Ep 185: Q&A: Supporting Your Whole Class, Recognising Burnout & Ridiculous Teacher Tasks To Reject!

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Hello everyone, welcome back to
another episode of TCP.

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My name is Dylan.
And my name's Hayden.

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Back with.
Another Q&A, What does Q&A stand

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for Hayden?
Question and answer.

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Queen and Albert, let's go.
First question, any tips on how

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to help a child who is working
at a lower level than their

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chronological age?
I'm a new secondary teacher and

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have GCSE history class with one
child who has very low literacy

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skills as it's a subject that
needs quite a high level of

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literacy.
He is really struggling and

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because I teach a very mixed
ability group it isn't easy to

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give him the attention that he
needs.

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I know you guys taught primary
school so I thought you might

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have experienced this more than
we do in secondary.

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I listened to your episode a few
weeks ago and I totally agree

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that parents are playing a big
part in getting them back up to

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speed.
But if this support simply isn't

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happening, do you think there's
anything that we can do to get

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kids like this to where they
need to be?

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Very interesting from the
secondary perspective.

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I was reading that and I
thought, do you know what?

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Welcome to the old daily primary
experience of just children not

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being where they should be.
It is interesting, I will say

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about secondary and and literacy
because at the end of the day,

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you're a history teacher.
Yeah.

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There is only so much you
personally can do for their

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literacy schools.
Whereas with with primary school

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you know it is it's front and
centre of what they do all the

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time.
It's like when you do do

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history, it's like, well, like
I, I teach you English as well

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so I know your literary schools
can account for that.

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It must be quite hard in
secondary.

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That's exactly what I was
thinking because I was like, at

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the end of the day, every
primary school teacher's

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teaching literacy, Yeah, like,
you're doing all of the

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subjects, but if you're a
specialist in a particular

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subject in secondary, is it fair
to hold you to the same account?

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It's tricky because.
Like they mentioned, like is

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that just a prerequisite of,
well, you are teaching them year

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10 history and if they can't
quite read properly or

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understand the text and
comprehension, at what point is

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that genuinely not your job?
But equally it's your job to get

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them to understand and you need
to support them.

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So it is of course your job as
well.

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So that's really hard, I.
Think, yeah, yeah, I think

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there's a middle ground because
regardless of the fact that we

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just said primary school
teachers teach everything.

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So we can establish that maybe
it's a bit more normal for if

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you're teaching history in
primary, you kind of know what

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the children are at different
levels.

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And you would account for that
in the in the resourcing of the

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lesson perhaps or in the way you
teach and the way you group up,

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basically any part of the role
of actually teaching in front of

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kids.
I don't think that completely

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goes away just just because
you're a secondary school

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teacher, but I do think there's
probably should be some more

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leeway.
I think ultimately, like you

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can't do nothing.
I don't think this person can

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just go, Oh well, not my fault,
kid, do nothing.

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I think you've got to try and do
something.

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I just don't think you need to
beat yourself up over the fact

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that by the year 10, they can't
do the specialist subject that

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you're teaching.
I think you can probably, you

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know, there's almost definitely
some resources or

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differentiation you can put in
place, which I imagine is still

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quite commonplace anyway, by
that point, have some some

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levels of thinking about the
fact that not all children are

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cognitively exactly the same,
right?

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Yeah, for sure.
And I think if you look at, you

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know, I'm going to take it to
the just as a generic, generic

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point now about asking about a
child below their chronological

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age, what can you do to support
them?

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I'm thinking now from my point
of view, in the afternoon

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lessons when I knew there were
groups of children in my class

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who weren't quite at the level
or everyone else, you know, did

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I still expect them to join in?
It's like, well, yeah.

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And also, I suppose you can take
a look at what are your aims for

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your subject.
If you look at history,

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obviously the aims for history,
and I'm just going to take a few

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as an example, might be the
ability to interpret sources.

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And it's like, OK, well, how
much of that is dependent on a

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child's chronological age for
their reading?

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Or could you adapt something so
that it's at their level in

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terms of their literacy, but
they can still be interpreting

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sources and looking at bias,
etcetera, and still ticking the

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boxes for that history lesson,
just that you you've adapted it

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so it's at a lower level and
they can access it.

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Are they still then going to be
access in the history

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curriculum?
Yeah, sounds like there would

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be.
It reminds me of everything we

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learned in primary really, which
is trying not to just box off

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children purely based on
electricity.

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I remember before teachers said
to me or head teachers and

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leaders would say things like
don't assume just because that

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child struggles in English
lessons that they're now going

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to need the exact same level of
support or help all the time.

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In some, you know, insert any
afternoon subject.

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She was like, sometimes you'll.
Find those for reading.

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They will with specific elements
but like it was on a wider

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sense, they were like, don't
just assume they can't do

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anything and are not interested
just because they struggle with

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English like or they struggle
with maths and therefore they

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don't want to do this thing.
It was a really good point

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because there were just
genuinely some children who

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would flourish in those
afternoon subjects if you

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allowed that support.
Like you said, you took away

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some of the burden of the thing
they struggle with, which was

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reading.
Even though it's obviously

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integral, they still then
flourished in the actual subject

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itself when you just helped them
overcome that.

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OK, you struggle to read this
and when you struggle to write,

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but you're just, as you know,
switched on when it comes to

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being interested in this
historical subject or even

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remembering the facts that I'm
that I'm teaching you.

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Yeah, like interest is a weird
one, because interest isn't

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really on the curriculum level,
that kind of stuff.

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And as a teacher, obviously you
want everyone to be interested

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all the time.
And the level of literacy, if

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that ruins a child's interest in
something that makes sense to

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you to account for that.
But.

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Literally just the pure actual
skills.

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Like I can think of some
children who I've taught

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previously.
Who really, really, really.

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Low ability in their English and
their reading and they struggle

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to read properly and it takes
them a long time just to decode

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words and they've got to try and
understand what they mean etc

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and go from there.
But with a little bit of pre

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teaching of vocabulary
beforehand with pictures and

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support, when it got to the
lesson for science, those

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children genuinely were ahead of
the rest of the class because

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they already knew what a canine
tooth was, they already knew

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what a molar was.
And it didn't matter that they

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couldn't read it.
They'd been taught it beforehand

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and had some prompts.
And then when we spoke about the

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what what the actual teeth were
doing in the mouth and the roles

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they had and the link it had to
digestion, they were ahead of

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the game because they had that
little bit of pre teaching.

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So with the right support, you
can actually get children on a

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level or further literally
attainment wise if you reduce

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that barrier in just literacy,
for example.

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And yeah, like these children, I
remember 1, the assistant had

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covered my class and we were in
the middle of a unit about

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digestion and teeth.
He was in year 4 and he finished

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and we were just talking after
and he was almost like

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flabbergasted at how well
certain children are done in

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that lesson because.
And he said himself like, I just

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had this preconception that
these children, obviously

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because they don't have the
literacy skills, will find it

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much more tricky.
And he was like, wow, the pre

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teachings really clearly working
because in class discussion and

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when we literally looked at the
objectives of the lesson, they

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were at the top of the class.
And I think that's that's what

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you can do for children who are
below their chronological age.

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You can make adjustments so that
you can still meet the needs.

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Are they ever going to crack on
and be exactly what everyone

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else is in terms of literacy and
reading?

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No, that is a long, long road.
But then the literacy is so

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embedded in everything.
I can understand why people

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think, well, in that case, I
guess they're low in everything.

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Really.
Genuinely, no.

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And if you're actually assessing
their historical skill or their

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scientific skill or their
geography skill or their

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physical education, obviously is
the most obvious one.

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That's so separate.
Yeah.

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There are degrees of separation
that you can, I think, with

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support, give children so they
can still flourish to an extent.

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Is it harder the older you get?
I think that's what I was.

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Going to say next.
I was like, at the end of the

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day, it is easier for us to say
as primary school teachers.

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And I do sympathise with this
person because I even said it in

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the in the question.
It's a subject that needs quite

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a high level of literacy.
So when it gets more and more

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linked to the actual subject
itself, like it clearly does,

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the higher up you get, I can see
it posing more of a problem.

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Like I really can.
And as much as you know, you can

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try any of these strategies and
things we're saying, I can

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appreciate that It does just get
to a point though, where you are

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just limited.
Like we're not perfect and there

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isn't, this system is flawed.
Like there is a point where

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where you can literally look at
a situation and go, I can

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implement everything I possibly
can within the constraints of

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reality here.
But at the end of the day, it's

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year 10 and reading is linked to
90% of the stuff we do.

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And if they can't read, I
simply, they simply cannot

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access what we're doing.
And, and I can't do anything

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about that.
And it sucks because it's like

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admitting defeat, but there is
only so much you can do.

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And and you even pointed to it
yourself.

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You know, parents do play a big
part of it.

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And it's not all on you.
I mean, it's just worth

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remembering you as the history
teacher in year 10, their

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entirety of their life up to
that point.

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And whatever's got them there
and whatever, you know, might be

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going on with that child or that
family or maybe SEND anything is

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not actually your fault.
And but you know, so you've just

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got to do what you can using the
things that we've said.

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But there isn't.
There is.

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Any progress is good if you
frame it as I'm going to help

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this child get as far as they
can, and even if you do it a

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little bit, that's better than
nothing as compared to I need

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everyone to get to this line and
if they haven't, I've failed.

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I think that's a nice way of
framing it.

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I also think if I think back to
like when I did history or

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geography, etcetera, there was a
huge amount of it that was in

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the skill of the teacher to
translate something from the

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page to real life.
If I think back to what I

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remember, I remember my history
teacher stood at the front

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telling stories, drawing on
sources and interpreting them

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almost for the class as well.
Sure, we still went away and

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looked at newspaper clippings,
or I remember we looked at

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cartoons, sometimes political
cartoons.

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There's no reason why these kids
can't look at them and

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understand them.
I remember watching

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documentaries, clips from
documentaries.

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So as long as you're sprinkling
in those opportunities that

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aren't just simply sat down
reading a text for an hour, I

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think that's good pedagogy
anyway.

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And I think that's good for
anyone regardless of their

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literacy levels.
But if you just, I think have at

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the forefront of your mind what
different tasks can I do that

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just allow as much involvement
from everyone as possible, I

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think that's a net gain At the
end of the day.

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Are they going to have to sit
and write an essay?

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And then yes, they are.
So you know, there comes a point

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where you have to just say,
look, I can do what I can for

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you.
But the end of the.

227
00:09:30,560 --> 00:09:32,240
Day you've got a lot to.
Work on that isn't just in my

228
00:09:32,240 --> 00:09:32,920
subject.
Yeah.

229
00:09:32,920 --> 00:09:35,800
And this child might not get the
grades that they want, but in in

230
00:09:35,800 --> 00:09:37,920
that in that process, they can
still learn, they can still make

231
00:09:37,920 --> 00:09:40,080
progress themselves through all
of the things you said as well.

232
00:09:40,720 --> 00:09:41,400
Yeah.
Tricky.

233
00:09:41,400 --> 00:09:44,240
One question, so next question.
Next three questions.

234
00:09:44,240 --> 00:09:45,360
In fact, we're from the same
person.

235
00:09:45,360 --> 00:09:47,480
Did you write them yourself?
I did not write them myself, did

236
00:09:47,480 --> 00:09:48,480
you?
Just set yourself up for a

237
00:09:48,480 --> 00:09:50,560
little.
All these lovely people sending

238
00:09:50,560 --> 00:09:51,640
the questions.
You're like, do you know what?

239
00:09:51,640 --> 00:09:52,800
I was going to write my own ones
here and.

240
00:09:52,800 --> 00:09:55,000
The first one is why is Hayden
so much cooler than Dylan?

241
00:09:55,160 --> 00:09:58,120
Really interesting, no, Right.
So first, first of the three

242
00:09:58,120 --> 00:10:02,040
questions then is what are the
early signs of teacher burnouts

243
00:10:02,040 --> 00:10:04,840
that people often ignore?
And what can teachers do before

244
00:10:04,840 --> 00:10:06,920
it reaches breaking point?
Very good question.

245
00:10:06,960 --> 00:10:10,640
Hives.
Yeah, that's quite early.

246
00:10:10,640 --> 00:10:12,680
Or any other.
I'm really itchy.

247
00:10:12,800 --> 00:10:15,240
Any other physical signs I'm?
Stressed, probably fainting

248
00:10:15,240 --> 00:10:16,920
randomly.
Yeah, painting.

249
00:10:17,400 --> 00:10:20,920
Overtired bags under the eyes,
walking into the door.

250
00:10:21,000 --> 00:10:23,400
Walking Yeah, Classic 1.
Walking in and someone saying,

251
00:10:23,400 --> 00:10:27,960
oh, you look tired when you're
actually OK and you think, Oh

252
00:10:27,960 --> 00:10:29,960
yeah, I am.
Yeah, I pretend you are.

253
00:10:30,040 --> 00:10:31,760
Any teacher, isn't it?
That's any teacher ever.

254
00:10:33,480 --> 00:10:35,440
I, I do you know what early
signs of burnout?

255
00:10:35,560 --> 00:10:39,200
It's so hard because talking
about myself personally now for

256
00:10:39,200 --> 00:10:41,880
a second and stress, you know
this.

257
00:10:42,360 --> 00:10:46,680
I don't feel stress in what I
deem as the traditional way

258
00:10:47,000 --> 00:10:50,440
where my brain fogs up and my
brains filled with things and I

259
00:10:50,440 --> 00:10:51,920
think, oh gosh, I'm just
overthinking everything.

260
00:10:51,920 --> 00:10:53,000
I'm so stressed.
I've got so much.

261
00:10:53,040 --> 00:10:54,240
You don't recognise it, do you?
I don't.

262
00:10:54,240 --> 00:10:56,400
Recognise it because to me
that's traditional stress.

263
00:10:56,400 --> 00:10:58,840
That's what stress is.
And clearly that's just a really

264
00:10:58,840 --> 00:11:01,520
bad understanding of stress that
I think most people have, which

265
00:11:01,520 --> 00:11:03,600
is stress is only one thing when
it's filling your head and

266
00:11:03,600 --> 00:11:05,240
you've got lots to think.
About and you think, oh, I'm so

267
00:11:05,240 --> 00:11:06,880
stressed.
Exactly, exactly.

268
00:11:06,880 --> 00:11:11,720
Whereas I've learned over over
years that my body stress is

269
00:11:11,720 --> 00:11:12,960
linked.
Not only it's a mental thing,

270
00:11:12,960 --> 00:11:14,440
but it becomes a physical thing
for me.

271
00:11:14,720 --> 00:11:18,160
Or I get like reflux.
I, I, my, my stomachs and I get

272
00:11:18,160 --> 00:11:21,600
chest pain literally.
Like I, I begin to feel ill and

273
00:11:21,600 --> 00:11:24,040
then I'm like, oh, what am I
stressed over?

274
00:11:24,200 --> 00:11:26,840
And I think backwards and I go,
oh, yeah, that makes sense.

275
00:11:26,840 --> 00:11:28,160
It's because of this, this and
this.

276
00:11:28,320 --> 00:11:30,960
So that's how I've learned what
stress is for me.

277
00:11:30,960 --> 00:11:33,920
And early indicators for me were
genuinely don't, don't put down

278
00:11:33,920 --> 00:11:38,720
or diminish your physical health
as an indicator of you're

279
00:11:38,720 --> 00:11:41,120
overworked, you're overwhelmed.
Percent because it's all linked.

280
00:11:41,120 --> 00:11:43,000
You're sitting ill all the time.
Like I say, you're getting chest

281
00:11:43,000 --> 00:11:44,400
pains out of nowhere you don't
normally get.

