,480 --> 00:39:12,320
It's not that me and Dylan are
on our high.
1033
00:39:12,360 --> 00:39:13,920
I keep saying high horse, but
we're not that we're on a high
1034
00:39:13,920 --> 00:39:15,680
horse and we're like, we don't
want to do the work anymore
1035
00:39:15,680 --> 00:39:17,800
because we've got children now.
So we think everyone should be
1036
00:39:17,800 --> 00:39:20,120
like us.
I, I think it's deep, way
1037
00:39:20,120 --> 00:39:23,000
further rooted than this.
Not being a martyr is a huge
1038
00:39:23,000 --> 00:39:25,040
problem in general.
I think we should just break
1039
00:39:25,040 --> 00:39:28,360
down why it's a massive problem
to education, to all of us as a
1040
00:39:28,360 --> 00:39:30,120
collective.
Look.
1041
00:39:30,120 --> 00:39:32,520
Look at the fact of retention,
right?
1042
00:39:32,520 --> 00:39:36,560
Look at retention right now, OK?
It's a huge crisis.
1043
00:39:36,720 --> 00:39:39,520
We all agree there's not.
I don't think there's a teacher
1044
00:39:39,520 --> 00:39:40,800
out there who'll say retention's
all right.
1045
00:39:41,160 --> 00:39:43,240
Because if you don't, you are
literally disagreeing with a
1046
00:39:43,240 --> 00:39:45,080
number.
Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.
1047
00:39:45,080 --> 00:39:47,720
Not remotely meeting the needs
of how many teachers we have and
1048
00:39:47,720 --> 00:39:50,880
need.
So that what that comes down to
1049
00:39:50,880 --> 00:39:54,920
for me and what teacher
martyrdom does is it sets such
1050
00:39:55,000 --> 00:39:59,520
an unrealistic bar.
And the biggest issue I have
1051
00:39:59,520 --> 00:40:00,840
with wearing like a badge of
honour.
1052
00:40:01,320 --> 00:40:05,160
Is it then becomes so much
easier for it to become the
1053
00:40:05,160 --> 00:40:08,800
norm.
And if you, especially if you're
1054
00:40:08,800 --> 00:40:11,680
too faced about it, especially
if you wear it as a badge of
1055
00:40:11,680 --> 00:40:13,880
honour and, and say and, and to
the people above you, you're
1056
00:40:13,880 --> 00:40:16,280
like, yeah, I've done that.
I've done that straight away for
1057
00:40:16,280 --> 00:40:17,320
you.
So well done.
1058
00:40:17,680 --> 00:40:19,720
But then you go to your team and
moan and moan and moan.
1059
00:40:19,720 --> 00:40:22,640
Yeah, yeah.
Listen, don't moan at me.
1060
00:40:22,720 --> 00:40:25,800
You're setting the bar for me.
Don't talk to me about how crap
1061
00:40:25,800 --> 00:40:27,800
this is because you're doing it,
OK?
1062
00:40:27,800 --> 00:40:29,560
Don't come to me as like, I'm
your comrade.
1063
00:40:29,560 --> 00:40:31,360
Isn't this crap?
Yeah, Yeah, it's crap.
1064
00:40:31,360 --> 00:40:32,560
Did you do it?
Yeah.
1065
00:40:32,840 --> 00:40:34,080
Don't.
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
1066
00:40:34,200 --> 00:40:36,440
The amount of times I've said to
people don't do it.
1067
00:40:36,440 --> 00:40:37,280
Yeah.
And they've gone.
1068
00:40:37,320 --> 00:40:39,440
Oh.
Because what it does is it ruins
1069
00:40:39,440 --> 00:40:41,120
your opportunity to say
something about it.
1070
00:40:41,120 --> 00:40:43,960
Exactly.
If if, if eight members of staff
1071
00:40:43,960 --> 00:40:46,400
out of 10 do the thing and they
all moan about it, the two
1072
00:40:46,400 --> 00:40:48,520
members of staff that were
thinking before they did it, ah,
1073
00:40:48,520 --> 00:40:50,080
we all don't want to do this
thing.
1074
00:40:50,080 --> 00:40:52,280
Let's go and tell SOT.
Actually, this is unreasonable.
1075
00:40:52,840 --> 00:40:55,040
It loses all power when 8 of
them actually did it, though.
1076
00:40:55,680 --> 00:40:57,760
You go to SOTI, don't want to do
this, what all your colleagues
1077
00:40:57,760 --> 00:40:58,880
did.
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
1078
00:40:58,880 --> 00:41:00,640
But they didn't want to.
Well, they didn't tell me that.
1079
00:41:00,640 --> 00:41:01,600
And they.
Did and they did it.
1080
00:41:01,600 --> 00:41:03,320
So, yeah, this is kind of what I
meant, right?
1081
00:41:03,320 --> 00:41:05,200
Let's start the episode when I
said I'm losing the will to live
1082
00:41:05,200 --> 00:41:07,360
as a teacher.
The reason I'm losing the will
1083
00:41:07,360 --> 00:41:09,960
to live as a teacher is because
it is like fighting an uphill
1084
00:41:09,960 --> 00:41:11,800
battle.
And my enemies are the literal
1085
00:41:11,800 --> 00:41:14,480
people I'm trying to help.
It is you guys.
1086
00:41:14,480 --> 00:41:17,640
It is the, it is teachers that I
work with and love and respect
1087
00:41:17,640 --> 00:41:20,440
who are just in the way.
They're just, they're just,
1088
00:41:20,440 --> 00:41:22,560
they're saying one thing.
I don't want to do all this
1089
00:41:22,560 --> 00:41:23,760
work.
This is crazy.
1090
00:41:23,760 --> 00:41:25,240
This job isn't.
It's getting mad how much work,
1091
00:41:25,240 --> 00:41:27,920
what's really impacting my life.
And then they're doing it
1092
00:41:27,920 --> 00:41:30,440
anyway.
And then when I try to say
1093
00:41:30,440 --> 00:41:32,800
anything about it, it's well, we
all did it.
1094
00:41:32,800 --> 00:41:34,600
Why aren't you doing it?
You look bad in comparison.
1095
00:41:34,600 --> 00:41:36,480
And you know what?
People like me quit.
1096
00:41:37,240 --> 00:41:39,600
I'm a good teacher.
I think I'm a good teacher.
1097
00:41:39,600 --> 00:41:41,600
The kids because like me that we
get, we get on well.
1098
00:41:41,640 --> 00:41:43,880
They learn lots of things.
I tell you what though, I'm
1099
00:41:43,880 --> 00:41:46,480
going to quit this job if it
carries on because I can't.
1100
00:41:46,480 --> 00:41:47,720
I feel like it's just a losing
battle.
1101
00:41:47,960 --> 00:41:50,280
This is what I mean.
Losing the world to live because
1102
00:41:50,760 --> 00:41:53,080
teacher martyrs, setting on an
unrealistic bar that I'm not
1103
00:41:53,080 --> 00:41:55,760
willing to reach anymore because
I don't think you need to reach
1104
00:41:55,760 --> 00:41:57,680
it to be a good teacher.
Said, you know what, if I can't
1105
00:41:57,680 --> 00:41:58,960
reach it, I'm going to get
penalised for it.
1106
00:41:58,960 --> 00:41:59,840
See you later.
Find someone.
1107
00:41:59,840 --> 00:42:01,720
Else And the craziest thing
about this bar is we all
1108
00:42:01,720 --> 00:42:02,920
collectively agree it's too
high.
1109
00:42:02,960 --> 00:42:05,880
Yeah, like how?
What on earth is going on when
1110
00:42:05,880 --> 00:42:09,280
not one person thinks that bar
is acceptable, yet we still will
1111
00:42:09,280 --> 00:42:11,560
have to magically reach it?
Stop it.
1112
00:42:12,000 --> 00:42:14,400
Say no.
If you all agree as
1113
00:42:14,400 --> 00:42:16,480
professionals that it's not
having an impact.
1114
00:42:16,680 --> 00:42:19,200
If you're spending an hour and a
half doing something every week
1115
00:42:19,200 --> 00:42:21,600
that you know is having such a
negligible impact on the
1116
00:42:21,600 --> 00:42:24,200
children, right?
It's not worth that nought
1117
00:42:24,200 --> 00:42:26,880
point, nought .2% rise that
you're gonna get out the kids if
1118
00:42:26,920 --> 00:42:28,080
you're spending an hour and a
half doing it.
1119
00:42:28,080 --> 00:42:32,520
Yeah, if you're going home and
you know, you know, prepping
1120
00:42:32,520 --> 00:42:35,280
stuff for the children, like I'm
in math every day, I'm just
1121
00:42:35,280 --> 00:42:37,400
going to do the margins for them
because it's such a faff.
1122
00:42:37,400 --> 00:42:39,280
And you know, it'll save 2
minutes at the start of maths
1123
00:42:39,280 --> 00:42:41,000
when we write our margins and
our date and stuff, I'm just
1124
00:42:41,000 --> 00:42:43,200
going to do it for them.
And it takes you an hour to do
1125
00:42:43,200 --> 00:42:45,720
that and you've saved 2 minutes
of the lesson.
1126
00:42:46,200 --> 00:42:48,480
That's insane.
Yeah, that is not cost effective
1127
00:42:48,480 --> 00:42:50,080
of.
Course, you shouldn't do that.
1128
00:42:50,240 --> 00:42:52,160
And then because you've done
that, guess what, you're taking
1129
00:42:52,160 --> 00:42:54,560
your marking home that evening
of it's it's half five and I've
1130
00:42:54,560 --> 00:42:55,640
got to take my market home.
Yeah.
1131
00:42:55,800 --> 00:42:58,280
But do you know why?
Because you did something insane
1132
00:42:58,280 --> 00:42:59,800
earlier that you did not have to
do.
1133
00:42:59,840 --> 00:43:01,000
Yeah.
Stop doing it.
1134
00:43:01,000 --> 00:43:02,560
You know, you know what you're
getting at because we've kind of
1135
00:43:02,560 --> 00:43:04,200
mentioned sort of this in the
past.
1136
00:43:04,200 --> 00:43:06,760
It's prioritisation when we've
when we've talked on this, but
1137
00:43:06,760 --> 00:43:07,840
we don't always just run the
moment.
1138
00:43:07,840 --> 00:43:09,800
By the way, guys, if you're a
new listener, go back and listen
1139
00:43:09,800 --> 00:43:11,920
to songs where we're positive
and we think about solutions.
1140
00:43:11,920 --> 00:43:14,800
Yeah, but sorry, very quickly,
negativity and realism has been
1141
00:43:14,800 --> 00:43:17,360
morphed.
You know, it's true.
1142
00:43:17,560 --> 00:43:19,480
I think we're we are.
Maybe we do sneak into
1143
00:43:19,480 --> 00:43:21,640
negativity sometimes, but we're
just realistic about.
1144
00:43:21,680 --> 00:43:23,720
It so sorry and a bit fed up.
I think it's probably the better
1145
00:43:23,720 --> 00:43:24,840
way.
It's not even negative really,
1146
00:43:24,920 --> 00:43:26,360
We're just fed up and trying to
highlight issues.
1147
00:43:27,560 --> 00:43:30,120
Yes, tore up priorities.
You know, one of the ways we
1148
00:43:30,120 --> 00:43:32,080
said we could tackle workload is
actually just on us as well,
1149
00:43:32,080 --> 00:43:34,280
which is just prioritise
properly, be more efficient with
1150
00:43:34,280 --> 00:43:36,560
the time that you spend.
Like think about what is going
1151
00:43:36,560 --> 00:43:38,440
to have a big impact, what
should be left or last.
1152
00:43:38,720 --> 00:43:41,640
What teacher masters do is they
have no priorities.
1153
00:43:41,640 --> 00:43:43,920
Their priority is get everything
done at all costs.
1154
00:43:44,240 --> 00:43:46,560
That's the problem, they don't
prioritise at all.
1155
00:43:46,560 --> 00:43:49,320
They just think I've got 8 hours
of work to do and I've only got
1156
00:43:49,320 --> 00:43:52,320
3 hours left.
Their next thought is guess I'm
1157
00:43:52,320 --> 00:43:56,040
doing 5 hours tonight rather
than what should I prioritise
1158
00:43:56,040 --> 00:43:58,120
and what can I drop, what can I
leave, what can I leave for
1159
00:43:58,120 --> 00:43:59,680
another day?
All of those questions are
1160
00:43:59,680 --> 00:44:01,440
coming to head.
So that's that is why being a
1161
00:44:01,440 --> 00:44:04,320
martyr is a problem because once
again it sets the bar.
1162
00:44:04,480 --> 00:44:06,800
It shows everyone else that oh
work life balance isn't
1163
00:44:06,800 --> 00:44:08,760
necessary because you can get
everything done if you just
1164
00:44:08,760 --> 00:44:10,960
sacrifice your entire life.
They don't stand up for
1165
00:44:10,960 --> 00:44:13,040
themselves.
It lowers the morale across the
1166
00:44:13,040 --> 00:44:15,200
whole school because everyone
else is thinking oh God they've
1167
00:44:15,200 --> 00:44:17,320
got it all done.
I need to find a way to get it
1168
00:44:17,320 --> 00:44:19,440
all done now, otherwise I'll
look bad by comparison.
1169
00:44:19,520 --> 00:44:21,560
So do you know what a classic
retort to that is?
1170
00:44:21,560 --> 00:44:23,840
You know, if I was to bring that
up, yeah, people have said this
1171
00:44:23,920 --> 00:44:25,640
to me before and we've we've
talked about ourselves.
1172
00:44:25,960 --> 00:44:28,640
We know it's important that when
you bring up a problem, you have
1173
00:44:28,640 --> 00:44:29,600
a solution.
Sure, right.
1174
00:44:29,600 --> 00:44:34,160
That's really important.
So my my point though is that's
1175
00:44:34,160 --> 00:44:36,400
right.
OK, let's say, let's say we have
1176
00:44:36,400 --> 00:44:39,040
a problem with our with your
mass planning in a school, the
1177
00:44:39,040 --> 00:44:41,960
mass curriculum just it honestly
just doesn't hit the national
1178
00:44:41,960 --> 00:44:44,480
curriculum and you bring up that
problem, you say we're not
1179
00:44:44,480 --> 00:44:47,200
hitting this.
You should come to that with so
1180
00:44:47,200 --> 00:44:50,800
let's try XYZ, right.
My point to people is, you know
1181
00:44:50,800 --> 00:44:54,800
what, sometimes the solution is
to not do it and people don't
1182
00:44:54,800 --> 00:44:57,720
like to hear that.
So it will say, OK, I've got 8
1183
00:44:57,720 --> 00:45:00,080
hours of work and I've only got
3 hours after school to do it
1184
00:45:00,080 --> 00:45:01,560
in.
OK, well what's your solution
1185
00:45:01,560 --> 00:45:02,680
then, Dylan?
What do you mean?
1186
00:45:02,680 --> 00:45:04,120
Yeah, I've got to take five
hours home.
1187
00:45:04,280 --> 00:45:05,760
What's your solution?
If you're just going to moan
1188
00:45:05,760 --> 00:45:07,680
about it?
My solution is to not do some of
1189
00:45:07,680 --> 00:45:09,520
it.
And people don't see that as a
1190
00:45:09,520 --> 00:45:11,640
solution.
People are so warped by the fact
1191
00:45:11,640 --> 00:45:14,480
they've got to get everything
done that a solution to them is
1192
00:45:14,720 --> 00:45:17,040
doing something differently or
doing something at a different
1193
00:45:17,040 --> 00:45:18,520
time.
And I just want to be here to
1194
00:45:18,520 --> 00:45:20,360
say, do you know what sometimes
the solution is?
1195
00:45:20,760 --> 00:45:23,200
It's to not do that thing.
Do you know what if you turn
1196
00:45:23,200 --> 00:45:24,920
around and say, well, it's
school policy.
1197
00:45:25,560 --> 00:45:27,880
It's school policy to change the
fonts on the SMART because we
1198
00:45:27,880 --> 00:45:30,800
decided that's a new policy now.
It's the school policy that
1199
00:45:31,240 --> 00:45:33,360
displays get changed every six
weeks, every time.
1200
00:45:33,360 --> 00:45:35,320
That's the school policy.
Do you know what the solution to
1201
00:45:35,320 --> 00:45:36,760
that is?
The school policy is wrong.
1202
00:45:37,160 --> 00:45:40,560
The solution isn't okay, let me
do it anyway and maybe we'll
1203
00:45:40,560 --> 00:45:42,120
give a teaching assistant some
time to do it.
1204
00:45:42,120 --> 00:45:44,840
No, no, no, no.
The solution is get rid of it,
1205
00:45:45,000 --> 00:45:49,320
get rid of that expectation, be
allowed to say, as a teacher,
1206
00:45:49,520 --> 00:45:53,200
no, no, I don't need to do this
thing anymore, erase it.
1207
00:45:53,440 --> 00:45:55,280
That is sometimes a solution
that.
1208
00:45:55,280 --> 00:45:57,480
The problem comes and there is
this horrible grey area right
1209
00:45:57,480 --> 00:46:00,480
where I'm sure teachers are in
this situation, where part of
1210
00:46:00,480 --> 00:46:02,440
that extra work that they've
got, that they've got to do that
1211
00:46:02,440 --> 00:46:05,120
night is something essential,
like they've got a plan,
1212
00:46:05,120 --> 00:46:07,320
tomorrow's lessons.
But, but my point is usually
1213
00:46:07,320 --> 00:46:09,160
that comes because something's
been pushed back.
1214
00:46:09,680 --> 00:46:12,240
So, so one of two things with
that, OK, let's say that you
1215
00:46:12,240 --> 00:46:13,720
you're you're a teacher.
There Monday night.
1216
00:46:13,880 --> 00:46:15,440
You're a bit of a martyr.
You're like, oh, well, I'm just
1217
00:46:15,440 --> 00:46:16,600
going to get it done because
it's Monday.
1218
00:46:16,600 --> 00:46:18,080
It's half eight and I've got to
do my planning.
1219
00:46:18,120 --> 00:46:21,000
OK, One of two things.
One's in your control, 1 isn't.
1220
00:46:21,280 --> 00:46:22,720
So I really want to make this
clear to people.
1221
00:46:22,720 --> 00:46:24,560
I don't anyone sat there
thinking they're in a toxic
1222
00:46:24,560 --> 00:46:27,280
school.
Huge expectations, no budget, no
1223
00:46:27,280 --> 00:46:28,600
wiggle room.
It's not your fault.
1224
00:46:28,680 --> 00:46:30,120
OK, then we made that really
clear.
1225
00:46:30,400 --> 00:46:32,480
So there's there are go and
listen to other episodes like
1226
00:46:32,480 --> 00:46:34,560
you said, because we talk so
much about other external
1227
00:46:34,560 --> 00:46:36,360
factors.
We're talking today about things
1228
00:46:36,360 --> 00:46:38,640
we have control over.
So the two reasons you might be
1229
00:46:38,640 --> 00:46:40,880
planning on a Monday evening is
because your school has
1230
00:46:40,880 --> 00:46:42,280
unbelievable expectations of
you.
1231
00:46:42,400 --> 00:46:44,240
You've got to plan from scratch
whatever reason it is and.
1232
00:46:44,400 --> 00:46:46,080
You just can't get it done you.
Just can't get it done because
1233
00:46:46,080 --> 00:46:47,240
you've got too much you've got
to do.
1234
00:46:47,240 --> 00:46:49,840
You might be in a small school.
The the the school just don't
1235
00:46:49,840 --> 00:46:51,560
care that you're doing it at
half eight and then watch pack
1236
00:46:51,560 --> 00:46:53,200
on doing it.
I'm not talking to you right
1237
00:46:53,200 --> 00:46:54,600
now.
I know loads of teachers like
1238
00:46:54,600 --> 00:46:55,440
that.
It's crap.
1239
00:46:55,720 --> 00:46:57,600
There's, there's other, there's
other problems going on.
1240
00:46:58,160 --> 00:47:01,320
The other problem, and I see
this and I know this exists, so
1241
00:47:01,320 --> 00:47:04,200
let's not pretend it doesn't, is
someone has to do some planning
1242
00:47:04,200 --> 00:47:07,520
at half eight that evening.
It's because in school they've
1243
00:47:07,520 --> 00:47:10,760
chosen to do something else that
they feel like they've got to do
1244
00:47:10,760 --> 00:47:13,440
in school, EG they spent an hour
and a half doing a display.
1245
00:47:13,840 --> 00:47:16,160
OK, so you can't, you can't do a
display at home.
1246
00:47:16,440 --> 00:47:18,520
So you look at this job, you
look at your list, you've got,
1247
00:47:18,840 --> 00:47:20,640
I've got this huge display to do
in the corridor and I've got
1248
00:47:20,640 --> 00:47:22,200
this mark, this planning for
tomorrow.
1249
00:47:22,320 --> 00:47:24,520
OK.
What a teacher martyr will do is
1250
00:47:24,520 --> 00:47:26,120
say, well, I've got to get both
done.
1251
00:47:26,240 --> 00:47:27,640
I can only do the display in
school.
1252
00:47:27,640 --> 00:47:30,040
So I do the display now and I'll
take my marking or my planning.
1253
00:47:30,040 --> 00:47:32,160
Yeah, yeah.
What a realist does and what we
1254
00:47:32,160 --> 00:47:34,880
have to do as a profession is
say, well, I'm, I'm, I'm
1255
00:47:34,880 --> 00:47:37,320
stopping working at half four or
five, wherever it is.
1256
00:47:37,600 --> 00:47:40,280
So, oh, it doesn't matter that
only one of these can happen in
1257
00:47:40,280 --> 00:47:41,320
school.
That's irrelevant.
1258
00:47:41,720 --> 00:47:44,120
I'm going to do something now.
And the only thing that matters
1259
00:47:44,120 --> 00:47:46,760
out of doing a display or
planning my lesson for tomorrow
1260
00:47:46,760 --> 00:47:48,800
with the children to educate
them, which is my job.
1261
00:47:49,080 --> 00:47:50,560
Let me think which one I'm going
to do.
1262
00:47:51,040 --> 00:47:53,400
Don't do the display plan at
home.
1263
00:47:53,600 --> 00:47:56,280
Don't take anything home.
Oh, but, but I can't take my, I
1264
00:47:56,280 --> 00:47:58,480
can't take my display home.
There's a solution.
1265
00:47:58,520 --> 00:48:01,000
Don't do it.
So when someone says to me, what
1266
00:48:01,000 --> 00:48:02,200
can I do?
What's the solution?
1267
00:48:02,240 --> 00:48:04,080
Take it away.
Don't do it.
1268
00:48:04,080 --> 00:48:05,960
Shove what you were going to do
in the evening to your time
1269
00:48:05,960 --> 00:48:08,280
after school, which we will do
for extra anyway, Gets
1270
00:48:08,280 --> 00:48:09,480
forgotten.
That's already extra.
1271
00:48:09,640 --> 00:48:12,760
That's past directed time past
3:45, But we forget that.
1272
00:48:13,000 --> 00:48:15,160
You know the extra hour we do
every night after and before,
1273
00:48:15,160 --> 00:48:17,920
which works out two hours a day?
That's already extra.
1274
00:48:18,320 --> 00:48:20,200
Don't feel bad that you're not
taking stuff home.
1275
00:48:20,800 --> 00:48:23,400
You're already doing extra.
The solution is to not do it,
1276
00:48:23,520 --> 00:48:25,240
and the teacher martyr won't
accept that.
1277
00:48:25,280 --> 00:48:26,600
Yeah, I agree.
That was a good analogy and it
1278
00:48:26,600 --> 00:48:28,840
kind of hurts back to the whole
priority prioritisation thing,
1279
00:48:28,840 --> 00:48:30,520
doesn't it?
If you're not prioritising and
1280
00:48:30,520 --> 00:48:31,960
doing anything, you're setting a
bad example.
1281
00:48:32,080 --> 00:48:34,600
It makes everyone else feel bad.
Being a martyr also blocks
1282
00:48:34,600 --> 00:48:36,680
collective action.
I mean, that's another huge
1283
00:48:36,680 --> 00:48:38,200
thing.
And it kind of your strike
1284
00:48:38,200 --> 00:48:39,480
analogy was quite good for that
as well.
1285
00:48:39,480 --> 00:48:41,840
You know, like a lot of people
are swayed by what everyone else
1286
00:48:41,840 --> 00:48:43,560
is doing.
And if there's enough martyrs in
1287
00:48:43,560 --> 00:48:46,960
a school, right, it completely
blocks anyone in your school
1288
00:48:46,960 --> 00:48:48,960
who's at school who's actually
trying to fight for your rights
1289
00:48:48,960 --> 00:48:51,400
and work life balance because
there's not enough of them.
1290
00:48:51,400 --> 00:48:55,080
Genuinely, if you martyrs stop
that happening, you need
1291
00:48:55,080 --> 00:48:56,920
collective action is the only
way we can make change.
1292
00:48:56,920 --> 00:48:59,000
Genuinely.
I truly believe that now after
1293
00:48:59,000 --> 00:49:02,000
spending years trying to
convince even my closest friends
1294
00:49:02,200 --> 00:49:04,080
who are teacher martyrs to stop
doing it.
1295
00:49:04,080 --> 00:49:05,040
I can't.
I can't do it.
1296
00:49:05,360 --> 00:49:07,880
I literally can't convince the
closest people to me who I
1297
00:49:07,880 --> 00:49:10,200
respect and have really nice
relationships with to stop doing
1298
00:49:10,200 --> 00:49:11,320
it.
Can't even do that.
1299
00:49:12,240 --> 00:49:14,400
It needs to be collective.
Like I'm convinced now that
1300
00:49:14,400 --> 00:49:16,440
there is nothing I can do by
myself.
1301
00:49:16,440 --> 00:49:20,320
I need eight people versus two
people who are martyring
1302
00:49:20,320 --> 00:49:23,000
themselves to say, hey, wait,
you're going to stop doing this
1303
00:49:23,200 --> 00:49:25,040
because it's it's bad for all of
us.
1304
00:49:25,480 --> 00:49:27,160
No one.
There's no badge of honour.
1305
00:49:27,160 --> 00:49:29,080
You've made it up.
No one really cares.
1306
00:49:29,080 --> 00:49:31,040
The second you quit this job,
they'll replace you with someone
1307
00:49:31,040 --> 00:49:32,360
else.
It's not real.
1308
00:49:32,360 --> 00:49:35,080
It's an illusion in your head
that you have to be a martyr to
1309
00:49:35,080 --> 00:49:37,520
be good at this job.
I tell you what, I know martyrs
1310
00:49:37,520 --> 00:49:40,240
who are rubbish teachers.
And I know people who go home at
1311
00:49:40,240 --> 00:49:43,320
3:45 every day who are
unbelievably good teachers, but
1312
00:49:43,320 --> 00:49:46,080
they are hated by their SLT
because they don't get XY and Z
1313
00:49:46,080 --> 00:49:47,440
done all the time.
But you know what?
1314
00:49:47,440 --> 00:49:49,120
The kids love being in their
class, you learn the most, the
1315
00:49:49,120 --> 00:49:51,280
parents love them.
And it's like there's, it's just
1316
00:49:51,280 --> 00:49:54,680
a complete illusion, this idea
of tying work life balance and
1317
00:49:54,680 --> 00:49:57,160
time with being good at this
job.
1318
00:49:57,280 --> 00:49:59,280
And that's what we need to stop.
And we can only do it with
1319
00:49:59,280 --> 00:50:01,440
collective.
Action you're absolutely right.
1320
00:50:01,760 --> 00:50:05,000
A martyr will equivocate all
parts of this job.
1321
00:50:05,560 --> 00:50:06,840
They will see them as equally
important.
1322
00:50:07,320 --> 00:50:10,680
They will equivocate everything.
A realist looks at what's
1323
00:50:10,680 --> 00:50:12,440
important and says I'll do that
really well.
1324
00:50:12,960 --> 00:50:15,720
Your time with the kids, your
impact you're having on them,
1325
00:50:16,120 --> 00:50:19,400
the relationships you build with
them and their parents and the
1326
00:50:19,400 --> 00:50:23,160
impact you can have on them is
so much more important than
1327
00:50:23,160 --> 00:50:25,280
whether you've ticked a box to
say you've got a display up in
1328
00:50:25,280 --> 00:50:27,440
the board or you've put
something in an assessment sheet
1329
00:50:27,440 --> 00:50:29,800
which is for no one.
Or you've made your worksheets
1330
00:50:29,800 --> 00:50:32,200
look a particular way because at
your school, the policies we do
1331
00:50:32,200 --> 00:50:33,600
it.
But the green border they.
1332
00:50:33,600 --> 00:50:35,080
Always have a differentiation.
The green board is
1333
00:50:35,080 --> 00:50:37,320
differentiated and it has to fit
into a column rather than a
1334
00:50:37,320 --> 00:50:38,040
whole.
What do you mean?
1335
00:50:38,080 --> 00:50:39,600
What do you mean?
The slides on your smart
1336
00:50:39,600 --> 00:50:40,920
presentation?
Not this exact colour.
1337
00:50:40,920 --> 00:50:42,800
How will the kids know this is
reading comprehension?
1338
00:50:42,920 --> 00:50:45,800
What do you mean?
Of course they will know.
1339
00:50:45,800 --> 00:50:48,520
It's reading comprehension.
When I say we're going to read
1340
00:50:48,520 --> 00:50:50,120
some questions and answer that,
what are you?
1341
00:50:50,320 --> 00:50:51,640
They're not confused.
It's matched.
1342
00:50:51,640 --> 00:50:52,920
It's not green.
Are you?
1343
00:50:52,920 --> 00:50:54,520
Insane.
There's so many little things
1344
00:50:54,520 --> 00:50:55,720
like that.
Insane.
1345
00:50:55,800 --> 00:50:57,920
Yeah, Don't you do it.
And I feel like I've maybe
1346
00:50:57,920 --> 00:50:59,240
mentioned this before, but I'm
coming back to it.
1347
00:50:59,400 --> 00:51:01,600
I make it really, really clear.
But again, this whole collective
1348
00:51:01,600 --> 00:51:04,040
action thing, right, it blocks
it.
1349
00:51:04,200 --> 00:51:06,280
It blocks SLT from knowing the
problems as well.
1350
00:51:06,280 --> 00:51:08,560
Because you know what, there are
actually some really good.
1351
00:51:08,560 --> 00:51:12,400
There's so many great SLT, but
they're out of the classroom.
1352
00:51:12,640 --> 00:51:15,320
It is so easy to be disconnected
with what your teachers are
1353
00:51:15,320 --> 00:51:16,360
doing.
Like that's one of the biggest
1354
00:51:16,360 --> 00:51:19,480
criticisms of SLT in general,
especially toxic SLT, which is
1355
00:51:19,480 --> 00:51:21,520
they are totally, totally
disenfranchised.
1356
00:51:21,520 --> 00:51:23,920
They have no idea what teachings
like anymore.