282
00:11:44,400 --> 00:11:46,560
You're getting indigestion that
you don't normally get.

283
00:11:46,560 --> 00:11:47,640
That for you, like you said,
was.

284
00:11:47,640 --> 00:11:49,040
Just really bad reflux.
And it was ages.

285
00:11:49,040 --> 00:11:50,760
It took you ages, didn't it?
I remember you one day being

286
00:11:50,760 --> 00:11:53,360
like, Oh my God, like almost
like realising that oh God,

287
00:11:53,480 --> 00:11:56,360
obviously this is stress and
I've just not been recognising

288
00:11:56,360 --> 00:11:57,840
this as stress.
I've been thinking oh why am I

289
00:11:57,880 --> 00:11:59,000
ill?
For some reason, because people

290
00:11:59,000 --> 00:12:00,600
said, is it your diet?
I was like, I diet, It's awful

291
00:12:00,600 --> 00:12:02,360
all the time.
If it was my diet, I'd

292
00:12:02,360 --> 00:12:04,400
constantly be having reflux.
So it's not my diet.

293
00:12:05,080 --> 00:12:07,320
And I just made that link where
I was like, actually, if I look

294
00:12:07,320 --> 00:12:11,120
back the last four times I felt
this way, something has been

295
00:12:11,120 --> 00:12:14,840
going on either in my personal
life or in my work life that I

296
00:12:14,840 --> 00:12:18,000
can point to and say, oh, I'm
feeling overwhelmed and stressed

297
00:12:18,000 --> 00:12:19,840
out.
And that's how it manifested

298
00:12:19,840 --> 00:12:21,880
itself.
So for me, the point I'm making

299
00:12:21,880 --> 00:12:24,160
here is that for every single
individual person, I do think it

300
00:12:24,160 --> 00:12:27,000
will be different and I do think
it manifest itself differently.

301
00:12:27,000 --> 00:12:29,360
So I don't be this person sound
this podcast going, oh, you're

302
00:12:29,360 --> 00:12:31,280
listening to me.
Well, I'll tell you what the

303
00:12:31,280 --> 00:12:33,400
early signs are.
You should look out for this bag

304
00:12:33,400 --> 00:12:34,880
under your eyes.
Literally hives because it's

305
00:12:34,880 --> 00:12:36,920
physical stuff for you.
Yeah, you weren't joking.

306
00:12:37,600 --> 00:12:40,360
That's fair enough.
I think one for me would be like

307
00:12:40,360 --> 00:12:44,160
my snappiness, like obviously
everyone has a temperament and,

308
00:12:44,160 --> 00:12:46,600
and you can, you can get snappy.
Genuinely, no, it's not

309
00:12:46,600 --> 00:12:48,720
necessarily like early burnout,
right?

310
00:12:49,040 --> 00:12:52,080
No, I, I found that in general,
and I have seen this in other

311
00:12:52,080 --> 00:12:55,240
people as well when they, when
people are getting more towards

312
00:12:55,240 --> 00:12:58,440
burnout, they are just quicker
to react to stuff quicker to get

313
00:12:58,440 --> 00:13:01,600
annoyed by things.
I certainly did that.

314
00:13:01,800 --> 00:13:05,560
It's almost like you're
predisposed to be annoyed about

315
00:13:05,560 --> 00:13:06,480
the fact that you're burning
out.

316
00:13:06,480 --> 00:13:08,320
It's like, and then and then
you're just, I don't know.

317
00:13:08,320 --> 00:13:10,720
I just found I was when I was
feeling like that, I I just

318
00:13:10,720 --> 00:13:14,800
found I was really, really
irritated by stuff like way more

319
00:13:14,800 --> 00:13:16,440
easily and then and.
This back out.

320
00:13:17,400 --> 00:13:20,280
Yeah, and then I then I'd like
reflect on it a bit like you and

321
00:13:20,280 --> 00:13:23,400
be like, oh, it's because I'm
really stressed right now and

322
00:13:23,400 --> 00:13:24,560
I'm just being snappy towards
people.

323
00:13:24,560 --> 00:13:26,960
I'm being a Dick.
You know, very rarely am IA Dick

324
00:13:26,960 --> 00:13:30,440
right, Dylan setting you up
there.

325
00:13:31,320 --> 00:13:33,560
But no, in all seriousness, you
know you'd say things or react

326
00:13:33,560 --> 00:13:35,400
to things.
You think, oh, I'd normally do

327
00:13:35,400 --> 00:13:36,880
that, but.
What we're saying here is quite

328
00:13:36,960 --> 00:13:39,560
reactive.
Where where we're talking about

329
00:13:39,560 --> 00:13:41,760
how actually it took a while to
learn those prompts.

330
00:13:41,760 --> 00:13:43,400
Yeah, definitely.
But once we learn them, then you

331
00:13:43,400 --> 00:13:45,880
can be more proactive, 100%.
And if we're talking about now,

332
00:13:45,880 --> 00:13:48,720
what can you do to to stop you
getting from breaking point?

333
00:13:48,880 --> 00:13:51,000
I think you need to learn
yourself and your own body and

334
00:13:51,000 --> 00:13:53,080
your own needs and your own,
your own cues.

335
00:13:53,600 --> 00:13:54,960
That's really important.
Like what?

336
00:13:54,960 --> 00:13:56,840
What?
Have you seen in your past when

337
00:13:56,840 --> 00:14:00,000
you're burning out, what do you
see as like physically or

338
00:14:00,000 --> 00:14:03,520
mentally is happening to you?
And then I think honestly, to be

339
00:14:03,520 --> 00:14:06,880
proactive, you, you just have
to, and it's like a broken

340
00:14:06,880 --> 00:14:10,040
record.
You have to prioritise yourself.

341
00:14:10,880 --> 00:14:13,320
And what I mean by this is, you
know, people say, oh, it's easy

342
00:14:13,320 --> 00:14:15,800
for you to say to just say no,
but I feel like I've got to

343
00:14:15,800 --> 00:14:19,040
you're, you're on the verge of a
breakdown.

344
00:14:19,200 --> 00:14:21,120
Yeah, yeah.
Say no.

345
00:14:21,800 --> 00:14:23,360
Oh, but I've got to.
You don't.

346
00:14:23,960 --> 00:14:26,240
Quite a lot of time you're
convincing yourself you do and

347
00:14:26,240 --> 00:14:28,440
you don't.
And don't let other people get

348
00:14:28,440 --> 00:14:31,760
away with making you feel that
way because it's you who's

349
00:14:31,760 --> 00:14:33,440
bearing that burden at the end
of the day.

350
00:14:33,720 --> 00:14:36,080
Oh, but they won't be able to do
this thing that they want to do

351
00:14:36,080 --> 00:14:38,720
over the weekend if I don't do
my work now out of my own time.

352
00:14:39,080 --> 00:14:41,160
That sounds a lot like a them
problem.

353
00:14:41,160 --> 00:14:41,880
Yeah.
Yeah.

354
00:14:41,880 --> 00:14:44,680
And if you always keeping that
burden and you're taking that

355
00:14:44,680 --> 00:14:48,000
burden of everyone else on you,
you'll be seen as the person

356
00:14:48,000 --> 00:14:49,840
that can they can do that to
constantly.

357
00:14:50,000 --> 00:14:53,200
You have to say no and stop.
And if you notice you're burning

358
00:14:53,200 --> 00:14:56,520
out, you have to reduce what
you're doing and the world will

359
00:14:56,520 --> 00:14:59,280
keep turning and life will go
on.

360
00:14:59,560 --> 00:15:02,240
And if you oh, they'll just put
me on a capability plan, let

361
00:15:02,240 --> 00:15:06,760
them and then fight it like like
you have to you just otherwise

362
00:15:06,800 --> 00:15:09,840
I'm and I'm what I'm saying here
in this situation is you're

363
00:15:09,840 --> 00:15:12,000
getting burnt out and feel like
crap because of what's going on

364
00:15:12,000 --> 00:15:14,080
right now.
If you constantly think of,

365
00:15:14,080 --> 00:15:17,080
well, if I do this, then that is
it better or worse than what's

366
00:15:17,080 --> 00:15:19,080
currently happening to you?
Because it sounds I'm talking to

367
00:15:19,080 --> 00:15:21,680
people who are literally burning
out right now and won't be able

368
00:15:21,680 --> 00:15:24,800
to last any longer.
So the option then has to be to

369
00:15:24,800 --> 00:15:27,080
try something different.
You have to do that.

370
00:15:27,280 --> 00:15:30,080
If you're fine with how it is
and you think the other option's

371
00:15:30,080 --> 00:15:32,320
worse, then I don't feel like it
sounds like you're a breaking

372
00:15:32,320 --> 00:15:32,800
point.
Really.

373
00:15:33,080 --> 00:15:35,000
I'm talking about people who are
literally at the end of their

374
00:15:35,000 --> 00:15:36,000
tether.
What can I do?

375
00:15:36,280 --> 00:15:39,120
Reduce, reduce, reduce.
Say no, say no, say no.

376
00:15:39,120 --> 00:15:41,320
And if you can't do it anymore,
get a different job because life

377
00:15:41,320 --> 00:15:43,800
is too short.
Go and work somewhere else.

378
00:15:44,280 --> 00:15:46,520
Your life is too short.
If you're constantly feeling

379
00:15:46,520 --> 00:15:49,960
like crap, go and do something
else, because the world will

380
00:15:49,960 --> 00:15:51,760
continue.
That'll replace you in a

381
00:15:51,760 --> 00:15:54,400
nanosecond and you'll be
happier, hopefully.

382
00:15:54,520 --> 00:15:56,200
And if you're not, at least you
had to go.

383
00:15:56,760 --> 00:15:58,360
But it sounds like you can't get
much worse.

384
00:15:58,480 --> 00:16:01,520
If you're at breaking point, try
something different please, for

385
00:16:01,520 --> 00:16:04,280
your own sake.
Yeah, I agree.

386
00:16:04,840 --> 00:16:09,080
I agree wholeheartedly.
Life is too short and I think

387
00:16:10,920 --> 00:16:12,320
even just some other like little
signs.

388
00:16:12,320 --> 00:16:15,120
We'll move on to next question.
One more thing I thought of when

389
00:16:15,120 --> 00:16:18,640
you were talking there is when
you get to the weekend or the

390
00:16:18,640 --> 00:16:23,320
half terms and you just feel
like you don't really want to do

391
00:16:23,320 --> 00:16:25,760
anything.
That's for me looking back and

392
00:16:25,760 --> 00:16:27,800
even now, because sometimes I
still get burned out a bit or

393
00:16:27,800 --> 00:16:30,000
get close to burnout because we,
you know, we work a lot.

394
00:16:31,400 --> 00:16:32,920
I sometimes go, I recognise
that.

395
00:16:32,920 --> 00:16:35,720
Now what I need to do is
actually genuinely just stop.

396
00:16:35,720 --> 00:16:37,920
And I need to stop for two days.
And sometimes I'll do that.

397
00:16:37,920 --> 00:16:39,480
I'll go a week and I'll be like,
I'm do you know what?

398
00:16:39,600 --> 00:16:42,160
I'm just not even going to
engage my brain with some of

399
00:16:42,160 --> 00:16:44,600
this stuff because I don't even
want to do like basic things

400
00:16:44,600 --> 00:16:46,360
that I like.
And that for me now is like a

401
00:16:46,360 --> 00:16:49,080
massive sign of, oh, you're
overworked, you're stressed out,

402
00:16:49,080 --> 00:16:50,960
even though you're really bad at
recognising stress a bit like

403
00:16:50,960 --> 00:16:53,640
you, and you just need to stop.
Otherwise you'll feel like this

404
00:16:53,640 --> 00:16:55,160
perpetually.
And that's like the worst

405
00:16:55,160 --> 00:16:57,720
possible outcome.
So anyway, yeah, it's a tricky

406
00:16:57,720 --> 00:16:59,760
one.
It's like Dylan said, it's

407
00:16:59,880 --> 00:17:02,080
personal end of the day, but you
do need to just keep on top of

408
00:17:02,080 --> 00:17:04,640
it and as soon as you're aware
of something that is a sign for

409
00:17:04,640 --> 00:17:05,960
you.
You have to be proactive about

410
00:17:05,960 --> 00:17:07,280
it.
Go, go, go, go, go.

411
00:17:07,400 --> 00:17:09,079
My next the.
Next part of the three parter

412
00:17:09,480 --> 00:17:10,760
is.
Why is it?

413
00:17:10,760 --> 00:17:13,319
This is a better trilogy than
Star Wars, isn't it?

414
00:17:13,560 --> 00:17:17,160
Isn't just The Godfather Part 2?
And there's many Star Wars

415
00:17:17,160 --> 00:17:19,200
trilogies.
Why is it that teachers.

416
00:17:19,200 --> 00:17:21,720
There's a trilogy of trilogies.
There's a literally a trilogy of

417
00:17:21,720 --> 00:17:24,520
trilogies which is maybe a bit
better than this.

418
00:17:24,839 --> 00:17:26,079
What's your favourite ever
trilogy?

419
00:17:27,480 --> 00:17:29,520
Oh my God.
Mine was Toy Story, then they

420
00:17:29,520 --> 00:17:32,480
brought 4 out and now it's not a
trilogy anymore but the first 3

421
00:17:32,480 --> 00:17:35,640
Toy Story films.
Unbelievable.

422
00:17:35,680 --> 00:17:38,640
Yeah, I'm thinking blade blade
1-2 and three.

423
00:17:39,000 --> 00:17:41,440
Those were some sweet films.
Give me Shrek the Third any day,

424
00:17:41,440 --> 00:17:43,000
baby.
Sorry, but.

425
00:17:43,080 --> 00:17:44,400
Right.
Why is it that teachers can

426
00:17:44,400 --> 00:17:47,040
control a room of 30 plus
children but completely lose the

427
00:17:47,040 --> 00:17:50,760
ability to say no to one extra
task in a staff meeting?

428
00:17:51,920 --> 00:17:54,960
It's good question.
Some teachers, some teachers

429
00:17:54,960 --> 00:17:56,280
can't control a room with 30
children.

430
00:17:57,480 --> 00:17:59,120
It's not there and.
One of them is in this room.

431
00:18:00,000 --> 00:18:02,600
But I can say no, that's for
sure.

432
00:18:03,520 --> 00:18:05,840
Guilt.
There's a lot of guilt that goes

433
00:18:05,840 --> 00:18:08,160
on in this profession.
Of course, feeling like you have

434
00:18:08,160 --> 00:18:09,720
got to have got to do, I've just
got to do it.

435
00:18:09,920 --> 00:18:12,360
You don't.
News flash, genuine news flash.

436
00:18:12,360 --> 00:18:15,640
You can say nerd stuff, It's a
job, but why?

437
00:18:15,640 --> 00:18:17,600
Why is it teachers can do that
but then lose the ability?

438
00:18:17,600 --> 00:18:19,040
I think it's AI think it's
because they're in different

439
00:18:19,040 --> 00:18:21,960
environments.
And I have a theory that I've

440
00:18:22,040 --> 00:18:25,760
had for a long time, which is
that the environment of a school

441
00:18:26,200 --> 00:18:30,080
and being a teacher and you're
in charge and this idea of I am

442
00:18:30,080 --> 00:18:32,440
your guardian and I am the
person guiding you and I'm in

443
00:18:32,440 --> 00:18:33,880
charge.
And if I say don't do it, don't

444
00:18:33,880 --> 00:18:35,680
do it, and then just follow my
instructions, please.

445
00:18:35,680 --> 00:18:38,320
And I'm in charge of you guys as
a classroom.

446
00:18:38,600 --> 00:18:42,560
I think that when you work in a
school, that translates to also

447
00:18:42,560 --> 00:18:44,840
sometimes leadership to you.
Yeah, I was literally thinking

448
00:18:44,840 --> 00:18:47,640
that that happens all the time.
So you just revert back to it.

449
00:18:47,680 --> 00:18:49,760
You literally sat in a classroom
with someone at the front saying

450
00:18:49,760 --> 00:18:50,680
they're doing this new
initiative.

451
00:18:50,840 --> 00:18:53,280
You just turn into the little
sheet like, yes, OK, so sure.

452
00:18:53,720 --> 00:18:56,000
You no, you it's a different
dynamic.

453
00:18:56,000 --> 00:18:59,400
And there's too often that
dynamic is is merged into one.

454
00:18:59,760 --> 00:19:03,240
The dynamic of you in your class
is not the same dynamic as your

455
00:19:03,240 --> 00:19:06,760
leader in you as a professional.
And and that I think if you're

456
00:19:06,760 --> 00:19:09,560
asking me why it happens, I
think that very.

457
00:19:09,560 --> 00:19:14,000
Often I think your theory is
like, very, very like likely to

458
00:19:14,000 --> 00:19:15,920
be true.
Because if you spend, you spend

459
00:19:15,920 --> 00:19:20,160
13, every year you've spent in
school, there's been someone who

460
00:19:20,160 --> 00:19:22,240
is like your boss, like your
teacher essentially, right?

461
00:19:22,240 --> 00:19:25,120
You spent 13 years as that
person who had a teacher you

462
00:19:25,120 --> 00:19:27,360
need to listen to.
So it makes sense that when you

463
00:19:27,360 --> 00:19:30,520
go back as a teacher, you still
have that feeling of, oh, I'm in

464
00:19:30,520 --> 00:19:32,400
a school though.
And this is where like, I'm, I'm

465
00:19:32,400 --> 00:19:34,240
now in charge of these guys, but
these guys are in charge of me.

466
00:19:34,240 --> 00:19:35,680
I'm their pupil.
I get it.

467
00:19:35,720 --> 00:19:37,080
Like it makes sense as to why
you do that.

468
00:19:37,080 --> 00:19:38,400
And it's wrong and I don't like
it.

469
00:19:38,400 --> 00:19:39,320
And I've spent.
I've spent.

470
00:19:39,320 --> 00:19:42,160
So you know what it's like.
I spent a lot of my career just

471
00:19:42,160 --> 00:19:47,720
trying to convince people that
it's not rude or bad to be in a

472
00:19:47,720 --> 00:19:49,120
discussion and question
something.

473
00:19:49,120 --> 00:19:52,720
Yeah, because you are a
qualified professional doing a

474
00:19:52,720 --> 00:19:54,400
job.
You're not a child in a

475
00:19:54,400 --> 00:19:56,720
classroom.
And too often people go, well,

476
00:19:56,720 --> 00:19:58,320
if it's good enough for the
kids, good enough for me, and a

477
00:19:58,320 --> 00:20:00,200
lot of different scenarios,
right.

478
00:20:00,400 --> 00:20:02,000
It's like, well, why should the
kids be picked up in their

479
00:20:02,000 --> 00:20:03,800
uniform if a teacher's not going
to wear a full suit?

480
00:20:04,040 --> 00:20:06,720
Because we're not the same, you
idiot.

481
00:20:07,400 --> 00:20:09,280
It's not equivalent.
There's not.

482
00:20:09,280 --> 00:20:12,480
It's not an equal game here.
They're a child in a class and

483
00:20:12,480 --> 00:20:14,480
I'm a teacher teaching them.
It's not equal.

484
00:20:14,480 --> 00:20:17,160
Yeah, they're not so.
There's differences and you just

485
00:20:17,160 --> 00:20:20,400
have to like it's it's just not
the same relationship when it

486
00:20:20,400 --> 00:20:22,000
comes to now you as professional
on your boss.

487
00:20:22,200 --> 00:20:23,960
Are there some things your boss
can tell you to do?

488
00:20:24,000 --> 00:20:26,840
Yes, of course there are there a
boss the whole system would

489
00:20:26,840 --> 00:20:28,840
collapse and you couldn't have
someone making decisions.

490
00:20:30,200 --> 00:20:33,360
But equally, when it's part of
your contract being asked to do

491
00:20:33,360 --> 00:20:35,880
extra you, you have to just say
no.

492
00:20:36,040 --> 00:20:37,520
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
The amount of times said

493
00:20:37,520 --> 00:20:39,800
something, we don't have to do
this and they're like, oh, but

494
00:20:40,240 --> 00:20:42,480
who will do it otherwise?
No one.

495
00:20:42,600 --> 00:20:44,960
Yeah, yeah, no one.
This isn't a we don't have to

496
00:20:44,960 --> 00:20:47,440
have someone do this.
You've made-up a situation where

497
00:20:47,440 --> 00:20:49,760
one of us has to do it because
you feel bad and.

498
00:20:49,760 --> 00:20:51,080
It always happens to be me,
yeah.

499
00:20:52,120 --> 00:20:54,480
Because I won't be doing it.
And a big part of thing why I

500
00:20:54,480 --> 00:20:57,560
tried to convince lots of people
to say no is because I didn't

501
00:20:57,560 --> 00:20:59,680
want to end up feeling like the
guilty one because I always said

502
00:20:59,680 --> 00:21:01,600
no to stuff.
And then your team would end up

503
00:21:01,600 --> 00:21:03,360
having to do the stuff because
they didn't want to say no.

504
00:21:03,360 --> 00:21:06,320
This literally happened by the
way, to me where we had policies

505
00:21:06,320 --> 00:21:09,600
of having to do hallway
displays, right?

506
00:21:09,920 --> 00:21:12,000
And it was, and then at the
start of the year, they just

507
00:21:12,000 --> 00:21:14,880
made this rota of who was in
charge of the hallway display at

508
00:21:14,880 --> 00:21:17,400
certain points of the year.
And I, and I just said I was

509
00:21:17,400 --> 00:21:20,080
like, guys, I'm sorry, but I'm
not doing this.

510
00:21:21,120 --> 00:21:23,000
It's just, it's literally, it's
not, it's extra.

511
00:21:23,000 --> 00:21:25,640
It's not part of my job.
I'm not, I'm not good at them

512
00:21:25,640 --> 00:21:26,880
anyway.
Not that that matters.

513
00:21:27,320 --> 00:21:29,320
I don't want to do it.
I've got enough on my plate.

514
00:21:29,320 --> 00:21:32,920
I'm not doing that.
And then, and my point was,

515
00:21:33,000 --> 00:21:36,440
let's just go to management and
say as a year group, we'll put

516
00:21:36,440 --> 00:21:38,320
up a couple of displays, but
I'll just stay there for the

517
00:21:38,320 --> 00:21:39,680
whole year.
And we're not going to be

518
00:21:39,680 --> 00:21:41,440
putting them up and down because
it is just extra.

519
00:21:42,160 --> 00:21:45,240
And it was like, oh, yeah, OK.
A week later it turns out all

520
00:21:45,240 --> 00:21:47,840
they did was just redo the rotor
so it included everyone instead

521
00:21:47,840 --> 00:21:50,040
of me, so they just put me off
the rota.

522
00:21:50,160 --> 00:21:51,680
I end up looking like a.
Result.

523
00:21:51,680 --> 00:21:53,560
Yeah, I know It's great.
It's well, I don't want to do

524
00:21:53,760 --> 00:21:54,160
it.
I'm joking.

525
00:21:54,160 --> 00:21:56,080
No, but but well, it is a result
for me.

526
00:21:56,280 --> 00:21:58,320
Yeah.
But the the point I was trying

527
00:21:58,320 --> 00:22:01,920
to make was it is just another
lot of stuff you have to think

528
00:22:01,920 --> 00:22:04,320
about that is genuinely not part
of your job.

529
00:22:04,320 --> 00:22:07,200
And literally if you look at the
appendix of jobs teachers are

530
00:22:07,200 --> 00:22:09,640
expected to do or not, it says
you should not be doing this,

531
00:22:09,640 --> 00:22:12,200
right.
So you can not even being rude,

532
00:22:12,200 --> 00:22:14,240
just say, hey, guys, sorry,
don't know if you noticed this,

533
00:22:14,240 --> 00:22:15,760
but I don't have to do that.
So I'm not going to do it.

534
00:22:16,200 --> 00:22:19,120
And just the fact that it ended
up just being, they both took on

535
00:22:19,280 --> 00:22:21,200
one of my slots each.
They could do the rotor between

536
00:22:21,200 --> 00:22:23,160
themselves.
I was like, now you're doing

537
00:22:23,160 --> 00:22:24,320
more work.
Yeah, yeah.

538
00:22:24,320 --> 00:22:25,560
That's not.
That's not what I want.

539
00:22:25,560 --> 00:22:27,560
I'm talking behind your back now
saying yeah, I'm doing more work

540
00:22:27,560 --> 00:22:29,080
because he didn't want a bloody
do it, didn't he?

541
00:22:29,080 --> 00:22:30,800
Lazy teacher.
Yeah, lazy lefty.

542
00:22:30,800 --> 00:22:32,680
Just beta teacher.
I'm like, honestly, I'm like,

543
00:22:32,680 --> 00:22:35,120
OK, at some point I have to
just, like, wash my hands and be

544
00:22:35,120 --> 00:22:38,200
like, if you want to do a fight,
clearly you want to do it.

545
00:22:38,640 --> 00:22:40,760
Yeah, clearly you value doing
that more than just, you know,

546
00:22:40,760 --> 00:22:42,680
speaking up for your own working
rights.

547
00:22:43,000 --> 00:22:46,000
And by the way, these are the
same people who would say to me

548
00:22:46,000 --> 00:22:47,400
it's it's ridiculous that we've
got to do.

549
00:22:47,600 --> 00:22:48,120
It.
Yeah, yeah.

550
00:22:48,200 --> 00:22:49,080
Yeah.
And I'm like, OK, well, should

551
00:22:49,080 --> 00:22:50,080
we not then?
Oh no.

552
00:22:50,240 --> 00:22:51,720
No.
What does the teacher tell?

553
00:22:51,720 --> 00:22:53,400
I mean, I mean, Boss told me to,
yeah.

554
00:22:53,800 --> 00:22:57,960
Honestly, it's like, OK, so if
we just want to moan and not do

555
00:22:57,960 --> 00:23:00,000
anything about it, I'm not
interested in that conversation.

556
00:23:00,360 --> 00:23:02,200
Yeah, goodbye.
Enjoy doing this display go.

557
00:23:02,240 --> 00:23:04,880
Home.
Yeah, honestly, honestly, I

558
00:23:04,960 --> 00:23:07,160
leave, right.
I remember a couple of times I

559
00:23:07,160 --> 00:23:09,520
left and they were doing the
display in the hallway.

560
00:23:10,600 --> 00:23:13,440
I don't want to do that.
If you listen to this podcast

561
00:23:13,440 --> 00:23:15,720
with nearly 200 episodes right
now, I hope you do understand.

562
00:23:15,720 --> 00:23:18,000
I really do genuinely care about
people, and I wouldn't be doing

563
00:23:18,000 --> 00:23:19,920
this otherwise and giving this
advice out to people.

564
00:23:20,320 --> 00:23:22,680
But there's only so much I can
do, and that kind of translates

565
00:23:22,680 --> 00:23:24,320
to that as well.
It translates both ways.

566
00:23:24,520 --> 00:23:26,800
There's only so much I can do
and say repeatedly to people.

567
00:23:26,800 --> 00:23:27,800
You don't have to do this, by
the way.

568
00:23:27,800 --> 00:23:31,160
You need to decide to not do it.
If they then decide not, I can't

569
00:23:31,160 --> 00:23:34,240
control that.
I'm sorry, but I'm not going to

570
00:23:34,240 --> 00:23:36,800
feel guilty for your choice to
go and do that because there was

571
00:23:36,800 --> 00:23:40,240
a situation here when none of us
had to do it and you've chosen

572
00:23:40,240 --> 00:23:41,960
to not do that.
It's like, OK, you want OK,

573
00:23:41,960 --> 00:23:43,200
cool.
I didn't do it.

574
00:23:43,200 --> 00:23:45,120
Did I get in trouble?
No, because it was fine what I

575
00:23:45,120 --> 00:23:46,040
did.
What if you're wrong?

576
00:23:46,360 --> 00:23:47,640
What do you mean?
What do you mean what?

577
00:23:47,640 --> 00:23:49,520
If you're wrong about the
assumption that there was a

578
00:23:49,520 --> 00:23:51,600
situation way done if you had to
do it because it never got that

579
00:23:51,600 --> 00:23:54,160
far, no.
But what I never exactly, I

580
00:23:54,160 --> 00:23:57,120
never found out.
And also and also I'm not wrong.

581
00:23:57,320 --> 00:23:59,800
Like it's it's literally
enshrined in the contract that

582
00:23:59,800 --> 00:24:01,200
we don't have to do it.
Yeah.

583
00:24:01,280 --> 00:24:04,160
So what do you mean by wrong?
What if the SLT turn around and

584
00:24:04,160 --> 00:24:05,640
they were just they don't care
about like they're not, they're

585
00:24:05,640 --> 00:24:06,800
not being correct with the
contract.

586
00:24:06,800 --> 00:24:07,840
They say sorry guys, you just
got to do.

587
00:24:07,840 --> 00:24:10,240
It and the burden is on them and
then.

588
00:24:10,240 --> 00:24:11,560
Your team still goes, oh, we
don't want them.

589
00:24:11,560 --> 00:24:12,480
We don't.
We don't upset anyone.

590
00:24:12,480 --> 00:24:13,560
We're just going.
To do it, we know.

591
00:24:13,560 --> 00:24:15,200
We know it's wrong.
It's still on them.

592
00:24:15,320 --> 00:24:17,280
It's still on them because
they're still accepting

593
00:24:17,280 --> 00:24:19,120
something.
It's not wrong.

594
00:24:19,760 --> 00:24:22,760
Yeah, they're accepting then,
taking on something they don't

595
00:24:22,760 --> 00:24:25,880
have to do, and that's on them.
So someone had the opinion of

596
00:24:25,880 --> 00:24:29,880
you, which was, Oh yeah, Dylan
just doesn't do certain.

597
00:24:29,880 --> 00:24:32,000
Things they did.
Or no, no, no, I'm trying.

598
00:24:32,000 --> 00:24:33,320
I'm really trying to play
devil's advocate here.

599
00:24:33,320 --> 00:24:33,640
Right?
Yeah.

600
00:24:34,040 --> 00:24:36,920
Someone turns around and says in
that situation, they see you

601
00:24:36,920 --> 00:24:38,960
walking home and.
And they're doing, the other

602
00:24:38,960 --> 00:24:39,960
guys are doing the display.
Yeah.

603
00:24:40,240 --> 00:24:42,640
And someone says, Oh yeah,
Dylan, Dylan has a really good

604
00:24:42,640 --> 00:24:45,920
point to say about XY and Z
about not doing displays because

605
00:24:45,920 --> 00:24:47,600
on the contract.
But ultimately it has just left

606
00:24:47,600 --> 00:24:48,360
it.
Now other people are just

607
00:24:48,360 --> 00:24:50,120
picking up his slack.
Yeah, but they don't have to do

608
00:24:50,120 --> 00:24:51,320
it is.
That what you say?