1357
00:51:23,920 --> 00:51:25,680
They've forgotten it and and
therefore they make terrible
1358
00:51:25,680 --> 00:51:28,000
decisions.
But you know what, sometimes SLT
1359
00:51:28,000 --> 00:51:30,280
do care and they do want to do
the right things.
1360
00:51:30,720 --> 00:51:33,840
But when they've got 10 staff
and eight of them are martyrs
1361
00:51:33,880 --> 00:51:36,520
all going, yeah, it's all great
and not say anything and only
1362
00:51:36,520 --> 00:51:39,560
two of them are owning, do you
know what their reasonable
1363
00:51:40,680 --> 00:51:43,280
conclusion is?
Is well 8 versus 2.
1364
00:51:43,280 --> 00:51:44,760
Those two people are probably
just being a bit.
1365
00:51:44,760 --> 00:51:46,400
They're just not.
They're just not really doing
1366
00:51:46,400 --> 00:51:47,440
it.
They're not really working very
1367
00:51:47,440 --> 00:51:48,720
hard.
It's fine, but the others are
1368
00:51:48,720 --> 00:51:50,000
all doing it, so it's clearly
fine.
1369
00:51:50,240 --> 00:51:53,840
It blocks SLT actually
understanding wider issues and
1370
00:51:53,840 --> 00:51:55,600
therefore you don't even let
them.
1371
00:51:55,600 --> 00:51:59,280
Doesn't give them a chance.
How can you moan at SLT for not
1372
00:51:59,280 --> 00:52:01,360
trying to fix a problem that
they don't even know exists?
1373
00:52:01,680 --> 00:52:02,880
Seriously.
Yeah, yeah.
1374
00:52:02,880 --> 00:52:04,520
No, I agree.
So I want to, I want to finish
1375
00:52:04,520 --> 00:52:06,080
with a bit of a debate because I
know you think slightly
1376
00:52:06,080 --> 00:52:07,720
different to me.
OK, so thinking about why
1377
00:52:07,720 --> 00:52:11,080
teacher martyrdom is a problem,
from what I understand, you can
1378
00:52:11,080 --> 00:52:13,920
correct me if I'm wrong.
Your your approach there to what
1379
00:52:13,920 --> 00:52:17,240
we're talking about is you
honestly shouldn't be allowed to
1380
00:52:17,240 --> 00:52:18,840
do it hours and hours.
I said that in that episode,
1381
00:52:18,840 --> 00:52:20,960
didn't I before?
But but you know that I know
1382
00:52:20,960 --> 00:52:22,400
that is your idea.
So I just want to come at you
1383
00:52:22,400 --> 00:52:25,520
and say no right now after all
of this chat, OK?
1384
00:52:25,920 --> 00:52:27,960
Part of my solution, and we'll
come onto the solutions quickly
1385
00:52:27,960 --> 00:52:33,360
in a second, is I don't think
you should tell people no.
1386
00:52:33,360 --> 00:52:36,920
No, you literally can't do that.
That person who's the mass lead
1387
00:52:36,920 --> 00:52:39,920
who did that post, right?
I would not say to that person,
1388
00:52:39,920 --> 00:52:42,200
you're not allowed to take on
mass lead for no TLR.
1389
00:52:42,440 --> 00:52:44,440
You're not allowed to go above
and beyond, blah, blah, blah,
1390
00:52:44,440 --> 00:52:46,120
blah.
But what I would say from my
1391
00:52:46,120 --> 00:52:49,520
line is you should be one of the
loudest people defending people
1392
00:52:49,520 --> 00:52:50,840
who don't want to do that.
Well, that's good.
1393
00:52:50,840 --> 00:52:52,240
That's a good.
Thing that's what I'm saying
1394
00:52:52,240 --> 00:52:54,800
here is OK, I don't mind.
People go above, beyond.
1395
00:52:54,800 --> 00:52:57,240
It's like I said earlier in this
chat, there are two different
1396
00:52:57,240 --> 00:53:00,240
types of martyrs to me.
One aren't really even martyrs
1397
00:53:00,240 --> 00:53:02,200
because they just crack on and
do loads and you wouldn't even
1398
00:53:02,200 --> 00:53:04,040
know about it.
And they're the first person to
1399
00:53:04,040 --> 00:53:06,440
say no, of course, that's fine.
Yeah, go home, go see your baby.
1400
00:53:06,440 --> 00:53:08,320
I'm going to stay for an hour
and do this because I want to,
1401
00:53:08,320 --> 00:53:09,920
but I'm going to be the first
person.
1402
00:53:09,920 --> 00:53:12,000
If someone moans at you, I'm
going to be the first person to
1403
00:53:12,000 --> 00:53:13,280
say no.
No, they don't have to do that.
1404
00:53:13,560 --> 00:53:15,560
I'm choosing to do this.
Don't judge their books.
1405
00:53:15,560 --> 00:53:17,680
It doesn't look as nice as mine.
I'm sat here for an hour doing
1406
00:53:17,680 --> 00:53:19,200
the books.
So don't do that comparison.
1407
00:53:19,200 --> 00:53:22,640
That's completely unfair, but
they they need to do that
1408
00:53:22,640 --> 00:53:24,800
because if, if they're going to
go above and beyond, I think it
1409
00:53:24,800 --> 00:53:27,240
has to come with a caveat of you
need to be one of the loudest
1410
00:53:27,240 --> 00:53:29,400
people to say no, no, no, no.
This is not the bar.
1411
00:53:29,400 --> 00:53:31,560
Don't set the bar to me.
I'm doing it because I want to.
1412
00:53:31,680 --> 00:53:34,080
Whereas you, you, I feel like
you kind of, I think I'm a step.
1413
00:53:34,120 --> 00:53:36,240
Further, I think I'm a step
further and the reason I'm a
1414
00:53:36,240 --> 00:53:38,360
step further than that is
because I've spent 10 years
1415
00:53:38,360 --> 00:53:41,120
feeling like that and seeing it
not exist in reality anywhere in
1416
00:53:41,120 --> 00:53:42,880
the world.
Genuinely, it doesn't exist.
1417
00:53:42,880 --> 00:53:44,920
What you're saying is to me is
idealistic.
1418
00:53:44,920 --> 00:53:47,200
I don't think any.
I don't think they can exist.
1419
00:53:47,200 --> 00:53:49,760
I think those people that are
going above and beyond that,
1420
00:53:49,760 --> 00:53:52,760
that they know that the only
thing they can get out of this
1421
00:53:53,080 --> 00:53:55,000
is at least a bit of recognition
and praise.
1422
00:53:55,560 --> 00:53:57,880
And if we, and if we're saying
no, no, don't even accept that,
1423
00:53:57,880 --> 00:53:59,360
Tell everyone else not to do
what you're doing.
1424
00:53:59,360 --> 00:54:01,360
I think people, I don't think
they can exist, coexist.
1425
00:54:01,360 --> 00:54:02,720
I think people, it's just never
going to work.
1426
00:54:02,720 --> 00:54:05,640
People aren't going to be
selfless enough to say, I've
1427
00:54:05,640 --> 00:54:07,840
done all this extra work, but I
don't want any praise for it.
1428
00:54:07,840 --> 00:54:10,320
And actually this is not the bar
that's I just don't think people
1429
00:54:10,320 --> 00:54:12,200
will do.
That I I I I'm going against
1430
00:54:12,200 --> 00:54:13,280
that because I think I've seen
that.
1431
00:54:13,760 --> 00:54:16,200
I think I've seen teachers I can
think of teachers I've worked
1432
00:54:16,200 --> 00:54:20,520
with who to me fit the bill
where I wouldn't say they make
1433
00:54:20,520 --> 00:54:22,080
me feel bad for what I do.
OK.
1434
00:54:22,520 --> 00:54:25,160
I think lots do.
I'd say there are some teachers
1435
00:54:25,160 --> 00:54:27,120
out there, though, who just,
they live and breathe the job.
1436
00:54:27,680 --> 00:54:30,520
It's part of their identity.
I'd never want to discredit them
1437
00:54:30,520 --> 00:54:32,760
as what I'm saying.
I think what you're saying hits
1438
00:54:32,760 --> 00:54:35,480
78% of martyrs.
Yeah, Yeah, in a good way.
1439
00:54:35,480 --> 00:54:37,520
OK.
Who have like, not vindictive,
1440
00:54:37,520 --> 00:54:39,320
but who have them the aim of
like, no, no, everyone should be
1441
00:54:39,320 --> 00:54:41,360
like me.
I'm talking about protecting
1442
00:54:41,360 --> 00:54:43,600
those people who don't say
everyone should be like me, but
1443
00:54:43,600 --> 00:54:45,720
simply like, you know, people
who volunteer at a food bank
1444
00:54:45,720 --> 00:54:48,200
after they go to work, right?
So it's the same kind of idea to
1445
00:54:48,200 --> 00:54:50,080
me.
If I, I might not know you go
1446
00:54:50,080 --> 00:54:52,080
and do that, but I would never
say no, no, don't do that
1447
00:54:52,080 --> 00:54:54,200
because then I might feel like I
need to go to a food bank.
1448
00:54:54,200 --> 00:54:55,720
I, I feel like I need to do
that.
1449
00:54:55,720 --> 00:54:57,120
It's like, no, no, no, no, of
course not.
1450
00:54:57,360 --> 00:54:59,320
Of course, amazing volunteer
work.
1451
00:54:59,320 --> 00:55:01,320
I'm not going to discredit that.
It's not a race to the bottom.
1452
00:55:01,320 --> 00:55:02,600
Like no one does anything
anymore.
1453
00:55:02,920 --> 00:55:05,640
Do it, but just don't make
someone else feel bad for not
1454
00:55:05,640 --> 00:55:07,440
going to the soup kitchen.
You know, I'm going to define
1455
00:55:07,440 --> 00:55:09,400
what I mean because we kind of
we kind of glossed over what I'm
1456
00:55:09,440 --> 00:55:11,560
even saying here because we
obviously know what I think from
1457
00:55:11,560 --> 00:55:13,560
previous episodes.
So let me just really define it.
1458
00:55:13,560 --> 00:55:15,680
And I think it's a good
comparison, but I'm not going to
1459
00:55:15,680 --> 00:55:18,120
fully accept it.
The whole volunteering because
1460
00:55:18,840 --> 00:55:21,400
first of first of all,
volunteering at a place that's
1461
00:55:21,400 --> 00:55:23,400
exclusively made for
volunteering and built from the
1462
00:55:23,400 --> 00:55:26,480
ground up as a voluntary to me,
it's very different to you go
1463
00:55:26,480 --> 00:55:28,320
into a job and you're gaslight
into thinking you have to
1464
00:55:28,320 --> 00:55:30,560
volunteer to get the job done.
I don't know, it's different.
1465
00:55:30,560 --> 00:55:33,160
It's slightly different in my
head, but my, my opinion is
1466
00:55:33,160 --> 00:55:36,640
this.
I, I don't think the teachers
1467
00:55:36,640 --> 00:55:38,520
are going to help themselves.
I'm being pessimistic.
1468
00:55:38,520 --> 00:55:41,440
And I think the only thing we
can do now from like almost like
1469
00:55:41,440 --> 00:55:45,760
a top down approach is literally
tell people to stop doing it and
1470
00:55:45,760 --> 00:55:48,080
not celebrate it at all.
So if someone goes above and
1471
00:55:48,080 --> 00:55:50,400
beyond, we're going to call it,
it sounds really awful because
1472
00:55:50,400 --> 00:55:51,880
it sounds like a great thing to
do above and beyond.
1473
00:55:52,000 --> 00:55:55,280
If someone does loads of extra
workload, right that way more
1474
00:55:55,280 --> 00:55:56,960
than they should have done.
What more than that paid for?
1475
00:55:57,240 --> 00:56:01,000
I think we should actually, the
response from SLT and anyone top
1476
00:56:01,000 --> 00:56:03,840
down should be oh crikey, what
happened there?
1477
00:56:04,480 --> 00:56:06,480
Oh dear, that's not good.
Okay, let's look into that.
1478
00:56:06,480 --> 00:56:08,160
Let's have a meeting next week
and find out why.
1479
00:56:08,440 --> 00:56:10,440
Why you take you book Simon 6.
That's what I think.
1480
00:56:10,440 --> 00:56:13,400
And I think it should almost be
seen as like, oh, slap on the
1481
00:56:13,400 --> 00:56:13,880
wrist.
Sure.
1482
00:56:14,120 --> 00:56:15,600
I don't think it should be the
way around.
1483
00:56:15,600 --> 00:56:17,320
Yeah, Yeah, I really do think.
I know.
1484
00:56:17,360 --> 00:56:19,600
I know that almost like punishes
people that do just want to go
1485
00:56:19,600 --> 00:56:20,720
and do the extra things for
their kids.
1486
00:56:20,720 --> 00:56:23,080
And I'm not saying they
shouldn't shouldn't be able to
1487
00:56:23,080 --> 00:56:25,680
do it, but what I'm saying is we
need to have such a firm
1488
00:56:25,680 --> 00:56:28,240
approach of this isn't the bar,
not just from them saying this
1489
00:56:28,240 --> 00:56:31,080
isn't the bar from from a
leadership government, everyone
1490
00:56:31,080 --> 00:56:34,080
else from top down saying this
is not the bar to so much
1491
00:56:34,080 --> 00:56:35,920
degree.
This is how serious we are about
1492
00:56:35,920 --> 00:56:36,840
it.
We're gonna have meetings about
1493
00:56:36,840 --> 00:56:38,560
it.
And if anyone goes above this,
1494
00:56:38,560 --> 00:56:41,440
then there's a there's a problem
in your school like, and it has
1495
00:56:41,440 --> 00:56:44,520
to be totally LED from the top
down, not celebrated at all.
1496
00:56:44,800 --> 00:56:47,920
And until we fix this culture, I
think it needs to be quite
1497
00:56:47,920 --> 00:56:48,920
draconian.
And like that.
1498
00:56:48,920 --> 00:56:51,400
I really do think that because
the culture is broken, when a
1499
00:56:51,400 --> 00:56:53,080
broken system, do we want
teachers or not?
1500
00:56:53,320 --> 00:56:55,480
If we do, we need to fix this
and we need to be hard on it,
1501
00:56:55,720 --> 00:56:58,120
put our foot down.
Nope, you can't do that anymore.
1502
00:56:58,120 --> 00:57:00,320
You are not being efficient.
You are not a good, good role
1503
00:57:00,320 --> 00:57:02,240
model for other teachers.
Loads of other teachers now are
1504
00:57:02,240 --> 00:57:05,040
going to have a really rubbish
time because they're, they're
1505
00:57:05,040 --> 00:57:07,040
seeing you do all these things.
They think it's expectation,
1506
00:57:07,040 --> 00:57:09,200
whether you say it is or not.
So we're going to stop you doing
1507
00:57:09,200 --> 00:57:11,680
that.
Like I I know it's harsh but I
1508
00:57:11,680 --> 00:57:12,920
just don't see any other way of
fixing.
1509
00:57:12,920 --> 00:57:14,520
It I guess we you absolutely
yeah.
1510
00:57:14,520 --> 00:57:17,000
No, it's really interesting.
I don't I don't think I disagree
1511
00:57:17,000 --> 00:57:18,000
with you.
I really don't.
1512
00:57:18,000 --> 00:57:22,440
I just, I wouldn't want to
discredit someone who's just
1513
00:57:22,440 --> 00:57:24,040
doing something out of the love
of their own heart.
1514
00:57:24,040 --> 00:57:27,120
Do you know what the problem?
You're right.
1515
00:57:27,120 --> 00:57:29,240
The toxicity comes when it's
expected from everyone.
1516
00:57:29,600 --> 00:57:31,600
And I get what you're saying
about we're too far down the
1517
00:57:31,600 --> 00:57:33,720
road where we need to force it.
I guess we've kind of creeped
1518
00:57:33,720 --> 00:57:35,640
into the last section here,
which we'll go through quickly.
1519
00:57:35,640 --> 00:57:37,040
It's just like, OK, how can we
solve it?
1520
00:57:37,040 --> 00:57:38,480
Can I just do one?
I know you want to move on.
1521
00:57:38,480 --> 00:57:40,200
Can I do one last analogy?
Is this something that really
1522
00:57:40,200 --> 00:57:41,840
happened about eight years ago?
Right.
1523
00:57:41,880 --> 00:57:43,840
And it's a really good example
of exactly what you just said,
1524
00:57:43,840 --> 00:57:45,440
goodness of your own heart, not
discrediting it.
1525
00:57:45,640 --> 00:57:47,960
I know a story in which someone
and I don't what you feel about
1526
00:57:47,960 --> 00:57:49,800
this where someone got
discredited for doing something
1527
00:57:49,800 --> 00:57:51,880
out the goodness their own heart
because it made everyone else
1528
00:57:51,880 --> 00:57:54,480
look bad, which was I know a
teacher who many, many years
1529
00:57:54,480 --> 00:57:56,680
ago, smiling as you probably
know what it is, who brought in
1530
00:57:56,680 --> 00:57:58,680
an Easter egg for every child in
that class, Right.
1531
00:57:59,080 --> 00:58:00,920
Really lovely thing to do.
They went and spent their own
1532
00:58:00,920 --> 00:58:02,760
money and time after school
bought an Easter egg for every
1533
00:58:02,760 --> 00:58:05,520
single child in their class.
But it was a massive school and
1534
00:58:05,520 --> 00:58:07,600
no one else did that.
It wasn't the expectation.
1535
00:58:07,600 --> 00:58:10,560
And by comparison, every other
child in the group that wasn't
1536
00:58:10,560 --> 00:58:12,120
in that class was like, oh, why
do they get that?
1537
00:58:12,120 --> 00:58:14,200
And some of your parents even
said, my child, oh, I don't
1538
00:58:14,200 --> 00:58:16,120
think you, I don't think you
realise, but my child didn't get
1539
00:58:16,120 --> 00:58:17,760
one of those Easter eggs.
I was like, yeah, they're not in
1540
00:58:17,760 --> 00:58:19,760
that class.
And that was to me, it was a
1541
00:58:19,760 --> 00:58:21,800
really good example of and I
didn't know where I felt about
1542
00:58:21,800 --> 00:58:23,720
that because that teacher was
almost punished for doing that.
1543
00:58:24,600 --> 00:58:25,840
And I was like, oh, I don't
know.
1544
00:58:25,840 --> 00:58:29,000
Because part of me is like,
yeah, that was a bit mental.
1545
00:58:29,160 --> 00:58:31,240
They shouldn't do that because
you know what it did set a bar,
1546
00:58:31,240 --> 00:58:33,640
whether they like to think it or
not, it did.
1547
00:58:33,640 --> 00:58:35,440
But they were being just being
kind.
1548
00:58:35,840 --> 00:58:38,160
This is but this is where I'm
now like, you know what?
1549
00:58:38,160 --> 00:58:39,520
It needs to just needs to be a
foot down.
1550
00:58:39,520 --> 00:58:40,880
I'm sorry.
It's going to hurt some feelings
1551
00:58:40,880 --> 00:58:42,280
something.
But oh, but I want to be nice.
1552
00:58:42,280 --> 00:58:43,240
You know what?
Cool.
1553
00:58:43,240 --> 00:58:44,200
You want to be nice.
But you know what?
1554
00:58:44,200 --> 00:58:45,520
I want teachers to stay in the
job.
1555
00:58:45,600 --> 00:58:47,520
And that is more important to me
than you feeling good about
1556
00:58:47,520 --> 00:58:49,400
yourself.
Honestly I don't care, just I'd
1557
00:58:49,400 --> 00:58:50,680
rather we just had teachers in
the job.
1558
00:58:50,680 --> 00:58:53,680
No, I can't disagree with that.
I think you're absolutely right.
1559
00:58:53,680 --> 00:58:55,200
And that's one big part of what
we're saying.
1560
00:58:55,200 --> 00:58:59,200
How to fix it is top down has to
be stringent and I think really
1561
00:58:59,200 --> 00:59:01,240
clear expectations because I
think we're wishy washy.
1562
00:59:01,240 --> 00:59:02,880
I think the government are wishy
washy.
1563
00:59:02,880 --> 00:59:05,400
I think leadership can be wishy
washy because you know what, if
1564
00:59:05,440 --> 00:59:07,880
I'm getting more out of someone,
why would I stop them?
1565
00:59:07,880 --> 00:59:10,080
That's very much a kind of idea,
OK.
1566
00:59:10,080 --> 00:59:12,840
And, and that idea that some
leaders have where they're like,
1567
00:59:13,480 --> 00:59:15,200
you know, if you went to them
and said, you know, I've got too
1568
00:59:15,200 --> 00:59:17,680
much on, I'm not going to get
this done.
1569
00:59:18,200 --> 00:59:20,080
And the leader's like, oh, no,
of course that's fine.
1570
00:59:20,280 --> 00:59:21,960
That's, that's lovely.
That's really nice.
1571
00:59:22,200 --> 00:59:26,000
But then, but then when what
happens, there is no one else
1572
00:59:26,000 --> 00:59:28,440
gets told that information, it
builds resentment.
1573
00:59:28,480 --> 00:59:30,880
It does like, and if you're a
martyr and you're thinking, OK,
1574
00:59:31,280 --> 00:59:32,720
I'm, I'm kind of on the side of
the martyr here.
1575
00:59:32,720 --> 00:59:35,480
If you see that you're going to
be with resentful, you're going
1576
00:59:35,480 --> 00:59:38,280
to think you've got to do it.
And you might not think as
1577
00:59:38,280 --> 00:59:40,520
someone who's turned into a
teacher martyr, you're just
1578
00:59:40,520 --> 00:59:42,280
doing your job.
Maybe you're just doing
1579
00:59:42,280 --> 00:59:43,480
everything that's expected of
you.
1580
00:59:43,840 --> 00:59:45,640
Why is that my fault?
Of course it's not my fault.
1581
00:59:45,640 --> 00:59:46,600
Everyone else should be doing
it.
1582
00:59:46,600 --> 00:59:51,040
It's our job.
It's like, OK #1 the top down
1583
00:59:51,040 --> 00:59:53,320
needs to be really clear because
if it's OK for someone else to
1584
00:59:53,320 --> 00:59:55,560
not do it, then it's OK for
everyone to not do it.
1585
00:59:55,840 --> 00:59:58,600
You can't just, you can't just
say again, oh, the goodness of
1586
00:59:58,600 --> 01:00:00,320
your own heart, I'm going to get
more out of this person.
1587
01:00:00,520 --> 01:00:02,720
It's obviously not OK.
We've talked about top down
1588
01:00:02,720 --> 01:00:05,880
government, top down SLT.
I want to talk about two other
1589
01:00:05,880 --> 01:00:07,640
groups.
OK, I'm going to, I'm going to
1590
01:00:07,640 --> 01:00:09,720
keep going with people who
aren't themselves a martyr.
1591
01:00:09,720 --> 01:00:12,360
So this, the first group I'm
going to talk about is teachers
1592
01:00:12,360 --> 01:00:15,160
like me and you, teachers who
don't mind standing up and
1593
01:00:15,160 --> 01:00:16,480
saying, no, I don't think we
should do this.
1594
01:00:16,480 --> 01:00:19,760
I think this is wrong.
What can we do, do you think?
1595
01:00:19,760 --> 01:00:22,280
Would you say in terms of, OK,
there's teacher martyrs in our
1596
01:00:22,280 --> 01:00:24,560
school?
Because I'm quite hopeless.
1597
01:00:24,640 --> 01:00:26,880
I, I think, I think there's some
you can get to.
1598
01:00:27,120 --> 01:00:28,800
I think you, you can't do other
things.
1599
01:00:28,800 --> 01:00:31,240
So is there anything we can do
to be like, OK, look, it's
1600
01:00:31,240 --> 01:00:34,160
impacting me at this point, so
can I try and solve this?
1601
01:00:34,160 --> 01:00:35,000
Problem.
Oh, I don't know, do you know
1602
01:00:35,000 --> 01:00:36,600
what we, we can, we've said
these things before.
1603
01:00:36,600 --> 01:00:39,480
I think you can take a bit of
more control of your own
1604
01:00:39,480 --> 01:00:40,800
workload.
That you mean you've mentioned
1605
01:00:40,800 --> 01:00:42,760
prioritising already.
I mean, a really good example.
1606
01:00:42,920 --> 01:00:44,080
We talked about parents evening,
right?
1607
01:00:44,840 --> 01:00:45,920
We had parents evening last
night.
1608
01:00:46,200 --> 01:00:48,440
Our parents even started
literally 5 minutes after the
1609
01:00:48,440 --> 01:00:50,040
kids went home and it went on
for six hours.
1610
01:00:50,800 --> 01:00:54,600
OK should anyone be expected to
mark in those lessons, those
1611
01:00:54,600 --> 01:00:56,840
lessons for that day?
Sorry, honestly no.
1612
01:00:56,840 --> 01:00:58,040
Do you know what you mark after
school?
1613
01:00:58,040 --> 01:01:00,280
And if it has to be marked for
the next day, it's totally
1614
01:01:00,280 --> 01:01:04,000
unreasonable and and I feel like
all teachers should have the
1615
01:01:04,000 --> 01:01:06,360
common sense to be like it's
completely acceptable.
1616
01:01:06,360 --> 01:01:08,680
I don't mark and no one would
even challenge that honestly
1617
01:01:08,680 --> 01:01:10,480
because anyone arguing
differently I'd say I was at
1618
01:01:10,480 --> 01:01:11,520
work till 9:00 PM.
Do you know that?
1619
01:01:12,160 --> 01:01:14,040
Oh yeah, you were sorry.
So at what point did SLT not
1620
01:01:14,040 --> 01:01:15,480
have to say something?
It's just like, come on, guys.
1621
01:01:15,520 --> 01:01:17,040
I know.
So I do agree that I do.
1622
01:01:17,040 --> 01:01:19,080
I actually think it's more
impactful than SLT.
1623
01:01:19,080 --> 01:01:22,040
So should come in and say have
rule like really firm
1624
01:01:22,040 --> 01:01:24,120
expectations of oh, by the way
guys, it's parents leaving this
1625
01:01:24,120 --> 01:01:25,040
day.
I know you're all working from
1626
01:01:25,040 --> 01:01:26,640
three till 6:00 PM after a day
of work.
1627
01:01:27,080 --> 01:01:30,640
It's clear expectation here.
Nobody marks today's work
1628
01:01:30,640 --> 01:01:32,840
exactly everyone, none of you
are to mark today's work.
1629
01:01:32,840 --> 01:01:35,040
What you did, you don't mark.
It oh, but I want to because I
1630
01:01:35,040 --> 01:01:36,080
love my kids.
Nope, stop it.
1631
01:01:36,480 --> 01:01:37,840
You're in trouble.
That's not coming back in now.
1632
01:01:37,960 --> 01:01:39,200
No, don't do it because you're
setting it.
1633
01:01:39,760 --> 01:01:42,720
You're setting a really bad
example for everyone else here.
1634
01:01:42,720 --> 01:01:44,600
Did you know that that's what
you're doing by going above and
1635
01:01:44,600 --> 01:01:46,760
beyond, you're setting a really
bad example of everybody else.
1636
01:01:46,760 --> 01:01:48,680
Stop.
It so that situation next next
1637
01:01:48,680 --> 01:01:51,680
step along teachers who aren't
martyrs and who are like very
1638
01:01:51,680 --> 01:01:54,760
happy to do that.
You would say in that situation
1639
01:01:54,760 --> 01:01:58,160
we should be saying to other
people is, you know, should we
1640
01:01:58,160 --> 01:02:00,920
be vocal is what I'm saying?
Should people like like what can
1641
01:02:00,920 --> 01:02:03,080
we do then?
Like should we be the one to say
1642
01:02:03,080 --> 01:02:05,480
to him, no, don't do that.
Or are we just barking up the
1643
01:02:05,480 --> 01:02:06,360
wrong?
Tree No, definitely.
1644
01:02:06,360 --> 01:02:07,720
Do you know what people are
scared to stand up for
1645
01:02:07,720 --> 01:02:09,480
themselves.
So people people that are OK
1646
01:02:09,480 --> 01:02:12,320
like us to just go and say
something, absolutely use your
1647
01:02:12,320 --> 01:02:13,880
voice.
Get as many people on side as
1648
01:02:13,880 --> 01:02:15,240
you can to say sort of certain
things.
1649
01:02:15,240 --> 01:02:17,040
You can have a target on your
back sometimes when you do that.
1650
01:02:17,320 --> 01:02:19,160
Yeah.
Like, do you just have to build
1651
01:02:19,160 --> 01:02:20,080
thick skin?
Is that what?
1652
01:02:20,080 --> 01:02:20,960
You're saying.
What do you think?
1653
01:02:21,200 --> 01:02:25,080
I, I, I personally feel like I'm
getting to the point where I'm
1654
01:02:25,080 --> 01:02:27,160
rubbing people out the wrong way
because I'm so consistent with
1655
01:02:27,160 --> 01:02:32,480
saying listen no.
And, and my my view of it is if
1656
01:02:32,480 --> 01:02:36,640
you've, if you get annoyed at me
for doing that, that's your
1657
01:02:36,640 --> 01:02:38,680
problem.
I'm going to carry on doing it
1658
01:02:38,680 --> 01:02:39,680
because to me it's more
important.
1659
01:02:39,880 --> 01:02:41,280
I think.
I think you have to build a bit
1660
01:02:41,280 --> 01:02:44,600
of a thick skin as a teacher
who's saying no, Yeah, I think
1661
01:02:44,600 --> 01:02:47,800
you have to get over the fact
some people won't appreciate it
1662
01:02:48,080 --> 01:02:50,280
and some people, some people
will think you're a worse
1663
01:02:50,280 --> 01:02:51,360
teacher.
Yeah, yeah.
1664
01:02:51,480 --> 01:02:53,560
OK, they will.
I suppose the blurred line here
1665
01:02:53,560 --> 01:02:56,640
is we're not excusing being a
bad teacher.
1666
01:02:56,800 --> 01:02:58,280
Yeah, because you know what?
It's not like every, every.
1667
01:02:58,280 --> 01:03:00,240
I'm not going to say every
teacher is fantastic because
1668
01:03:00,240 --> 01:03:02,360
they passed a course.
Some teachers aren't very good
1669
01:03:02,360 --> 01:03:04,120
and they need help, right?
Not many, though.
1670
01:03:04,120 --> 01:03:05,440
Most of us, we know exactly what
we're doing.
1671
01:03:05,440 --> 01:03:08,480
And what I'm not doing is
excusing, oh, if your, if your
1672
01:03:08,480 --> 01:03:11,640
SLT are telling you that you
need to, that your, your lessons
1673
01:03:11,640 --> 01:03:13,320
are completely inadequate and
you're not even teaching the
1674
01:03:13,320 --> 01:03:15,160
right curriculum.
I'm not saying, yeah, just tell
1675
01:03:15,160 --> 01:03:16,280
them, no, I'm not one of these.
Right.
1676
01:03:16,280 --> 01:03:18,000
Exactly.
There are some things where it's
1677
01:03:18,000 --> 01:03:19,760
like, no, actually you are
accountable for your job.
1678
01:03:19,960 --> 01:03:22,600
But if, if it's your SLT telling
you to do all of those clerical
1679
01:03:22,600 --> 01:03:24,600
things that we've literally said
of the government have made a
1680
01:03:24,600 --> 01:03:25,800
list of things you don't need to
do anymore.
1681
01:03:25,800 --> 01:03:28,200
And your SLT are saying, or can
you do these things still?
1682
01:03:28,640 --> 01:03:30,880
No.
And yeah, like you said, you
1683
01:03:30,880 --> 01:03:32,200
gotta have thick skin.
You've got to stand up for
1684
01:03:32,200 --> 01:03:33,720
yourself.
And you know what, you're then
1685
01:03:33,720 --> 01:03:36,240
the role model to that some of
those martyrs might convert.
1686
01:03:36,440 --> 01:03:38,200
We need to convert some of these
people, people like used like
1687
01:03:38,200 --> 01:03:40,480
they converted when we striked
because they found out enough
1688
01:03:40,480 --> 01:03:41,920
people striking so they weren't
alone.
1689
01:03:42,080 --> 01:03:44,240
If enough people are saying no,
actually we're not doing this
1690
01:03:44,240 --> 01:03:46,280
anymore, some of those people
might then convert as well and
1691
01:03:46,280 --> 01:03:48,080
be like, oh, actually, yeah, I
can say no, I can.
1692
01:03:48,680 --> 01:03:51,080
I can have a life if I want to.
I don't have to live and breathe
1693
01:03:51,080 --> 01:03:52,880
this job.
OK, so last thing, we're going
1694
01:03:52,880 --> 01:03:54,680
to talk about the martyrs
themselves.
1695
01:03:54,680 --> 01:03:56,880
If you're listening to this and
you've gone through all this and
1696
01:03:56,880 --> 01:03:59,400
you think you fit the category
of the people, basically we've
1697
01:03:59,440 --> 01:04:02,080
spent an hour ranting about
ranting, ranting, ranting.
1698
01:04:02,960 --> 01:04:06,120
You might be thinking, Oh, well,
that's a bit, I feel a bit crap
1699
01:04:06,120 --> 01:04:07,760
now.
What?
1700
01:04:07,800 --> 01:04:11,480
What can they do themselves?
What, what?
1701
01:04:11,560 --> 01:04:15,320
Because to me, OK, this is all
well and good saying top down in
1702
01:04:15,320 --> 01:04:16,960
this exact situation.
We're talking about where you've
1703
01:04:16,960 --> 01:04:19,120
been very clear.
We're not talking about toxic
1704
01:04:19,120 --> 01:04:20,760
schools.
We're not talking about things
1705
01:04:20,760 --> 01:04:22,800
you have no control of.
We're not talking about, you
1706
01:04:22,800 --> 01:04:24,360
know, teaching and learning,
which is really important.
1707
01:04:25,080 --> 01:04:27,280
We're talking about those extra
stuff which pushes people over
1708
01:04:27,280 --> 01:04:28,640
the edge that you still choose
to do.
1709
01:04:28,840 --> 01:04:31,680
For me, 95% of it has to come
from that person themselves.
1710
01:04:31,800 --> 01:04:34,160
I've seen it myself.
It's like whacking your head
1711
01:04:34,160 --> 01:04:36,080
against a brick wall sometimes
telling someone to not do
1712
01:04:36,080 --> 01:04:37,440
something.
It's a top down and bottom up
1713
01:04:37,520 --> 01:04:38,880
approach.
It really is like the people
1714
01:04:38,880 --> 01:04:41,840
that master at the bottom.
You have a you can't just wait
1715
01:04:41,840 --> 01:04:43,760
for people to save you.
Honestly, it's because it's not
1716
01:04:43,760 --> 01:04:44,600
working.
There's too many of you.
1717
01:04:44,880 --> 01:04:46,320
That is the that is the old
problem.
1718
01:04:46,320 --> 01:04:47,800
There's too many of you.
It is.
1719
01:04:47,800 --> 01:04:50,000
It's ruining this profession,
totally ruining this profession.
1720
01:04:50,360 --> 01:04:52,600
The government can even come in
with a list and literally say
1721
01:04:52,600 --> 01:04:54,360
you don't have to do these
things anymore and you'll still
1722
01:04:54,480 --> 01:04:56,280
do them.
It's like what is wrong with?
1723
01:04:56,280 --> 01:04:56,840
What is?
Wrong with us.
1724
01:04:56,840 --> 01:04:59,720
So at what point do we have to
just say it's on us?
1725
01:04:59,720 --> 01:05:00,960
Yeah, it's on us.
It's on you.
1726
01:05:00,960 --> 01:05:03,960
Stop doing it seriously.
And I'm hoping, you know, I
1727
01:05:03,960 --> 01:05:05,440
can't imagine.
We've got many people, I think
1728
01:05:05,440 --> 01:05:07,440
the audience that we get
ironically listening to this and
1729
01:05:07,520 --> 01:05:09,840
or not typically those people.
But if if we do.
1730
01:05:09,840 --> 01:05:11,480
But share this, give this to
someone.
1731
01:05:11,640 --> 01:05:13,720
Tell them because you know what?
I want to talk to you as well.
1732
01:05:13,920 --> 01:05:15,320
Talk to me, message me.
Tell us.
1733
01:05:15,320 --> 01:05:17,640
We're wrong for some, like for
some reason in here.
1734
01:05:17,640 --> 01:05:19,880
If you've got no, no, no, it's
not acceptable, talk to me.
1735
01:05:19,880 --> 01:05:21,240
We can debate.
We can be adults.
1736
01:05:21,240 --> 01:05:24,240
We can be proper like grown-ups.
And there will be nuances 100%
1737
01:05:24,240 --> 01:05:27,920
there'll be, there'll be,
there'll be fringe examples
1738
01:05:27,920 --> 01:05:29,560
where it's like, oh, this just
doesn't apply.
1739
01:05:29,560 --> 01:05:32,640
And you know what, that's fine.
But actually, but on the whole,
1740
01:05:32,720 --> 01:05:34,440
this is the problem with
education.
1741
01:05:34,560 --> 01:05:37,440
There are too many teachers
martyring themselves for this
1742
01:05:37,440 --> 01:05:40,280
job, so many that people that
don't want to do it and actually
1743
01:05:40,280 --> 01:05:43,080
want to change it for you so
that you can have a better work
1744
01:05:43,080 --> 01:05:45,440
life balance don't have a voice.
There's not enough of us.
1745
01:05:45,440 --> 01:05:47,840
We don't have power.
We need collective action.
1746
01:05:48,200 --> 01:05:50,840
Unionise, you know, unions help.
I've heard of some schools that
1747
01:05:50,840 --> 01:05:53,800
have unions, union reps in
school who take that role really
1748
01:05:53,800 --> 01:05:55,840
seriously.
And they will have, you know,
1749
01:05:55,840 --> 01:05:58,880
group chats with everyone.
They'll have staff meetings that
1750
01:05:58,880 --> 01:06:01,080
are just for all the union.
People and I like that they'll
1751
01:06:01,080 --> 01:06:02,840
vote on something.
Yeah, where they'll all say, do
1752
01:06:02,840 --> 01:06:04,640
we all agree that this is
completely mental, that this
1753
01:06:04,640 --> 01:06:06,960
decision that our bosses have
told us is completely mental?
1754
01:06:06,960 --> 01:06:08,000
Do you all agree?
Yeah.
1755
01:06:08,000 --> 01:06:10,280
Cool.
Well, OK, there's twelve of us
1756
01:06:10,280 --> 01:06:11,880
here, so do you know what?
We're all going to go say we're
1757
01:06:11,880 --> 01:06:12,720
not doing this thing and
they'll.
1758
01:06:12,720 --> 01:06:14,520
Bloody.
And do you know what, even when
1759
01:06:14,600 --> 01:06:17,840
what I love about unionising,
which I would strongly tell
1760
01:06:17,840 --> 01:06:20,720
everyone to do, if you have a
vote and they'll say it's seven
1761
01:06:20,720 --> 01:06:24,200
to five, the five say, OK, yeah,
of course we lost the vote.
1762
01:06:24,280 --> 01:06:25,800
And as a 12, they still go
together.
1763
01:06:26,000 --> 01:06:28,360
It's not like, you know, this
whole point of a union, you
1764
01:06:28,360 --> 01:06:30,240
don't just like vote on it and
then six, go away and do
1765
01:06:30,240 --> 01:06:31,960
something.
You're part of the union.
1766
01:06:31,960 --> 01:06:34,120
You back each other up.
If you think something's too far
1767
01:06:34,120 --> 01:06:35,920
maybe or not, OK, let's do a
vote.
1768
01:06:36,120 --> 01:06:39,000
If your unions voted to do
something, you do it.
1769
01:06:39,160 --> 01:06:40,880
So even if you voted no, do you
know what?
1770
01:06:40,920 --> 01:06:43,720
No, We've got a voice of 12
teachers here who are saying no.
1771
01:06:43,720 --> 01:06:46,720
Let's do.
And I think if you want to be
1772
01:06:46,720 --> 01:06:48,960
serious about it, there's, you
know, you might get, again,
1773
01:06:48,960 --> 01:06:50,920
thick skin is what you need.
People are going to go after you
1774
01:06:50,920 --> 01:06:52,720
if they don't want unions.
Like that's obviously going to
1775
01:06:52,720 --> 01:06:54,920
be a thing.
But you've got to, if you really
1776
01:06:54,920 --> 01:06:56,200
want to change it, you've got to
try and do it.
1777
01:06:56,280 --> 01:06:57,360
Yeah, definitely.
Nice one.
1778
01:06:57,360 --> 01:06:58,480
It's been an interesting
episode.
1779
01:06:59,120 --> 01:07:01,360
It's been very ranty, but like
you said, it's not negative.
1780
01:07:01,360 --> 01:07:03,800
It is.
It's reflective, it's real, it
1781
01:07:03,800 --> 01:07:05,720
is the problem.
If you can't see that this is
1782
01:07:05,720 --> 01:07:07,160
the problem.
I don't know what world of
1783
01:07:07,160 --> 01:07:08,840
teaching you're living in, but
it is a problem.
1784
01:07:09,200 --> 01:07:11,920
And as I said, losing the world
to live, can we please change it
1785
01:07:11,920 --> 01:07:14,080
so that I can see some hope,
Because I am.
1786
01:07:14,120 --> 01:07:16,440
There is no light the end of the
tunnel for me anymore.
1787
01:07:16,840 --> 01:07:17,840
I just can't.
You know, we've done this
1788
01:07:17,840 --> 01:07:20,320
podcast a year and a half.
I can't even change the minds of
1789
01:07:20,320 --> 01:07:22,520
the people closest to me by
myself.
1790
01:07:22,840 --> 01:07:24,720
The next step is it has to be
collective if we're going to
1791
01:07:24,720 --> 01:07:27,640
change this culture.
Wow.
1792
01:07:28,120 --> 01:07:29,840
OK, let's wrap it up there,
shall we?
1793
01:07:29,840 --> 01:07:31,440
Yeah.
I mean, it's truthful.
1794
01:07:31,440 --> 01:07:33,520
And you know what a lot of
people tell us in messages,
1795
01:07:34,080 --> 01:07:36,560
you're saying what we think and
there's not a voice out there
1796
01:07:36,560 --> 01:07:38,240
saying this.
You'll very easily go out and
1797
01:07:38,240 --> 01:07:40,520
find a voice that says this new
pedagogy is really good.
1798
01:07:40,520 --> 01:07:42,720
We should spend 7 hours doing
CPD to learn all this stuff
1799
01:07:42,720 --> 01:07:43,720
because it's really good for the
kids.
1800
01:07:44,440 --> 01:07:45,280
Awesome.
Do you know what?
1801
01:07:45,280 --> 01:07:46,560
I'm realistic.
I'm a normal man.
1802
01:07:46,880 --> 01:07:47,960
I'm a teacher.
I love my job.
1803
01:07:47,960 --> 01:07:49,920
I'm good at it.
This parts mentor, we're gonna
1804
01:07:49,920 --> 01:07:51,840
talk about it.
We're going to call it out.
1805
01:07:51,920 --> 01:07:53,520
And if we're gonna change it,
this is how we can.
1806
01:07:53,520 --> 01:07:55,240
Do we're talking to you, so
please do write in.
1807
01:07:55,240 --> 01:07:56,280
Dylan loves it.
I love it.
1808
01:07:56,280 --> 01:07:57,920
He sends me all the messages we
get through.
1809
01:07:58,040 --> 01:08:00,360
I really love reading them and
especially if you challenge us
1810
01:08:00,360 --> 01:08:01,720
as well.
You know what it makes us think
1811
01:08:01,720 --> 01:08:04,120
and that's what we had to do.
We think on this podcast and
1812
01:08:04,160 --> 01:08:05,240
look forward to hearing from you
all.
1813
01:08:05,280 --> 01:08:06,760
But mainly if you want to give
us some praise.
1814
01:08:07,480 --> 01:08:10,040
And and a lovely Spotify review.
And yeah.
1815
01:08:10,320 --> 01:08:12,800
And anything like that be great.
Lovely reviews in general.
1816
01:08:12,800 --> 01:08:14,160
Leave as a comment.
If you listen on Spotify,
1817
01:08:14,160 --> 01:08:15,360
comments get automatically
published.
1818
01:08:15,360 --> 01:08:16,840
Now you can save you one.
Just appears.
1819
01:08:17,399 --> 01:08:20,000
Guys, thank you so much.
You see them, see you, then see
1820
01:08:20,000 --> 01:08:20,399
you next time.
00:00:00,080 --> 00:00:02,440
Hello everyone, and welcome back
to another episode of Teach
2
00:00:02,440 --> 00:00:03,840
Sleep Repeat.
My name is Dylan.
3
00:00:03,840 --> 00:00:05,800
And my name is Hayden.
Quick disclaimer for this
4
00:00:05,800 --> 00:00:07,280
episode.
This episode is going to be a
5
00:00:07,280 --> 00:00:09,800
little bit unhinged because I'm
losing the will to live as a
6
00:00:09,800 --> 00:00:11,120
teacher.
How are you, Dylan?
7
00:00:11,800 --> 00:00:15,120
What a way to start.
Welcome everyone, new teachers
8
00:00:15,120 --> 00:00:18,040
alike.
I needed to say it because you
9
00:00:18,040 --> 00:00:19,560
know what?
We are going to rant in this
10
00:00:19,560 --> 00:00:21,520
episode because you're.
Very.
11
00:00:21,520 --> 00:00:23,120
Loud.
I'm not getting really angry.
12
00:00:23,120 --> 00:00:25,120
We've planned this episode and
you know what?
13
00:00:25,120 --> 00:00:27,000
It is a bit of a moaner.
It is a bit of a ranter.
14
00:00:27,280 --> 00:00:29,720
At the end, we'll try and, you
know, give some suggestions.
15
00:00:29,720 --> 00:00:33,040
We're not just moan, but this
episode is one of those episodes
16
00:00:33,040 --> 00:00:35,400
for if you are also losing the
will to live as a teacher right
17
00:00:35,400 --> 00:00:38,800
now because of the state of
teaching, then hopefully you can
18
00:00:38,800 --> 00:00:40,160
rant along with us in this
episode.
19
00:00:40,160 --> 00:00:41,680
And I just wanted to say that at
the start.
20
00:00:41,680 --> 00:00:43,480
I wanted to say something then
based on what you've just said
21
00:00:43,480 --> 00:00:45,600
that because I think you need to
calm down for a second.
22
00:00:45,920 --> 00:00:47,440
OK?
But you're absolutely right.
23
00:00:47,440 --> 00:00:50,160
And we always worry.
And I'm going to say this as my
24
00:00:50,160 --> 00:00:51,760
disclaimer.
We always worry, don't we, when
25
00:00:51,760 --> 00:00:54,080
we talk about these things.
I think we're getting over it.
26
00:00:54,440 --> 00:00:55,640
But we used to think, gosh, are
we?
27
00:00:55,640 --> 00:00:58,760
Are we being negative?
And we've had enough people tell
28
00:00:58,760 --> 00:01:02,680
us we're not now, for example,
in the last week, since we've
29
00:01:02,920 --> 00:01:06,600
chatted with Omar last week
about very specific issues that
30
00:01:06,600 --> 00:01:08,520
are quite triggering to some
people because they've gone
31
00:01:08,520 --> 00:01:10,840
through bullying in a school or
been in a toxic school.
32
00:01:11,320 --> 00:01:13,360
It's it's a sensitive subject
almost, isn't it?
33
00:01:13,480 --> 00:01:15,720
But we're talking about it
because, because we think it's
34
00:01:15,720 --> 00:01:18,360
important, because we care about
the job so much.
35
00:01:18,560 --> 00:01:21,400
And enough people have messaged
us and said, thank you for
36
00:01:21,400 --> 00:01:23,920
talking about this.
You, you are the podcast.
37
00:01:23,920 --> 00:01:26,120
Someone said this week, you
guys, this episode.
38
00:01:26,120 --> 00:01:28,880
I wish I had it in my first year
of teaching because I was in a
39
00:01:28,880 --> 00:01:31,440
toxic school.
I kind of ignored those gut
40
00:01:31,440 --> 00:01:32,880
feelings.
We talked about where you feel
41
00:01:32,880 --> 00:01:34,840
like this isn't right, but
everyone else around you just
42
00:01:34,840 --> 00:01:37,280
seems to think it is.
And that's what we're going to
43
00:01:37,280 --> 00:01:38,960
continue doing.
And we're going to talk today
44
00:01:38,960 --> 00:01:41,400
about teacher martyrdom.
And it isn't.
45
00:01:41,440 --> 00:01:44,320
It can be a touchy subject
because we are essentially
46
00:01:44,320 --> 00:01:46,800
placing some blame about the
state of education right now
47
00:01:47,000 --> 00:01:47,920
onto teachers.
Yeah.
48
00:01:48,040 --> 00:01:50,760
And we're teachers ourselves and
and we're the first people to
49
00:01:50,760 --> 00:01:52,800
defend this job and the people
who do an amazing job.
50
00:01:53,240 --> 00:01:55,600
But we have to talk about this.
Yeah, I mean, lots of our
51
00:01:55,600 --> 00:01:57,720
episodes, you know, go back and
listen to episodes where they,
52
00:01:57,720 --> 00:02:01,040
we've done loads on SLT and how
they can help and they can stop,
53
00:02:01,080 --> 00:02:03,520
you know, causing such problems
in school, the government and
54
00:02:03,520 --> 00:02:05,600
how they can help.
Do you know what this episode is
55
00:02:05,600 --> 00:02:06,200
about?
Us.
56
00:02:06,400 --> 00:02:09,240
Yeah, it is about the teachers
at the bottom and things that we
57
00:02:09,240 --> 00:02:12,680
can do to to help fix this
horribly toxic culture of
58
00:02:12,680 --> 00:02:14,280
teaching.
And yeah, specifically the
59
00:02:14,280 --> 00:02:16,600
Martin we we mentioned it with
Omar last week.
60
00:02:16,600 --> 00:02:18,840
It was a really, I mean, you
said you got, we got lots of
61
00:02:18,840 --> 00:02:22,320
nice back back section where we
just briefly touched on being a
62
00:02:22,320 --> 00:02:22,800
martyr.
Well.
63
00:02:22,800 --> 00:02:24,160
Everyone can think of 1, can't
they?
64
00:02:24,160 --> 00:02:26,240
Everyone can think of what we're
saying whilst we're doing our
65
00:02:26,240 --> 00:02:27,240
introduction.
Just have a think.
66
00:02:27,240 --> 00:02:28,600
What's martyrdom to you?
What does it look like?
67
00:02:28,600 --> 00:02:29,760
And we'll tell you what we think
it is.
68
00:02:30,000 --> 00:02:32,120
But let's just chill out for 5
minutes, have a little catch up,
69
00:02:32,440 --> 00:02:34,800
we'll play the Jingle and then
yeah, guys, stick around because
70
00:02:34,800 --> 00:02:36,840
we're going to really, really
dive into this and I'm really
71
00:02:36,840 --> 00:02:39,200
interested to hear what people
have to say about it as well.
72
00:02:41,800 --> 00:02:43,760
Hayden, let's breathe.
I'm breathing.
73
00:02:44,280 --> 00:02:47,960
And I want to know how your week
was, because for anyone who's
74
00:02:47,960 --> 00:02:50,400
new listener, we are primary
school teachers, we work in
75
00:02:50,400 --> 00:02:51,600
school.
How's it going?
76
00:02:51,880 --> 00:02:55,600
Yeah, it's, you know, it's been
a very normal nice week up until
77
00:02:55,600 --> 00:02:57,960
yesterday in which we had
parents evening and now I'm not
78
00:02:57,960 --> 00:03:00,480
one to hate parents evening.
No, it can be a little bit like
79
00:03:00,480 --> 00:03:03,760
a long, it's a long old day
because our school, I mean,
80
00:03:03,760 --> 00:03:06,480
we've probably mentioned it
before, but our school, if this
81
00:03:06,480 --> 00:03:10,120
is different, we do, we do a
really long one parenting.
82
00:03:10,120 --> 00:03:13,000
We are at school till nine
o'clock 9:00 PM.
83
00:03:13,240 --> 00:03:15,520
So it's an incredibly long day,
but we get it all done in one
84
00:03:15,520 --> 00:03:17,120
go.
So we had that yesterday and
85
00:03:17,120 --> 00:03:19,320
we're recording on a Thursday.
You guys have seen this on a
86
00:03:19,320 --> 00:03:22,560
Monday, But yeah, parents
evening, I'd say for the first
87
00:03:22,560 --> 00:03:26,800
time ever, right?
Every single appointment I had
88
00:03:27,120 --> 00:03:29,640
was extremely positive.
I didn't.
89
00:03:29,640 --> 00:03:31,480
There was absolutely nothing
because there's normally at
90
00:03:31,480 --> 00:03:33,200
least one conversation.
It's a little bit awkward, a
91
00:03:33,200 --> 00:03:34,840
little bit difficult.
You kind of want to say
92
00:03:34,840 --> 00:03:37,160
something and the parent maybe
disagrees, like, oh, no, my
93
00:03:37,160 --> 00:03:39,760
child doesn't lie.
And I'm like, oh, they do, you
94
00:03:39,760 --> 00:03:40,920
know, you have those awkward
conversations.
95
00:03:40,920 --> 00:03:43,400
But last night.
But it just went so smoothly.
96
00:03:43,400 --> 00:03:45,000
It was lovely.
Every conversation was
97
00:03:45,160 --> 00:03:47,560
constructive and it was
brilliant, so actually I had a
98
00:03:47,560 --> 00:03:49,800
really nice time.
So people listening like hear
99
00:03:49,800 --> 00:03:52,600
that and say, Oh, my parents
even didn't go like that.
100
00:03:52,600 --> 00:03:54,400
Would you?
So are you putting that down to
101
00:03:54,400 --> 00:03:55,760
chance?
Are you putting that down to the
102
00:03:55,760 --> 00:03:57,840
fact you're quite experienced
now you can handle the
103
00:03:57,840 --> 00:04:01,240
situations and and do you think
you're better at framing
104
00:04:01,240 --> 00:04:03,640
difficult conversations in a way
where it's still positive?
105
00:04:03,920 --> 00:04:06,000
Or do you think it's kind of out
of your control?
106
00:04:06,000 --> 00:04:08,320
And you know, some parents are
just going to have be really
107
00:04:08,320 --> 00:04:09,920
awkward no matter how
experienced you are.
108
00:04:09,920 --> 00:04:12,320
And you know, you shouldn't
blame yourself hearing you say
109
00:04:12,320 --> 00:04:14,640
how amazing.
I think it was 80% luck,
110
00:04:15,160 --> 00:04:18,120
genuinely 80% and complete luck,
that I just happened to have
111
00:04:18,320 --> 00:04:21,560
loads of really mature parents
who were reflective and were
112
00:04:21,560 --> 00:04:25,440
able to take criticisms.
So did you, were you still, so I
113
00:04:25,440 --> 00:04:28,000
know you said it's positive,
Were you still negative in in
114
00:04:28,000 --> 00:04:31,320
terms of did you still say
things that aren't necessarily
115
00:04:31,320 --> 00:04:31,720
nice?
Things.
116
00:04:31,720 --> 00:04:34,320
Yeah, yeah, absolutely.
I don't have 32 angels in my
117
00:04:34,320 --> 00:04:37,480
class who where I couldn't say a
possible bad thing about them.
118
00:04:37,480 --> 00:04:39,560
Do you know what I mean?
I had lots of conversations
119
00:04:39,560 --> 00:04:41,960
where I was saying negative
things about their children in
120
00:04:41,960 --> 00:04:44,760
terms of our saying things like
when the conversation comes to
121
00:04:44,840 --> 00:04:46,800
mind, oh, you know, your child
has been behaving a lot
122
00:04:46,800 --> 00:04:48,560
recently, been sent out of
class, those of times.
123
00:04:48,560 --> 00:04:50,600
Let's get to the bottom of this.
So I do think there is an
124
00:04:50,600 --> 00:04:53,360
element of you can word it in a
certain way that doesn't get
125
00:04:53,360 --> 00:04:54,240
someones back up.
Yeah.
126
00:04:54,280 --> 00:04:56,160
You know, the whole positive
sandwich approach.
127
00:04:56,160 --> 00:04:57,360
Yeah.
I knew going into that
128
00:04:57,360 --> 00:05:00,120
conversation the first thing I
was going to say was not, oh,
129
00:05:00,120 --> 00:05:01,840
your child is getting sent out
all the time.
130
00:05:01,880 --> 00:05:03,800
Sure.
You know, it was actually, we're
131
00:05:03,800 --> 00:05:05,600
really fond of your child.
We love this about them.
132
00:05:05,600 --> 00:05:06,800
They've got a really funny
personality.
133
00:05:06,800 --> 00:05:08,520
We love it when they get
involved in class, they do all
134
00:05:08,520 --> 00:05:09,720
these things in discussion,
blah, blah, blah.
135
00:05:09,720 --> 00:05:11,240
But unfortunately I don't know
what's going on.
136
00:05:11,240 --> 00:05:14,040
But they've been set out five
times this week and that's a
137
00:05:14,040 --> 00:05:15,760
really difficult thing because
obviously they're not following
138
00:05:15,760 --> 00:05:17,600
our behaviour policy.
Are you seeing it at home?
139
00:05:18,080 --> 00:05:20,480
And we quite often make it a
discussion rather than I'm
140
00:05:20,480 --> 00:05:23,160
telling you off as a parent.
I think that's a mistake I made
141
00:05:23,160 --> 00:05:25,640
earlier on in my career, which
is you just kind of go in
142
00:05:25,640 --> 00:05:27,360
straight for the conflict.
It's like they don't want that.
143
00:05:27,360 --> 00:05:30,520
This is a collective.
Experience, and you don't want
144
00:05:30,520 --> 00:05:31,640
that either.
No, absolutely not.
145
00:05:31,640 --> 00:05:33,960
But it is luck because I have
had previous years where I'm
146
00:05:33,960 --> 00:05:36,640
just as experienced really.
And in terms of my understanding
147
00:05:36,640 --> 00:05:39,920
of how to run a parents evening
where you just, there's nothing
148
00:05:39,920 --> 00:05:42,560
you can say or do, it's going to
turn into some sort of conflict
149
00:05:42,560 --> 00:05:44,600
and be awkward.
So I was very lucky this year
150
00:05:44,600 --> 00:05:47,040
that that it didn't go that way
with anybody.
151
00:05:47,440 --> 00:05:49,120
How was your parents evening?
It was good.
152
00:05:49,240 --> 00:05:52,520
My sorts of parents evening are
always twofold where in the
153
00:05:52,520 --> 00:05:57,240
build up I'm like, oh God, and
I'm interested in what people
154
00:05:57,240 --> 00:05:59,120
think because I put a story up
about the fact ours is until
155
00:05:59,120 --> 00:06:00,880
9:00 PM.
It is normal for us at this
156
00:06:00,880 --> 00:06:01,880
point.
That's just what we do.
157
00:06:01,880 --> 00:06:04,280
But we do have votes as well
that multiple times across the
158
00:06:04,280 --> 00:06:07,960
years we've had votes where it's
been asked, would you rather do
159
00:06:08,040 --> 00:06:12,080
one very long parents evening
all the way up until 9:00 PM or
160
00:06:12,080 --> 00:06:15,120
split it across 2 days and go to
six, 630, something like that.
161
00:06:16,000 --> 00:06:19,240
And once I said that to people
on Instagram, by the way, you
162
00:06:19,240 --> 00:06:22,240
can follow us at TCP Podcast.
Once I'd said that on Instagram,
163
00:06:22,280 --> 00:06:23,800
people have messaged saying 9:00
PM.
164
00:06:23,800 --> 00:06:27,520
That's disgraceful.
A lot of them changed their mind
165
00:06:27,560 --> 00:06:30,200
and said, oh, do you know what?
I might have preferred actually
166
00:06:30,200 --> 00:06:33,560
staying until 9:00 PM rather
than having to go until 6 for
167
00:06:33,560 --> 00:06:37,520
two nights in a row.
I, I think my, my, my view on
168
00:06:37,520 --> 00:06:40,240
parents evening is there's no
good option in terms of your
169
00:06:40,240 --> 00:06:42,360
time and how stressed out you
are and how, how burnt out you
170
00:06:42,360 --> 00:06:44,560
might feel.
But what I will say is I think
171
00:06:44,560 --> 00:06:48,160
parents evening is amazing.
Like I think it's so vital, so
172
00:06:48,160 --> 00:06:52,160
important and I really enjoy it.
Like when I'm in parents evening
173
00:06:52,160 --> 00:06:54,360
doing it, I think it's ace.
I love it.
174
00:06:55,120 --> 00:06:57,080
The only the only qualm we can
have is the fact that we
175
00:06:57,080 --> 00:06:58,960
basically fit 2 working days
into one day.
176
00:06:59,040 --> 00:07:01,400
Yeah, like it should replace it
in my opinion.
177
00:07:01,560 --> 00:07:03,880
You know, when schools like
start parents living at half 12
178
00:07:03,880 --> 00:07:06,560
and the, the, the kids are doing
like maybe some PPA or they're
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outside of class or something,
But then part of your day, at
180
00:07:08,880 --> 00:07:11,640
least of what you would have
done teaching is now doing
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00:07:11,640 --> 00:07:13,080
because it's a job.
Right.
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00:07:13,280 --> 00:07:14,840
It's a bit odd tacked on, isn't
it?
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00:07:14,840 --> 00:07:16,840
Yeah, Evening.
It's like by default it already
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sounds terrible to me.
Yeah, an evening.
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00:07:18,400 --> 00:07:19,640
Sorry I'm not in the evening as
well.
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00:07:19,680 --> 00:07:21,520
Do you know what?