609
00:24:51,480 --> 00:24:53,200
Yes, I'd be like.
You don't have to do it though.

610
00:24:54,680 --> 00:24:55,960
That that's the end.
Like what?

611
00:24:56,120 --> 00:24:58,760
You don't do it.
Yeah, yeah, What more can I say?

612
00:24:59,480 --> 00:25:01,760
Like, oh, what if, what if they
did have to do it?

613
00:25:01,760 --> 00:25:03,760
They don't.
They don't.

614
00:25:03,840 --> 00:25:05,600
They don't.
Oh, what if the the pick flying

615
00:25:05,600 --> 00:25:07,840
through the sky was pink?
It's not pigs can't apply.

616
00:25:09,200 --> 00:25:11,000
It's like, it's such a such a
ridiculous.

617
00:25:11,000 --> 00:25:13,760
What if you don't have to do it?
You've convinced yourself you've

618
00:25:13,760 --> 00:25:15,760
got to do it.
And if someone tells you

619
00:25:15,760 --> 00:25:17,360
incorrectly, you've got to do
something which you don't have

620
00:25:17,360 --> 00:25:19,520
to do and you believe it.
That's not a me problem.

621
00:25:20,360 --> 00:25:24,440
We could just put something like
to display the display in the

622
00:25:24,440 --> 00:25:27,600
hallway.
About the water cycle, is it

623
00:25:27,600 --> 00:25:29,840
important that changes every six
weeks to be now?

624
00:25:29,840 --> 00:25:33,560
About the creation story, no one
cares.

625
00:25:33,880 --> 00:25:35,560
Some people do.
Some people and if they.

626
00:25:35,560 --> 00:25:36,600
Care.
They can do it, yeah.

627
00:25:36,800 --> 00:25:38,280
What about it's the kids that
care?

628
00:25:38,520 --> 00:25:40,920
Kids.
Can do it then crack on.

629
00:25:41,520 --> 00:25:42,880
You won't do it mate.
I'm not doing it.

630
00:25:43,520 --> 00:25:45,320
Yeah, it is.
I'll try.

631
00:25:45,320 --> 00:25:46,560
I can't find any more on you
here.

632
00:25:46,760 --> 00:25:50,760
You've defended yourself well.
I always felt like such a simple

633
00:25:50,760 --> 00:25:52,280
solution of.
Not do it at all.

634
00:25:52,280 --> 00:25:54,040
Yeah, not do it at all.
Or if it's really that

635
00:25:54,040 --> 00:25:55,960
important, right, either the
person that thinks it's really

636
00:25:55,960 --> 00:25:58,880
that important does it from SLT
in some of their non contact

637
00:25:58,880 --> 00:25:59,840
time.
And I'm not suggesting they're

638
00:25:59,840 --> 00:26:01,120
not busy as well, but you could
be.

639
00:26:01,520 --> 00:26:03,560
All busy, so why is it on me not
Yeah.

640
00:26:03,560 --> 00:26:07,120
We're all busy, so if you think
it's, if anything, I'll sort my

641
00:26:07,120 --> 00:26:09,040
classroom out.
That's the bit I carry you.

642
00:26:09,040 --> 00:26:11,320
You're you have the whole school
as senior leadership.

643
00:26:11,320 --> 00:26:13,960
It has actually probably more
your thing than my thing because

644
00:26:13,960 --> 00:26:16,160
I don't teach in the corridor.
You walk up and down that more

645
00:26:16,160 --> 00:26:17,320
than I do so.
You crack on that.

646
00:26:17,800 --> 00:26:21,120
And or or the better solution to
me is just like just the school

647
00:26:21,120 --> 00:26:24,440
just has some sort of school
wide system of getting displays

648
00:26:24,440 --> 00:26:27,000
done that doesn't revolve on
just potluck of whether the

649
00:26:27,000 --> 00:26:29,120
teachers will do it or not.
Genuinely why can't schools?

650
00:26:29,120 --> 00:26:31,000
Some schools have if they're
lucky enough big enough have

651
00:26:31,000 --> 00:26:32,720
like a a resource person will do
it.

652
00:26:32,720 --> 00:26:35,520
But a lot of schools will just
have at least one TA in the

653
00:26:35,520 --> 00:26:39,560
whole school who can could be
released from another job to do

654
00:26:39,560 --> 00:26:43,200
that if they're that important.
Get someone to do it that that's

655
00:26:43,240 --> 00:26:44,480
not just going to be a teacher.
Oh.

656
00:26:44,480 --> 00:26:46,240
No, no, no, they can't do that
because they have to be with the

657
00:26:46,240 --> 00:26:47,640
kids at all times.
Because they're not important.

658
00:26:47,840 --> 00:26:48,920
Exactly.
It's not that important.

659
00:26:48,920 --> 00:26:51,120
It's not that important then.
If it's not that important, then

660
00:26:51,200 --> 00:26:52,640
yeah, yeah.
Wait, sorry.

661
00:26:52,680 --> 00:26:56,800
So what you're saying is it's,
it's a teaching assistant can't

662
00:26:56,800 --> 00:26:59,880
possibly be released from a
classroom from their support to

663
00:26:59,880 --> 00:27:03,040
do a display because it's it's
not that important, but it's so

664
00:27:03,040 --> 00:27:05,600
important that a teacher in
their own time has to do it.

665
00:27:05,800 --> 00:27:07,280
Yeah, Yeah.
Sorry, they're not close.

666
00:27:07,280 --> 00:27:09,480
That's not on the same level.
That's not on the same higher.

667
00:27:09,480 --> 00:27:11,440
And if you're saying it's not in
their own time, you're saying

668
00:27:11,440 --> 00:27:15,200
another job of a teacher doing
the display is more important

669
00:27:15,200 --> 00:27:16,240
than that other part of that
role.

670
00:27:16,240 --> 00:27:18,440
So it's like, OK, so they don't
plan something or they mark

671
00:27:18,440 --> 00:27:20,840
something.
It's like, so it's not, there's

672
00:27:20,840 --> 00:27:23,960
nothing in a teaching
assistant's role that is like

673
00:27:23,960 --> 00:27:26,960
less important, but in a
teacher's role, you can find

674
00:27:26,960 --> 00:27:29,040
something that a display can
override it.

675
00:27:29,040 --> 00:27:31,000
It doesn't make sense to see.
That's what it boils down to.

676
00:27:31,000 --> 00:27:32,280
Ultimately, people are just
chanting their arm.

677
00:27:32,280 --> 00:27:34,040
Of course, they just want people
to do it in their own spare time

678
00:27:34,040 --> 00:27:35,320
and they don't want to do it
themselves.

679
00:27:36,760 --> 00:27:39,600
Exactly, and that's why you just
have to say no else.

680
00:27:39,600 --> 00:27:42,440
That continues to happen.
This is the theme of the podcast

681
00:27:42,440 --> 00:27:44,680
in the last few weeks.
I feel like you have to actually

682
00:27:44,680 --> 00:27:46,280
take action if you want
something to change.

683
00:27:46,280 --> 00:27:49,440
Sure, that's what I'm saying.
Say no, go on, let's complete

684
00:27:49,440 --> 00:27:51,200
the trilogy.
The Empire Strikes Back.

685
00:27:51,200 --> 00:27:53,880
Here we go, The Last Jedi say
Return of the Hope.

686
00:27:54,400 --> 00:27:56,880
Return of the hope.
Shrek the Third.

687
00:27:57,120 --> 00:27:59,120
Shrek, the third hope of the
returning of the.

688
00:27:59,360 --> 00:28:00,880
What is the?
Story 3.

689
00:28:01,480 --> 00:28:03,040
This time, the toys don't come
home.

690
00:28:03,400 --> 00:28:06,160
No, this time the toys say what
is the most ridiculous thing

691
00:28:06,160 --> 00:28:08,960
teachers are expected to do, but
we've all somehow just accepted

692
00:28:09,000 --> 00:28:11,400
as.
Normal displays, displays,

693
00:28:11,440 --> 00:28:12,800
displays.
I knew you're gonna say.

694
00:28:12,840 --> 00:28:14,200
That I knew you're gonna say
that.

695
00:28:14,200 --> 00:28:15,960
I'm trying to think of something
that's different now.

696
00:28:16,760 --> 00:28:18,320
OK, OK, let me let me be really
clear.

697
00:28:18,480 --> 00:28:21,520
Yeah, the most ridiculous thing
that teacher expected to do that

698
00:28:21,520 --> 00:28:26,680
we're all just how accepted as
normal is displays that are just

699
00:28:26,680 --> 00:28:29,240
on just looks.
What's the word I'm looking for?

700
00:28:29,520 --> 00:28:32,680
Not the decorative aesthetics.
Yeah, aesthetic displays.

701
00:28:32,880 --> 00:28:35,400
OK, the ridiculous you're.
Getting into, you're getting

702
00:28:35,400 --> 00:28:36,520
into the.
Ridiculous of displays.

703
00:28:36,520 --> 00:28:38,760
Let me tell you a story and
you'll know this.

704
00:28:39,000 --> 00:28:43,640
In my initial school, it became
a policy which we all had to do,

705
00:28:44,000 --> 00:28:46,600
was that our door had to be a
book cover.

706
00:28:48,040 --> 00:28:51,520
Everyone, everyone.
We've all got to do a book cover

707
00:28:51,520 --> 00:28:55,480
on our door.
What are you on about, you

708
00:28:56,080 --> 00:28:59,520
idiots?
What do you mean my door has to

709
00:28:59,520 --> 00:29:02,080
be a book cover?
Are you stupid?

710
00:29:02,280 --> 00:29:05,600
It's a door.
It's a door.

711
00:29:05,800 --> 00:29:08,360
Open the door.
But it's inviting.

712
00:29:08,360 --> 00:29:10,200
It looks nice, just like a
reading corner.

713
00:29:10,360 --> 00:29:12,320
It's a door.
It looks better when it's got a

714
00:29:12,320 --> 00:29:16,240
book on it surely does it looks.
Tatty after a week because it's

715
00:29:16,240 --> 00:29:20,960
a door that people push, pull
and open and squeeze, and it's a

716
00:29:20,960 --> 00:29:22,360
door.
And it's got a massive window in

717
00:29:22,360 --> 00:29:24,600
the middle of it.
Yeah, it was covered now or can

718
00:29:24,600 --> 00:29:26,920
you keep your door open please
so we can see in or casted door

719
00:29:26,920 --> 00:29:30,400
handle now.
Oh my God, insane.

720
00:29:30,400 --> 00:29:33,560
That was that was the ultimate,
ultimate, ultimate version for

721
00:29:33,560 --> 00:29:37,120
me, which was just like, OK,
yeah, that's ridiculous.

722
00:29:37,480 --> 00:29:39,240
And everyone's just like, Oh
yeah, yeah, yeah, I'm really

723
00:29:39,240 --> 00:29:40,440
artistic.
Good for you.

724
00:29:41,040 --> 00:29:42,520
That's great for you.
Nice.

725
00:29:42,520 --> 00:29:43,040
Well done.
I'm.

726
00:29:43,520 --> 00:29:45,440
I'm glad you enjoyed that on
your Saturday morning.

727
00:29:45,440 --> 00:29:47,360
I didn't.
I didn't enjoy doing.

728
00:29:47,360 --> 00:29:51,080
That I'd make my door a book
cover yeah I'm not even if

729
00:29:51,080 --> 00:29:54,280
someone wanted to do that then
crack on mate yeah but like a a

730
00:29:54,280 --> 00:29:57,400
school wide like you've got to
do this sorry when make.

731
00:29:57,520 --> 00:29:59,040
Up yourself if someone came to
you a.

732
00:29:59,320 --> 00:30:02,280
Door.
Sorry, but how big is a door?

733
00:30:02,680 --> 00:30:04,800
If someone came to you right,
like SOT and I said, look, this

734
00:30:04,800 --> 00:30:06,760
is what we we're gonna do.
We're gonna do a nice.

735
00:30:06,760 --> 00:30:08,040
But we're on each door, I'd be
saying.

736
00:30:08,120 --> 00:30:08,840
Score.
That's fine.

737
00:30:09,200 --> 00:30:10,320
I'm in a good at.
Should we place cup?

738
00:30:10,360 --> 00:30:11,920
Should we?
Should we do a role play?

739
00:30:11,920 --> 00:30:14,000
We can because I'm being a good.
At Go on, go on, go and come to.

740
00:30:14,040 --> 00:30:17,080
Me we we want to do book covers
on all the.

741
00:30:17,080 --> 00:30:18,520
Sorry, one second.
Let me just finish marketing.

742
00:30:19,320 --> 00:30:20,480
So much marketing today.
Go.

743
00:30:20,600 --> 00:30:21,920
On yeah, sorry for taking your
time.

744
00:30:22,240 --> 00:30:23,560
I appreciate your time is
important.

745
00:30:23,600 --> 00:30:25,080
So you're a good SLT.
Apparently I am.

746
00:30:25,080 --> 00:30:26,880
So what I've done is I've made a
list.

747
00:30:26,880 --> 00:30:27,960
I've got I'm gonna get all these
prepared.

748
00:30:27,960 --> 00:30:29,040
I've got 24 doors.
Yeah.

749
00:30:29,040 --> 00:30:30,800
And I've got 24 book covers.
Yeah.

750
00:30:30,880 --> 00:30:32,000
I just want you to pick the one
you want.

751
00:30:32,000 --> 00:30:33,000
It's just first come, first
serve.

752
00:30:33,000 --> 00:30:35,240
So here's a list.
OK, which one do you want?

753
00:30:35,240 --> 00:30:36,320
To have a look at David
Williams, please.

754
00:30:36,320 --> 00:30:37,160
Yeah.
OK, you want.

755
00:30:37,680 --> 00:30:39,320
David Williams, all David
Williams.

756
00:30:39,320 --> 00:30:41,360
Yeah, set that nice example.
Which David Williams you want on

757
00:30:41,360 --> 00:30:41,760
that one?
Cool.

758
00:30:41,760 --> 00:30:44,520
What we're gonna do is sarcasm.
Sarcasm, sarcasm.

759
00:30:44,520 --> 00:30:45,720
Alert.
What we're gonna do is get

760
00:30:45,720 --> 00:30:47,760
someone to whip that up.
Yep, one of the TA is gonna come

761
00:30:47,760 --> 00:30:49,480
out next week and then we'll
just give you the pack and then

762
00:30:49,480 --> 00:30:50,920
you just need to blue tack up on
your up on your door.

763
00:30:50,920 --> 00:30:53,240
Is that right?
Yeah, well, I've got to put it

764
00:30:53,240 --> 00:30:54,120
up.
Yeah, if that's all right.

765
00:30:54,120 --> 00:30:55,280
That's fine.
What I'm teaching, What I'll do

766
00:30:55,280 --> 00:30:57,240
is I get one of my teaching
assistants just spend 10 minutes

767
00:30:57,240 --> 00:30:57,800
there.
No problem.

768
00:30:57,960 --> 00:30:58,720
Brilliant.
That's fine.

769
00:30:58,880 --> 00:30:59,400
OK.
Nice one.

770
00:30:59,400 --> 00:31:00,440
I'm a good SL teacher, thank
you.

771
00:31:00,440 --> 00:31:02,160
No problem.
So in that situation, would you

772
00:31:02,160 --> 00:31:03,760
have an actual issue?
Hell no.

773
00:31:03,760 --> 00:31:04,600
Yeah, of course not, right.
Yeah.