I know why and I agree with it
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00:07:21,520 --> 00:07:23,960
because some parents work.
I had parents who could only
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00:07:23,960 --> 00:07:25,920
come at like 8:00 PM and they
were really grateful.
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00:07:25,920 --> 00:07:28,440
The fact we do a late 1.
So so absolutely I get there are
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00:07:28,440 --> 00:07:30,000
pros and cons.
I'm not suggesting there's one
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00:07:30,000 --> 00:07:32,560
right or one wrong way.
But my point here is I guess
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overall it's I I love it.
I like putting a face of the
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00:07:37,760 --> 00:07:40,440
children to the face of their
adult and knowing who they are
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00:07:40,440 --> 00:07:43,200
and you might cross their path
on the playground and kindly be
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00:07:43,200 --> 00:07:45,840
like, oh, you think he's dad?
And now I know for sure and it
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00:07:46,120 --> 00:07:47,560
can be really clear.
There's always so many
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00:07:47,560 --> 00:07:49,240
similarities.
I said so yesterday and I was
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00:07:49,240 --> 00:07:50,600
like, oh, that was weird.
Hayden, why did you say that?
199
00:07:50,600 --> 00:07:52,320
In my head I was thinking, why
did why did you say that?
200
00:07:52,320 --> 00:07:55,360
So that was just weird.
The parent came in and that kid,
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00:07:55,360 --> 00:07:57,000
I love that.
That kid is so nice.
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00:07:57,000 --> 00:07:59,880
Like one of like just so lovely.
And then the parent came in and
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00:08:00,160 --> 00:08:01,800
was sort of, we were having a
bit of a joke when they came in,
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00:08:01,800 --> 00:08:04,560
when they laughed, I went, you
laughed just like named her
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00:08:04,600 --> 00:08:06,040
child.
And I was like, that sounds kind
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00:08:06,040 --> 00:08:06,640
of creepy.
Actually.
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00:08:07,440 --> 00:08:09,920
She sort of went, oh, I was
thinking, oh man, why?
208
00:08:10,680 --> 00:08:12,800
Would I say?
But it just reminded me, like
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00:08:13,160 --> 00:08:16,160
every parent sits down and I'm
like, Oh my God, like children
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00:08:16,160 --> 00:08:18,080
are sponges.
They just speak like they're
211
00:08:18,080 --> 00:08:19,680
into.
It's the intonation when I hear
212
00:08:19,680 --> 00:08:22,720
someone speak and I'm like, oh,
your child speaks exactly like
213
00:08:22,720 --> 00:08:23,760
that.
They sound like.
214
00:08:23,760 --> 00:08:26,920
You don't you find now that
we're parents, like probably our
215
00:08:26,920 --> 00:08:30,120
first full year, I guess as
being parents in school now
216
00:08:30,120 --> 00:08:32,240
they're growing up as well and
our children are getting a
217
00:08:32,240 --> 00:08:33,799
little bit of a personality.
Yeah.
218
00:08:33,799 --> 00:08:36,320
Don't you find I found last
night was the first time at
219
00:08:36,320 --> 00:08:41,200
Parents evening where I really,
really consciously saw I'd love
220
00:08:41,200 --> 00:08:44,400
to hear this about my child and
I really want to hear about my
221
00:08:44,400 --> 00:08:46,840
child when Rory ends up having
parents evenings and stuff.
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00:08:47,160 --> 00:08:50,960
And my favourite part of parents
evening genuinely is making the
223
00:08:50,960 --> 00:08:53,880
parents proud of their child and
telling them all the really cool
224
00:08:53,880 --> 00:08:55,840
stuff they do.
And as teachers, I think it's
225
00:08:55,840 --> 00:08:59,160
our job to find that and tell
the parents, you know, we see
226
00:08:59,160 --> 00:09:00,640
you.
And my favourite part last
227
00:09:00,640 --> 00:09:03,480
night, a few parents said this
and it it fills you with
228
00:09:03,720 --> 00:09:04,840
happiness.
There's two things.
229
00:09:04,840 --> 00:09:07,720
One was they say things like we
never have an issue.
230
00:09:07,720 --> 00:09:10,240
They love going to school.
I'm like, as a teacher, when you
231
00:09:10,240 --> 00:09:12,560
hear that, I think I'm doing my
job.
232
00:09:12,840 --> 00:09:14,560
You know what?
I don't care if they come home
233
00:09:14,560 --> 00:09:16,160
and tell you what preposition
is, don't care.
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00:09:16,520 --> 00:09:18,560
But the fact, the fact they're
excited and happy to go into
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00:09:18,560 --> 00:09:20,160
school, I'm like, that's so
heartwarming.
236
00:09:20,440 --> 00:09:23,680
And the other thing was we had
multiple parents say after Amy
237
00:09:23,680 --> 00:09:27,120
and I taught Amy to my job show
and the parent would say, oh, do
238
00:09:27,120 --> 00:09:29,000
you know what?
That that fills me with pride.
239
00:09:29,000 --> 00:09:31,920
And I'm happy that you see that
part of my kid.
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00:09:32,320 --> 00:09:33,760
So they they and they're very
honest.
241
00:09:33,760 --> 00:09:35,840
They were saying, oh, do you
know, sometimes we worry because
242
00:09:36,160 --> 00:09:38,800
the child might be a bit full on
or a bit like, you know, a bit
243
00:09:38,800 --> 00:09:40,320
much.
And in the education
244
00:09:40,320 --> 00:09:42,440
environment, the parents think,
oh God, maybe the teacher will
245
00:09:42,440 --> 00:09:45,640
get annoyed or yeah, yeah.
And and they were just so happy
246
00:09:45,640 --> 00:09:48,840
that from what Amy and I had
said, they felt like we saw
247
00:09:48,880 --> 00:09:51,160
their child and we could see
them as an individual and really
248
00:09:51,160 --> 00:09:52,640
appreciate them as an
individual.
249
00:09:53,000 --> 00:09:54,640
And the parents being happy with
that.
250
00:09:54,640 --> 00:09:56,600
I was like, OK, again, that I've
done my job.
251
00:09:56,920 --> 00:10:00,240
I see the individual child and
everyone and the parents really
252
00:10:00,240 --> 00:10:02,240
appreciate that.
And they were so nice and happy.
253
00:10:02,240 --> 00:10:04,960
And I was like, OK, this, This
is why parents evenings really
254
00:10:04,960 --> 00:10:06,760
cool.
We set ourselves on that right
255
00:10:06,760 --> 00:10:08,240
foot.
Yeah. 100%, that's really nice.
256
00:10:08,240 --> 00:10:09,560
I had a few of those experiences
as well.
257
00:10:09,840 --> 00:10:13,000
How many of those parents after
saying that, then looked at your
258
00:10:13,000 --> 00:10:16,640
displays and said, but it's a
shame because actually you're
259
00:10:16,640 --> 00:10:19,840
clearly and actually a terrible
teacher because I tell you what,
260
00:10:19,840 --> 00:10:22,600
the environment does not look as
good as I've seen on Pinterest.
261
00:10:23,080 --> 00:10:24,960
How many of them did that?
Yeah.
262
00:10:24,960 --> 00:10:26,280
Oh, none of them.
Because you know what?
263
00:10:26,280 --> 00:10:28,000
No one cares about it.
No one cares.
264
00:10:28,000 --> 00:10:29,960
They just care that their child
is valued and loved.
265
00:10:29,960 --> 00:10:31,120
That's what makes a good
teacher.
266
00:10:31,280 --> 00:10:33,760
And I'm already, I'm not going
to rent yet, but I'm already
267
00:10:33,760 --> 00:10:35,840
getting into.
I'm just, I'm so I'm just really
268
00:10:35,840 --> 00:10:37,880
annoyed at the moment.
And I think I feel like you feel
269
00:10:37,880 --> 00:10:39,760
the same as well I do.
Maybe you're trying to hold back
270
00:10:39,760 --> 00:10:41,480
a bit, but we'll talk about it
in a minute.
271
00:10:41,480 --> 00:10:43,320
But I tell you what, before we
do, because I know you've got
272
00:10:43,320 --> 00:10:45,000
some, I think you've had some
funny things happen this week.
273
00:10:45,000 --> 00:10:47,480
I want you to tell some stories,
lighten the mood a little bit
274
00:10:47,640 --> 00:10:50,320
before I spend 45 minutes going
off on one.
275
00:10:50,520 --> 00:10:53,960
Well, one thing I was going to
start by saying is we're reading
276
00:10:53,960 --> 00:10:56,360
Varjak Paul and every single
time we're reading this on the
277
00:10:56,360 --> 00:10:58,360
podcast, I just feel like I need
to talk about it.
278
00:10:58,720 --> 00:11:00,200
OK?
Because SF Saeed, who's the
279
00:11:00,200 --> 00:11:02,800
author, he's I've seen
interviews with him.
280
00:11:02,800 --> 00:11:06,360
He he just comes across as such
a lovely guy and he just loves
281
00:11:06,360 --> 00:11:07,760
writing.
And he's like one of them people
282
00:11:07,760 --> 00:11:09,480
who said everyone's a writer,
everyone's a reader.
283
00:11:09,480 --> 00:11:10,840
If you're a reader, you're a
writer, you can do it.
284
00:11:10,920 --> 00:11:13,560
It's just quite inspiring
listening to talk and when you
285
00:11:13,560 --> 00:11:17,120
read his book, their kids love
it and it's still link, link to
286
00:11:17,120 --> 00:11:18,880
what we're saying.
Again, what do we really care
287
00:11:18,880 --> 00:11:19,840
about?
It's those moments for the
288
00:11:19,840 --> 00:11:21,640
children that's the most
unbelievable part of it.
289
00:11:22,000 --> 00:11:24,480
And again at Parents Evening,
sometimes the children came with
290
00:11:24,480 --> 00:11:28,000
them and multiple times the
children would say, I love
291
00:11:28,000 --> 00:11:31,640
Vajpay and OK, cool, this is
what matters.
292
00:11:31,640 --> 00:11:34,640
Reading really good text with
your children, engaging them,
293
00:11:34,640 --> 00:11:37,680
getting them to enjoy a story.
And do you know what it's it's a
294
00:11:37,680 --> 00:11:40,320
story that a lot of them with
independent reading wouldn't be
295
00:11:40,320 --> 00:11:43,120
able to access properly.
And there's those children who I
296
00:11:43,120 --> 00:11:46,480
know wouldn't access this book
are getting so much out of as
297
00:11:46,480 --> 00:11:49,080
just cordoning off some time to
read the story.
298
00:11:49,360 --> 00:11:51,280
Can I say something cool because
you don't know this, but our
299
00:11:51,280 --> 00:11:53,280
school recently, it's good for
the listeners as well to know
300
00:11:53,280 --> 00:11:54,560
you can reflect on this with
your school.
301
00:11:54,840 --> 00:11:57,600
But our school recently has made
big changes to English and we
302
00:11:57,600 --> 00:12:00,800
have really scrapped massively
those kind of lessons where you
303
00:12:00,800 --> 00:12:02,840
just go over test style
techniques all the time for
304
00:12:02,840 --> 00:12:04,120
reading, like reading
comprehension tests.
305
00:12:04,120 --> 00:12:05,240
This is how you get 2 marks in
these.
306
00:12:05,360 --> 00:12:07,840
Yeah.
We've really just just streamed
307
00:12:07,840 --> 00:12:09,280
back on that because that's
gonna come.
308
00:12:09,360 --> 00:12:09,960
Yeah.
Do you know what?
309
00:12:09,960 --> 00:12:11,400
We'll do a little bit of that
every now and then because
310
00:12:11,400 --> 00:12:13,680
actually familiarising the kids
of the test is probably sensible
311
00:12:13,680 --> 00:12:16,320
and like, yeah, whatever.
But we've really taken it back
312
00:12:16,320 --> 00:12:19,120
and replaced it with, should we
just read really, really good
313
00:12:19,120 --> 00:12:20,080
books though?
Like really.
314
00:12:20,080 --> 00:12:22,320
And just, And actually, like you
said, cordon off time to read
315
00:12:22,320 --> 00:12:24,680
really good books all the time
and see if we can get the kids
316
00:12:24,680 --> 00:12:27,400
passionate about reading so that
they go home and books that they
317
00:12:27,400 --> 00:12:29,360
like and read.
And that's what our school been
318
00:12:29,360 --> 00:12:32,120
doing for a couple of terms now.
And I know that our SLT were a
319
00:12:32,120 --> 00:12:35,200
little bit panicked because they
were obviously rightfully
320
00:12:35,200 --> 00:12:37,000
nervous.
Like, oh, we have just cut back
321
00:12:37,000 --> 00:12:39,680
tonnes of this test style stuff.
And we do get judged on tests
322
00:12:39,680 --> 00:12:40,840
though.
So I'm a bit worried about this.
323
00:12:41,320 --> 00:12:45,280
We had our autumn, autumn data
come through and our highest
324
00:12:45,280 --> 00:12:47,800
across all four year groups in
years, above average and
325
00:12:47,800 --> 00:12:49,920
everything where before we're
typically a little bit below
326
00:12:49,920 --> 00:12:52,560
average across like a
particular, it's not national,
327
00:12:52,560 --> 00:12:53,800
but it's like a big group that
we yeah.
328
00:12:53,800 --> 00:12:56,320
Sure.
Called Pixel and I could just
329
00:12:56,320 --> 00:13:01,520
see the relief on our SLTS face
and they're like OK, maybe maybe
330
00:13:01,560 --> 00:13:03,800
this maybe this is OK.
And I was so pleased because I,
331
00:13:03,840 --> 00:13:06,560
I would have been gutted if if
it wasn't that and they started
332
00:13:06,560 --> 00:13:08,520
then justifying or maybe we
should go back to just doing
333
00:13:08,520 --> 00:13:10,320
loads of test style.
Stuff do a teacher waggle and
334
00:13:10,320 --> 00:13:11,760
then do some questions from the
teacher waggle which.
335
00:13:11,800 --> 00:13:13,880
You've written as a teacher, I
thought you don't know that yet
336
00:13:13,880 --> 00:13:15,800
and I thought you'd be pleased.
That's weird that the kids it is
337
00:13:15,800 --> 00:13:17,800
working kids just enjoying
reading.
338
00:13:17,800 --> 00:13:20,280
Really simple model.
Read good books and get them to
339
00:13:20,280 --> 00:13:23,480
enjoy it and talk about it is
actually helping them read.
340
00:13:23,560 --> 00:13:24,760
Yeah.
Yeah, I completely agree,
341
00:13:24,760 --> 00:13:26,280
Completely agree.
And I just wanted to say that to
342
00:13:26,280 --> 00:13:29,320
people out there, like, don't
dismiss that time.
343
00:13:29,520 --> 00:13:31,160
Don't be convinced by the
people.
344
00:13:31,200 --> 00:13:33,000
And a big part of what we're
going to talk about later is
345
00:13:33,000 --> 00:13:35,880
you're a professional person.
I'm a professional teacher.
346
00:13:35,880 --> 00:13:39,040
I've done it for 10 years.
OK, leave me alone. 9.
347
00:13:39,680 --> 00:13:41,640
Is it 9?
You're you always think you're
348
00:13:41,640 --> 00:13:42,080
me.
I'm.
349
00:13:43,360 --> 00:13:44,600
I've said decade for the whole
year.
350
00:13:45,280 --> 00:13:47,520
I know I like decade.
I'm going to stick with decade.
351
00:13:47,640 --> 00:13:48,720
I'm going to count my training
here.
352
00:13:48,720 --> 00:13:49,560
I was teaching.
All right.
353
00:13:50,160 --> 00:13:51,680
So yeah, I've been teaching for
a decade.
354
00:13:51,960 --> 00:13:54,560
Sounds so good a decade.
Doesn't it look like leave me
355
00:13:54,560 --> 00:13:56,080
alone?
Like don't come up to me and
356
00:13:56,080 --> 00:13:57,560
tell me, Oh no, you shouldn't be
reading that book.
357
00:13:57,560 --> 00:13:58,560
Actually, you should be doing
this.
358
00:13:58,840 --> 00:14:00,680
Leave me alone.
Like I'm just going, do you know
359
00:14:00,680 --> 00:14:02,360
what I'm going to do?
Because it's the most important
360
00:14:02,360 --> 00:14:04,320
part of the job in these six
hours.
361
00:14:04,320 --> 00:14:06,520
I'm with these kids.
These kids are going to bloody
362
00:14:06,520 --> 00:14:09,040
love school and they're going to
really enjoy being here and
363
00:14:09,040 --> 00:14:10,760
they're going to be engaged in
what they're doing.
364
00:14:11,160 --> 00:14:13,160
Leave me alone.
Don't don't tell me what
365
00:14:13,160 --> 00:14:14,760
honestly, honestly, I don't
care.
366
00:14:14,760 --> 00:14:17,040
I don't care at this point.
I'm just like, we can have a
367
00:14:17,040 --> 00:14:19,800
discussion about like which what
you think is better and stuff,
368
00:14:19,800 --> 00:14:22,480
right?
But you're not always right, you
369
00:14:22,760 --> 00:14:24,280
know, just because you're
outside of the classroom
370
00:14:24,280 --> 00:14:25,160
forever.
Yeah, yeah.
371
00:14:25,160 --> 00:14:27,440
But you're not all.
I get that you're in some
372
00:14:27,440 --> 00:14:28,920
position maybe.
So do you think there's any?
373
00:14:28,920 --> 00:14:31,120
Because what you're saying to me
sounds like everyone did.
374
00:14:31,120 --> 00:14:32,560
If everyone acted like you,
they'd be anarchy.
375
00:14:32,560 --> 00:14:34,840
No one would follow any.
We're all doing exactly what we
376
00:14:34,840 --> 00:14:35,360
want.
I'm a mass.
377
00:14:35,400 --> 00:14:37,320
Lead and we put say use White
Rose.
378
00:14:37,840 --> 00:14:39,800
Don't get me wrong.
What I'm saying is if I went
379
00:14:39,800 --> 00:14:43,680
into a room and someone within a
lesson had decided today they're
380
00:14:43,680 --> 00:14:44,800
not going to do a White Rose
small step.
381
00:14:44,800 --> 00:14:46,920
They're going to do an
investigation where the children
382
00:14:46,920 --> 00:14:49,080
are looking at all possibilities
and they've got some printed out
383
00:14:49,080 --> 00:14:50,160
ice creams that they're looking
at.
384
00:14:50,520 --> 00:14:53,680
I'm not going to say to that
teacher, oh, but we did all
385
00:14:53,680 --> 00:14:55,320
agree that we're doing White
Rose all the way through.
386
00:14:55,320 --> 00:14:57,200
When the kids are enjoying.
It Yeah, the kids are loving it,
387
00:14:57,200 --> 00:14:59,040
they're engaged, they're doing
maths, they're learning stuff,
388
00:14:59,040 --> 00:15:00,280
right?
There's not one way to learn
389
00:15:00,280 --> 00:15:02,400
stuff is my point.
If you come in and we're all
390
00:15:02,400 --> 00:15:04,920
reading Vajatpur and you stay
for 10 minutes and we're just
391
00:15:04,920 --> 00:15:08,600
reading a chapter and I've not
asked the leading question in 2
392
00:15:08,600 --> 00:15:12,840
minutes, So what is my point?
But those micromanaging is what
393
00:15:12,840 --> 00:15:13,360
I'm talking.
Sure.
394
00:15:13,600 --> 00:15:15,280
The the you know, I've been told
to teach.
395
00:15:15,280 --> 00:15:16,440
Watch out for.
Yeah.
396
00:15:16,440 --> 00:15:18,720
So obviously I'm not talking
about I'm gonna do whatever I
397
00:15:18,720 --> 00:15:19,400
want all the time.
Yeah.
398
00:15:19,640 --> 00:15:22,120
I'm saying within the confines
of a classroom as a
399
00:15:22,120 --> 00:15:23,760
professional.
But I said we're just gonna read
400
00:15:23,760 --> 00:15:25,720
a book for 20 minutes.
Yeah, we're just gonna read a
401
00:15:25,720 --> 00:15:27,680
book for 20 minutes.
OK, so scenario then the kid,
402
00:15:27,840 --> 00:15:30,720
it's 2 hour afternoon, yeah,
you're one hour 45 minutes into
403
00:15:30,720 --> 00:15:31,840
it.
The kids are are bored and
404
00:15:31,840 --> 00:15:33,560
knackered at this point, right.
You've been doing, I don't know,
405
00:15:33,560 --> 00:15:34,800
some geography and then they're
just.
406
00:15:34,800 --> 00:15:37,240
Always geography.
I'm sorry, John, it's.
407
00:15:37,600 --> 00:15:39,920
Just such a boring subject.
I'm really sorry.
408
00:15:40,120 --> 00:15:41,320
I'm really sorry, John.
We're.
409
00:15:41,320 --> 00:15:43,360
Going to get some pushback here.
I'm joking.
410
00:15:43,600 --> 00:15:45,040
It's not a boring subject, but
it can be.
411
00:15:45,040 --> 00:15:46,720
It can be, depending how you
teach them what you're teaching
412
00:15:46,720 --> 00:15:47,560
do.
You want to do 2 hours on
413
00:15:47,560 --> 00:15:50,520
latitude.
Not longitude on latitude, just
414
00:15:50,520 --> 00:15:51,560
latitude.
Because we'll do 2 hours of
415
00:15:51,560 --> 00:15:52,440
longitude exactly.
And you?
416
00:15:52,640 --> 00:15:53,760
Know what?
And you as a teacher, as a
417
00:15:53,760 --> 00:15:56,680
professional, like you said,
who's nine years in as a notice,
418
00:15:57,640 --> 00:15:59,880
notice that the kids are
flagging, they're bored of this
419
00:15:59,880 --> 00:16:01,080
now.
And you've got this one last
420
00:16:01,080 --> 00:16:02,840
task that you could do.
They've done an hour and 45
421
00:16:02,840 --> 00:16:05,920
minutes of it and you decide,
you know what, just not gonna do
422
00:16:05,920 --> 00:16:06,960
it?
School policies that you gotta
423
00:16:06,960 --> 00:16:08,000
finish it, you gotta finish
that.
424
00:16:08,000 --> 00:16:10,080
They gotta have this, they gotta
have that self reflection at the
425
00:16:10,080 --> 00:16:11,800
end or whatever it's.
Because if they didn't write it
426
00:16:11,800 --> 00:16:13,360
down, they didn't possibly learn
it for an hour.
427
00:16:13,360 --> 00:16:15,280
And 45, you go now I'm gonna
read the book.
428
00:16:15,280 --> 00:16:17,360
So you're saying in that
scenario of an SLT can leave in
429
00:16:17,360 --> 00:16:19,720
it and goes, no, don't be doing
that, you need to be.
430
00:16:19,720 --> 00:16:20,960
They haven't done their self
reflection.
431
00:16:20,960 --> 00:16:23,240
I can see they've done this hour
and 45 minutes of work, but they
432
00:16:23,240 --> 00:16:25,080
haven't done this bit and that's
the policy to finish that you'd
433
00:16:25,080 --> 00:16:27,000
be like.
Yeah, I would say, look, I'm a
434
00:16:27,000 --> 00:16:29,040
professional.
Here are my reasons for doing
435
00:16:29,040 --> 00:16:31,480
it.
OK, accept them, please, because
436
00:16:31,480 --> 00:16:34,880
I'm not some player, but off the
street, like on a genuinely like
437
00:16:34,880 --> 00:16:37,240
if you've picked up a profession
off the street in a different
438
00:16:37,240 --> 00:16:39,800
career who's well switched on, I
think they could probably
439
00:16:39,800 --> 00:16:40,840
deliver a lesson you plan for
them.
440
00:16:40,840 --> 00:16:42,280
It wouldn't be the best thing in
the world, but they could
441
00:16:42,280 --> 00:16:43,920
probably go through slides and
be like, oh, I've got to do this
442
00:16:43,920 --> 00:16:44,600
next.
Got to do this.
443
00:16:44,640 --> 00:16:47,040
Yeah, formulaic, formulaic,
clunky.
444
00:16:47,040 --> 00:16:49,560
Fine, they'd get through through
it, but that's not what I am.
445
00:16:49,560 --> 00:16:51,240
I'm a teacher, so leave me
alone.
446
00:16:51,440 --> 00:16:53,920
I'm going to read to the kids
now because they want to listen
447
00:16:53,920 --> 00:16:56,080
to the rest of the story.
They're going to be inspired by
448
00:16:56,080 --> 00:16:57,120
it.
They're going to maybe make them
449
00:16:57,120 --> 00:16:59,240
pick up the next book.
The amount of children last year
450
00:16:59,240 --> 00:17:01,520
who came back and had the second
Vajrac Paul book because we
451
00:17:01,520 --> 00:17:02,920
wrote the first one that was
never have happened.
452
00:17:03,360 --> 00:17:06,480
You know what all I'm saying is
on these micromanaging parts of
453
00:17:06,480 --> 00:17:08,200
it, just let me do it.
I'm going to finish off with a
454
00:17:08,200 --> 00:17:10,440
really quick story.
It's it's really heart warming.
455
00:17:10,520 --> 00:17:14,000
It's it's quite funny and it's
one of my favourite stories to
456
00:17:14,000 --> 00:17:16,520
come out of teaching.
Recently, we were doing English.
457
00:17:16,520 --> 00:17:19,640
We were looking at root words.
OK, so we, we were given a word
458
00:17:19,640 --> 00:17:22,119
and we were discussing with the
children how you can add a
459
00:17:22,119 --> 00:17:24,640
suffix to the end of a word, how
you can add a prefix.
460
00:17:24,920 --> 00:17:28,119
And the idea that from one word,
if we learn that spelling, we
461
00:17:28,119 --> 00:17:29,720
can kind of learn lots of
spellings from it.
462
00:17:30,000 --> 00:17:32,840
So we're doing Ed for past
tense, we're doing ING.
463
00:17:33,040 --> 00:17:34,720
We're thinking about how that
might change the spending of the
464
00:17:34,720 --> 00:17:36,600
word, etcetera.
So we're putting it all into one
465
00:17:36,720 --> 00:17:39,640
kind of lesson now.
And for example, we'd give them
466
00:17:39,640 --> 00:17:42,680
the word like and then the
children around like would have
467
00:17:42,680 --> 00:17:44,760
to write all the words they can
think of with that root word
468
00:17:45,000 --> 00:17:48,120
liking, liked, likes and then
dislike.
469
00:17:48,480 --> 00:17:51,360
And we kind of realised after a
few together that it's harder to
470
00:17:51,360 --> 00:17:54,240
think of a prefix than it is a
suffix because we're doing loads
471
00:17:54,240 --> 00:17:56,880
of spelling rules, so and they
tend to be suffixes in general.
472
00:17:57,240 --> 00:18:00,000
So I was saying to the children,
OK, look on this next one, I
473
00:18:00,000 --> 00:18:03,000
want you to really think hard.
Can you think of a prefix,
474
00:18:03,000 --> 00:18:05,080
something to go before OK,
right.
475
00:18:05,520 --> 00:18:08,720
The next word is appear.
And again, that's a good one
476
00:18:08,720 --> 00:18:11,440
because you've got loads that go
in the end appearing appeared
477
00:18:11,800 --> 00:18:15,000
like appears.
But this to me, I thought quite
478
00:18:15,000 --> 00:18:17,640
a very obvious prefix
disappeared.
479
00:18:17,840 --> 00:18:19,480
So I thought loads of children,
I think of that.
480
00:18:19,480 --> 00:18:20,880
That's great.
So they were writing stuff down.
481
00:18:20,880 --> 00:18:24,280
I was going around the room and
I went back to the front and I
482
00:18:24,280 --> 00:18:27,280
said, OK, I've seen loads of
words, lots of suffixes still,
483
00:18:27,280 --> 00:18:31,040
but can anyone think of a prefix
for appear?
484
00:18:31,560 --> 00:18:32,680
And there wasn't that many hands
up.
485
00:18:32,680 --> 00:18:34,360
They were really just thinking
about I was like, God, I really
486
00:18:34,400 --> 00:18:36,920
thought someone would get this
appear And one of my children at
487
00:18:36,920 --> 00:18:40,480
the front, his kind of eyes lit
up and his his hand shot up
488
00:18:40,480 --> 00:18:41,840
straight away.
And I was like, yes, cool.
489
00:18:42,280 --> 00:18:44,360
And he went, I know, I know.
And I yes, what do you think?
490
00:18:44,360 --> 00:18:46,920
What's your prefix for appear?
What's your new word?
491
00:18:47,080 --> 00:18:52,800
And he went on a matter appear.
He's like reappear or something
492
00:18:52,800 --> 00:18:55,360
like different like Oh well done
automatic is.
493
00:18:56,160 --> 00:18:59,400
Like, Oh my God, that is 10 out
of 10.
494
00:18:59,520 --> 00:19:02,800
Unbelievable.
Like even no automatic.
495
00:19:02,800 --> 00:19:05,280
I was like, you thought you've
gone back to time 1 when we did
496
00:19:05,280 --> 00:19:08,000
poetry and we, we, we talked
about automatic beer and he was
497
00:19:08,000 --> 00:19:11,040
so, so impressed with himself.
And I was like, mate, I
498
00:19:11,040 --> 00:19:13,440
honestly, I laughed and he
laughed and then we all thought
499
00:19:13,440 --> 00:19:15,600
it was funny.
And I went, I said to him, that
500
00:19:15,600 --> 00:19:19,120
is an unbelievable answer.
I was like, that is such a good
501
00:19:19,120 --> 00:19:21,280
answer because you know what?
It has the sound of appear at
502
00:19:21,280 --> 00:19:23,120
the end, doesn't it?
And you've put in the front on a
503
00:19:23,120 --> 00:19:25,080
mat.
I was like, Oh my God, it's so
504
00:19:25,080 --> 00:19:27,080
good.
I got to explain to him the
505
00:19:27,080 --> 00:19:29,960
spelling was off, but Oh my God,
it cracked me up so much.
506
00:19:29,960 --> 00:19:31,280
I just wasn't expecting it.
Yeah.
507
00:19:31,400 --> 00:19:34,800
And my TA was doing something
else, so I just said, oh, miss,
508
00:19:34,840 --> 00:19:37,320
and we've got a really good idea
here for a beer.
509
00:19:37,680 --> 00:19:39,240
She was like, oh, yeah.
And I was like, yeah, someone
510
00:19:39,240 --> 00:19:42,480
said on a mat appear, she was
just like, cracking up as well.
511
00:19:42,720 --> 00:19:44,320
But the kid, like, absolutely
loved it.
512
00:19:44,560 --> 00:19:45,920
He could tell.
Do you know when children pick
513
00:19:45,920 --> 00:19:47,320
up something's funny?
Yeah.
514
00:19:47,480 --> 00:19:49,040
And they know it's made you
laugh in a good way.
515
00:19:49,040 --> 00:19:50,360
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
That's all he said.
516
00:19:50,360 --> 00:19:51,720
For the rest, I.