774
00:31:04,600 --> 00:31:06,360
So it's not.
So I just want the whole point

775
00:31:06,360 --> 00:31:08,400
of that is to be really clear.
You're not just some Scrooge who

776
00:31:08,400 --> 00:31:10,480
hates things that might look
nicer than other things for

777
00:31:10,480 --> 00:31:11,760
children.
No better reading corner.

778
00:31:11,760 --> 00:31:13,400
I'm not doing a reading corner.
No, no, no, no.

779
00:31:13,400 --> 00:31:15,600
It's just the fact that
sometimes if it is purely

780
00:31:15,600 --> 00:31:18,280
aesthetic and the door, the door
being a book is a bit more

781
00:31:18,280 --> 00:31:19,760
aesthetic, I think, than a
reading corner.

782
00:31:19,760 --> 00:31:23,960
Just to be really clear, I'm
exaggerating being silly, but

783
00:31:23,960 --> 00:31:27,440
yeah, if it's just someone else
has decided that you now have to

784
00:31:27,440 --> 00:31:29,840
take on this additional workload
for this very minor aesthetic

785
00:31:29,840 --> 00:31:31,880
thing that most schools don't
do, so really, we can appreciate

786
00:31:31,880 --> 00:31:33,280
this really is an optional
extra.

787
00:31:33,680 --> 00:31:35,040
It's just taking the piss
really, isn't it?

788
00:31:35,040 --> 00:31:37,280
Yeah, completely, completely.
And do you know what I've had

789
00:31:37,280 --> 00:31:40,320
previously?
Genuinely, some schools where

790
00:31:40,320 --> 00:31:42,960
they would say, they've said a
couple of times this week's

791
00:31:42,960 --> 00:31:45,840
staff meeting is not happening.
You've got an hour, can you

792
00:31:45,840 --> 00:31:47,080
please just rearrange your book?
Corner?

793
00:31:47,080 --> 00:31:48,640
Fine.
Or something like that. 10 out

794
00:31:48,640 --> 00:31:50,640
of 10.
I'll do it till the cows come

795
00:31:50,640 --> 00:31:52,400
home.
By the cows, Cows come home.

796
00:31:52,400 --> 00:31:53,640
I mean that one hour period.
Yeah.

797
00:31:53,640 --> 00:31:55,480
Because it's my directed time.
Absolutely.

798
00:31:55,480 --> 00:31:57,640
And I would have otherwise been
in a meeting, maybe doing

799
00:31:57,640 --> 00:31:58,800
something else.
I'm not in it.

800
00:31:58,800 --> 00:32:01,280
I do my job.
Yeah, I will do my job.

801
00:32:01,280 --> 00:32:03,360
And if it's within my
parameters, I'll do whatever.

802
00:32:03,880 --> 00:32:05,880
If someone says, oh, we've
booked cover for you.

803
00:32:05,880 --> 00:32:07,880
Well, I'd rather be teaching
English, to be honest with you.

804
00:32:07,880 --> 00:32:10,760
But you put cover for this half
an hour in that half an hour,

805
00:32:10,760 --> 00:32:12,480
all I need you to do is go and
pick up your pack and put up

806
00:32:12,480 --> 00:32:14,840
this display.
I wouldn't even bat an eyelid.

807
00:32:14,840 --> 00:32:18,320
And the context here is that
this is always in free time.

808
00:32:18,320 --> 00:32:21,320
That's just expected.
And it and it is not having

809
00:32:21,320 --> 00:32:24,120
enough of an impact on the
children in my class for me to

810
00:32:24,120 --> 00:32:25,920
justify my own free time doing
it.

811
00:32:26,160 --> 00:32:29,160
I already do that when it comes
to planning or marking or doing

812
00:32:29,160 --> 00:32:31,240
things that I think have a
genuine impact on the children.

813
00:32:31,440 --> 00:32:33,480
And that's as part of my
contract going above additional.

814
00:32:33,880 --> 00:32:36,840
I'm not going to do anything in
that additional time, which is

815
00:32:36,840 --> 00:32:39,280
superfluous to me.
A complete waste of time.

816
00:32:39,280 --> 00:32:41,800
I'm not even very good at it,
and it has no impact on the kids

817
00:32:41,800 --> 00:32:43,800
whatsoever.
The answer is no.

818
00:32:43,800 --> 00:32:46,000
And you can't direct me to do
that because guess what?

819
00:32:46,120 --> 00:32:48,080
That's literally what directed
time means.

820
00:32:48,240 --> 00:32:51,160
You cannot direct me to do
something outside of it that I

821
00:32:51,160 --> 00:32:53,400
don't think necessary to fulfil
the professional duties of my

822
00:32:53,400 --> 00:32:55,840
job.
And newsflash, everyone making

823
00:32:55,840 --> 00:32:59,640
my door look like the BFG is not
something I think is necessary

824
00:32:59,640 --> 00:33:01,240
for me to fulfil the
professional duties of a

825
00:33:01,240 --> 00:33:02,760
teacher.
Amen to that, brother.

826
00:33:03,080 --> 00:33:04,800
Amen.
I think I've got two things

827
00:33:04,800 --> 00:33:06,600
about this.
One meta level, even more meta.

828
00:33:06,600 --> 00:33:07,680
I'm trying to go bigger than
this, right?

829
00:33:07,680 --> 00:33:10,120
And one little thing that I've
heard of that I think is

830
00:33:10,160 --> 00:33:11,600
ridiculous for teachers to be
expected to do.

831
00:33:11,600 --> 00:33:13,160
Can you try and make it 3 so
it's another trilogy?

832
00:33:13,760 --> 00:33:15,480
No, you've done the first one,
so it isn't trilogy.

833
00:33:15,480 --> 00:33:16,440
I've got the second.
I've got the second.

834
00:33:16,440 --> 00:33:18,640
And the third it's fine change
director halfway through the

835
00:33:18,640 --> 00:33:19,960
vibe changed, but let's see if
it.

836
00:33:19,960 --> 00:33:22,080
Conditions, yeah.
So the big one for me is

837
00:33:22,080 --> 00:33:23,040
basically what you just said
there.

838
00:33:23,040 --> 00:33:25,600
You brought out another one,
which is the most ridiculous

839
00:33:25,600 --> 00:33:27,560
thing teachers are expected to
do that we've all just somehow

840
00:33:27,560 --> 00:33:30,040
accepted.
Accepted as normal is doing 15

841
00:33:30,040 --> 00:33:33,000
hours of work extra a week on
top of directed time because the

842
00:33:33,000 --> 00:33:35,720
contract says reasonable
additional hours and gaslighting

843
00:33:35,720 --> 00:33:37,080
ourselves into thinking that's
reasonable.

844
00:33:37,280 --> 00:33:39,240
No, it's not.
It's ridiculous and it is

845
00:33:39,240 --> 00:33:41,160
normal.
It is very, very, very normal

846
00:33:41,160 --> 00:33:43,760
for teachers to work absurd
amounts of hours outside of

847
00:33:43,760 --> 00:33:45,800
directed hours and everyone just
goes, that's just what you do.

848
00:33:45,800 --> 00:33:46,920
It's vocation you do for the
kids.

849
00:33:47,000 --> 00:33:48,600
Shut up.
No, it's not.

850
00:33:49,560 --> 00:33:50,680
No, it's not.
It's a job.

851
00:33:51,000 --> 00:33:53,400
It's AI, don't care how you
dress it up.

852
00:33:53,400 --> 00:33:55,720
You can love your job.
It's a job though.

853
00:33:55,720 --> 00:33:59,600
It's a job and making this bar,
it all comes back around.

854
00:33:59,600 --> 00:34:02,160
The reason teachers are burning
out is because there's too much

855
00:34:02,160 --> 00:34:04,840
work to do, because we've all
accepted it's normal.

856
00:34:04,920 --> 00:34:06,480
That's why so many teachers burn
out and quit.

857
00:34:06,480 --> 00:34:08,600
That's why we have some crazy
stats of people quitting.

858
00:34:08,920 --> 00:34:11,080
So that's my big one.
That was a good Are they going

859
00:34:11,080 --> 00:34:13,280
to ruin it with the trilogy?
Because sometimes they do the

860
00:34:13,280 --> 00:34:15,679
third one and it doesn't.
Live up, I think it might do a.

861
00:34:16,239 --> 00:34:19,320
Good tick, it might do this.
One is just like a little normal

862
00:34:19,320 --> 00:34:20,679
thing.
This is something that just

863
00:34:20,679 --> 00:34:22,360
annoys me.
Teachers have been expected to

864
00:34:22,360 --> 00:34:26,000
do lunch juices that to me, I'm
like, that's mental.

865
00:34:26,000 --> 00:34:27,960
We've never done it.
But I know loads of teachers,

866
00:34:27,960 --> 00:34:29,920
including people that close to
me where they're like, Oh yeah,

867
00:34:30,280 --> 00:34:33,080
got 2 lunch duties a week and
they don't get they don't get a

868
00:34:33,080 --> 00:34:34,679
break, they don't get a lunch
break.

869
00:34:34,760 --> 00:34:35,719
Yeah, don't know.
You don't.

870
00:34:36,800 --> 00:34:38,480
I'm sorry.
And I'm not diminishing any

871
00:34:38,480 --> 00:34:41,000
other role in a school, but I am
just picking up the fact that my

872
00:34:41,000 --> 00:34:43,920
role is already as a teacher,
unbelievably fulfilled.

873
00:34:43,920 --> 00:34:47,080
And I have so much stuff to do.
I don't have time to go and

874
00:34:47,080 --> 00:34:49,520
stand outside for an hour during
lunch.

875
00:34:49,520 --> 00:34:52,679
Not getting my own break when I
could, if I really wanted to

876
00:34:52,679 --> 00:34:54,960
sacrifice my own lunch.
I've got a million other jobs to

877
00:34:54,960 --> 00:34:56,520
do that are gonna keep me his or
6.

878
00:34:56,520 --> 00:34:58,840
Exactly.
It's like, come on, Like how

879
00:34:58,880 --> 00:35:00,640
many?
Roles do we have to do you got

880
00:35:00,640 --> 00:35:03,200
prep for the afternoon lesson?
Yeah, Sorry, I can't.

881
00:35:03,200 --> 00:35:06,400
I'm watching 5 kids have a go of
each other over a football.

882
00:35:06,520 --> 00:35:08,280
Yeah, literally.
Like it's mental.

883
00:35:08,520 --> 00:35:13,000
Like, again, I know we're both
worried because we, we, we know

884
00:35:13,000 --> 00:35:14,840
the roles of people is so
important.

885
00:35:14,840 --> 00:35:16,840
Of course it is.
But the point I'm making here is

886
00:35:16,840 --> 00:35:18,960
that the children, I need to
prepare for them for their

887
00:35:18,960 --> 00:35:21,160
afternoon lesson.
And there just comes a point.

888
00:35:21,280 --> 00:35:24,000
Not even that by the way, just
my contract says I need to stop

889
00:35:24,000 --> 00:35:25,320
every now and then.
Literally.

890
00:35:26,120 --> 00:35:27,560
So I did go to uni to be a
teacher.

891
00:35:27,560 --> 00:35:30,280
I want to do like, I already
focused so much of my time not

892
00:35:30,280 --> 00:35:32,160
on the bit.
In fact, that's why I quit

893
00:35:32,640 --> 00:35:34,360
already.
So much of my job as a teacher

894
00:35:34,360 --> 00:35:36,840
was not doing the thing I wanted
to do, which was teach kids.

895
00:35:37,400 --> 00:35:39,320
And I like, this is just more
that to me, I'm just like, Oh my

896
00:35:39,320 --> 00:35:39,920
God.
Yeah.

897
00:35:40,120 --> 00:35:43,040
Like as if some schools are
getting their teaching staff to

898
00:35:43,040 --> 00:35:45,080
go out and do lunch duties and
stuff, break duties.

899
00:35:45,080 --> 00:35:47,720
I'm a bit like, it's a much
shorter window of time.

900
00:35:47,920 --> 00:35:50,960
And I think you can
contractually get away with not

901
00:35:50,960 --> 00:35:52,800
having that break there or?
Something I think that's, I

902
00:35:52,800 --> 00:35:54,320
think that's.
Fine, I get that break duties,

903
00:35:54,320 --> 00:35:56,080
but yeah, lunch.
I'm like, that's a long old

904
00:35:56,440 --> 00:36:00,800
unpaid hour to just give up.
But in our, I know as well for a

905
00:36:00,800 --> 00:36:04,640
fact in our most recent school,
when we did break duty, we still

906
00:36:04,640 --> 00:36:07,520
got a break because during
assembly time, that's right

907
00:36:07,640 --> 00:36:10,120
where you know, when people even
doing maybe interventions or

908
00:36:10,120 --> 00:36:12,440
assembly duty, etcetera, you'd
have your break.

909
00:36:12,880 --> 00:36:15,200
So there was never a loss of
break even even on the days you

910
00:36:15,200 --> 00:36:17,400
did your duty.
And even that's not widespread.

911
00:36:17,440 --> 00:36:18,720
It's like, oh, it's duty day
today.

912
00:36:18,880 --> 00:36:21,000
I've got no time to stop at all
for 8 hours.

913
00:36:21,000 --> 00:36:22,840
Most schools don't.
So we to be clear, we had our

914
00:36:22,840 --> 00:36:24,320
assembly right before break.
Yeah.

915
00:36:24,320 --> 00:36:26,000
So most people have assembly
like first thing in the morning,

916
00:36:26,000 --> 00:36:27,680
somebody thinking that's not
really a break, I've just

917
00:36:27,680 --> 00:36:29,200
started.
So it worked really well for us,

918
00:36:29,200 --> 00:36:31,840
but.
Yeah, anyway, decent trilogy.

919
00:36:31,840 --> 00:36:34,120
Trilogy is completed.
I think the third film was a bit

920
00:36:34,120 --> 00:36:36,080
of a cash grab, but it was all
right.

921
00:36:36,520 --> 00:36:38,040
It didn't ruin the trilogy
itself.

922
00:36:38,040 --> 00:36:39,080
Yeah, it's fine, 'cause we're
done now.

923
00:36:39,080 --> 00:36:40,960
So we take the cash and run.
Yeah, absolutely.

924
00:36:41,440 --> 00:36:44,840
And next question, School dogs
useful tools or fuzzy

925
00:36:44,840 --> 00:36:46,920
distractions?
I recently looked into getting

926
00:36:46,920 --> 00:36:52,320
my dog school certified and it
looks like it would cost ��5000.

927
00:36:52,320 --> 00:36:53,600
Oh my God.
Insane.

928
00:36:53,600 --> 00:36:55,480
Sorry, do you know what?
5 grand Do you know what my.

929
00:36:55,480 --> 00:36:58,320
First thought there is go on.
I know of some schools and

930
00:36:58,320 --> 00:37:01,880
people who've got their dog in
school and I'm just thinking

931
00:37:02,680 --> 00:37:05,000
they spent that much on that
being a thing.

932
00:37:05,400 --> 00:37:06,280
That's a lot.
It's.

933
00:37:06,280 --> 00:37:10,200
Not bad, they just fired at.
It for it literally, yeah, isn't

934
00:37:10,200 --> 00:37:11,200
that it's a.
Lot of money, yeah.

935
00:37:12,000 --> 00:37:13,840
Overall, though, like ignoring
the money, I do think they're

936
00:37:13,840 --> 00:37:15,000
really nice.
I think they're a nice idea.

937
00:37:15,000 --> 00:37:17,440
I've only ever really heard of
it being lovely.