Was gonna say did he just keep
517
00:19:51,720 --> 00:19:53,240
saying Oh yeah, remember,
remember, Yeah.
518
00:19:53,240 --> 00:19:55,280
Do you remember that from 10
seconds ago on about the pier
519
00:19:55,280 --> 00:19:56,200
though?
That's funny, wasn't it, Sir?
520
00:19:56,200 --> 00:19:57,880
The.
Kid next to him.
521
00:19:57,880 --> 00:19:59,680
You've seen that I'd laughed
because it was nonsense.
522
00:20:00,080 --> 00:20:01,520
He started going I've got one,
I've got one.
523
00:20:01,680 --> 00:20:02,760
Hello.
Appear I was.
524
00:20:03,280 --> 00:20:05,600
Like no ruined it.
Just say.
525
00:20:08,520 --> 00:20:11,440
Yeah, they have to just jump in
there, try and get some still
526
00:20:11,480 --> 00:20:13,920
some of the limelight.
So on a matter beer that's
527
00:20:13,920 --> 00:20:18,040
pretty new spelling and an
APPEAR much easier to remember.
528
00:20:18,160 --> 00:20:20,680
I presume you didn't then go and
model how to spell that word on
529
00:20:20,680 --> 00:20:22,280
the board, so it is impossible
to spell.
530
00:20:22,560 --> 00:20:25,360
No, I was like on a matter put
the vowels on some kind of.
531
00:20:25,360 --> 00:20:26,720
Order.
It just smells exactly how we
532
00:20:26,720 --> 00:20:28,000
said it.
Yeah, you're right, actually.
533
00:20:28,000 --> 00:20:29,680
You know what, kid?
Actually, kid, you're right.
534
00:20:31,120 --> 00:20:34,080
Because I don't know.
Well, it's just honestly, I, I,
535
00:20:34,240 --> 00:20:35,600
I was like, that's the story I'm
gonna remember.
536
00:20:35,600 --> 00:20:36,360
Forever.
Yeah, they never.
537
00:20:36,360 --> 00:20:38,960
One of them failed to amaze
them, if you ask me, like, what
538
00:20:38,960 --> 00:20:39,760
do you think?
What prefix?
539
00:20:39,760 --> 00:20:42,440
I never in a million years would
have guessed on a matter.
540
00:20:42,520 --> 00:20:43,160
Never.
I would have.
541
00:20:43,160 --> 00:20:45,000
I was literally thinking like
this real.
542
00:20:45,000 --> 00:20:46,120
I was not that many.
Years.
543
00:20:46,120 --> 00:20:48,840
No, but I just thought, you see
a peer.
544
00:20:48,840 --> 00:20:50,040
I just thought the kids will
think.
545
00:20:50,040 --> 00:20:51,120
Disappeared.
Yeah, I thought, of course.
546
00:20:51,320 --> 00:20:52,760
The obvious one, that's
brilliant.
547
00:20:52,840 --> 00:20:55,040
Love that.
Right, let's we've had our
548
00:20:55,080 --> 00:20:57,320
little calm down, thanks.
For attempting to cheer me up.
549
00:20:57,400 --> 00:21:00,240
I did try.
We are going to now crack on
550
00:21:00,240 --> 00:21:03,800
with teacher martyrdom, guys.
We're going to have a go at
551
00:21:03,800 --> 00:21:05,640
ourselves here a little bit in
terms of profession.
552
00:21:05,640 --> 00:21:10,280
So just buckle up.
When we spoke to Omar last week,
553
00:21:10,560 --> 00:21:12,480
he touched upon teacher
martyrdom.
554
00:21:13,040 --> 00:21:16,760
And for a lot of people, they
know that term and something
555
00:21:16,760 --> 00:21:18,800
straight away comes to mind or
someone, Right?
556
00:21:18,920 --> 00:21:20,440
Yeah.
But what I think's interesting
557
00:21:20,440 --> 00:21:22,080
is I think people have different
definitions.
558
00:21:22,080 --> 00:21:24,440
I know you and I differ on what
we think of straight away.
559
00:21:24,600 --> 00:21:26,640
So before we get into this whole
conversation about what teacher
560
00:21:26,640 --> 00:21:29,400
martyr it is, how it's, you
know, ruining the profession in
561
00:21:29,400 --> 00:21:32,840
a way and how it's really, you
know, impacting the job, let's
562
00:21:32,840 --> 00:21:35,560
try and define it.
So I want to hear when I say
563
00:21:35,560 --> 00:21:37,440
teacher martyr, what do you
think?
564
00:21:37,440 --> 00:21:41,840
OK, So OK, I think a teacher
martyr is someone who obviously
565
00:21:41,840 --> 00:21:45,520
in teaching, in education,
education thinks that they're
566
00:21:45,520 --> 00:21:49,160
only worthwhile in this job if
they make considerable personal
567
00:21:49,160 --> 00:21:51,200
sacrifices.
So they have to make sacrifices
568
00:21:51,200 --> 00:21:54,240
outside of the job to consider
themselves as a good teacher, as
569
00:21:54,240 --> 00:21:56,480
good at the job.
And and I always think that
570
00:21:56,480 --> 00:21:59,160
those people probably look at
look at other people who aren't
571
00:21:59,160 --> 00:22:00,880
doing that and think they're
they're not as good teachers as
572
00:22:00,880 --> 00:22:02,560
me.
They they really, really have
573
00:22:02,560 --> 00:22:04,920
gasoline themselves into
thinking I'm only a good teacher
574
00:22:05,280 --> 00:22:08,000
if my work life balance is
terrible, if I'm burning out,
575
00:22:08,000 --> 00:22:09,280
because that's what good
teachers do.
576
00:22:09,280 --> 00:22:10,800
They sacrifice themselves for
the job.
577
00:22:11,440 --> 00:22:12,800
That's what a teacher martyr is
to me.
578
00:22:13,040 --> 00:22:14,640
Is your definition a bit
different?
579
00:22:14,640 --> 00:22:17,080
Yes, I guess slightly I, I get
what you're saying.
580
00:22:17,080 --> 00:22:19,920
I don't disagree with it.
But to me, I think what's
581
00:22:19,920 --> 00:22:22,480
important when we think about
teacher martyrdom is I think
582
00:22:22,680 --> 00:22:25,840
they actively relish in feeling
annoyed.
583
00:22:26,240 --> 00:22:28,760
Like if it feels to me when I
think of teacher martyrs,
584
00:22:28,760 --> 00:22:31,760
they're the kind of people who
will sit and moan about
585
00:22:31,760 --> 00:22:33,400
something like, oh gosh, yeah,
I'll go.
586
00:22:33,400 --> 00:22:36,440
I took these home the other day.
I did, you know, you did, you
587
00:22:36,440 --> 00:22:38,360
did 10 hours on mark and I did
11.
588
00:22:38,360 --> 00:22:41,160
And I like they relish in the
fact that they are bad.
589
00:22:41,160 --> 00:22:41,800
They've got it.
Worse.
590
00:22:41,800 --> 00:22:44,040
Yeah, they've got it worse.
And they think, gosh, aren't
591
00:22:44,040 --> 00:22:45,920
aren't I really putting myself
out there?
592
00:22:45,920 --> 00:22:47,680
And that's where your definition
comes in, I suppose.
593
00:22:47,720 --> 00:22:49,120
Aren't I an amazing teacher?
Because.
594
00:22:49,320 --> 00:22:52,960
But it's not always even that.
It's just the people who seem to
595
00:22:52,960 --> 00:22:55,880
want to let everyone know how
much they're letting this job
596
00:22:55,880 --> 00:22:58,840
take over their life and wear it
almost like a badge of honour.
597
00:22:58,920 --> 00:23:01,080
To me, that's what a teacher.
I guess that's quite similarly.
598
00:23:01,080 --> 00:23:03,520
So we're really just in the
whole, we're talking about
599
00:23:03,520 --> 00:23:06,240
people who do, who basically
sacrifice their own time at
600
00:23:06,240 --> 00:23:07,440
home.
They think they should, they
601
00:23:07,440 --> 00:23:10,080
think they have to, and they
wear it as a bit of a badger
602
00:23:10,120 --> 00:23:12,320
wanna and yeah.
So when, when, when I say
603
00:23:12,320 --> 00:23:15,800
teacher martyr, people listening
now might be thinking of someone
604
00:23:15,800 --> 00:23:18,280
straight away.
I, I have a very specific set of
605
00:23:18,280 --> 00:23:20,040
things in my mind when I think
about it.
606
00:23:20,040 --> 00:23:23,600
So before we go on to, you know,
why it's a problem, the impact
607
00:23:23,600 --> 00:23:26,600
it's having in a job, What does
it look like?
608
00:23:26,600 --> 00:23:27,960
What does teacher martyrdom look
like?
609
00:23:27,960 --> 00:23:30,320
Because we, we need to try and
cut it out.
610
00:23:30,320 --> 00:23:32,520
So let's define first, what do
we see?
611
00:23:32,520 --> 00:23:37,400
Because the first thing I think
of is touching upon what we just
612
00:23:37,400 --> 00:23:39,840
said it.
You'll know who a teacher martyr
613
00:23:39,840 --> 00:23:41,400
is because they'll tell you they
took their marking home.
614
00:23:42,000 --> 00:23:43,960
They'll let you know that.
Oh, God, yeah.
615
00:23:44,320 --> 00:23:47,080
I left at six the other day and
I had to take all my marking
616
00:23:47,080 --> 00:23:49,280
home.
Why, Yeah.
617
00:23:49,280 --> 00:23:50,160
Did you had to?
Did you?
618
00:23:50,160 --> 00:23:51,880
Did you mean to say had?
Yeah.
619
00:23:52,000 --> 00:23:53,080
You had to take away your
marking.
620
00:23:53,080 --> 00:23:54,560
I don't think you had to take
away your marking home.
621
00:23:54,560 --> 00:23:55,960
You choose to take away your
marking because I'll tell you
622
00:23:55,960 --> 00:23:58,240
what, mate, I didn't.
Yeah, I agree.
623
00:23:58,360 --> 00:24:00,160
Teachers that take home them, I
was it.
624
00:24:00,400 --> 00:24:01,640
It was me.
I was that person.
625
00:24:01,640 --> 00:24:03,160
Like I'm not going to pretend.
I'm going to sit in my high
626
00:24:03,160 --> 00:24:04,440
horse and be like, yeah,
everyone's like this.
627
00:24:04,440 --> 00:24:05,840
And I've always been not like
this.
628
00:24:05,880 --> 00:24:08,280
I was like that for years.
Absolutely a teacher martyr.
629
00:24:08,280 --> 00:24:10,040
And I totally relished in it.
So I know it's true.
630
00:24:10,280 --> 00:24:12,640
I totally went home and I tell
my mates who had other jobs
631
00:24:12,640 --> 00:24:15,080
because I thought my job was
more prestigious than I'm
632
00:24:15,080 --> 00:24:17,480
working jobs that I didn't think
it were as prestigious because I
633
00:24:17,480 --> 00:24:19,120
was in my early 20s.
Oh yeah.
634
00:24:19,120 --> 00:24:20,800
I can't come out tonight, mate.
Can't come out.
635
00:24:20,800 --> 00:24:21,960
Do you know why?
I didn't ask?
636
00:24:22,080 --> 00:24:23,360
Do you know why?
Can't come out tonight, mate?
637
00:24:23,520 --> 00:24:25,000
I was a markings dude.
I'm a teacher.
638
00:24:25,000 --> 00:24:27,760
Did You Know?
I help kids, I love kids.
639
00:24:27,840 --> 00:24:29,240
Do it for the money.
Don't think so.
640
00:24:29,240 --> 00:24:30,600
I do it for the money.
I'm bloody good at it though.
641
00:24:30,800 --> 00:24:32,040
Now do you know?
Do you know how you know?
642
00:24:32,040 --> 00:24:33,440
I'm good.
Got all those markets do
643
00:24:33,440 --> 00:24:34,400
tonight.
Can't come to the pub.
644
00:24:34,400 --> 00:24:37,120
See you later mate.
I live that and I think that is
645
00:24:37,640 --> 00:24:40,040
a huge sign.
I think there's a big
646
00:24:40,040 --> 00:24:41,600
discrepancy here.
Then we're going to come on to
647
00:24:41,600 --> 00:24:43,200
this, I think, in a minute and
have a real discussion about
648
00:24:43,200 --> 00:24:44,640
this.
To me, there's a huge
649
00:24:44,640 --> 00:24:47,160
discrepancy, and what makes a
martyr is someone who doesn't
650
00:24:47,160 --> 00:24:49,800
stop going on about it.
I know some teachers who go
651
00:24:49,800 --> 00:24:53,160
above and beyond every day, like
way more than they need to in
652
00:24:53,160 --> 00:24:55,280
the job.
And they'll do marking at home,
653
00:24:55,280 --> 00:24:57,600
or they'll, they'll take stuff
or they'll do something, but you
654
00:24:57,600 --> 00:24:59,520
will never know about it.
Yeah, you only know about it
655
00:24:59,520 --> 00:25:01,400
because you've seen them do it.
They'll they'll never, ever,
656
00:25:01,400 --> 00:25:02,880
ever walk through and say, I've
done this.
657
00:25:02,880 --> 00:25:04,600
By the way, to me, they're not
martyrs.
658
00:25:04,960 --> 00:25:07,160
Yeah, that's a different problem
that we're talking about there.
659
00:25:07,400 --> 00:25:09,760
A teacher martyr is someone who
honestly like, wears it like a
660
00:25:09,760 --> 00:25:11,520
badge of honour.
Yeah, you will know they're
661
00:25:11,520 --> 00:25:14,240
doing extra because they just
won't ever stop talking about
662
00:25:14,240 --> 00:25:14,880
it.
Yeah, yeah.
663
00:25:15,240 --> 00:25:16,440
OK.
Listen to some more things that
664
00:25:16,440 --> 00:25:18,160
define it because I really want
to build a picture.
665
00:25:18,400 --> 00:25:21,520
I want people to who listen to
this to understand like, oh,
666
00:25:21,680 --> 00:25:23,280
those kind of people.
I get it now.
667
00:25:23,440 --> 00:25:27,440
So another sign of a teacher
martyr is someone who undermines
668
00:25:27,440 --> 00:25:29,920
others who do less.
So it's like when someone is
669
00:25:29,920 --> 00:25:32,760
actually trying to stand up for
themselves or I don't know, just
670
00:25:32,760 --> 00:25:34,640
has a lot, has an appointment to
go to.
671
00:25:34,920 --> 00:25:37,280
It's just that just has a life
outside of teaching, right?
672
00:25:37,600 --> 00:25:39,760
Who says something and then
someone else, rather than just
673
00:25:39,760 --> 00:25:43,360
letting them be that person,
they have to say something.
674
00:25:43,520 --> 00:25:44,960
It's like, oh, well, I don't
know.
675
00:25:44,960 --> 00:25:46,680
I wouldn't do that.
I don't think I do that.
676
00:25:46,680 --> 00:25:49,640
I tell you what, I think it's
more important that we that we
677
00:25:49,640 --> 00:25:51,640
put the kids first.
So I will be doing this work
678
00:25:51,640 --> 00:25:54,360
that you just said you can't do.
It's those kind of people
679
00:25:54,360 --> 00:25:55,680
actually.
I've, I've got, I've got to
680
00:25:55,680 --> 00:25:57,600
share this with you because I
know you don't always like me
681
00:25:57,600 --> 00:26:00,800
sharing posts from Facebook and
things, but this I can't not I
682
00:26:00,840 --> 00:26:02,560
can't.
Keyboard warrior unlocked.
683
00:26:02,720 --> 00:26:05,600
You know, I'm trying so hard at
the moment to just not get as
684
00:26:05,600 --> 00:26:06,680
involved.
So there used to be a proper
685
00:26:06,680 --> 00:26:07,960
keyboard barrier.
Get involved in everything.
686
00:26:08,000 --> 00:26:10,600
But don't you find before you go
into this, don't you find that
687
00:26:10,600 --> 00:26:14,560
it's I, I I feel helpless.
Yeah.
688
00:26:14,560 --> 00:26:15,680
And and annoyed.
Yeah.
689
00:26:15,680 --> 00:26:19,640
Because when I bring stuff up,
the teacher, master them crusade
690
00:26:19,640 --> 00:26:22,280
come out and say, oh, aren't you
a good teacher, don't you?
691
00:26:22,280 --> 00:26:24,680
But what do you mean?
You care about this or you want
692
00:26:24,680 --> 00:26:27,320
money or you think you should
get time, blah, blah, blah.
693
00:26:27,360 --> 00:26:30,400
Yeah, shut up.
It's like, honestly, no, sorry,
694
00:26:30,400 --> 00:26:32,240
but just shut up.
Like leave me alone.
695
00:26:32,680 --> 00:26:35,360
It does not define how good I am
as a teacher because I'm not
696
00:26:35,360 --> 00:26:38,840
willing to sacrifice my evenings
to do stuff, which I think is
697
00:26:38,840 --> 00:26:42,280
pointless because like I said
before, I'm a professional and I
698
00:26:42,280 --> 00:26:44,160
know it won't have an impact on
the children.
699
00:26:44,160 --> 00:26:45,400
So you've got some.
Ready to link?
700
00:26:45,480 --> 00:26:47,760
I purposely not showing you this
because I wanted to rile you up.
701
00:26:47,800 --> 00:26:50,840
Remember old section is riling
you up on the podcast very early
702
00:26:50,840 --> 00:26:52,520
days.
I purposely leave things just to
703
00:26:52,520 --> 00:26:55,040
get him annoyed.
So someone just asked a genuine
704
00:26:55,040 --> 00:26:57,240
question right on on this group
it's about mass leads right?
705
00:26:57,600 --> 00:27:01,040
And it says can I just ask if
I'm not paid for a TLR to be
706
00:27:01,040 --> 00:27:02,600
mass lead, does it mean I'm
accountable?
707
00:27:02,600 --> 00:27:05,280
Basically when off to come in am
I ultimately the the most
708
00:27:05,280 --> 00:27:08,080
accountable person?
I'm not being paid a TLR, just a
709
00:27:08,080 --> 00:27:09,880
genuine question.
The answer is the answer is no.
710
00:27:09,880 --> 00:27:13,000
The answer is no, and it's a
it's a hard one because the real
711
00:27:13,000 --> 00:27:15,520
answer is you're responsible
because you have literally got
712
00:27:15,520 --> 00:27:16,880
the job title and that is what
you're doing.
713
00:27:16,880 --> 00:27:19,400
So you're if you're the person
who has been named responsible
714
00:27:19,400 --> 00:27:22,720
for organising maths and
monitoring books, then yeah,
715
00:27:22,720 --> 00:27:25,240
they're going to talk to you,
but you're not ultimately
716
00:27:25,240 --> 00:27:27,080
accountable.
Good for the outcomes of it.
717
00:27:27,080 --> 00:27:28,360
Yeah, that's the that was the
real.
718
00:27:28,360 --> 00:27:30,720
That's what I wanted to know
because it's quite clearly.
719
00:27:31,240 --> 00:27:32,960
So if if it is a.
Responsibility.
720
00:27:32,960 --> 00:27:34,560
If only we had some kind of
teaching and learning
721
00:27:34,560 --> 00:27:35,520
responsibility.
Money.
722
00:27:35,520 --> 00:27:37,760
I know, I know.
It's like honestly, in my
723
00:27:37,760 --> 00:27:40,280
opinion, as soon as you're not
paid the TLR, yeah, teaching and
724
00:27:40,280 --> 00:27:43,560
learning responsibility.
In my head I think it's fair
725
00:27:43,560 --> 00:27:45,160
enough to say no, it's not my
responsibility.
726
00:27:45,320 --> 00:27:46,400
Do you know what?
I might help.
727
00:27:46,840 --> 00:27:49,680
I might accept being masted.
Lots of people in small schools
728
00:27:49,680 --> 00:27:51,760
probably shouting now going,
well someones got to do it,
729
00:27:51,840 --> 00:27:53,240
sure.
But you know what?
730
00:27:53,320 --> 00:27:56,480
Someones also got to say no at
some point and then we'll
731
00:27:56,480 --> 00:27:59,480
realise the system is broken
completely built on goodwill.
732
00:27:59,600 --> 00:28:01,720
I always think of the bar
someone's got to do, OK,
733
00:28:01,720 --> 00:28:03,560
someone's got to teach, but we
all accept we get paid for that
734
00:28:03,560 --> 00:28:04,240
one.
Exactly.
735
00:28:04,320 --> 00:28:05,960
OK.
If they took that away, yeah.
736
00:28:06,240 --> 00:28:08,520
Would you accept someone saying,
well, someone's got to teach the
737
00:28:08,520 --> 00:28:09,360
kids?
That's a good point.
738
00:28:09,480 --> 00:28:11,160
So I will have to bloody do it
for free?
739
00:28:11,320 --> 00:28:13,760
No, you wouldn't.
So why do we just have a weird
740
00:28:13,760 --> 00:28:15,600
bar?
Someone's got to scan the
741
00:28:15,600 --> 00:28:18,600
groceries at Asda.
Yeah, well, yeah, of course they
742
00:28:18,600 --> 00:28:20,000
do.
Yeah, that's a society.
743
00:28:20,120 --> 00:28:22,440
Get over it.
We live in a society where you
744
00:28:22,440 --> 00:28:24,800
need to be.
You've given money for what
745
00:28:24,800 --> 00:28:26,520
you're doing.
Someone's got to do this job.
746
00:28:26,520 --> 00:28:29,760
Yes, we have job.
We pay people to do jobs anyway.
747
00:28:29,920 --> 00:28:31,960
So this person and I couldn't, I
couldn't not buy.
748
00:28:31,960 --> 00:28:33,400
I ready.
Someone, someone replied.
749
00:28:33,400 --> 00:28:35,960
Commented on this person's post
right I was thinking that the
750
00:28:35,960 --> 00:28:37,840
suitable The only thing that
people should be commenting on
751
00:28:37,840 --> 00:28:40,760
this is an answer with either
yes or no and why sure this
752
00:28:40,760 --> 00:28:42,560
person put here we.
Go.
753
00:28:42,600 --> 00:28:44,000
I know it's going to.
I can fill myself.
754
00:28:44,000 --> 00:28:44,800
Yeah.
Ready.
755
00:28:45,360 --> 00:28:48,080
I've been a mass lead since I
was on M2M2.
756
00:28:48,080 --> 00:28:50,240
For those that aren't in
teaching, is a pay scale quite
757
00:28:50,240 --> 00:28:52,000
early on in the pay scale.
Two years in, two years into
758
00:28:52,000 --> 00:28:55,120
teaching, still on main pay
scale now and also key stage
759
00:28:55,120 --> 00:28:57,200
lead.
Proud to be in a position of
760
00:28:57,200 --> 00:29:00,520
responsibility and only want to
do the best for my school.
761
00:29:00,800 --> 00:29:03,200
Whether it's Ofsted or my
day-to-day kids, they'll see the
762
00:29:03,200 --> 00:29:06,640
best of me and my school.
Happy to be held accountable for
763
00:29:06,640 --> 00:29:09,080
the work I do.
That's teacher Marta.
764
00:29:10,280 --> 00:29:13,200
That's teacher Marta.
Exactly what it is that is
765
00:29:13,280 --> 00:29:15,320
wearing it as a badge of pride.
That's my whole point.
766
00:29:15,320 --> 00:29:16,200
And do you know what?
Really?
767
00:29:16,200 --> 00:29:17,520
Do you know what annoyed me even
more?
768
00:29:17,760 --> 00:29:20,760
It was the most liked response
on that whole post and there was
769
00:29:20,760 --> 00:29:22,520
loads of interaction.
OK, I'm going to play devil's
770
00:29:22,520 --> 00:29:24,720
advocate slightly, OK?
Because do you know what?
771
00:29:24,720 --> 00:29:29,400
I know we think the same thing
about this, but is that a bad
772
00:29:29,400 --> 00:29:31,760
thing to say?
You know, why is it a bad thing
773
00:29:31,760 --> 00:29:33,800
to say specifically?
Because if someone wants to do
774
00:29:33,800 --> 00:29:37,400
that, if someone feels like, OK,
look, I am actually, I'm proud,
775
00:29:38,200 --> 00:29:41,080
why is that problematic?
OK, because pride doesn't pay
776
00:29:41,080 --> 00:29:44,200
the bills.
Pride doesn't pay the bills and
777
00:29:44,320 --> 00:29:47,160
it sets a rubbish example to
others.
778
00:29:47,520 --> 00:29:51,760
If, if, if we want to, if we
collectively agree that teaching
779
00:29:51,760 --> 00:29:54,000
is dire at the moment, it's in a
dire state that people don't
780
00:29:54,000 --> 00:29:55,320
want to do it.
People are leaving the job.
781
00:29:55,320 --> 00:29:57,480
If we agree that that is a
problem and it's a problem we
782
00:29:57,480 --> 00:30:00,360
need to fix.
We just can't accept opinions
783
00:30:00,360 --> 00:30:01,320
like that.
We can't.
784
00:30:01,480 --> 00:30:04,400
We can't have people coming in
with smarmy high horse opinions
785
00:30:04,640 --> 00:30:07,680
to people who are just asking a
genuine question and say and not
786
00:30:07,680 --> 00:30:10,840
even answer it and just be like,
I wouldn't even ask that
787
00:30:10,840 --> 00:30:13,520
question because actually I just
do it because I love it.
788
00:30:13,520 --> 00:30:15,800
Yeah, it's like, no, it's not
acceptable.
789
00:30:15,800 --> 00:30:18,360
So I'm I'm very much of the
opinion of no, it's not.
790
00:30:18,360 --> 00:30:20,280
That's not OK to do that.
I actually replied, I'm going to
791
00:30:20,280 --> 00:30:22,840
read my reply.
And I put you could also just do
792
00:30:22,840 --> 00:30:25,800
it not for free, though.
We should all set the example
793
00:30:25,800 --> 00:30:28,480
that our time is valuable and
not to be taken for granted and
794
00:30:28,480 --> 00:30:30,680
pride doesn't pay the bills.
And I thought, I'm going to say
795
00:30:30,680 --> 00:30:31,240
it.
And you know what?
796
00:30:31,240 --> 00:30:32,840
I know people disagree.
And then someone underneath it
797
00:30:32,840 --> 00:30:34,520
commented and I thought, oh,
maybe they're maybe they're
798
00:30:34,520 --> 00:30:36,920
agreeing with me and said it's
so wonderful to see your level
799
00:30:36,920 --> 00:30:38,840
to the the original person, your
level of commitment and
800
00:30:38,840 --> 00:30:40,880
enthusiasm.
Unfortunately, budgets in
801
00:30:40,880 --> 00:30:42,520
schools just don't allow for
TLRS.
802
00:30:42,880 --> 00:30:44,960
Thanks for going above and
behalf above and beyond.
803
00:30:45,040 --> 00:30:46,680
Yeah, cool.
What do you mean?
804
00:30:46,680 --> 00:30:48,000
OK, so we're all accepting it
then, are we?
805
00:30:48,160 --> 00:30:51,720
Unfortunately, we don't have
money anymore, but we still need
806
00:30:51,720 --> 00:30:53,040
to do the job.
So we're all going to do it for
807
00:30:53,040 --> 00:30:54,880
free.
Yeah, unbelievable.
808
00:30:54,880 --> 00:30:56,440
What are you talking about?
And there was something in
809
00:30:56,440 --> 00:30:58,680
there, I can't remember what it
was now, but towards the end it
810
00:30:58,680 --> 00:31:01,000
kind of it.
There's a huge inference in what
811
00:31:01,000 --> 00:31:04,760
he said there, which is I I care
about my kids.
812
00:31:04,760 --> 00:31:06,360
Yeah.
Yeah, I care about my school.
813
00:31:06,360 --> 00:31:07,720
See the best of me, they'll see
the best.
814
00:31:07,760 --> 00:31:12,360
Therefore I'll do this.
And what that infers is all well
815
00:31:12,360 --> 00:31:13,480
and good.
You want to go up and beyond,
816
00:31:13,480 --> 00:31:13,800
right?
Yeah.
817
00:31:14,080 --> 00:31:17,240
But don't you dare put comments
like that in a teacher group,
818
00:31:17,400 --> 00:31:19,800
which is essentially inferring
if anyone has any kind of
819
00:31:19,800 --> 00:31:21,920
inference schools, which I hope
you do as a teacher in a teacher
820
00:31:21,920 --> 00:31:26,040
group, you are honestly saying,
therefore, if you don't, you are
821
00:31:26,040 --> 00:31:27,520
not on my level of caring.
Yeah.
822
00:31:27,680 --> 00:31:30,280
Martyrdom completely.
If you don't do it, it is that
823
00:31:30,280 --> 00:31:32,280
first thing I said.
It is that like, you're only
824
00:31:32,280 --> 00:31:35,080
worthwhile if you make personal
sacrifices, and therefore if you
825
00:31:35,080 --> 00:31:37,200
see other people who aren't
doing those same sacrifices, you
826
00:31:37,200 --> 00:31:38,120
think they're not as good as
you.
827
00:31:38,200 --> 00:31:39,640
I hate it.
Completely.
828
00:31:39,800 --> 00:31:42,040
And that's kind of the other end
here of what we're going to say
829
00:31:42,040 --> 00:31:44,120
in terms of like teacher
martyrdom.
830
00:31:44,440 --> 00:31:46,000
There are two types.
They're that type where this
831
00:31:46,000 --> 00:31:48,240
guy's just happy to do it, still
a martyr.
832
00:31:48,560 --> 00:31:50,720
There's the other type where
they they, they're burnt out
833
00:31:50,720 --> 00:31:52,720
because of it.
They let themselves get burnt
834
00:31:52,720 --> 00:31:54,560
out.
They know it's bad for them.
835
00:31:54,560 --> 00:31:57,520
They complain about it, but they
still wear it as a badge of
836
00:31:57,520 --> 00:31:59,040
honour.
They still say, but you know
837
00:31:59,040 --> 00:32:01,400
what?
I'm tough, stiff up a lip.
838
00:32:01,400 --> 00:32:04,440
I'm going to wear it like about
I am burnt out and I know it's a
839
00:32:04,440 --> 00:32:06,160
problem, but you know what?
I'm not one of them quitters.
840
00:32:06,160 --> 00:32:08,160
Yeah, yeah, we talk about
retention crisis, but I'm not
841
00:32:08,160 --> 00:32:09,440
one of them quitters.
I'm burnt out.
842
00:32:09,720 --> 00:32:13,000
That's so unhealthy.
It's so unhealthy.
843
00:32:13,000 --> 00:32:15,880
That badge of honour is probably
our next identifier, isn't it,
844
00:32:15,920 --> 00:32:17,400
of what so we're going through
right now What?
845
00:32:17,400 --> 00:32:20,520
How can you identify someone who
is this martyr, Right?
846
00:32:20,520 --> 00:32:23,200
And they take home, they take
loads of homework regularly, all
847
00:32:23,200 --> 00:32:24,720
the time, and they always talk
about it.
848
00:32:24,720 --> 00:32:26,960
Like you said, they mention the
fact they do that they undermine
849
00:32:26,960 --> 00:32:29,160
others who aren't martyring
themselves for some reason
850
00:32:29,160 --> 00:32:31,320
rather than just letting them be
or even sticking up for them.
851
00:32:32,040 --> 00:32:33,960
And also they wear their burnout
as a badge of honour.
852
00:32:34,120 --> 00:32:36,880
Another thing they do is they
don't remotely try and solve the
853
00:32:36,880 --> 00:32:38,760
issue, so they all moan about
the stuff.
854
00:32:39,240 --> 00:32:40,640
So a teacher might just think
about it.
855
00:32:40,640 --> 00:32:43,200
I'm sorry if we're like hitting
home with this and maybe you do
856
00:32:43,200 --> 00:32:44,640
some of these things.
I certainly have done all these
857
00:32:44,640 --> 00:32:46,360
things in my career.
Of course, I'm not sat here in
858
00:32:46,360 --> 00:32:50,680
my high horse, I promise you.
But people who moan about stuff
859
00:32:50,680 --> 00:32:52,240
to you as another teacher.
Teacher.
860
00:32:52,520 --> 00:32:54,480
Oh, God, have you seen SLT have
done this now?
861
00:32:54,480 --> 00:32:56,360
As if we haven't got enough work
going on.
862
00:32:56,520 --> 00:32:58,200
Moan, moan, moan, moan, moan.
SLT.
863
00:32:58,200 --> 00:32:59,280
Come along.
Is everyone all right?
864
00:32:59,320 --> 00:33:00,000
Yeah.
Doing great.
865
00:33:00,000 --> 00:33:01,320
We're fine.
We're absolutely fine.
866
00:33:01,320 --> 00:33:02,880
Completely fine.
They don't say anything.
867
00:33:02,880 --> 00:33:04,120
It's like, what do you want
then?
868
00:33:04,840 --> 00:33:06,760
It's like, it's like that, that
mean the whole thing of like
869
00:33:06,760 --> 00:33:08,760
you're in a staff meeting.
You're like, are you going to
870
00:33:08,760 --> 00:33:09,960
say it?
I'll say it if you say it.
871
00:33:10,160 --> 00:33:11,840
I'll say if you say you're going
to say something about it.
872
00:33:11,840 --> 00:33:13,240
Yeah, I'll do that.
OK, no problem.
873
00:33:13,480 --> 00:33:14,960
All right, guys.
So that's a new initiative.
874
00:33:14,960 --> 00:33:19,880
Any problems sat there silently?
Yeah, no, Listen, be a
875
00:33:19,880 --> 00:33:21,880
professional.
And do you know what?
876
00:33:21,880 --> 00:33:24,240
Solving the issue.
Again, you're talking a lot
877
00:33:24,240 --> 00:33:27,400
about people who moan about it.
I think after hearing that post,
878
00:33:27,400 --> 00:33:29,120
we need to include the people
who don't moan about it.
879
00:33:29,360 --> 00:33:31,240
They're almost more toxic,
genuinely.
880
00:33:31,240 --> 00:33:33,320
Like, I get people in moaning
and bring people down and not
881
00:33:33,320 --> 00:33:34,440
fixing.
That's really frustrating.
882
00:33:35,040 --> 00:33:37,200
At least you feel like you can
kind of be on the level and kind
883
00:33:37,200 --> 00:33:39,400
of maybe you can work together
with them to say, let's, let's,
884
00:33:39,440 --> 00:33:41,320
let's try and solve this then.
Maybe that's your voice.
885
00:33:41,320 --> 00:33:42,200
Yeah, completely.
Maybe.
886
00:33:42,200 --> 00:33:44,400
And they're just a bit, maybe
they are nervous about speaking
887
00:33:44,400 --> 00:33:46,280
up.
OK, it's still a problem, still
888
00:33:46,280 --> 00:33:48,360
problematic.
The people like that person on
889
00:33:48,360 --> 00:33:51,200
the post, they're more of a
problem because they are
890
00:33:51,200 --> 00:33:52,760
championing at it.
They're saying no, no, no.
891
00:33:52,760 --> 00:33:54,440
This is what teaching.
Putting you down for.
892
00:33:54,440 --> 00:33:56,520
Yeah.
And and what winds me up, I'll
893
00:33:56,520 --> 00:33:58,080
make this.
It's a slightly separate point,
894
00:33:58,080 --> 00:33:59,840
but it's linked to what this
guy's talking about.
895
00:34:00,400 --> 00:34:03,840
It's that kind of attitude where
people who aren't in school will
896
00:34:03,840 --> 00:34:06,880
look at it, congratulate it, say
well done, that's right, that's
897
00:34:06,880 --> 00:34:08,639
why you get into teaching.
We need more of the.
898
00:34:08,639 --> 00:34:11,600
Amount of people who've said to
me, why did you get into
899
00:34:11,600 --> 00:34:14,040
teaching if you're worried about
the money, What do you why you
900
00:34:14,040 --> 00:34:15,639
might well do you not care about
the kids?
901
00:34:15,920 --> 00:34:17,600
And I'm just like, you're so
toxic.
902
00:34:17,920 --> 00:34:19,400
You are.
This is a job.
903
00:34:19,560 --> 00:34:21,679
What you're doing is horrendous.
I'm a human being.
904
00:34:21,960 --> 00:34:23,960
I've got a family, I've got
interests.
905
00:34:24,120 --> 00:34:26,840
This is my job.
OK, get over it.
906
00:34:26,840 --> 00:34:31,199
The fact that I am not going to
sacrifice my entire life because
907
00:34:31,199 --> 00:34:34,120
I like children.
Why should someone who's in a
908
00:34:34,120 --> 00:34:36,840
job like teaching nursing, being
a doctor, being a public
909
00:34:36,840 --> 00:34:39,239
servant, doing a job which we
all collectively agree is really
910
00:34:39,239 --> 00:34:41,159
important and goes above what
other jobs do?
911
00:34:41,520 --> 00:34:45,239
Why should that person then as a
result of that also be put in
912
00:34:45,239 --> 00:34:47,239
this benchmark of which means
you don't care about money or
913
00:34:47,239 --> 00:34:48,440
you shouldn't be like
represented.
914
00:34:48,440 --> 00:34:50,080
Well, you shouldn't be given
money to like because you've
915
00:34:50,080 --> 00:34:52,920
gone above and beyond.
What an insane dichotomy we
916
00:34:52,920 --> 00:34:53,280
have.
Yeah.
917
00:34:53,480 --> 00:34:55,480
Yeah.
Where we we all agree being an
918
00:34:55,480 --> 00:34:58,480
insurance broker and A and a
quantity surveyor.
919
00:34:58,640 --> 00:34:59,760
We all agree.
Oh, yeah.
920
00:35:00,240 --> 00:35:01,600
I couldn't be a teacher.
That's like you.
921
00:35:01,600 --> 00:35:03,440
That's the love for the job.
And nurses have worked to the
922
00:35:03,440 --> 00:35:05,160
bone.
But we then also collectively
923
00:35:05,160 --> 00:35:06,160
agree.
Yeah, you should be.
924
00:35:06,160 --> 00:35:07,360
Yeah.
They get much more money than a
925
00:35:07,360 --> 00:35:09,520
teacher.
What are you talking about?
926
00:35:09,880 --> 00:35:12,080
Of course we should stand up for
ourselves and get paid for
927
00:35:12,080 --> 00:35:12,720
stuff.
Yeah.
928
00:35:13,160 --> 00:35:15,520
No one's walking around a
building site with a badge
929
00:35:15,520 --> 00:35:16,320
going.
I'm a builder.
930
00:35:16,760 --> 00:35:18,400
Someone's got to build this
nursery.
931
00:35:18,800 --> 00:35:20,400
Yeah, they have.
And you should get paid for it.
932
00:35:20,680 --> 00:35:21,520
Yeah, of course you should.
Yeah.
933
00:35:21,760 --> 00:35:23,200
Tell you what, that doesn't
happen anywhere else.
934
00:35:23,280 --> 00:35:25,920
Is it exactly Someone's got to
pay there, Someone's got to be
935
00:35:25,920 --> 00:35:28,040
an accountant to sort those
bills out, haven't they?
936
00:35:28,040 --> 00:35:29,680
Yeah, yeah.
And you'd never do.
937
00:35:29,720 --> 00:35:31,280
And I'm proud of my work.
Yeah.
938
00:35:31,280 --> 00:35:33,120
Once again, I'm going to mention
this bargain because I feel like
939
00:35:33,120 --> 00:35:35,080
it's the easiest analogy to get
through to people, right?
940
00:35:35,360 --> 00:35:36,840
It is just whatever you think
you're.
941
00:35:36,840 --> 00:35:39,520
But if you are a teacher martyr,
if you agree with that person,
942
00:35:39,680 --> 00:35:41,240
that's like, well, you know,
like the one that said, oh,
943
00:35:41,240 --> 00:35:44,760
there's no budget for the TLRS,
OK, All right, Suddenly we're in
944
00:35:44,760 --> 00:35:45,760
a new world now.
Ready.
945
00:35:45,800 --> 00:35:48,040
Oh, there's no budget for
teaching anymore.
946
00:35:48,040 --> 00:35:50,040
It's been halved.
Will you do your job?
947
00:35:50,080 --> 00:35:52,640
I'm asking you, the listener,
would you do your job?
948
00:35:52,640 --> 00:35:54,440
Whatever it is, if it's
teaching, whatever for half the
949
00:35:54,440 --> 00:35:56,520
pay right now, cut in half,
would you do it?
950
00:35:56,760 --> 00:36:00,320
If the answer is no, which it
probably is, OK, maybe have some
951
00:36:00,320 --> 00:36:02,400
envy for those other people who
are just higher.
952
00:36:02,400 --> 00:36:04,640
They just have a slightly higher
bar than you who are thinking,
953
00:36:04,720 --> 00:36:08,360
no, I won't also be a mass lead
for free on top it needs it's a
954
00:36:08,360 --> 00:36:10,880
part of the job is extra.
I need to be paid for it.
955
00:36:11,800 --> 00:36:13,920
Oh, well, you know, you get paid
a lot as you.
956
00:36:13,960 --> 00:36:17,160
You just do what you can.
I'm, I'm proud of what I do.
957
00:36:18,120 --> 00:36:19,760
I just, I don't know.
It drives me crazy.
958
00:36:19,760 --> 00:36:21,520
Yeah, yeah, yeah, I agree.
I completely agree.
959
00:36:21,880 --> 00:36:24,000
And and on that, do you know
what all you need to think about
960
00:36:24,000 --> 00:36:25,720
is the strikes.
I keep going back to the strikes
961
00:36:25,720 --> 00:36:26,880
and this lifts ramp free in my
head.
962
00:36:27,080 --> 00:36:29,680
OK, think about your score,
right.
963
00:36:29,680 --> 00:36:32,640
If you're listening right now,
think about when you went on
964
00:36:32,640 --> 00:36:34,440
strike last year, if you did or
not, whatever.
965
00:36:34,440 --> 00:36:36,480
But think about that process
when people were deciding
966
00:36:36,480 --> 00:36:39,440
whether to go on strike or not.
OK, so there are three, There
967
00:36:39,440 --> 00:36:41,520
are three camps.
They're the people who decided
968
00:36:41,520 --> 00:36:44,960
not to go on strike.
You know what, at least they're
969
00:36:44,960 --> 00:36:46,640
holding their head above and
say, no, I don't want to go on
970
00:36:46,640 --> 00:36:48,520
strike, blah, blah for the kids.
We can fix it.
971
00:36:49,280 --> 00:36:51,160
I can have a debate with you.
At least I don't, I don't agree
972
00:36:51,160 --> 00:36:52,800
with you.
Obviously there's the people
973
00:36:52,800 --> 00:36:56,040
like us who from the offset, as
the second group were saying,
974
00:36:56,040 --> 00:36:57,520
OK, I'm going on strike.
Of course I am.
975
00:36:57,600 --> 00:36:59,480
This is completely broken.
I'm going on strike.
976
00:36:59,640 --> 00:37:01,440
We're going to, I'm going to
hold my head above the parapet.
977
00:37:01,440 --> 00:37:03,880
I'm going to lose hundreds of
pounds out of my pay packet
978
00:37:04,080 --> 00:37:06,720
because I want to make the point
that this is completely broken
979
00:37:06,720 --> 00:37:09,920
and we need to fix something.
Now think of that third group.
980
00:37:10,160 --> 00:37:12,840
And that third group of people
were the ones who didn't really
981
00:37:12,840 --> 00:37:14,520
talk about strike, a bit more
reluctant.
982
00:37:14,520 --> 00:37:16,640
And it might be for a lot of
reasons, by the way, not just
983
00:37:16,640 --> 00:37:18,880
because they're a martyr, might
be because they're struggling
984
00:37:18,880 --> 00:37:21,520
with finances at home, all, all
legitimate reasons.
985
00:37:21,760 --> 00:37:23,040
But just think of that third
group.
986
00:37:23,400 --> 00:37:25,760
And within that third group, I
bet you find the martyrs.
987
00:37:26,120 --> 00:37:27,760
I bet you find those martyrs
who.
988
00:37:27,760 --> 00:37:29,720
Yeah, OK, some of them might be
the ones who didn't go on
989
00:37:29,720 --> 00:37:31,600
strike, but at least they're
holding their convictions and
990
00:37:31,600 --> 00:37:33,160
that you can have a SO.
Make this group really clear.
991
00:37:33,160 --> 00:37:34,880
So these are people who who are
not.
992
00:37:34,880 --> 00:37:36,720
Sure.
Yeah, unlike us who still went
993
00:37:36,720 --> 00:37:39,640
on strike in the end, right?
But these are the people who
994
00:37:39,640 --> 00:37:41,960
were waiting to see what
everyone did, OK?
995
00:37:42,160 --> 00:37:44,160
They're the people.
I bet you can all think of
996
00:37:44,160 --> 00:37:46,680
someone who went up to you or
other people in the school went,
997
00:37:46,680 --> 00:37:49,600
are you going on strike?
Because that was the thing they
998
00:37:49,600 --> 00:37:52,920
needed to decide themselves.
And if everyone said no, these
999
00:37:52,920 --> 00:37:54,640
people probably would have said
no as well.
1000
00:37:54,640 --> 00:37:55,760
If everyone said yes, they said
yes.
1001
00:37:55,760 --> 00:37:57,280
So they're kind of on the fence
and they don't.
1002
00:37:57,280 --> 00:37:59,520
They need that.
And that's why a lot of schools,
1003
00:37:59,960 --> 00:38:02,960
95% of the teachers went on
strike or 10% of the teachers
1004
00:38:02,960 --> 00:38:05,680
went on strike, because that
middle group, the ones who can
1005
00:38:05,680 --> 00:38:08,840
be swayed for collective action,
are the ones because that needed
1006
00:38:08,840 --> 00:38:12,080
to be LED a certain way.
And in there, I can think of
1007
00:38:12,080 --> 00:38:16,120
people who I know of from other
schools, from my profession, I
1008
00:38:16,120 --> 00:38:21,080
see on online all the time who I
know went on strike but now do
1009
00:38:21,160 --> 00:38:24,560
absolutely nothing to try and
reduce their workload and almost
1010
00:38:24,560 --> 00:38:26,160
thrive in it and say, oh, it's
just a job, isn't it?
1011
00:38:26,680 --> 00:38:29,360
So you were willing to lose
hundreds of pounds from your pay
1012
00:38:29,360 --> 00:38:30,120
packet.
Yeah.
1013
00:38:30,240 --> 00:38:33,280
And the face of going on strike
and saying this to me, the
1014
00:38:33,280 --> 00:38:35,800
ultimate action to say that this
is a completely broken system.
1015
00:38:35,800 --> 00:38:37,280
Yeah.
But you're not willing to now
1016
00:38:37,280 --> 00:38:39,520
say, oh, actually, I think that
thing you're asking me to plan
1017
00:38:39,520 --> 00:38:40,520
out the weekend is a bit too
much?
1018
00:38:40,520 --> 00:38:41,640
Which I've been on strike for
last year.
1019
00:38:41,640 --> 00:38:43,080
Completely.
I think it's insane.
1020
00:38:43,200 --> 00:38:45,440
And I think if you if you go to
the level where you're going to
1021
00:38:45,440 --> 00:38:47,160
lose hundreds of pounds every
month because you're willing to
1022
00:38:47,160 --> 00:38:49,280
go on strike, yeah.
But you can't then say to your
1023
00:38:49,280 --> 00:38:52,520
SLT, I'm a professional and this
is not acceptable.
1024
00:38:52,840 --> 00:38:54,880
What on earth is going on?
And it comes down to that
1025
00:38:54,880 --> 00:38:56,440
collective action.
Yeah, yeah.
1026
00:38:56,560 --> 00:38:59,000
The power of collective action.
I think we've kind of defined
1027
00:38:59,520 --> 00:39:01,680
what teacher Marthas are they?
Look, I think we should move on
1028
00:39:01,680 --> 00:39:04,600
to why?
Like really why it's a problem?
1029
00:39:04,600 --> 00:39:07,560
Because when we said we're
ranting a lot and I really want
1030
00:39:07,560 --> 00:39:08,880
to get into because.
Someone.
1031
00:39:08,880 --> 00:39:10,480
Yeah, go on.
It's not, it's not just that.
1032
00:39:10,480 --> 00:39:12,320
It's not that me and Dylan are
on our high.
1033
00:39:12,360 --> 00:39:13,920
I keep saying high horse, but
we're not that we're on a high
1034
00:39:13,920 --> 00:39:15,680
horse and we're like, we don't
want to do the work anymore
1035
00:39:15,680 --> 00:39:17,800
because we've got children now.
So we think everyone should be
1036
00:39:17,800 --> 00:39:20,120
like us.
I, I think it's deep, way
1037
00:39:20,120 --> 00:39:23,000
further rooted than this.
Not being a martyr is a huge
1038
00:39:23,000 --> 00:39:25,040
problem in general.
I think we should just break
1039
00:39:25,040 --> 00:39:28,360
down why it's a massive problem
to education, to all of us as a
1040
00:39:28,360 --> 00:39:30,120
collective.
Look.
1041
00:39:30,120 --> 00:39:32,520
Look at the fact of retention,
right?
1042
00:39:32,520 --> 00:39:36,560
Look at retention right now, OK?
It's a huge crisis.
1043
00:39:36,720 --> 00:39:39,520
We all agree there's not.
I don't think there's a teacher
1044
00:39:39,520 --> 00:39:40,800
out there who'll say retention's
all right.
1045
00:39:41,160 --> 00:39:43,240
Because if you don't, you are
literally disagreeing with a
1046
00:39:43,240 --> 00:39:45,080
number.
Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.
1047
00:39:45,080 --> 00:39:47,720
Not remotely meeting the needs
of how many teachers we have and
1048
00:39:47,720 --> 00:39:50,880
need.
So that what that comes down to
1049
00:39:50,880 --> 00:39:54,920
for me and what teacher
martyrdom does is it sets such
1050
00:39:55,000 --> 00:39:59,520
an unrealistic bar.
And the biggest issue I have
1051
00:39:59,520 --> 00:40:00,840
with wearing like a badge of
honour.
1052
00:40:01,320 --> 00:40:05,160
Is it then becomes so much
easier for it to become the
1053
00:40:05,160 --> 00:40:08,800
norm.
And if you, especially if you're
1054
00:40:08,800 --> 00:40:11,680
too faced about it, especially
if you wear it as a badge of
1055
00:40:11,680 --> 00:40:13,880
honour and, and say and, and to
the people above you, you're
1056
00:40:13,880 --> 00:40:16,280
like, yeah, I've done that.
I've done that straight away for
1057
00:40:16,280 --> 00:40:17,320
you.
So well done.
1058
00:40:17,680 --> 00:40:19,720
But then you go to your team and
moan and moan and moan.
1059
00:40:19,720 --> 00:40:22,640
Yeah, yeah.
Listen, don't moan at me.
1060
00:40:22,720 --> 00:40:25,800
You're setting the bar for me.
Don't talk to me about how crap
1061
00:40:25,800 --> 00:40:27,800
this is because you're doing it,
OK?
1062
00:40:27,800 --> 00:40:29,560
Don't come to me as like, I'm
your comrade.
1063
00:40:29,560 --> 00:40:31,360
Isn't this crap?
Yeah, Yeah, it's crap.
1064
00:40:31,360 --> 00:40:32,560
Did you do it?
Yeah.
1065
00:40:32,840 --> 00:40:34,080
Don't.
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
1066
00:40:34,200 --> 00:40:36,440
The amount of times I've said to
people don't do it.
1067
00:40:36,440 --> 00:40:37,280
Yeah.
And they've gone.
1068
00:40:37,320 --> 00:40:39,440
Oh.
Because what it does is it ruins
1069
00:40:39,440 --> 00:40:41,120
your opportunity to say
something about it.
1070
00:40:41,120 --> 00:40:43,960
Exactly.
If if, if eight members of staff
1071
00:40:43,960 --> 00:40:46,400
out of 10 do the thing and they
all moan about it, the two
1072
00:40:46,400 --> 00:40:48,520
members of staff that were
thinking before they did it, ah,
1073
00:40:48,520 --> 00:40:50,080
we all don't want to do this
thing.
1074
00:40:50,080 --> 00:40:52,280
Let's go and tell SOT.
Actually, this is unreasonable.
1075
00:40:52,840 --> 00:40:55,040
It loses all power when 8 of
them actually did it, though.
1076
00:40:55,680 --> 00:40:57,760
You go to SOTI, don't want to do
this, what all your colleagues
1077
00:40:57,760 --> 00:40:58,880
did.
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
1078
00:40:58,880 --> 00:41:00,640
But they didn't want to.
Well, they didn't tell me that.
1079
00:41:00,640 --> 00:41:01,600
And they.
Did and they did it.
1080
00:41:01,600 --> 00:41:03,320
So, yeah, this is kind of what I
meant, right?
1081
00:41:03,320 --> 00:41:05,200
Let's start the episode when I
said I'm losing the will to live
1082
00:41:05,200 --> 00:41:07,360
as a teacher.
The reason I'm losing the will
1083
00:41:07,360 --> 00:41:09,960
to live as a teacher is because
it is like fighting an uphill
1084
00:41:09,960 --> 00:41:11,800
battle.
And my enemies are the literal
1085
00:41:11,800 --> 00:41:14,480
people I'm trying to help.
It is you guys.
1086
00:41:14,480 --> 00:41:17,640
It is the, it is teachers that I
work with and love and respect
1087
00:41:17,640 --> 00:41:20,440
who are just in the way.
They're just, they're just,
1088
00:41:20,440 --> 00:41:22,560
they're saying one thing.
I don't want to do all this
1089
00:41:22,560 --> 00:41:23,760
work.
This is crazy.
1090
00:41:23,760 --> 00:41:25,240
This job isn't.
It's getting mad how much work,
1091
00:41:25,240 --> 00:41:27,920
what's really impacting my life.
And then they're doing it
1092
00:41:27,920 --> 00:41:30,440
anyway.
And then when I try to say
1093
00:41:30,440 --> 00:41:32,800
anything about it, it's well, we
all did it.
1094
00:41:32,800 --> 00:41:34,600
Why aren't you doing it?
You look bad in comparison.
1095
00:41:34,600 --> 00:41:36,480
And you know what?
People like me quit.
1096
00:41:37,240 --> 00:41:39,600
I'm a good teacher.
I think I'm a good teacher.
1097
00:41:39,600 --> 00:41:41,600
The kids because like me that we
get, we get on well.
1098
00:41:41,640 --> 00:41:43,880
They learn lots of things.
I tell you what though, I'm
1099
00:41:43,880 --> 00:41:46,480
going to quit this job if it
carries on because I can't.
1100
00:41:46,480 --> 00:41:47,720
I feel like it's just a losing
battle.
1101
00:41:47,960 --> 00:41:50,280
This is what I mean.
Losing the world to live because
1102
00:41:50,760 --> 00:41:53,080
teacher martyrs, setting on an
unrealistic bar that I'm not
1103
00:41:53,080 --> 00:41:55,760
willing to reach anymore because
I don't think you need to reach
1104
00:41:55,760 --> 00:41:57,680
it to be a good teacher.
Said, you know what, if I can't
1105
00:41:57,680 --> 00:41:58,960
reach it, I'm going to get
penalised for it.
1106
00:41:58,960 --> 00:41:59,840
See you later.
Find someone.
1107
00:41:59,840 --> 00:42:01,720
Else And the craziest thing
about this bar is we all
1108
00:42:01,720 --> 00:42:02,920
collectively agree it's too
high.
1109
00:42:02,960 --> 00:42:05,880
Yeah, like how?
What on earth is going on when
1110
00:42:05,880 --> 00:42:09,280
not one person thinks that bar
is acceptable, yet we still will
1111
00:42:09,280 --> 00:42:11,560
have to magically reach it?
Stop it.
1112
00:42:12,000 --> 00:42:14,400
Say no.
If you all agree as
1113
00:42:14,400 --> 00:42:16,480
professionals that it's not
having an impact.
1114
00:42:16,680 --> 00:42:19,200
If you're spending an hour and a
half doing something every week
1115
00:42:19,200 --> 00:42:21,600
that you know is having such a
negligible impact on the
1116
00:42:21,600 --> 00:42:24,200
children, right?
It's not worth that nought
1117
00:42:24,200 --> 00:42:26,880
point, nought .2% rise that
you're gonna get out the kids if
1118
00:42:26,920 --> 00:42:28,080
you're spending an hour and a
half doing it.
1119
00:42:28,080 --> 00:42:32,520
Yeah, if you're going home and
you know, you know, prepping
1120
00:42:32,520 --> 00:42:35,280
stuff for the children, like I'm
in math every day, I'm just
1121
00:42:35,280 --> 00:42:37,400
going to do the margins for them
because it's such a faff.
1122
00:42:37,400 --> 00:42:39,280
And you know, it'll save 2
minutes at the start of maths
1123
00:42:39,280 --> 00:42:41,000
when we write our margins and
our date and stuff, I'm just
1124
00:42:41,000 --> 00:42:43,200
going to do it for them.
And it takes you an hour to do
1125
00:42:43,200 --> 00:42:45,720
that and you've saved 2 minutes
of the lesson.
1126
00:42:46,200 --> 00:42:48,480
That's insane.
Yeah, that is not cost effective
1127
00:42:48,480 --> 00:42:50,080
of.
Course, you shouldn't do that.
1128
00:42:50,240 --> 00:42:52,160
And then because you've done
that, guess what, you're taking
1129
00:42:52,160 --> 00:42:54,560
your marking home that evening
of it's it's half five and I've
1130
00:42:54,560 --> 00:42:55,640
got to take my market home.
Yeah.
1131
00:42:55,800 --> 00:42:58,280
But do you know why?
Because you did something insane
1132
00:42:58,280 --> 00:42:59,800
earlier that you did not have to
do.
1133
00:42:59,840 --> 00:43:01,000
Yeah.
Stop doing it.
1134
00:43:01,000 --> 00:43:02,560
You know, you know what you're
getting at because we've kind of
1135
00:43:02,560 --> 00:43:04,200
mentioned sort of this in the
past.
1136
00:43:04,200 --> 00:43:06,760
It's prioritisation when we've
when we've talked on this, but
1137
00:43:06,760 --> 00:43:07,840
we don't always just run the
moment.
1138
00:43:07,840 --> 00:43:09,800
By the way, guys, if you're a
new listener, go back and listen
1139
00:43:09,800 --> 00:43:11,920
to songs where we're positive
and we think about solutions.
1140
00:43:11,920 --> 00:43:14,800
Yeah, but sorry, very quickly,
negativity and realism has been
1141
00:43:14,800 --> 00:43:17,360
morphed.
You know, it's true.
1142
00:43:17,560 --> 00:43:19,480
I think we're we are.
Maybe we do sneak into
1143
00:43:19,480 --> 00:43:21,640
negativity sometimes, but we're
just realistic about.
1144
00:43:21,680 --> 00:43:23,720
It so sorry and a bit fed up.
I think it's probably the better
1145
00:43:23,720 --> 00:43:24,840
way.
It's not even negative really,
1146
00:43:24,920 --> 00:43:26,360
We're just fed up and trying to
highlight issues.
1147
00:43:27,560 --> 00:43:30,120
Yes, tore up priorities.
You know, one of the ways we
1148
00:43:30,120 --> 00:43:32,080
said we could tackle workload is
actually just on us as well,
1149
00:43:32,080 --> 00:43:34,280
which is just prioritise
properly, be more efficient with
1150
00:43:34,280 --> 00:43:36,560
the time that you spend.
Like think about what is going
1151
00:43:36,560 --> 00:43:38,440
to have a big impact, what
should be left or last.
1152
00:43:38,720 --> 00:43:41,640
What teacher masters do is they
have no priorities.
1153
00:43:41,640 --> 00:43:43,920
Their priority is get everything
done at all costs.
1154
00:43:44,240 --> 00:43:46,560
That's the problem, they don't
prioritise at all.
1155
00:43:46,560 --> 00:43:49,320
They just think I've got 8 hours
of work to do and I've only got
1156
00:43:49,320 --> 00:43:52,320
3 hours left.
Their next thought is guess I'm
1157
00:43:52,320 --> 00:43:56,040
doing 5 hours tonight rather
than what should I prioritise
1158
00:43:56,040 --> 00:43:58,120
and what can I drop, what can I
leave, what can I leave for
1159
00:43:58,120 --> 00:43:59,680
another day?
All of those questions are
1160
00:43:59,680 --> 00:44:01,440
coming to head.
So that's that is why being a
1161
00:44:01,440 --> 00:44:04,320
martyr is a problem because once
again it sets the bar.
1162
00:44:04,480 --> 00:44:06,800
It shows everyone else that oh
work life balance isn't
1163
00:44:06,800 --> 00:44:08,760
necessary because you can get
everything done if you just
1164
00:44:08,760 --> 00:44:10,960
sacrifice your entire life.
They don't stand up for
1165
00:44:10,960 --> 00:44:13,040
themselves.
It lowers the morale across the
1166
00:44:13,040 --> 00:44:15,200
whole school because everyone
else is thinking oh God they've
1167
00:44:15,200 --> 00:44:17,320
got it all done.
I need to find a way to get it
1168
00:44:17,320 --> 00:44:19,440
all done now, otherwise I'll
look bad by comparison.
1169
00:44:19,520 --> 00:44:21,560
So do you know what a classic
retort to that is?
1170
00:44:21,560 --> 00:44:23,840
You know, if I was to bring that
up, yeah, people have said this
1171
00:44:23,920 --> 00:44:25,640
to me before and we've we've
talked about ourselves.
1172
00:44:25,960 --> 00:44:28,640
We know it's important that when
you bring up a problem, you have
1173
00:44:28,640 --> 00:44:29,600
a solution.
Sure, right.