938
00:37:17,640 --> 00:37:19,080
Yeah.
So schools, I guess the only

939
00:37:19,080 --> 00:37:21,280
thing I've taken into
consideration which is a bit

940
00:37:21,320 --> 00:37:23,160
allergies is allergies, yeah.
Bit annoying.

941
00:37:23,240 --> 00:37:24,680
Oh sorry, sorry that my allergy
is.

942
00:37:24,680 --> 00:37:27,800
Oh, it's a bit annoying.
Some kids are just a little bit

943
00:37:27,800 --> 00:37:29,640
annoying, isn't it all my
symbolism?

944
00:37:30,480 --> 00:37:32,240
You're allergic.
Sorry everyone.

945
00:37:32,240 --> 00:37:36,360
There's one child, who I won't
name, who's allergic to dogs.

946
00:37:39,160 --> 00:37:41,440
And here's the guy called Dog
Allergy Man.

947
00:37:42,440 --> 00:37:44,120
We'll put a little label on his
book bag.

948
00:37:44,200 --> 00:37:46,600
I'm that the reason we can joke
about this everyone, this thing

949
00:37:46,640 --> 00:37:49,320
who might be having a breakdown
now is because I'm I'm that

950
00:37:49,320 --> 00:37:52,400
person with nuts where on planes
I stop everyone.

951
00:37:52,400 --> 00:37:54,560
Having Oh my.
God, sorry, just a little

952
00:37:54,560 --> 00:37:56,520
announcement.
All passengers will not be

953
00:37:56,520 --> 00:37:59,680
having any nuts on today's
flight because of one person due

954
00:37:59,680 --> 00:38:03,720
to allergic to the.
C37-B If you want to know, do.

955
00:38:03,800 --> 00:38:04,800
You want to throw some nuts at
him?

956
00:38:06,120 --> 00:38:08,320
So yeah, I've got a nut allergy,
by the way, which is why we can

957
00:38:08,320 --> 00:38:10,640
joke about it, OK?
Yeah, and this is a This is a

958
00:38:10,640 --> 00:38:13,280
nut free podcast studio, so.
It is, and it's a dog free one.

959
00:38:13,280 --> 00:38:14,920
Yeah, it's a.
Dog free as well because you're

960
00:38:14,920 --> 00:38:16,560
also allergic to dogs.
Not allergic to dogs.

961
00:38:16,560 --> 00:38:18,560
I just like to defend people
hating before you go after them

962
00:38:18,560 --> 00:38:21,200
for things they can't control.
Oh yeah, I'm on the Labrador on

963
00:38:21,200 --> 00:38:22,840
my lap.
Oh, kids are allergic.

964
00:38:22,840 --> 00:38:23,840
Yeah.
We can't have the lab, Dorman.

965
00:38:24,560 --> 00:38:27,320
Look, I wouldn't, I wouldn't
really make a big thing of a

966
00:38:27,320 --> 00:38:29,040
child being allergic.
I would just be saying you need

967
00:38:29,040 --> 00:38:30,920
to look these things up first
before you go Oh yeah, we're all

968
00:38:30,920 --> 00:38:33,760
going to get a dog, excite all
the kids and then look into it.

969
00:38:33,880 --> 00:38:34,520
I.
Actually can't.

970
00:38:34,720 --> 00:38:36,800
Suddenly the child's below and
everything, Yeah.

971
00:38:38,880 --> 00:38:40,440
Just yeah, take into.
Consideration.

972
00:38:40,680 --> 00:38:44,360
But yeah, yeah.
Oh, big dip, big dip.

973
00:38:44,600 --> 00:38:47,640
Nothing to do with the allergy.
That is really horrible, Hayden.

974
00:38:47,640 --> 00:38:49,280
No.
As someone who as someone who

975
00:38:49,280 --> 00:38:51,960
personally has allergies, I
can't wait for the audience to

976
00:38:51,960 --> 00:38:54,520
cancel you.
Yeah, I think it's cancellable.

977
00:38:54,920 --> 00:38:56,520
It's cancellable.
It can be a distraction.

978
00:38:56,520 --> 00:38:58,920
I can imagine it can be a
distraction, but every single

979
00:38:58,920 --> 00:39:01,680
version of it I've seen
genuinely of in like two or

980
00:39:01,680 --> 00:39:02,960
three weeks, it's just
completely normal.

981
00:39:02,960 --> 00:39:04,000
Yeah.
It's like, oh, there's a school

982
00:39:04,000 --> 00:39:05,840
dog.
Like I've been in schools before

983
00:39:05,840 --> 00:39:08,520
walking through and like the
kids have walked past the dog.

984
00:39:08,520 --> 00:39:11,080
Like it's not there because it's
just the dog in the school.

985
00:39:11,080 --> 00:39:11,680
Oh.
Poor dog.

986
00:39:12,760 --> 00:39:16,600
Horrendous, that dog's there.
Check my directed time.

987
00:39:16,720 --> 00:39:18,160
What's my directed time at this
school?

988
00:39:18,400 --> 00:39:20,000
You can't ask me to be petted
constantly.

989
00:39:20,120 --> 00:39:23,400
I need a break.
Poor dog getting ignored.

990
00:39:23,560 --> 00:39:25,960
Oh you petted it.
Oh God, considering all the

991
00:39:25,960 --> 00:39:28,040
children is who's worse here?
Cancel Dylan.

992
00:39:28,040 --> 00:39:30,840
He thinks it's fine to walk past
animals and ignore them.

993
00:39:32,760 --> 00:39:34,640
I'm clutching the.
Straws you are really clutching.

994
00:39:35,400 --> 00:39:37,000
But yeah, overall I think, I
think they're lovely.

995
00:39:37,000 --> 00:39:39,200
If you can do it in your school,
then yeah, it's a nice, a lot of

996
00:39:39,200 --> 00:39:40,520
money thing to do A.
Lot of money.

997
00:39:40,640 --> 00:39:43,920
Good well-being right here.
Unless unless you're terrified

998
00:39:44,680 --> 00:39:49,840
except for right next question.
I taught ACF 5-6 split class for

999
00:39:49,840 --> 00:39:52,960
three years before moving to
teaching maths at secondary.

1000
00:39:53,200 --> 00:39:55,280
It has provided a much better
work life balance so I was

1001
00:39:55,280 --> 00:39:57,200
wondering if you'd ever
considered the transition?

1002
00:39:57,680 --> 00:40:00,040
Never have.
I've always thought, no, I don't

1003
00:40:00,040 --> 00:40:03,360
want to do that.
However, right now I'm the

1004
00:40:03,360 --> 00:40:05,560
closest I think I could be to
unemployed.

1005
00:40:06,200 --> 00:40:08,920
Unemployed, desperate for money.
I'm now in the position where

1006
00:40:08,920 --> 00:40:10,120
we're like, yeah, give me any
job ever.

1007
00:40:11,440 --> 00:40:13,200
No, I.
I think I would, I would, I

1008
00:40:13,200 --> 00:40:14,840
would maybe consider it a little
bit now.

1009
00:40:14,840 --> 00:40:17,000
Whereas before it was like a
flat out laugh it away.

1010
00:40:17,000 --> 00:40:20,240
I was like, no way would I ever
work in secondary school, Not

1011
00:40:20,240 --> 00:40:21,720
for me.
That's just a different ball

1012
00:40:21,720 --> 00:40:23,560
game.
Whereas now I'm a bit like, I

1013
00:40:23,560 --> 00:40:26,040
don't know, I feel like the age
gap, I was always worried that I

1014
00:40:26,040 --> 00:40:28,400
was the age gap was too close
and I wouldn't be able to like

1015
00:40:28,680 --> 00:40:31,640
have behaviour management over
15 year olds because when you

1016
00:40:31,640 --> 00:40:33,600
start primary school, even year
sixes are a bit scary.

1017
00:40:33,880 --> 00:40:35,280
Whereas now I'm obviously an old
man.

1018
00:40:35,520 --> 00:40:38,400
I'm a bit like Nah, I think.
I think I'm experienced enough

1019
00:40:38,400 --> 00:40:40,640
now.
And old enough second year you

1020
00:40:40,640 --> 00:40:41,840
shave your head off.
Or can you been all right?

1021
00:40:43,600 --> 00:40:46,720
Well, this old man's 54, but we
better listen to him.

1022
00:40:47,200 --> 00:40:47,840
Yeah.
Cheers, mate.

1023
00:40:47,840 --> 00:40:49,680
Yeah, cancel him again, shall
we?

1024
00:40:51,240 --> 00:40:53,040
But I don't know.
I'd consider it.

1025
00:40:53,040 --> 00:40:54,800
I don't think I'd want to do
that.

1026
00:40:54,800 --> 00:40:57,600
No, I'd like to try it, I think
I think I think I would like to

1027
00:40:57,600 --> 00:41:01,280
like teach a few year 8 or 9
lessons at least year 78 and 9

1028
00:41:01,520 --> 00:41:04,440
because let's be honest, if it's
in place the same, it seems

1029
00:41:04,440 --> 00:41:07,200
great.
I, I looked at a foundation GCSE

1030
00:41:07,200 --> 00:41:10,880
paper the other day and I
genuinely, every time I'm like

1031
00:41:11,040 --> 00:41:15,080
flabbergasted by how it's just
almost completely what we teach

1032
00:41:15,080 --> 00:41:16,200
you is it's good.
Yeah, yeah, yeah.

1033
00:41:16,200 --> 00:41:18,080
And something is wrong.
Now I can't wait for the new

1034
00:41:18,080 --> 00:41:21,720
curriculum to come in and please
sort something out because my

1035
00:41:21,720 --> 00:41:24,000
gut instinct is we just do too
much too quick in primary.

1036
00:41:24,120 --> 00:41:27,120
So like I would say maybe the
foundation papers probably, it

1037
00:41:27,120 --> 00:41:28,400
probably shouldn't change too
much.

1038
00:41:28,400 --> 00:41:30,720
Like maybe that's where the
foundation level should be when

1039
00:41:30,720 --> 00:41:33,480
you're doing GCSE.
But that's like, that's so

1040
00:41:33,600 --> 00:41:36,520
that's three, four years after
we teach it for the first time.

1041
00:41:36,520 --> 00:41:39,200
And like, yeah, like what?
Can we not just get really good

1042
00:41:39,200 --> 00:41:40,920
at everything else and then just
whack up a bit?

1043
00:41:40,920 --> 00:41:43,000
Maybe, Yeah.
And just be really clear before

1044
00:41:43,000 --> 00:41:45,240
the secondary mass teachers are
rolling their eyes at you,

1045
00:41:45,240 --> 00:41:47,200
Dylan.
The curriculum obviously does

1046
00:41:47,200 --> 00:41:48,600
change in year 7, year
eight-year 9.

1047
00:41:48,600 --> 00:41:51,240
And despite the fact that the
GCSE, but you said the

1048
00:41:51,240 --> 00:41:54,520
curriculum is exactly the same.
I'm more honestly this guy.

1049
00:41:54,600 --> 00:41:55,680
Well, it's matter.
It's true.

1050
00:41:55,680 --> 00:41:57,080
It's true.
Right.

1051
00:41:57,080 --> 00:41:58,200
Fine.
But I was talking about the

1052
00:41:58,200 --> 00:42:00,480
foundation paper afterwards.
Yeah, Foundation, by the way,

1053
00:42:00,480 --> 00:42:03,320
the result.
I'm not like fine.

1054
00:42:03,520 --> 00:42:05,920
But I would also probably quite
enjoy teaching maths.

1055
00:42:06,400 --> 00:42:08,680
Yeah, definitely to secondary
school kids, do you think?

1056
00:42:08,680 --> 00:42:13,560
There'd be like a lot of
transferable skill, or do you

1057
00:42:13,560 --> 00:42:14,840
think you'd be a bit out of
depth?

1058
00:42:16,000 --> 00:42:17,360
I think there'll be a lot of
transferable skill.

1059
00:42:17,360 --> 00:42:19,480
I'm sure I would be out of my
death at first anyway because

1060
00:42:19,480 --> 00:42:21,440
there'll be some other stuff
that I don't really know yet,

1061
00:42:21,480 --> 00:42:22,520
but I think there'll be a lot
of.

1062
00:42:22,520 --> 00:42:24,720
Transferable, like there's a lot
of stuff you don't know, but you

1063
00:42:24,720 --> 00:42:26,560
teach history just fine and you
kind of teach yourself.

1064
00:42:26,560 --> 00:42:28,880
Like when you know, before I do
ancient Egypt, I'll teach myself

1065
00:42:28,880 --> 00:42:30,120
the ancient Egypt parts and
stuff.

1066
00:42:30,560 --> 00:42:32,320
Do you think it would be enough
where with maths you're like,

1067
00:42:32,320 --> 00:42:34,800
well I kind of know the journey
we're on, I'll teach myself this

1068
00:42:34,800 --> 00:42:35,960
and then it'll be absolutely
fine.

1069
00:42:35,960 --> 00:42:38,320
It'll be the same as primary.
Or do you just think there'll be

1070
00:42:38,320 --> 00:42:40,600
something that is just literally
different where it'd be harder

1071
00:42:40,600 --> 00:42:41,680
for?
You I think there'll be a few

1072
00:42:41,680 --> 00:42:44,080
little nuanced bits like that.
Based on even my experience of

1073
00:42:44,080 --> 00:42:47,360
primary, I think I became a much
better last teacher over time.

1074
00:42:47,440 --> 00:42:51,360
Yes, because after teaching them
I did realise little ways to

1075
00:42:51,360 --> 00:42:53,640
teach certain things that are
like great conceptually that I

1076
00:42:53,640 --> 00:42:55,240
maybe I didn't know straight
away even though I was really

1077
00:42:55,240 --> 00:42:57,080
confident the maths myself.
But that's nothing to do the

1078
00:42:57,080 --> 00:42:58,680
fact they're secondary, that's
just that you've not taught it

1079
00:42:58,680 --> 00:43:00,200
before.
Yeah, that's what I'm saying.

1080
00:43:00,200 --> 00:43:01,400
So I did that.
That same thing happened to be

1081
00:43:01,400 --> 00:43:02,480
in primary.
I think it would happen in

1082
00:43:02,480 --> 00:43:03,920
secondary as well.
I'd look at something and go,

1083
00:43:03,920 --> 00:43:05,160
oh, I know that how to do that
really well.

1084
00:43:05,160 --> 00:43:06,080
I know how I'm going to teach
that.

1085
00:43:06,080 --> 00:43:08,320
I'd teach it and then maybe the
second year I'd go, oh, do you

1086
00:43:08,320 --> 00:43:09,960
know what?
Actually I've discovered this

1087
00:43:09,960 --> 00:43:12,000
better way of doing it now.
I think that would happen.

1088
00:43:12,200 --> 00:43:13,800
Yeah.
And most, most of the people

1089
00:43:13,800 --> 00:43:16,840
I've spoken to about secondary
who've done both do genuinely

1090
00:43:16,840 --> 00:43:18,520
say that the workload is much
less in secondary.

1091
00:43:19,120 --> 00:43:21,240
So it's it's interesting.
Off we go.

1092
00:43:22,600 --> 00:43:23,800
See ya.
Do you know what the workload is

1093
00:43:23,800 --> 00:43:25,240
less we just quit?
Yeah.

1094
00:43:25,440 --> 00:43:26,280
Is it?
I don't know.

1095
00:43:26,280 --> 00:43:27,400
Our workload is pretty
horrendous.

1096
00:43:27,880 --> 00:43:31,480
We give ourselves a lot of work.
For that role, I'm doing less

1097
00:43:31,480 --> 00:43:34,000
planning and delivering and
marketing lessons, more other

1098
00:43:34,000 --> 00:43:35,640
stuff.
My work to pay ratio is

1099
00:43:35,720 --> 00:43:38,120
negatively infinite so what's
going on here mate?

1100
00:43:39,160 --> 00:43:40,800
But you're not getting paid what
you are.

1101
00:43:40,800 --> 00:43:44,040
Oh my God, I'm the guy in charge
of socials.

1102
00:43:44,040 --> 00:43:47,360
Maybe we've had so many deals
you don't know about and I've

1103
00:43:47,360 --> 00:43:49,640
been slipping in like little
little little things every now

1104
00:43:49,640 --> 00:43:51,840
and then, nor VPN by now and
you've already noticed.

1105
00:43:52,120 --> 00:43:53,600
It's a joke.
You've not noticed you should

1106
00:43:53,600 --> 00:43:55,320
have all these.
Strange cans of drink and.

1107
00:43:55,360 --> 00:43:57,680
It's so weird.
Yeah, get high at water now,

1108
00:43:57,680 --> 00:43:59,440
wherever you get your water
from, just in game.

1109
00:43:59,440 --> 00:44:02,320
But now we don't have any.
We don't have any deals.

1110
00:44:02,480 --> 00:44:03,480
No, we don't know.
We don't.

1111
00:44:03,480 --> 00:44:05,120
If we did, we'd be.
Yeah, definitely not with the

1112
00:44:05,120 --> 00:44:07,520
government either.
And juicing a new white paper

1113
00:44:07,520 --> 00:44:11,040
now on SEND solving SEND for
your future.

1114
00:44:12,120 --> 00:44:14,920
Wow, American too.
Oh my God.

1115
00:44:14,920 --> 00:44:16,200
Last question.
Last question.

1116
00:44:16,480 --> 00:44:18,000
You can do it.
Just very quickly, I don't think

1117
00:44:18,000 --> 00:44:21,160
the white paper's solving SAND
and we're not being paid.

1118
00:44:21,800 --> 00:44:25,160
What's your opinion on the
scheme of opening nurseries

1119
00:44:25,160 --> 00:44:27,200
within schools?
Do you feel?

1120
00:44:27,360 --> 00:44:31,640
That a QTS teacher is skilled
enough in early years to be

1121
00:44:31,640 --> 00:44:34,080
teaching there.
I do feel that, yeah, I do.

1122
00:44:34,240 --> 00:44:35,840
I do feel it.
I do feel that.

1123
00:44:36,000 --> 00:44:39,680
My phonics is on the point baby.
I think the scheme in general is

1124
00:44:39,680 --> 00:44:40,960
pretty good.
Yeah.

1125
00:44:40,960 --> 00:44:42,920
I like the idea of nurseries
being attached to schools.

1126
00:44:42,920 --> 00:44:44,840
I like the idea of it being a
through thing.

1127
00:44:46,320 --> 00:44:49,200
But I am completely on board
with, for me, it is such a

1128
00:44:49,200 --> 00:44:52,320
specialist role.
And actually just getting QTS,

1129
00:44:52,320 --> 00:44:55,800
for example, me, I would not
hire me to go into early years

1130
00:44:55,800 --> 00:44:57,480
right now.
Yeah, yeah, I think that's fair

1131
00:44:57,480 --> 00:44:59,680
enough.
I think it's very reasonable to

1132
00:44:59,680 --> 00:45:04,000
say that QTS is like is like a
General practitioner.

1133
00:45:04,080 --> 00:45:05,720
Do you know what I mean?
It's like, it's like fake you're

1134
00:45:05,760 --> 00:45:08,240
you generally understand how
people learn.

1135
00:45:08,520 --> 00:45:12,200
You have pedagogies under your
belt, you know sort of roughly

1136
00:45:12,200 --> 00:45:14,880
how schools work and run.
Like you're getting that general

1137
00:45:14,880 --> 00:45:16,240
side of things.
I think it's completely fair

1138
00:45:16,240 --> 00:45:18,640
enough to say you obviously have
specialists.

1139
00:45:18,640 --> 00:45:20,960
But you go to different, but do
you not feel like very

1140
00:45:20,960 --> 00:45:24,280
specifically early years jumps
out as different like QTS?

1141
00:45:24,280 --> 00:45:26,520
Sure, it's a generic thing like
we just spoke about going to

1142
00:45:26,520 --> 00:45:29,720
secondary school and teaching.
Although it's different, it's

1143
00:45:29,720 --> 00:45:33,520
close enough because to me early
years sticks out like a sore

1144
00:45:33,520 --> 00:45:37,040
thumb, Completely different and
needs and needs real specialist

1145
00:45:37,040 --> 00:45:39,640
approach because it to me it's
the most important step.

1146
00:45:39,640 --> 00:45:41,840
Genuinely.
Like if I think about setting

1147
00:45:41,840 --> 00:45:44,640
kids up for the future, the
earlier we do that, the better

1148
00:45:44,640 --> 00:45:46,920
outcomes, like all the research
says that I've ever seen.

1149
00:45:46,920 --> 00:45:50,880
So we need to get that right.
And yeah, if it means that we

1150
00:45:50,880 --> 00:45:53,080
end up diluting that space with
people who aren't necessarily

1151
00:45:53,080 --> 00:45:56,920
experts but they've got QTS and
then moved around, that is where

1152
00:45:56,920 --> 00:45:58,200
I think the scheme could fall
down.

1153
00:45:58,600 --> 00:46:01,400
It's interesting.
And I do agree that the earlier

1154
00:46:01,400 --> 00:46:04,360
you go down, the more it jumps
out I think as needing like

1155
00:46:04,360 --> 00:46:08,240
really specialist understanding
of how to how to work and teach

1156
00:46:08,360 --> 00:46:13,080
children at that age.
But I still think if this

1157
00:46:13,080 --> 00:46:16,920
question is, do you feel a QTS,
sorry, do you feel a QTAQTS

1158
00:46:16,920 --> 00:46:19,760
teacher is skilled enough?
It's kind of a loaded question

1159
00:46:19,760 --> 00:46:23,000
really because I don't really
think anyone straight away is

1160
00:46:23,080 --> 00:46:25,680
skilled and I think you learn, I
think in teacher.

1161
00:46:25,760 --> 00:46:27,200
I do think you learn a lot on
the job though.

1162
00:46:27,200 --> 00:46:29,840
I was skilled enough to do year
4 teaching when I got my QTS.

1163
00:46:30,000 --> 00:46:32,080
Skilled enough, yeah, but you
still like you learn a lot.

1164
00:46:32,080 --> 00:46:34,520
But I was skilled enough.
Okay, I think someone could be

1165
00:46:34,520 --> 00:46:36,800
skilled enough with QTS to work
in early years.

1166
00:46:37,320 --> 00:46:38,720
I think they could.
I think that.

1167
00:46:38,720 --> 00:46:39,920
I think I just think the gap is
a bit bigger.

1168
00:46:39,920 --> 00:46:41,440
I think you didn't.
There's not much more scope

1169
00:46:41,440 --> 00:46:43,600
above you for year 4.
You got there quicker and it's

1170
00:46:43,600 --> 00:46:45,520
just a bigger scope.
I still think you're skilled

1171
00:46:45,520 --> 00:46:48,040
enough.
I think AQTAI think I could, and

1172
00:46:48,040 --> 00:46:49,840
I think you could go to early
years.

1173
00:46:50,160 --> 00:46:53,480
And although it would be mad to
us at first, I think we have

1174
00:46:53,480 --> 00:46:57,080
enough understanding of pedagogy
and teaching to at least start

1175
00:46:57,080 --> 00:46:59,200
doing the job, and then we'd
learn more things as we go.

1176
00:46:59,200 --> 00:47:03,720
I'd need someone to really be
heavily guided me, like I, I'd

1177
00:47:03,720 --> 00:47:05,320
need to learn a lot from people
around me.

1178
00:47:05,440 --> 00:47:07,160
Well, you'd be doing a lot of
research anywhere, like you

1179
00:47:07,160 --> 00:47:09,120
would in any role, wouldn't you?
Like if you go to year 4, I

1180
00:47:09,120 --> 00:47:10,160
don't do a lot of research,
mate.

1181
00:47:10,360 --> 00:47:12,480
Yeah, you don't anymore.
But I'm sure the first time you

1182
00:47:12,480 --> 00:47:14,040
went to year 4, you were
obviously learning the

1183
00:47:14,040 --> 00:47:15,560
curriculum for the first time.
You didn't know the whole

1184
00:47:15,560 --> 00:47:16,600
curriculum by the back of your
hand.

1185
00:47:16,680 --> 00:47:18,920
No, but I, what I mean is I
don't think just knowing the,

1186
00:47:19,240 --> 00:47:21,640
this is this is literally my
point, by the way, just knowing

1187
00:47:21,640 --> 00:47:25,200
the curriculum can get you by in
other year groups, but I don't

1188
00:47:25,200 --> 00:47:27,240
think it can get you by in early
years because there's so much

1189
00:47:27,240 --> 00:47:30,120
more to it, like play based
learning, understanding and like

1190
00:47:30,120 --> 00:47:31,960
emotional health, physical
health.

1191
00:47:32,280 --> 00:47:34,240
You know, the, the whole thing
about, you know, some of the

1192
00:47:34,240 --> 00:47:36,720
money, even potty trained
helping them learn how to do

1193
00:47:36,720 --> 00:47:39,000
knife.
I, I don't, I, I, what I'm

1194
00:47:39,000 --> 00:47:42,040
saying here is, are you, if you
got go through QTS and you get

1195
00:47:42,040 --> 00:47:44,720
your qualification, I think you
can be put in a year group and

1196
00:47:44,720 --> 00:47:46,800
you're skilled enough just to
follow the curriculum and just

1197
00:47:46,800 --> 00:47:49,520
stay ahead of the curriculum.
But I don't think that's enough

1198
00:47:49,520 --> 00:47:52,200
in early years where obviously
we go into early years and look

1199
00:47:52,200 --> 00:47:54,720
at the curriculum and stay ahead
of the curriculum, but I don't

1200
00:47:54,720 --> 00:47:57,320
think that it would be good
enough.

1201
00:47:58,040 --> 00:48:00,120
And that's that's why it's
glaringly different to me.

1202
00:48:00,120 --> 00:48:03,000
So you can, you can, you know, I
think what I did in year 4, I

1203
00:48:03,000 --> 00:48:04,680
thought I was fine.
I understood, I did lots of

1204
00:48:04,680 --> 00:48:06,920
teaching practise and my
pedagogy was good and I could

1205
00:48:06,920 --> 00:48:09,040
stay ahead of the curriculum.
In early years.

1206
00:48:09,040 --> 00:48:10,560
I think you need specialist
training.

1207
00:48:10,640 --> 00:48:11,920
Yeah, OK.
I agree.

1208
00:48:12,200 --> 00:48:13,520
I agree.
The way you worded that was much

1209
00:48:13,520 --> 00:48:15,160
better.
Thank you.

1210
00:48:15,320 --> 00:48:17,400
I think the I guess what I'm
trying to say is the baseline is

1211
00:48:17,400 --> 00:48:18,800
good, though.
I don't want to undermine the

1212
00:48:18,800 --> 00:48:22,640
baseline of QTSI think, Oh no, I
think that is doing 80% of of it

1213
00:48:22,640 --> 00:48:24,600
for OK.
I think it's doing 90% of it for

1214
00:48:24,600 --> 00:48:26,920
you when you're in year 4, and I
think it's doing 70% of it for

1215
00:48:26,920 --> 00:48:28,360
you when you're in early.
This is what I'm trying to say.

1216
00:48:28,360 --> 00:48:30,360
I don't think, I don't think
that void goes down to nothing

1217
00:48:30,360 --> 00:48:31,880
and the QTS is worth nothing.
Sure.

1218
00:48:31,960 --> 00:48:33,800
So I guess yeah, that's why I
say it's a loaded question,

1219
00:48:33,800 --> 00:48:36,520
because skilled enough means
yeah, yeah, I guess no is my

1220
00:48:36,520 --> 00:48:39,160
answer to that.
Do you think QTS is skilled

1221
00:48:39,160 --> 00:48:41,240
enough early as well?
No, I think you absolutely

1222
00:48:41,240 --> 00:48:43,640
anyone going into early years
needs additional specialist.

1223
00:48:43,640 --> 00:48:45,200
But on my side eventually.
But you did.

1224
00:48:45,200 --> 00:48:47,800
You did, to be fair.
But yeah.

1225
00:48:47,800 --> 00:48:49,600
But I don't want to undermine
it.

1226
00:48:49,600 --> 00:48:51,520
You know I.
Think no, no, I don't think it's

1227
00:48:51,520 --> 00:48:53,200
undermining at all.
I think it's if anything,

1228
00:48:53,200 --> 00:48:56,040
putting on a pedestal what early
year specialists do.

1229
00:48:56,320 --> 00:48:58,720
And I think if you are getting a
job in an early year setting

1230
00:48:58,720 --> 00:49:00,960
like that, I think you need to
have specialist training in it.

1231
00:49:00,960 --> 00:49:02,240
Yeah.
I don't think you need to have

1232
00:49:02,240 --> 00:49:04,640
specialist training in Year 4 to
become a Year 4 teacher.

1233
00:49:04,920 --> 00:49:06,720
I don't think you need
specialist training in upper key

1234
00:49:06,720 --> 00:49:08,480
Stage 2 to be an Upper Key Stage
2 teacher.

1235
00:49:08,760 --> 00:49:11,680
Fun mutation phonics.
I think I think it's a sliding

1236
00:49:11,680 --> 00:49:13,600
scale going down.
Yeah, yeah, cuz how I say it's

1237
00:49:13,640 --> 00:49:14,760
just yeah, literally just
changes.

1238
00:49:14,760 --> 00:49:17,880
But early years, it's like,
yeah, it's off the chart.

1239
00:49:18,000 --> 00:49:21,040
Whereas year 1, rightly or
wrongly, does become more

1240
00:49:21,040 --> 00:49:23,160
formal.
And QTS is like, if you've been

1241
00:49:23,160 --> 00:49:25,760
practising in year 4, there's
more of a crossover with year

1242
00:49:25,760 --> 00:49:27,720
one.
Yeah, it shouldn't necessarily

1243
00:49:27,720 --> 00:49:29,440
be the way because it should be
play based, should be continued

1244
00:49:29,440 --> 00:49:31,160
provision.
And then that my point there is

1245
00:49:31,160 --> 00:49:34,160
that that is 100% always the
case in early years, which is

1246
00:49:34,160 --> 00:49:35,800
why it's so important.
You need specialists in there.

1247
00:49:36,080 --> 00:49:39,400
Me and my training and QTS and
having done just key stage one

1248
00:49:39,400 --> 00:49:41,840
and two would not be suitable
for me to go into an early

1249
00:49:41,840 --> 00:49:45,400
years, an early years foundation
stage because I would, I

1250
00:49:45,400 --> 00:49:47,200
wouldn't know where to start
with continuous provision.

1251
00:49:47,480 --> 00:49:49,560
No.
And, and I, I could learn what

1252
00:49:49,560 --> 00:49:51,360
it was and I could look at the
curriculum and I could put some

1253
00:49:51,360 --> 00:49:54,640
numb blocks down.
But really I think you need

1254
00:49:54,640 --> 00:49:57,640
specialist training and be in
that setting enough to get to

1255
00:49:57,640 --> 00:49:58,840
that level where it's quality.
Yeah.