1174
00:44:29,600 --> 00:44:34,160
That's really important.
So my my point though is that's
1175
00:44:34,160 --> 00:44:36,400
right.
OK, let's say, let's say we have
1176
00:44:36,400 --> 00:44:39,040
a problem with our with your
mass planning in a school, the
1177
00:44:39,040 --> 00:44:41,960
mass curriculum just it honestly
just doesn't hit the national
1178
00:44:41,960 --> 00:44:44,480
curriculum and you bring up that
problem, you say we're not
1179
00:44:44,480 --> 00:44:47,200
hitting this.
You should come to that with so
1180
00:44:47,200 --> 00:44:50,800
let's try XYZ, right.
My point to people is, you know
1181
00:44:50,800 --> 00:44:54,800
what, sometimes the solution is
to not do it and people don't
1182
00:44:54,800 --> 00:44:57,720
like to hear that.
So it will say, OK, I've got 8
1183
00:44:57,720 --> 00:45:00,080
hours of work and I've only got
3 hours after school to do it
1184
00:45:00,080 --> 00:45:01,560
in.
OK, well what's your solution
1185
00:45:01,560 --> 00:45:02,680
then, Dylan?
What do you mean?
1186
00:45:02,680 --> 00:45:04,120
Yeah, I've got to take five
hours home.
1187
00:45:04,280 --> 00:45:05,760
What's your solution?
If you're just going to moan
1188
00:45:05,760 --> 00:45:07,680
about it?
My solution is to not do some of
1189
00:45:07,680 --> 00:45:09,520
it.
And people don't see that as a
1190
00:45:09,520 --> 00:45:11,640
solution.
People are so warped by the fact
1191
00:45:11,640 --> 00:45:14,480
they've got to get everything
done that a solution to them is
1192
00:45:14,720 --> 00:45:17,040
doing something differently or
doing something at a different
1193
00:45:17,040 --> 00:45:18,520
time.
And I just want to be here to
1194
00:45:18,520 --> 00:45:20,360
say, do you know what sometimes
the solution is?
1195
00:45:20,760 --> 00:45:23,200
It's to not do that thing.
Do you know what if you turn
1196
00:45:23,200 --> 00:45:24,920
around and say, well, it's
school policy.
1197
00:45:25,560 --> 00:45:27,880
It's school policy to change the
fonts on the SMART because we
1198
00:45:27,880 --> 00:45:30,800
decided that's a new policy now.
It's the school policy that
1199
00:45:31,240 --> 00:45:33,360
displays get changed every six
weeks, every time.
1200
00:45:33,360 --> 00:45:35,320
That's the school policy.
Do you know what the solution to
1201
00:45:35,320 --> 00:45:36,760
that is?
The school policy is wrong.
1202
00:45:37,160 --> 00:45:40,560
The solution isn't okay, let me
do it anyway and maybe we'll
1203
00:45:40,560 --> 00:45:42,120
give a teaching assistant some
time to do it.
1204
00:45:42,120 --> 00:45:44,840
No, no, no, no.
The solution is get rid of it,
1205
00:45:45,000 --> 00:45:49,320
get rid of that expectation, be
allowed to say, as a teacher,
1206
00:45:49,520 --> 00:45:53,200
no, no, I don't need to do this
thing anymore, erase it.
1207
00:45:53,440 --> 00:45:55,280
That is sometimes a solution
that.
1208
00:45:55,280 --> 00:45:57,480
The problem comes and there is
this horrible grey area right
1209
00:45:57,480 --> 00:46:00,480
where I'm sure teachers are in
this situation, where part of
1210
00:46:00,480 --> 00:46:02,440
that extra work that they've
got, that they've got to do that
1211
00:46:02,440 --> 00:46:05,120
night is something essential,
like they've got a plan,
1212
00:46:05,120 --> 00:46:07,320
tomorrow's lessons.
But, but my point is usually
1213
00:46:07,320 --> 00:46:09,160
that comes because something's
been pushed back.
1214
00:46:09,680 --> 00:46:12,240
So, so one of two things with
that, OK, let's say that you
1215
00:46:12,240 --> 00:46:13,720
you're you're a teacher.
There Monday night.
1216
00:46:13,880 --> 00:46:15,440
You're a bit of a martyr.
You're like, oh, well, I'm just
1217
00:46:15,440 --> 00:46:16,600
going to get it done because
it's Monday.
1218
00:46:16,600 --> 00:46:18,080
It's half eight and I've got to
do my planning.
1219
00:46:18,120 --> 00:46:21,000
OK, One of two things.
One's in your control, 1 isn't.
1220
00:46:21,280 --> 00:46:22,720
So I really want to make this
clear to people.
1221
00:46:22,720 --> 00:46:24,560
I don't anyone sat there
thinking they're in a toxic
1222
00:46:24,560 --> 00:46:27,280
school.
Huge expectations, no budget, no
1223
00:46:27,280 --> 00:46:28,600
wiggle room.
It's not your fault.
1224
00:46:28,680 --> 00:46:30,120
OK, then we made that really
clear.
1225
00:46:30,400 --> 00:46:32,480
So there's there are go and
listen to other episodes like
1226
00:46:32,480 --> 00:46:34,560
you said, because we talk so
much about other external
1227
00:46:34,560 --> 00:46:36,360
factors.
We're talking today about things
1228
00:46:36,360 --> 00:46:38,640
we have control over.
So the two reasons you might be
1229
00:46:38,640 --> 00:46:40,880
planning on a Monday evening is
because your school has
1230
00:46:40,880 --> 00:46:42,280
unbelievable expectations of
you.
1231
00:46:42,400 --> 00:46:44,240
You've got to plan from scratch
whatever reason it is and.
1232
00:46:44,400 --> 00:46:46,080
You just can't get it done you.
Just can't get it done because
1233
00:46:46,080 --> 00:46:47,240
you've got too much you've got
to do.
1234
00:46:47,240 --> 00:46:49,840
You might be in a small school.
The the the school just don't
1235
00:46:49,840 --> 00:46:51,560
care that you're doing it at
half eight and then watch pack
1236
00:46:51,560 --> 00:46:53,200
on doing it.
I'm not talking to you right
1237
00:46:53,200 --> 00:46:54,600
now.
I know loads of teachers like
1238
00:46:54,600 --> 00:46:55,440
that.
It's crap.
1239
00:46:55,720 --> 00:46:57,600
There's, there's other, there's
other problems going on.
1240
00:46:58,160 --> 00:47:01,320
The other problem, and I see
this and I know this exists, so
1241
00:47:01,320 --> 00:47:04,200
let's not pretend it doesn't, is
someone has to do some planning
1242
00:47:04,200 --> 00:47:07,520
at half eight that evening.
It's because in school they've
1243
00:47:07,520 --> 00:47:10,760
chosen to do something else that
they feel like they've got to do
1244
00:47:10,760 --> 00:47:13,440
in school, EG they spent an hour
and a half doing a display.
1245
00:47:13,840 --> 00:47:16,160
OK, so you can't, you can't do a
display at home.
1246
00:47:16,440 --> 00:47:18,520
So you look at this job, you
look at your list, you've got,
1247
00:47:18,840 --> 00:47:20,640
I've got this huge display to do
in the corridor and I've got
1248
00:47:20,640 --> 00:47:22,200
this mark, this planning for
tomorrow.
1249
00:47:22,320 --> 00:47:24,520
OK.
What a teacher martyr will do is
1250
00:47:24,520 --> 00:47:26,120
say, well, I've got to get both
done.
1251
00:47:26,240 --> 00:47:27,640
I can only do the display in
school.
1252
00:47:27,640 --> 00:47:30,040
So I do the display now and I'll
take my marking or my planning.
1253
00:47:30,040 --> 00:47:32,160
Yeah, yeah.
What a realist does and what we
1254
00:47:32,160 --> 00:47:34,880
have to do as a profession is
say, well, I'm, I'm, I'm
1255
00:47:34,880 --> 00:47:37,320
stopping working at half four or
five, wherever it is.
1256
00:47:37,600 --> 00:47:40,280
So, oh, it doesn't matter that
only one of these can happen in
1257
00:47:40,280 --> 00:47:41,320
school.
That's irrelevant.
1258
00:47:41,720 --> 00:47:44,120
I'm going to do something now.
And the only thing that matters
1259
00:47:44,120 --> 00:47:46,760
out of doing a display or
planning my lesson for tomorrow
1260
00:47:46,760 --> 00:47:48,800
with the children to educate
them, which is my job.
1261
00:47:49,080 --> 00:47:50,560
Let me think which one I'm going
to do.
1262
00:47:51,040 --> 00:47:53,400
Don't do the display plan at
home.
1263
00:47:53,600 --> 00:47:56,280
Don't take anything home.
Oh, but, but I can't take my, I
1264
00:47:56,280 --> 00:47:58,480
can't take my display home.
There's a solution.
1265
00:47:58,520 --> 00:48:01,000
Don't do it.
So when someone says to me, what
1266
00:48:01,000 --> 00:48:02,200
can I do?
What's the solution?
1267
00:48:02,240 --> 00:48:04,080
Take it away.
Don't do it.
1268
00:48:04,080 --> 00:48:05,960
Shove what you were going to do
in the evening to your time
1269
00:48:05,960 --> 00:48:08,280
after school, which we will do
for extra anyway, Gets
1270
00:48:08,280 --> 00:48:09,480
forgotten.
That's already extra.
1271
00:48:09,640 --> 00:48:12,760
That's past directed time past
3:45, But we forget that.
1272
00:48:13,000 --> 00:48:15,160
You know the extra hour we do
every night after and before,
1273
00:48:15,160 --> 00:48:17,920
which works out two hours a day?
That's already extra.
1274
00:48:18,320 --> 00:48:20,200
Don't feel bad that you're not
taking stuff home.
1275
00:48:20,800 --> 00:48:23,400
You're already doing extra.
The solution is to not do it,
1276
00:48:23,520 --> 00:48:25,240
and the teacher martyr won't
accept that.
1277
00:48:25,280 --> 00:48:26,600
Yeah, I agree.
That was a good analogy and it
1278
00:48:26,600 --> 00:48:28,840
kind of hurts back to the whole
priority prioritisation thing,
1279
00:48:28,840 --> 00:48:30,520
doesn't it?
If you're not prioritising and
1280
00:48:30,520 --> 00:48:31,960
doing anything, you're setting a
bad example.
1281
00:48:32,080 --> 00:48:34,600
It makes everyone else feel bad.
Being a martyr also blocks
1282
00:48:34,600 --> 00:48:36,680
collective action.
I mean, that's another huge
1283
00:48:36,680 --> 00:48:38,200
thing.
And it kind of your strike
1284
00:48:38,200 --> 00:48:39,480
analogy was quite good for that
as well.
1285
00:48:39,480 --> 00:48:41,840
You know, like a lot of people
are swayed by what everyone else
1286
00:48:41,840 --> 00:48:43,560
is doing.
And if there's enough martyrs in
1287
00:48:43,560 --> 00:48:46,960
a school, right, it completely
blocks anyone in your school
1288
00:48:46,960 --> 00:48:48,960
who's at school who's actually
trying to fight for your rights
1289
00:48:48,960 --> 00:48:51,400
and work life balance because
there's not enough of them.
1290
00:48:51,400 --> 00:48:55,080
Genuinely, if you martyrs stop
that happening, you need
1291
00:48:55,080 --> 00:48:56,920
collective action is the only
way we can make change.
1292
00:48:56,920 --> 00:48:59,000
Genuinely.
I truly believe that now after
1293
00:48:59,000 --> 00:49:02,000
spending years trying to
convince even my closest friends
1294
00:49:02,200 --> 00:49:04,080
who are teacher martyrs to stop
doing it.
1295
00:49:04,080 --> 00:49:05,040
I can't.
I can't do it.
1296
00:49:05,360 --> 00:49:07,880
I literally can't convince the
closest people to me who I
1297
00:49:07,880 --> 00:49:10,200
respect and have really nice
relationships with to stop doing
1298
00:49:10,200 --> 00:49:11,320
it.
Can't even do that.
1299
00:49:12,240 --> 00:49:14,400
It needs to be collective.
Like I'm convinced now that
1300
00:49:14,400 --> 00:49:16,440
there is nothing I can do by
myself.
1301
00:49:16,440 --> 00:49:20,320
I need eight people versus two
people who are martyring
1302
00:49:20,320 --> 00:49:23,000
themselves to say, hey, wait,
you're going to stop doing this
1303
00:49:23,200 --> 00:49:25,040
because it's it's bad for all of
us.
1304
00:49:25,480 --> 00:49:27,160
No one.
There's no badge of honour.
1305
00:49:27,160 --> 00:49:29,080
You've made it up.
No one really cares.
1306
00:49:29,080 --> 00:49:31,040
The second you quit this job,
they'll replace you with someone
1307
00:49:31,040 --> 00:49:32,360
else.
It's not real.
1308
00:49:32,360 --> 00:49:35,080
It's an illusion in your head
that you have to be a martyr to
1309
00:49:35,080 --> 00:49:37,520
be good at this job.
I tell you what, I know martyrs
1310
00:49:37,520 --> 00:49:40,240
who are rubbish teachers.
And I know people who go home at
1311
00:49:40,240 --> 00:49:43,320
3:45 every day who are
unbelievably good teachers, but
1312
00:49:43,320 --> 00:49:46,080
they are hated by their SLT
because they don't get XY and Z
1313
00:49:46,080 --> 00:49:47,440
done all the time.
But you know what?
1314
00:49:47,440 --> 00:49:49,120
The kids love being in their
class, you learn the most, the
1315
00:49:49,120 --> 00:49:51,280
parents love them.
And it's like there's, it's just
1316
00:49:51,280 --> 00:49:54,680
a complete illusion, this idea
of tying work life balance and
1317
00:49:54,680 --> 00:49:57,160
time with being good at this
job.
1318
00:49:57,280 --> 00:49:59,280
And that's what we need to stop.
And we can only do it with
1319
00:49:59,280 --> 00:50:01,440
collective.
Action you're absolutely right.
1320
00:50:01,760 --> 00:50:05,000
A martyr will equivocate all
parts of this job.
1321
00:50:05,560 --> 00:50:06,840
They will see them as equally
important.
1322
00:50:07,320 --> 00:50:10,680
They will equivocate everything.
A realist looks at what's
1323
00:50:10,680 --> 00:50:12,440
important and says I'll do that
really well.
1324
00:50:12,960 --> 00:50:15,720
Your time with the kids, your
impact you're having on them,
1325
00:50:16,120 --> 00:50:19,400
the relationships you build with
them and their parents and the
1326
00:50:19,400 --> 00:50:23,160
impact you can have on them is
so much more important than
1327
00:50:23,160 --> 00:50:25,280
whether you've ticked a box to
say you've got a display up in
1328
00:50:25,280 --> 00:50:27,440
the board or you've put
something in an assessment sheet
1329
00:50:27,440 --> 00:50:29,800
which is for no one.
Or you've made your worksheets
1330
00:50:29,800 --> 00:50:32,200
look a particular way because at
your school, the policies we do
1331
00:50:32,200 --> 00:50:33,600
it.
But the green border they.
1332
00:50:33,600 --> 00:50:35,080
Always have a differentiation.
The green board is
1333
00:50:35,080 --> 00:50:37,320
differentiated and it has to fit
into a column rather than a
1334
00:50:37,320 --> 00:50:38,040
whole.
What do you mean?
1335
00:50:38,080 --> 00:50:39,600
What do you mean?
The slides on your smart
1336
00:50:39,600 --> 00:50:40,920
presentation?
Not this exact colour.
1337
00:50:40,920 --> 00:50:42,800
How will the kids know this is
reading comprehension?
1338
00:50:42,920 --> 00:50:45,800
What do you mean?
Of course they will know.
1339
00:50:45,800 --> 00:50:48,520
It's reading comprehension.
When I say we're going to read
1340
00:50:48,520 --> 00:50:50,120
some questions and answer that,
what are you?
1341
00:50:50,320 --> 00:50:51,640
They're not confused.
It's matched.
1342
00:50:51,640 --> 00:50:52,920
It's not green.
Are you?
1343
00:50:52,920 --> 00:50:54,520
Insane.
There's so many little things
1344
00:50:54,520 --> 00:50:55,720
like that.
Insane.
1345
00:50:55,800 --> 00:50:57,920
Yeah, Don't you do it.
And I feel like I've maybe
1346
00:50:57,920 --> 00:50:59,240
mentioned this before, but I'm
coming back to it.
1347
00:50:59,400 --> 00:51:01,600
I make it really, really clear.
But again, this whole collective
1348
00:51:01,600 --> 00:51:04,040
action thing, right, it blocks
it.
1349
00:51:04,200 --> 00:51:06,280
It blocks SLT from knowing the
problems as well.
1350
00:51:06,280 --> 00:51:08,560
Because you know what, there are
actually some really good.
1351
00:51:08,560 --> 00:51:12,400
There's so many great SLT, but
they're out of the classroom.
1352
00:51:12,640 --> 00:51:15,320
It is so easy to be disconnected
with what your teachers are
1353
00:51:15,320 --> 00:51:16,360
doing.
Like that's one of the biggest
1354
00:51:16,360 --> 00:51:19,480
criticisms of SLT in general,
especially toxic SLT, which is
1355
00:51:19,480 --> 00:51:21,520
they are totally, totally
disenfranchised.
1356
00:51:21,520 --> 00:51:23,920
They have no idea what teachings
like anymore.
1357
00:51:23,920 --> 00:51:25,680
They've forgotten it and and
therefore they make terrible
1358
00:51:25,680 --> 00:51:28,000
decisions.
But you know what, sometimes SLT
1359
00:51:28,000 --> 00:51:30,280
do care and they do want to do
the right things.
1360
00:51:30,720 --> 00:51:33,840
But when they've got 10 staff
and eight of them are martyrs
1361
00:51:33,880 --> 00:51:36,520
all going, yeah, it's all great
and not say anything and only
1362
00:51:36,520 --> 00:51:39,560
two of them are owning, do you
know what their reasonable
1363
00:51:40,680 --> 00:51:43,280
conclusion is?
Is well 8 versus 2.
1364
00:51:43,280 --> 00:51:44,760
Those two people are probably
just being a bit.
1365
00:51:44,760 --> 00:51:46,400
They're just not.
They're just not really doing
1366
00:51:46,400 --> 00:51:47,440
it.
They're not really working very
1367
00:51:47,440 --> 00:51:48,720
hard.
It's fine, but the others are
1368
00:51:48,720 --> 00:51:50,000
all doing it, so it's clearly
fine.
1369
00:51:50,240 --> 00:51:53,840
It blocks SLT actually
understanding wider issues and
1370
00:51:53,840 --> 00:51:55,600
therefore you don't even let
them.
1371
00:51:55,600 --> 00:51:59,280
Doesn't give them a chance.
How can you moan at SLT for not
1372
00:51:59,280 --> 00:52:01,360
trying to fix a problem that
they don't even know exists?
1373
00:52:01,680 --> 00:52:02,880
Seriously.
Yeah, yeah.
1374
00:52:02,880 --> 00:52:04,520
No, I agree.
So I want to, I want to finish
1375
00:52:04,520 --> 00:52:06,080
with a bit of a debate because I
know you think slightly
1376
00:52:06,080 --> 00:52:07,720
different to me.
OK, so thinking about why
1377
00:52:07,720 --> 00:52:11,080
teacher martyrdom is a problem,
from what I understand, you can
1378
00:52:11,080 --> 00:52:13,920
correct me if I'm wrong.
Your your approach there to what
1379
00:52:13,920 --> 00:52:17,240
we're talking about is you
honestly shouldn't be allowed to
1380
00:52:17,240 --> 00:52:18,840
do it hours and hours.
I said that in that episode,
1381
00:52:18,840 --> 00:52:20,960
didn't I before?
But but you know that I know
1382
00:52:20,960 --> 00:52:22,400
that is your idea.
So I just want to come at you
1383
00:52:22,400 --> 00:52:25,520
and say no right now after all
of this chat, OK?
1384
00:52:25,920 --> 00:52:27,960
Part of my solution, and we'll
come onto the solutions quickly
1385
00:52:27,960 --> 00:52:33,360
in a second, is I don't think
you should tell people no.
1386
00:52:33,360 --> 00:52:36,920
No, you literally can't do that.
That person who's the mass lead
1387
00:52:36,920 --> 00:52:39,920
who did that post, right?
I would not say to that person,
1388
00:52:39,920 --> 00:52:42,200
you're not allowed to take on
mass lead for no TLR.
1389
00:52:42,440 --> 00:52:44,440
You're not allowed to go above
and beyond, blah, blah, blah,
1390
00:52:44,440 --> 00:52:46,120
blah.
But what I would say from my
1391
00:52:46,120 --> 00:52:49,520
line is you should be one of the
loudest people defending people
1392
00:52:49,520 --> 00:52:50,840
who don't want to do that.
Well, that's good.
1393
00:52:50,840 --> 00:52:52,240
That's a good.
Thing that's what I'm saying
1394
00:52:52,240 --> 00:52:54,800
here is OK, I don't mind.
People go above, beyond.
1395
00:52:54,800 --> 00:52:57,240
It's like I said earlier in this
chat, there are two different
1396
00:52:57,240 --> 00:53:00,240
types of martyrs to me.
One aren't really even martyrs
1397
00:53:00,240 --> 00:53:02,200
because they just crack on and
do loads and you wouldn't even
1398
00:53:02,200 --> 00:53:04,040
know about it.
And they're the first person to
1399
00:53:04,040 --> 00:53:06,440
say no, of course, that's fine.
Yeah, go home, go see your baby.
1400
00:53:06,440 --> 00:53:08,320
I'm going to stay for an hour
and do this because I want to,
1401
00:53:08,320 --> 00:53:09,920
but I'm going to be the first
person.
1402
00:53:09,920 --> 00:53:12,000
If someone moans at you, I'm
going to be the first person to
1403
00:53:12,000 --> 00:53:13,280
say no.
No, they don't have to do that.
1404
00:53:13,560 --> 00:53:15,560
I'm choosing to do this.
Don't judge their books.
1405
00:53:15,560 --> 00:53:17,680
It doesn't look as nice as mine.
I'm sat here for an hour doing
1406
00:53:17,680 --> 00:53:19,200
the books.
So don't do that comparison.
1407
00:53:19,200 --> 00:53:22,640
That's completely unfair, but
they they need to do that
1408
00:53:22,640 --> 00:53:24,800
because if, if they're going to
go above and beyond, I think it
1409
00:53:24,800 --> 00:53:27,240
has to come with a caveat of you
need to be one of the loudest
1410
00:53:27,240 --> 00:53:29,400
people to say no, no, no, no.
This is not the bar.
1411
00:53:29,400 --> 00:53:31,560
Don't set the bar to me.
I'm doing it because I want to.
1412
00:53:31,680 --> 00:53:34,080
Whereas you, you, I feel like
you kind of, I think I'm a step.
1413
00:53:34,120 --> 00:53:36,240
Further, I think I'm a step
further and the reason I'm a
1414
00:53:36,240 --> 00:53:38,360
step further than that is
because I've spent 10 years
1415
00:53:38,360 --> 00:53:41,120
feeling like that and seeing it
not exist in reality anywhere in
1416
00:53:41,120 --> 00:53:42,880
the world.
Genuinely, it doesn't exist.
1417
00:53:42,880 --> 00:53:44,920
What you're saying is to me is
idealistic.
1418
00:53:44,920 --> 00:53:47,200
I don't think any.
I don't think they can exist.
1419
00:53:47,200 --> 00:53:49,760
I think those people that are
going above and beyond that,
1420
00:53:49,760 --> 00:53:52,760
that they know that the only
thing they can get out of this
1421
00:53:53,080 --> 00:53:55,000
is at least a bit of recognition
and praise.
1422
00:53:55,560 --> 00:53:57,880
And if we, and if we're saying
no, no, don't even accept that,
1423
00:53:57,880 --> 00:53:59,360
Tell everyone else not to do
what you're doing.
1424
00:53:59,360 --> 00:54:01,360
I think people, I don't think
they can exist, coexist.
1425
00:54:01,360 --> 00:54:02,720
I think people, it's just never
going to work.
1426
00:54:02,720 --> 00:54:05,640
People aren't going to be
selfless enough to say, I've
1427
00:54:05,640 --> 00:54:07,840
done all this extra work, but I
don't want any praise for it.
1428
00:54:07,840 --> 00:54:10,320
And actually this is not the bar
that's I just don't think people
1429
00:54:10,320 --> 00:54:12,200
will do.
That I I I I'm going against
1430
00:54:12,200 --> 00:54:13,280
that because I think I've seen
that.
1431
00:54:13,760 --> 00:54:16,200
I think I've seen teachers I can
think of teachers I've worked
1432
00:54:16,200 --> 00:54:20,520
with who to me fit the bill
where I wouldn't say they make
1433
00:54:20,520 --> 00:54:22,080
me feel bad for what I do.
OK.
1434
00:54:22,520 --> 00:54:25,160
I think lots do.
I'd say there are some teachers
1435
00:54:25,160 --> 00:54:27,120
out there, though, who just,
they live and breathe the job.
1436
00:54:27,680 --> 00:54:30,520
It's part of their identity.
I'd never want to discredit them
1437
00:54:30,520 --> 00:54:32,760
as what I'm saying.
I think what you're saying hits
1438
00:54:32,760 --> 00:54:35,480
78% of martyrs.
Yeah, Yeah, in a good way.
1439
00:54:35,480 --> 00:54:37,520
OK.
Who have like, not vindictive,
1440
00:54:37,520 --> 00:54:39,320
but who have them the aim of
like, no, no, everyone should be
1441
00:54:39,320 --> 00:54:41,360
like me.
I'm talking about protecting
1442
00:54:41,360 --> 00:54:43,600
those people who don't say
everyone should be like me, but
1443
00:54:43,600 --> 00:54:45,720
simply like, you know, people
who volunteer at a food bank
1444
00:54:45,720 --> 00:54:48,200
after they go to work, right?
So it's the same kind of idea to
1445
00:54:48,200 --> 00:54:50,080
me.
If I, I might not know you go
1446
00:54:50,080 --> 00:54:52,080
and do that, but I would never
say no, no, don't do that
1447
00:54:52,080 --> 00:54:54,200
because then I might feel like I
need to go to a food bank.
1448
00:54:54,200 --> 00:54:55,720
I, I feel like I need to do
that.
1449
00:54:55,720 --> 00:54:57,120
It's like, no, no, no, no, of
course not.
1450
00:54:57,360 --> 00:54:59,320
Of course, amazing volunteer
work.
1451
00:54:59,320 --> 00:55:01,320
I'm not going to discredit that.
It's not a race to the bottom.
1452
00:55:01,320 --> 00:55:02,600
Like no one does anything
anymore.
1453
00:55:02,920 --> 00:55:05,640
Do it, but just don't make
someone else feel bad for not
1454
00:55:05,640 --> 00:55:07,440
going to the soup kitchen.
You know, I'm going to define
1455
00:55:07,440 --> 00:55:09,400
what I mean because we kind of
we kind of glossed over what I'm
1456
00:55:09,440 --> 00:55:11,560
even saying here because we
obviously know what I think from
1457
00:55:11,560 --> 00:55:13,560
previous episodes.
So let me just really define it.
1458
00:55:13,560 --> 00:55:15,680
And I think it's a good
comparison, but I'm not going to
1459
00:55:15,680 --> 00:55:18,120
fully accept it.
The whole volunteering because
1460
00:55:18,840 --> 00:55:21,400
first of first of all,
volunteering at a place that's
1461
00:55:21,400 --> 00:55:23,400
exclusively made for
volunteering and built from the
1462
00:55:23,400 --> 00:55:26,480
ground up as a voluntary to me,
it's very different to you go
1463
00:55:26,480 --> 00:55:28,320
into a job and you're gaslight
into thinking you have to
1464
00:55:28,320 --> 00:55:30,560
volunteer to get the job done.
I don't know, it's different.
1465
00:55:30,560 --> 00:55:33,160
It's slightly different in my
head, but my, my opinion is
1466
00:55:33,160 --> 00:55:36,640
this.
I, I don't think the teachers
1467
00:55:36,640 --> 00:55:38,520
are going to help themselves.
I'm being pessimistic.
1468
00:55:38,520 --> 00:55:41,440
And I think the only thing we
can do now from like almost like
1469
00:55:41,440 --> 00:55:45,760
a top down approach is literally
tell people to stop doing it and
1470
00:55:45,760 --> 00:55:48,080
not celebrate it at all.
So if someone goes above and
1471
00:55:48,080 --> 00:55:50,400
beyond, we're going to call it,
it sounds really awful because
1472
00:55:50,400 --> 00:55:51,880
it sounds like a great thing to
do above and beyond.
1473
00:55:52,000 --> 00:55:55,280
If someone does loads of extra
workload, right that way more
1474
00:55:55,280 --> 00:55:56,960
than they should have done.
What more than that paid for?
1475
00:55:57,240 --> 00:56:01,000
I think we should actually, the
response from SLT and anyone top
1476
00:56:01,000 --> 00:56:03,840
down should be oh crikey, what
happened there?
1477
00:56:04,480 --> 00:56:06,480
Oh dear, that's not good.
Okay, let's look into that.
1478
00:56:06,480 --> 00:56:08,160
Let's have a meeting next week
and find out why.
1479
00:56:08,440 --> 00:56:10,440
Why you take you book Simon 6.
That's what I think.
1480
00:56:10,440 --> 00:56:13,400
And I think it should almost be
seen as like, oh, slap on the
1481
00:56:13,400 --> 00:56:13,880
wrist.
Sure.
1482
00:56:14,120 --> 00:56:15,600
I don't think it should be the
way around.
1483
00:56:15,600 --> 00:56:17,320
Yeah, Yeah, I really do think.
I know.
1484
00:56:17,360 --> 00:56:19,600
I know that almost like punishes
people that do just want to go
1485
00:56:19,600 --> 00:56:20,720
and do the extra things for
their kids.
1486
00:56:20,720 --> 00:56:23,080
And I'm not saying they
shouldn't shouldn't be able to
1487
00:56:23,080 --> 00:56:25,680
do it, but what I'm saying is we
need to have such a firm
1488
00:56:25,680 --> 00:56:28,240
approach of this isn't the bar,
not just from them saying this
1489
00:56:28,240 --> 00:56:31,080
isn't the bar from from a
leadership government, everyone
1490
00:56:31,080 --> 00:56:34,080
else from top down saying this
is not the bar to so much
1491
00:56:34,080 --> 00:56:35,920
degree.
This is how serious we are about
1492
00:56:35,920 --> 00:56:36,840
it.
We're gonna have meetings about
1493
00:56:36,840 --> 00:56:38,560
it.
And if anyone goes above this,
1494
00:56:38,560 --> 00:56:41,440
then there's a there's a problem
in your school like, and it has
1495
00:56:41,440 --> 00:56:44,520
to be totally LED from the top
down, not celebrated at all.