1256
00:49:59,040 --> 00:50:03,080
And, and you've year one and
year 2A, higher proportion, more

1257
00:50:03,080 --> 00:50:05,040
and more of it becomes more
formal base, which you might

1258
00:50:05,040 --> 00:50:07,520
have later on.
Yeah, which is why you're more

1259
00:50:07,520 --> 00:50:10,120
suited maybe to year 2 or 1
compared to early years.

1260
00:50:10,120 --> 00:50:11,440
I think early years just on a
pedestal.

1261
00:50:11,440 --> 00:50:13,040
Yeah, sure.
But even my point about phonics,

1262
00:50:13,040 --> 00:50:15,240
by the way, was just that
there's still stuff in year 1

1263
00:50:15,240 --> 00:50:17,240
and 2.
Yeah, completely where it's like

1264
00:50:17,240 --> 00:50:19,400
realistically, QTS does not
prepare you to teach a phonics

1265
00:50:19,400 --> 00:50:21,480
scheme.
It doesn't like in terms of you

1266
00:50:21,480 --> 00:50:23,200
still need some training on that
phonics scheme.

1267
00:50:23,200 --> 00:50:25,840
Like when we when we were QTS,
there's no way I could have just

1268
00:50:25,840 --> 00:50:28,680
walked into just a year one
classroom and just, yeah, just

1269
00:50:28,680 --> 00:50:29,840
picked.
Oh yeah, yeah, I know this

1270
00:50:29,840 --> 00:50:32,240
scheme, they're intricate and
phonics is like you need

1271
00:50:32,240 --> 00:50:34,280
training on it.
It's really hard to deliver

1272
00:50:34,680 --> 00:50:37,000
correctly without someone
actually saying, oh this is how

1273
00:50:37,000 --> 00:50:39,000
you do this.
Phonics same same with math

1274
00:50:39,000 --> 00:50:40,600
schemes.
Enough as ski stage.

1275
00:50:41,360 --> 00:50:42,760
Do you think as much?
Because I think I still think

1276
00:50:42,760 --> 00:50:45,520
what you said about you could
walk, I could walk into a Year 6

1277
00:50:45,520 --> 00:50:47,640
classroom.
And realistically, I think it's

1278
00:50:47,640 --> 00:50:49,520
completely appropriate to just
as long as you stay on top of

1279
00:50:49,520 --> 00:50:52,520
the curriculum and you've got
QTS 99% done.

1280
00:50:52,720 --> 00:50:55,120
But you still need to look at a
scheme and given and and there

1281
00:50:55,120 --> 00:50:56,640
might be certain ways that you
deliver it as a class.

1282
00:50:56,640 --> 00:50:57,560
I don't really need training on
that.

1283
00:50:57,560 --> 00:50:59,320
Really.
You don't need training on that,

1284
00:50:59,400 --> 00:51:00,280
no.
Less so.

1285
00:51:00,320 --> 00:51:02,080
Less so because you.
Need training on phonics and you

1286
00:51:02,080 --> 00:51:03,360
definitely need training on the
earlier stuff.

1287
00:51:03,360 --> 00:51:04,960
So I'm just agreeing with you
that as you go down.

1288
00:51:05,840 --> 00:51:08,080
But in my QTS I did get phonics
training.

1289
00:51:09,600 --> 00:51:11,400
I don't like I.
Did like one day or I did like

1290
00:51:14,240 --> 00:51:17,280
contrast emplacement in case
stage 1, I didn't do that.

1291
00:51:17,640 --> 00:51:19,680
I thought you had to do.
Contrast I did, I had one of my

1292
00:51:19,680 --> 00:51:22,040
actual placements was in was in
year 1, but I didn't have train,

1293
00:51:22,040 --> 00:51:23,200
Yeah, but I didn't have training
on.

1294
00:51:23,360 --> 00:51:25,280
Did you not teach phonics?
I did a little bit of teaching

1295
00:51:25,280 --> 00:51:27,160
in phonics but only from like
what the teacher told me.

1296
00:51:27,160 --> 00:51:29,120
Like I didn't go away and do
like a training course on.

1297
00:51:30,240 --> 00:51:32,880
How to Yeah, I think that's, I
think that's still part of it.

1298
00:51:32,880 --> 00:51:34,840
Like with any scheme, you're
going to need to be trained on

1299
00:51:34,840 --> 00:51:36,840
it.
Yeah.

1300
00:51:37,040 --> 00:51:38,440
I.
Just didn't think I had adequate

1301
00:51:38,440 --> 00:51:40,160
training for.
Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

1302
00:51:40,160 --> 00:51:42,000
And I think I think that's true
for a lot of things.

1303
00:51:42,440 --> 00:51:46,320
I guess what I'm saying is the
literal setting should be so

1304
00:51:46,320 --> 00:51:48,200
different in early years that
it's incomparable.

1305
00:51:48,360 --> 00:51:50,560
Yeah, that's what guess what I'm
saying, like in terms of

1306
00:51:50,560 --> 00:51:52,960
individual schemes and training
and stuff that's ongoing and

1307
00:51:52,960 --> 00:51:54,640
part of professional development
should always happen.

1308
00:51:55,120 --> 00:51:57,880
But the literal delivering and
the way you literally teach

1309
00:51:57,880 --> 00:52:02,160
day-to-day all of the time in
early years should be and is so

1310
00:52:02,160 --> 00:52:04,880
different to if you've just been
in a setting in key Stage 1 or

1311
00:52:04,880 --> 00:52:07,880
key Stage 2 or key Stage 3.
Like it just seems so different

1312
00:52:07,880 --> 00:52:09,720
to me.
So for sure I want specialists

1313
00:52:09,720 --> 00:52:11,400
in there with my kids.
I think about my son starting

1314
00:52:11,400 --> 00:52:14,600
school.
I would quite like when he goes

1315
00:52:14,600 --> 00:52:18,840
to early years settings for his
teacher to be a specialist in

1316
00:52:18,840 --> 00:52:20,560
early years.
Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

1317
00:52:20,560 --> 00:52:22,840
Not just, oh, the year 6, she
worked in year 6 last year or he

1318
00:52:22,840 --> 00:52:24,760
worked in year 6 last year.
They've been brought down to

1319
00:52:24,800 --> 00:52:26,440
they've never done this before.
You'd be, you'd be, you would

1320
00:52:26,520 --> 00:52:29,080
naturally be a bit like, oh God.
OK, Yeah.

1321
00:52:29,080 --> 00:52:31,240
Whereas if whereas if they said
I was down in year 2 now after

1322
00:52:31,240 --> 00:52:32,840
being in year 6 for so long.
But oh nice.

1323
00:52:33,360 --> 00:52:33,760
Really.
Yeah.

1324
00:52:34,280 --> 00:52:36,000
But maybe you'd have a little
bit what?

1325
00:52:36,000 --> 00:52:38,560
About the other way around.
Oh this year 6 teacher was only

1326
00:52:38,560 --> 00:52:39,560
done early years up to this
point.

1327
00:52:39,560 --> 00:52:41,320
I'd just be going to year 6 now.
Yeah, completely.

1328
00:52:41,320 --> 00:52:42,840
I'd be like, oh, that's just
going to be very different.

1329
00:52:42,840 --> 00:52:45,160
That's, that's a tricky one.
I'd I'd prefer some of a bit

1330
00:52:45,160 --> 00:52:47,040
more experience of that.
But you'd probably be thinking,

1331
00:52:47,200 --> 00:52:49,960
but it's an easier, quite easier
to pick up just the curriculum I

1332
00:52:50,000 --> 00:52:53,320
I personally think.
I personally think it's easier

1333
00:52:53,320 --> 00:52:56,080
to do that, but I still think
that they're so different.

1334
00:52:56,080 --> 00:52:57,440
It does work both ways.
Yeah, sure.

1335
00:52:57,720 --> 00:52:59,760
If you've only if you've been
trained and you're a specialist

1336
00:52:59,760 --> 00:53:01,320
in early years, then you're
asked, do you see it?

1337
00:53:01,320 --> 00:53:04,200
That's equally very different.
And I'd equally be like, oh,

1338
00:53:04,200 --> 00:53:06,000
it's hard just to just to flip
it on.

1339
00:53:06,000 --> 00:53:08,760
Yeah, because it because the
literal way you teach is so

1340
00:53:08,760 --> 00:53:10,880
different.
I think that that would equally

1341
00:53:10,880 --> 00:53:12,520
be a bit of like a oh, that's
hard.

1342
00:53:12,720 --> 00:53:14,000
Would you do it?
I'll finish with this.

1343
00:53:14,000 --> 00:53:16,840
Would you go to, let's just say
there was the perfect situation

1344
00:53:16,840 --> 00:53:19,480
in terms of like renumeration
job, whatever, like it was

1345
00:53:19,480 --> 00:53:24,160
perfect for you, ��7,000,000 a
month, ��7,000,000 a month and

1346
00:53:24,280 --> 00:53:26,560
you have to do earliest.
Would you do earliest?

1347
00:53:27,120 --> 00:53:30,720
��7,000,001.00 a month, yeah, the
early years, yeah, definitely.

1348
00:53:30,800 --> 00:53:34,160
But I personally just like
knowing that I'm doing a good

1349
00:53:34,160 --> 00:53:36,480
job, yeah.
And I'd worry with that, that I

1350
00:53:36,480 --> 00:53:38,880
would spend a long time not
doing the best job because I'm

1351
00:53:38,880 --> 00:53:40,840
just not trained.
I think it'd be hard to be a

1352
00:53:40,840 --> 00:53:44,280
type B teacher.
Yeah, like quite scatty and

1353
00:53:44,280 --> 00:53:45,640
leaving stuff everywhere.
Isn't it?

1354
00:53:45,840 --> 00:53:47,000
Really.
You know, like horrible to the

1355
00:53:47,000 --> 00:53:48,520
kids.
Like horrible to the kids.

1356
00:53:48,520 --> 00:53:49,600
Sorry, is that you?
Is that sorry?

1357
00:53:49,720 --> 00:53:52,280
I am the nice.
I'm joking, yeah, but people

1358
00:53:52,280 --> 00:53:53,360
listening to this don't know
that.

1359
00:53:53,360 --> 00:53:57,560
Hey, I'm sure the kids will.
Love you in terms of like I love

1360
00:53:57,760 --> 00:53:59,600
school your personality in terms
of like just like leaving stuff

1361
00:53:59,600 --> 00:54:02,200
around like losing stuff, being
a bit messy, like that type BI

1362
00:54:02,200 --> 00:54:03,960
know it sounds horrible, but
that is just who you are.

1363
00:54:08,480 --> 00:54:10,440
Ways of describing type Type B
was enough.

1364
00:54:10,880 --> 00:54:14,960
I didn't really go disgusting,
disgusting, horrible, dirty man.

1365
00:54:14,960 --> 00:54:16,320
Even things everywhere doesn't
what?

1366
00:54:16,480 --> 00:54:19,880
Doesn't shower for weeks.
Yeah, just disgusting.

1367
00:54:21,200 --> 00:54:23,360
Look like this goes to your
hands.

1368
00:54:23,360 --> 00:54:25,320
You're the type of he isn't
analogy, right?

1369
00:54:25,320 --> 00:54:27,520
Okay, because I'm not enough.
No, it's not.

1370
00:54:27,520 --> 00:54:30,640
I need to describe this more.
The type of teacher who loses

1371
00:54:30,640 --> 00:54:34,320
their lanyard so many times that
they feel embarrassed to ask for

1372
00:54:34,320 --> 00:54:35,800
a new one again to get into the
car box.

1373
00:54:35,800 --> 00:54:39,720
They just start parking outside
the school, that kind of that

1374
00:54:39,720 --> 00:54:42,320
kind of teacher.
I don't think that's an analogy

1375
00:54:42,320 --> 00:54:43,920
when it's just describing what
happened.

1376
00:54:44,200 --> 00:54:46,040
Yeah, right.
Why not park in the car park?

1377
00:54:46,320 --> 00:54:48,400
I love the walk you.
Didn't have to admit that just

1378
00:54:48,400 --> 00:54:49,920
it was just an analogy until you
said that.

1379
00:54:50,520 --> 00:54:52,320
Just a very, very specific
analogy.

1380
00:54:52,520 --> 00:54:54,920
I yeah, I think I would struggle
in an.

1381
00:54:54,920 --> 00:54:56,360
Analogy.
What if you're a teacher?

1382
00:54:56,360 --> 00:55:05,440
Here we go when you're just like
a wow, a Type C teacher.

1383
00:55:06,520 --> 00:55:09,960
Type C Yeah, all right, Dylan
sounds to get so tetchy.

1384
00:55:10,640 --> 00:55:12,360
So I found sold for the last 5
minutes.

1385
00:55:13,960 --> 00:55:15,440
Oh God.
Anyway.

1386
00:55:16,400 --> 00:55:19,360
Follow, follow enlightens and
share rate.

1387
00:55:19,360 --> 00:55:21,640
That was pretty funny.
That was really funny.

1388
00:55:22,760 --> 00:55:24,760
We'll finish there, shall we?
Yeah, let's do that.

1389
00:55:25,240 --> 00:55:27,040
Let's do that.
You're going to he's he's going

1390
00:55:27,040 --> 00:55:28,920
to have a he's going to moan at
me now after this being so

1391
00:55:28,920 --> 00:55:30,200
horrible to him.
He will he.

1392
00:55:30,200 --> 00:55:32,320
Will shut up.
Shut up now.

1393
00:55:32,880 --> 00:55:34,160
Sorry, the recording's not
stopped.

1394
00:55:34,880 --> 00:55:38,280
All right, so.
It's over, Mr. Can you treat me

1395
00:55:38,280 --> 00:55:41,640
with some bloody respect?
Well, thank you.

1396
00:55:41,960 --> 00:55:43,440
I've lost my bloody lanyard.
If.

1397
00:55:43,520 --> 00:55:47,640
You can if you can find me one
working radiator pen in this.

1398
00:55:50,520 --> 00:55:55,080
What have you got here?
I've got my school lanyard that

1399
00:55:55,080 --> 00:55:57,920
I said I took the take back to
school five months ago and I

1400
00:55:57,920 --> 00:55:59,240
haven't.
Yeah, I'm there you go.

1401
00:55:59,240 --> 00:56:01,040
There's a little bit of it.
I'll show you what school is.

1402
00:56:01,400 --> 00:56:04,080
So found it after I left.
Well done.

1403
00:56:04,080 --> 00:56:06,960
And that will wherever that,
wherever that just landed, I

1404
00:56:06,960 --> 00:56:09,800
promise you, I promise you in
three years that will be there.

1405
00:56:09,880 --> 00:56:11,880
Three years is a bit strange.
OK, two years.

1406
00:56:12,200 --> 00:56:14,320
Yeah, maybe.
I promise you it'll be there

1407
00:56:14,760 --> 00:56:16,760
with the other random stuff
that's there next to the door

1408
00:56:16,760 --> 00:56:18,040
that's still on the on the wall
and the.

1409
00:56:18,520 --> 00:56:21,840
Yeah, anyway, bit of a crazy
one.

1410
00:56:22,160 --> 00:56:23,920
Type B teacher.
Type C teacher.

1411
00:56:24,200 --> 00:56:27,400
That makes you a type A teacher.
A teacher who leaves us a review

1412
00:56:27,400 --> 00:56:28,680
and does all that good stuff.
Oh.

1413
00:56:29,280 --> 00:56:30,440
That was good, see you next
time.

1414
00:56:30,800 --> 00:56:30,920
Bye.