1496
00:56:44,800 --> 00:56:47,920
And until we fix this culture, I
think it needs to be quite
1497
00:56:47,920 --> 00:56:48,920
draconian.
And like that.
1498
00:56:48,920 --> 00:56:51,400
I really do think that because
the culture is broken, when a
1499
00:56:51,400 --> 00:56:53,080
broken system, do we want
teachers or not?
1500
00:56:53,320 --> 00:56:55,480
If we do, we need to fix this
and we need to be hard on it,
1501
00:56:55,720 --> 00:56:58,120
put our foot down.
Nope, you can't do that anymore.
1502
00:56:58,120 --> 00:57:00,320
You are not being efficient.
You are not a good, good role
1503
00:57:00,320 --> 00:57:02,240
model for other teachers.
Loads of other teachers now are
1504
00:57:02,240 --> 00:57:05,040
going to have a really rubbish
time because they're, they're
1505
00:57:05,040 --> 00:57:07,040
seeing you do all these things.
They think it's expectation,
1506
00:57:07,040 --> 00:57:09,200
whether you say it is or not.
So we're going to stop you doing
1507
00:57:09,200 --> 00:57:11,680
that.
Like I I know it's harsh but I
1508
00:57:11,680 --> 00:57:12,920
just don't see any other way of
fixing.
1509
00:57:12,920 --> 00:57:14,520
It I guess we you absolutely
yeah.
1510
00:57:14,520 --> 00:57:17,000
No, it's really interesting.
I don't I don't think I disagree
1511
00:57:17,000 --> 00:57:18,000
with you.
I really don't.
1512
00:57:18,000 --> 00:57:22,440
I just, I wouldn't want to
discredit someone who's just
1513
00:57:22,440 --> 00:57:24,040
doing something out of the love
of their own heart.
1514
00:57:24,040 --> 00:57:27,120
Do you know what the problem?
You're right.
1515
00:57:27,120 --> 00:57:29,240
The toxicity comes when it's
expected from everyone.
1516
00:57:29,600 --> 00:57:31,600
And I get what you're saying
about we're too far down the
1517
00:57:31,600 --> 00:57:33,720
road where we need to force it.
I guess we've kind of creeped
1518
00:57:33,720 --> 00:57:35,640
into the last section here,
which we'll go through quickly.
1519
00:57:35,640 --> 00:57:37,040
It's just like, OK, how can we
solve it?
1520
00:57:37,040 --> 00:57:38,480
Can I just do one?
I know you want to move on.
1521
00:57:38,480 --> 00:57:40,200
Can I do one last analogy?
Is this something that really
1522
00:57:40,200 --> 00:57:41,840
happened about eight years ago?
Right.
1523
00:57:41,880 --> 00:57:43,840
And it's a really good example
of exactly what you just said,
1524
00:57:43,840 --> 00:57:45,440
goodness of your own heart, not
discrediting it.
1525
00:57:45,640 --> 00:57:47,960
I know a story in which someone
and I don't what you feel about
1526
00:57:47,960 --> 00:57:49,800
this where someone got
discredited for doing something
1527
00:57:49,800 --> 00:57:51,880
out the goodness their own heart
because it made everyone else
1528
00:57:51,880 --> 00:57:54,480
look bad, which was I know a
teacher who many, many years
1529
00:57:54,480 --> 00:57:56,680
ago, smiling as you probably
know what it is, who brought in
1530
00:57:56,680 --> 00:57:58,680
an Easter egg for every child in
that class, Right.
1531
00:57:59,080 --> 00:58:00,920
Really lovely thing to do.
They went and spent their own
1532
00:58:00,920 --> 00:58:02,760
money and time after school
bought an Easter egg for every
1533
00:58:02,760 --> 00:58:05,520
single child in their class.
But it was a massive school and
1534
00:58:05,520 --> 00:58:07,600
no one else did that.
It wasn't the expectation.
1535
00:58:07,600 --> 00:58:10,560
And by comparison, every other
child in the group that wasn't
1536
00:58:10,560 --> 00:58:12,120
in that class was like, oh, why
do they get that?
1537
00:58:12,120 --> 00:58:14,200
And some of your parents even
said, my child, oh, I don't
1538
00:58:14,200 --> 00:58:16,120
think you, I don't think you
realise, but my child didn't get
1539
00:58:16,120 --> 00:58:17,760
one of those Easter eggs.
I was like, yeah, they're not in
1540
00:58:17,760 --> 00:58:19,760
that class.
And that was to me, it was a
1541
00:58:19,760 --> 00:58:21,800
really good example of and I
didn't know where I felt about
1542
00:58:21,800 --> 00:58:23,720
that because that teacher was
almost punished for doing that.
1543
00:58:24,600 --> 00:58:25,840
And I was like, oh, I don't
know.
1544
00:58:25,840 --> 00:58:29,000
Because part of me is like,
yeah, that was a bit mental.
1545
00:58:29,160 --> 00:58:31,240
They shouldn't do that because
you know what it did set a bar,
1546
00:58:31,240 --> 00:58:33,640
whether they like to think it or
not, it did.
1547
00:58:33,640 --> 00:58:35,440
But they were being just being
kind.
1548
00:58:35,840 --> 00:58:38,160
This is but this is where I'm
now like, you know what?
1549
00:58:38,160 --> 00:58:39,520
It needs to just needs to be a
foot down.
1550
00:58:39,520 --> 00:58:40,880
I'm sorry.
It's going to hurt some feelings
1551
00:58:40,880 --> 00:58:42,280
something.
But oh, but I want to be nice.
1552
00:58:42,280 --> 00:58:43,240
You know what?
Cool.
1553
00:58:43,240 --> 00:58:44,200
You want to be nice.
But you know what?
1554
00:58:44,200 --> 00:58:45,520
I want teachers to stay in the
job.
1555
00:58:45,600 --> 00:58:47,520
And that is more important to me
than you feeling good about
1556
00:58:47,520 --> 00:58:49,400
yourself.
Honestly I don't care, just I'd
1557
00:58:49,400 --> 00:58:50,680
rather we just had teachers in
the job.
1558
00:58:50,680 --> 00:58:53,680
No, I can't disagree with that.
I think you're absolutely right.
1559
00:58:53,680 --> 00:58:55,200
And that's one big part of what
we're saying.
1560
00:58:55,200 --> 00:58:59,200
How to fix it is top down has to
be stringent and I think really
1561
00:58:59,200 --> 00:59:01,240
clear expectations because I
think we're wishy washy.
1562
00:59:01,240 --> 00:59:02,880
I think the government are wishy
washy.
1563
00:59:02,880 --> 00:59:05,400
I think leadership can be wishy
washy because you know what, if
1564
00:59:05,440 --> 00:59:07,880
I'm getting more out of someone,
why would I stop them?
1565
00:59:07,880 --> 00:59:10,080
That's very much a kind of idea,
OK.
1566
00:59:10,080 --> 00:59:12,840
And, and that idea that some
leaders have where they're like,
1567
00:59:13,480 --> 00:59:15,200
you know, if you went to them
and said, you know, I've got too
1568
00:59:15,200 --> 00:59:17,680
much on, I'm not going to get
this done.
1569
00:59:18,200 --> 00:59:20,080
And the leader's like, oh, no,
of course that's fine.
1570
00:59:20,280 --> 00:59:21,960
That's, that's lovely.
That's really nice.
1571
00:59:22,200 --> 00:59:26,000
But then, but then when what
happens, there is no one else
1572
00:59:26,000 --> 00:59:28,440
gets told that information, it
builds resentment.
1573
00:59:28,480 --> 00:59:30,880
It does like, and if you're a
martyr and you're thinking, OK,
1574
00:59:31,280 --> 00:59:32,720
I'm, I'm kind of on the side of
the martyr here.
1575
00:59:32,720 --> 00:59:35,480
If you see that you're going to
be with resentful, you're going
1576
00:59:35,480 --> 00:59:38,280
to think you've got to do it.
And you might not think as
1577
00:59:38,280 --> 00:59:40,520
someone who's turned into a
teacher martyr, you're just
1578
00:59:40,520 --> 00:59:42,280
doing your job.
Maybe you're just doing
1579
00:59:42,280 --> 00:59:43,480
everything that's expected of
you.
1580
00:59:43,840 --> 00:59:45,640
Why is that my fault?
Of course it's not my fault.
1581
00:59:45,640 --> 00:59:46,600
Everyone else should be doing
it.
1582
00:59:46,600 --> 00:59:51,040
It's our job.
It's like, OK #1 the top down
1583
00:59:51,040 --> 00:59:53,320
needs to be really clear because
if it's OK for someone else to
1584
00:59:53,320 --> 00:59:55,560
not do it, then it's OK for
everyone to not do it.
1585
00:59:55,840 --> 00:59:58,600
You can't just, you can't just
say again, oh, the goodness of
1586
00:59:58,600 --> 01:00:00,320
your own heart, I'm going to get
more out of this person.
1587
01:00:00,520 --> 01:00:02,720
It's obviously not OK.
We've talked about top down
1588
01:00:02,720 --> 01:00:05,880
government, top down SLT.
I want to talk about two other
1589
01:00:05,880 --> 01:00:07,640
groups.
OK, I'm going to, I'm going to
1590
01:00:07,640 --> 01:00:09,720
keep going with people who
aren't themselves a martyr.
1591
01:00:09,720 --> 01:00:12,360
So this, the first group I'm
going to talk about is teachers
1592
01:00:12,360 --> 01:00:15,160
like me and you, teachers who
don't mind standing up and
1593
01:00:15,160 --> 01:00:16,480
saying, no, I don't think we
should do this.
1594
01:00:16,480 --> 01:00:19,760
I think this is wrong.
What can we do, do you think?
1595
01:00:19,760 --> 01:00:22,280
Would you say in terms of, OK,
there's teacher martyrs in our
1596
01:00:22,280 --> 01:00:24,560
school?
Because I'm quite hopeless.
1597
01:00:24,640 --> 01:00:26,880
I, I think, I think there's some
you can get to.
1598
01:00:27,120 --> 01:00:28,800
I think you, you can't do other
things.
1599
01:00:28,800 --> 01:00:31,240
So is there anything we can do
to be like, OK, look, it's
1600
01:00:31,240 --> 01:00:34,160
impacting me at this point, so
can I try and solve this?
1601
01:00:34,160 --> 01:00:35,000
Problem.
Oh, I don't know, do you know
1602
01:00:35,000 --> 01:00:36,600
what we, we can, we've said
these things before.
1603
01:00:36,600 --> 01:00:39,480
I think you can take a bit of
more control of your own
1604
01:00:39,480 --> 01:00:40,800
workload.
That you mean you've mentioned
1605
01:00:40,800 --> 01:00:42,760
prioritising already.
I mean, a really good example.
1606
01:00:42,920 --> 01:00:44,080
We talked about parents evening,
right?
1607
01:00:44,840 --> 01:00:45,920
We had parents evening last
night.
1608
01:00:46,200 --> 01:00:48,440
Our parents even started
literally 5 minutes after the
1609
01:00:48,440 --> 01:00:50,040
kids went home and it went on
for six hours.
1610
01:00:50,800 --> 01:00:54,600
OK should anyone be expected to
mark in those lessons, those
1611
01:00:54,600 --> 01:00:56,840
lessons for that day?
Sorry, honestly no.
1612
01:00:56,840 --> 01:00:58,040
Do you know what you mark after
school?
1613
01:00:58,040 --> 01:01:00,280
And if it has to be marked for
the next day, it's totally
1614
01:01:00,280 --> 01:01:04,000
unreasonable and and I feel like
all teachers should have the
1615
01:01:04,000 --> 01:01:06,360
common sense to be like it's
completely acceptable.
1616
01:01:06,360 --> 01:01:08,680
I don't mark and no one would
even challenge that honestly
1617
01:01:08,680 --> 01:01:10,480
because anyone arguing
differently I'd say I was at
1618
01:01:10,480 --> 01:01:11,520
work till 9:00 PM.
Do you know that?
1619
01:01:12,160 --> 01:01:14,040
Oh yeah, you were sorry.
So at what point did SLT not
1620
01:01:14,040 --> 01:01:15,480
have to say something?
It's just like, come on, guys.
1621
01:01:15,520 --> 01:01:17,040
I know.
So I do agree that I do.
1622
01:01:17,040 --> 01:01:19,080
I actually think it's more
impactful than SLT.
1623
01:01:19,080 --> 01:01:22,040
So should come in and say have
rule like really firm
1624
01:01:22,040 --> 01:01:24,120
expectations of oh, by the way
guys, it's parents leaving this
1625
01:01:24,120 --> 01:01:25,040
day.
I know you're all working from
1626
01:01:25,040 --> 01:01:26,640
three till 6:00 PM after a day
of work.
1627
01:01:27,080 --> 01:01:30,640
It's clear expectation here.
Nobody marks today's work
1628
01:01:30,640 --> 01:01:32,840
exactly everyone, none of you
are to mark today's work.
1629
01:01:32,840 --> 01:01:35,040
What you did, you don't mark.
It oh, but I want to because I
1630
01:01:35,040 --> 01:01:36,080
love my kids.
Nope, stop it.
1631
01:01:36,480 --> 01:01:37,840
You're in trouble.
That's not coming back in now.
1632
01:01:37,960 --> 01:01:39,200
No, don't do it because you're
setting it.
1633
01:01:39,760 --> 01:01:42,720
You're setting a really bad
example for everyone else here.
1634
01:01:42,720 --> 01:01:44,600
Did you know that that's what
you're doing by going above and
1635
01:01:44,600 --> 01:01:46,760
beyond, you're setting a really
bad example of everybody else.
1636
01:01:46,760 --> 01:01:48,680
Stop.
It so that situation next next
1637
01:01:48,680 --> 01:01:51,680
step along teachers who aren't
martyrs and who are like very
1638
01:01:51,680 --> 01:01:54,760
happy to do that.
You would say in that situation
1639
01:01:54,760 --> 01:01:58,160
we should be saying to other
people is, you know, should we
1640
01:01:58,160 --> 01:02:00,920
be vocal is what I'm saying?
Should people like like what can
1641
01:02:00,920 --> 01:02:03,080
we do then?
Like should we be the one to say
1642
01:02:03,080 --> 01:02:05,480
to him, no, don't do that.
Or are we just barking up the
1643
01:02:05,480 --> 01:02:06,360
wrong?
Tree No, definitely.
1644
01:02:06,360 --> 01:02:07,720
Do you know what people are
scared to stand up for
1645
01:02:07,720 --> 01:02:09,480
themselves.
So people people that are OK
1646
01:02:09,480 --> 01:02:12,320
like us to just go and say
something, absolutely use your
1647
01:02:12,320 --> 01:02:13,880
voice.
Get as many people on side as
1648
01:02:13,880 --> 01:02:15,240
you can to say sort of certain
things.
1649
01:02:15,240 --> 01:02:17,040
You can have a target on your
back sometimes when you do that.
1650
01:02:17,320 --> 01:02:19,160
Yeah.
Like, do you just have to build
1651
01:02:19,160 --> 01:02:20,080
thick skin?
Is that what?
1652
01:02:20,080 --> 01:02:20,960
You're saying.
What do you think?
1653
01:02:21,200 --> 01:02:25,080
I, I, I personally feel like I'm
getting to the point where I'm
1654
01:02:25,080 --> 01:02:27,160
rubbing people out the wrong way
because I'm so consistent with
1655
01:02:27,160 --> 01:02:32,480
saying listen no.
And, and my my view of it is if
1656
01:02:32,480 --> 01:02:36,640
you've, if you get annoyed at me
for doing that, that's your
1657
01:02:36,640 --> 01:02:38,680
problem.
I'm going to carry on doing it
1658
01:02:38,680 --> 01:02:39,680
because to me it's more
important.
1659
01:02:39,880 --> 01:02:41,280
I think.
I think you have to build a bit
1660
01:02:41,280 --> 01:02:44,600
of a thick skin as a teacher
who's saying no, Yeah, I think
1661
01:02:44,600 --> 01:02:47,800
you have to get over the fact
some people won't appreciate it
1662
01:02:48,080 --> 01:02:50,280
and some people, some people
will think you're a worse
1663
01:02:50,280 --> 01:02:51,360
teacher.
Yeah, yeah.
1664
01:02:51,480 --> 01:02:53,560
OK, they will.
I suppose the blurred line here
1665
01:02:53,560 --> 01:02:56,640
is we're not excusing being a
bad teacher.
1666
01:02:56,800 --> 01:02:58,280
Yeah, because you know what?
It's not like every, every.
1667
01:02:58,280 --> 01:03:00,240
I'm not going to say every
teacher is fantastic because
1668
01:03:00,240 --> 01:03:02,360
they passed a course.
Some teachers aren't very good
1669
01:03:02,360 --> 01:03:04,120
and they need help, right?
Not many, though.
1670
01:03:04,120 --> 01:03:05,440
Most of us, we know exactly what
we're doing.
1671
01:03:05,440 --> 01:03:08,480
And what I'm not doing is
excusing, oh, if your, if your
1672
01:03:08,480 --> 01:03:11,640
SLT are telling you that you
need to, that your, your lessons
1673
01:03:11,640 --> 01:03:13,320
are completely inadequate and
you're not even teaching the
1674
01:03:13,320 --> 01:03:15,160
right curriculum.
I'm not saying, yeah, just tell
1675
01:03:15,160 --> 01:03:16,280
them, no, I'm not one of these.
Right.
1676
01:03:16,280 --> 01:03:18,000
Exactly.
There are some things where it's
1677
01:03:18,000 --> 01:03:19,760
like, no, actually you are
accountable for your job.
1678
01:03:19,960 --> 01:03:22,600
But if, if it's your SLT telling
you to do all of those clerical
1679
01:03:22,600 --> 01:03:24,600
things that we've literally said
of the government have made a
1680
01:03:24,600 --> 01:03:25,800
list of things you don't need to
do anymore.
1681
01:03:25,800 --> 01:03:28,200
And your SLT are saying, or can
you do these things still?
1682
01:03:28,640 --> 01:03:30,880
No.
And yeah, like you said, you
1683
01:03:30,880 --> 01:03:32,200
gotta have thick skin.
You've got to stand up for
1684
01:03:32,200 --> 01:03:33,720
yourself.
And you know what, you're then
1685
01:03:33,720 --> 01:03:36,240
the role model to that some of
those martyrs might convert.
1686
01:03:36,440 --> 01:03:38,200
We need to convert some of these
people, people like used like
1687
01:03:38,200 --> 01:03:40,480
they converted when we striked
because they found out enough
1688
01:03:40,480 --> 01:03:41,920
people striking so they weren't
alone.
1689
01:03:42,080 --> 01:03:44,240
If enough people are saying no,
actually we're not doing this
1690
01:03:44,240 --> 01:03:46,280
anymore, some of those people
might then convert as well and
1691
01:03:46,280 --> 01:03:48,080
be like, oh, actually, yeah, I
can say no, I can.
1692
01:03:48,680 --> 01:03:51,080
I can have a life if I want to.
I don't have to live and breathe
1693
01:03:51,080 --> 01:03:52,880
this job.
OK, so last thing, we're going
1694
01:03:52,880 --> 01:03:54,680
to talk about the martyrs
themselves.
1695
01:03:54,680 --> 01:03:56,880
If you're listening to this and
you've gone through all this and
1696
01:03:56,880 --> 01:03:59,400
you think you fit the category
of the people, basically we've
1697
01:03:59,440 --> 01:04:02,080
spent an hour ranting about
ranting, ranting, ranting.
1698
01:04:02,960 --> 01:04:06,120
You might be thinking, Oh, well,
that's a bit, I feel a bit crap
1699
01:04:06,120 --> 01:04:07,760
now.
What?
1700
01:04:07,800 --> 01:04:11,480
What can they do themselves?
What, what?
1701
01:04:11,560 --> 01:04:15,320
Because to me, OK, this is all
well and good saying top down in
1702
01:04:15,320 --> 01:04:16,960
this exact situation.
We're talking about where you've
1703
01:04:16,960 --> 01:04:19,120
been very clear.
We're not talking about toxic
1704
01:04:19,120 --> 01:04:20,760
schools.
We're not talking about things
1705
01:04:20,760 --> 01:04:22,800
you have no control of.
We're not talking about, you
1706
01:04:22,800 --> 01:04:24,360
know, teaching and learning,
which is really important.
1707
01:04:25,080 --> 01:04:27,280
We're talking about those extra
stuff which pushes people over
1708
01:04:27,280 --> 01:04:28,640
the edge that you still choose
to do.
1709
01:04:28,840 --> 01:04:31,680
For me, 95% of it has to come
from that person themselves.
1710
01:04:31,800 --> 01:04:34,160
I've seen it myself.
It's like whacking your head
1711
01:04:34,160 --> 01:04:36,080
against a brick wall sometimes
telling someone to not do
1712
01:04:36,080 --> 01:04:37,440
something.
It's a top down and bottom up
1713
01:04:37,520 --> 01:04:38,880
approach.
It really is like the people
1714
01:04:38,880 --> 01:04:41,840
that master at the bottom.
You have a you can't just wait
1715
01:04:41,840 --> 01:04:43,760
for people to save you.
Honestly, it's because it's not
1716
01:04:43,760 --> 01:04:44,600
working.
There's too many of you.
1717
01:04:44,880 --> 01:04:46,320
That is the that is the old
problem.
1718
01:04:46,320 --> 01:04:47,800
There's too many of you.
It is.
1719
01:04:47,800 --> 01:04:50,000
It's ruining this profession,
totally ruining this profession.
1720
01:04:50,360 --> 01:04:52,600
The government can even come in
with a list and literally say
1721
01:04:52,600 --> 01:04:54,360
you don't have to do these
things anymore and you'll still
1722
01:04:54,480 --> 01:04:56,280
do them.
It's like what is wrong with?
1723
01:04:56,280 --> 01:04:56,840
What is?
Wrong with us.
1724
01:04:56,840 --> 01:04:59,720
So at what point do we have to
just say it's on us?
1725
01:04:59,720 --> 01:05:00,960
Yeah, it's on us.
It's on you.
1726
01:05:00,960 --> 01:05:03,960
Stop doing it seriously.
And I'm hoping, you know, I
1727
01:05:03,960 --> 01:05:05,440
can't imagine.
We've got many people, I think
1728
01:05:05,440 --> 01:05:07,440
the audience that we get
ironically listening to this and
1729
01:05:07,520 --> 01:05:09,840
or not typically those people.
But if if we do.
1730
01:05:09,840 --> 01:05:11,480
But share this, give this to
someone.
1731
01:05:11,640 --> 01:05:13,720
Tell them because you know what?
I want to talk to you as well.
1732
01:05:13,920 --> 01:05:15,320
Talk to me, message me.
Tell us.
1733
01:05:15,320 --> 01:05:17,640
We're wrong for some, like for
some reason in here.
1734
01:05:17,640 --> 01:05:19,880
If you've got no, no, no, it's
not acceptable, talk to me.
1735
01:05:19,880 --> 01:05:21,240
We can debate.
We can be adults.
1736
01:05:21,240 --> 01:05:24,240
We can be proper like grown-ups.
And there will be nuances 100%
1737
01:05:24,240 --> 01:05:27,920
there'll be, there'll be,
there'll be fringe examples
1738
01:05:27,920 --> 01:05:29,560
where it's like, oh, this just
doesn't apply.
1739
01:05:29,560 --> 01:05:32,640
And you know what, that's fine.
But actually, but on the whole,
1740
01:05:32,720 --> 01:05:34,440
this is the problem with
education.
1741
01:05:34,560 --> 01:05:37,440
There are too many teachers
martyring themselves for this
1742
01:05:37,440 --> 01:05:40,280
job, so many that people that
don't want to do it and actually
1743
01:05:40,280 --> 01:05:43,080
want to change it for you so
that you can have a better work
1744
01:05:43,080 --> 01:05:45,440
life balance don't have a voice.
There's not enough of us.
1745
01:05:45,440 --> 01:05:47,840
We don't have power.
We need collective action.
1746
01:05:48,200 --> 01:05:50,840
Unionise, you know, unions help.
I've heard of some schools that
1747
01:05:50,840 --> 01:05:53,800
have unions, union reps in
school who take that role really
1748
01:05:53,800 --> 01:05:55,840
seriously.
And they will have, you know,
1749
01:05:55,840 --> 01:05:58,880
group chats with everyone.
They'll have staff meetings that
1750
01:05:58,880 --> 01:06:01,080
are just for all the union.
People and I like that they'll
1751
01:06:01,080 --> 01:06:02,840
vote on something.
Yeah, where they'll all say, do
1752
01:06:02,840 --> 01:06:04,640
we all agree that this is
completely mental, that this
1753
01:06:04,640 --> 01:06:06,960
decision that our bosses have
told us is completely mental?
1754
01:06:06,960 --> 01:06:08,000
Do you all agree?
Yeah.
1755
01:06:08,000 --> 01:06:10,280
Cool.
Well, OK, there's twelve of us
1756
01:06:10,280 --> 01:06:11,880
here, so do you know what?
We're all going to go say we're
1757
01:06:11,880 --> 01:06:12,720
not doing this thing and
they'll.
1758
01:06:12,720 --> 01:06:14,520
Bloody.
And do you know what, even when
1759
01:06:14,600 --> 01:06:17,840
what I love about unionising,
which I would strongly tell
1760
01:06:17,840 --> 01:06:20,720
everyone to do, if you have a
vote and they'll say it's seven
1761
01:06:20,720 --> 01:06:24,200
to five, the five say, OK, yeah,
of course we lost the vote.
1762
01:06:24,280 --> 01:06:25,800
And as a 12, they still go
together.
1763
01:06:26,000 --> 01:06:28,360
It's not like, you know, this
whole point of a union, you
1764
01:06:28,360 --> 01:06:30,240
don't just like vote on it and
then six, go away and do
1765
01:06:30,240 --> 01:06:31,960
something.
You're part of the union.
1766
01:06:31,960 --> 01:06:34,120
You back each other up.
If you think something's too far
1767
01:06:34,120 --> 01:06:35,920
maybe or not, OK, let's do a
vote.
1768
01:06:36,120 --> 01:06:39,000
If your unions voted to do
something, you do it.
1769
01:06:39,160 --> 01:06:40,880
So even if you voted no, do you
know what?
1770
01:06:40,920 --> 01:06:43,720
No, We've got a voice of 12
teachers here who are saying no.
1771
01:06:43,720 --> 01:06:46,720
Let's do.
And I think if you want to be
1772
01:06:46,720 --> 01:06:48,960
serious about it, there's, you
know, you might get, again,
1773
01:06:48,960 --> 01:06:50,920
thick skin is what you need.
People are going to go after you
1774
01:06:50,920 --> 01:06:52,720
if they don't want unions.
Like that's obviously going to
1775
01:06:52,720 --> 01:06:54,920
be a thing.
But you've got to, if you really
1776
01:06:54,920 --> 01:06:56,200
want to change it, you've got to
try and do it.
1777
01:06:56,280 --> 01:06:57,360
Yeah, definitely.
Nice one.
1778
01:06:57,360 --> 01:06:58,480
It's been an interesting
episode.
1779
01:06:59,120 --> 01:07:01,360
It's been very ranty, but like
you said, it's not negative.
1780
01:07:01,360 --> 01:07:03,800
It is.
It's reflective, it's real, it
1781
01:07:03,800 --> 01:07:05,720
is the problem.
If you can't see that this is
1782
01:07:05,720 --> 01:07:07,160
the problem.
I don't know what world of
1783
01:07:07,160 --> 01:07:08,840
teaching you're living in, but
it is a problem.
1784
01:07:09,200 --> 01:07:11,920
And as I said, losing the world
to live, can we please change it
1785
01:07:11,920 --> 01:07:14,080
so that I can see some hope,
Because I am.
1786
01:07:14,120 --> 01:07:16,440
There is no light the end of the
tunnel for me anymore.
1787
01:07:16,840 --> 01:07:17,840
I just can't.
You know, we've done this
1788
01:07:17,840 --> 01:07:20,320
podcast a year and a half.
I can't even change the minds of
1789
01:07:20,320 --> 01:07:22,520
the people closest to me by
myself.
1790
01:07:22,840 --> 01:07:24,720
The next step is it has to be
collective if we're going to
1791
01:07:24,720 --> 01:07:27,640
change this culture.
Wow.
1792
01:07:28,120 --> 01:07:29,840
OK, let's wrap it up there,
shall we?
1793
01:07:29,840 --> 01:07:31,440
Yeah.
I mean, it's truthful.
1794
01:07:31,440 --> 01:07:33,520
And you know what a lot of
people tell us in messages,
1795
01:07:34,080 --> 01:07:36,560
you're saying what we think and
there's not a voice out there
1796
01:07:36,560 --> 01:07:38,240
saying this.
You'll very easily go out and
1797
01:07:38,240 --> 01:07:40,520
find a voice that says this new
pedagogy is really good.
1798
01:07:40,520 --> 01:07:42,720
We should spend 7 hours doing
CPD to learn all this stuff
1799
01:07:42,720 --> 01:07:43,720
because it's really good for the
kids.
1800
01:07:44,440 --> 01:07:45,280
Awesome.
Do you know what?
1801
01:07:45,280 --> 01:07:46,560
I'm realistic.
I'm a normal man.
1802
01:07:46,880 --> 01:07:47,960
I'm a teacher.
I love my job.
1803
01:07:47,960 --> 01:07:49,920
I'm good at it.
This parts mentor, we're gonna
1804
01:07:49,920 --> 01:07:51,840
talk about it.
We're going to call it out.
1805
01:07:51,920 --> 01:07:53,520
And if we're gonna change it,
this is how we can.
1806
01:07:53,520 --> 01:07:55,240
Do we're talking to you, so
please do write in.
1807
01:07:55,240 --> 01:07:56,280
Dylan loves it.
I love it.
1808
01:07:56,280 --> 01:07:57,920
He sends me all the messages we
get through.
1809
01:07:58,040 --> 01:08:00,360
I really love reading them and
especially if you challenge us
1810
01:08:00,360 --> 01:08:01,720
as well.
You know what it makes us think
1811
01:08:01,720 --> 01:08:04,120
and that's what we had to do.
We think on this podcast and
1812
01:08:04,160 --> 01:08:05,240
look forward to hearing from you
all.
1813
01:08:05,280 --> 01:08:06,760
But mainly if you want to give
us some praise.
1814
01:08:07,480 --> 01:08:10,040
And and a lovely Spotify review.
And yeah.
1815
01:08:10,320 --> 01:08:12,800
And anything like that be great.
Lovely reviews in general.
1816
01:08:12,800 --> 01:08:14,160
Leave as a comment.
If you listen on Spotify,
1817
01:08:14,160 --> 01:08:15,360
comments get automatically
published.
1818
01:08:15,360 --> 01:08:16,840
Now you can save you one.
Just appears.
1819
01:08:17,399 --> 01:08:20,000
Guys, thank you so much.
You see them, see you, then see
1820
01:08:20,000 --> 01:08:20,399
you next time.
